Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever.

Moderators: tsherkin, Doctor MJ, nate33, rrravenred, penbeast0

User avatar
JordansBulls
RealGM
Posts: 48,113
And1: 1,203
Joined: Jul 12, 2006
Location: HCA (Homecourt Advantage)

Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#1 » by JordansBulls » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:09 pm

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/766 ... lue-part-2


10. Dirk Nowitzki


I can't remember another NBA superstar having his personality transformed by an NBA title; if it happened with, say, Hakeem Olajuwon, I don't remember reading about it. Dirk's next few years will be interesting for historical purposes: In my basketball book, I ranked Bird, Duncan, Havlicek, Baylor, Erving, Pettit, Malone and Barkley as the greatest forwards of all time (in that order). Dirk already leapfrogged the last three; he's about to jump the next three; and if that happens, suddenly he's one of the best 12 or 13 players of all time by any calculation. He's also the greatest international basketball player ever — and actually, you could argue that the distance between Dirk and the next best foreign guy (Gasol, Ginobili) is more like a chasm.


Meaning only Duncan is considered better now according to Simmons.
Image
"Talent wins games, but teamwork and intelligence wins championships."
- Michael Jordan
User avatar
smith2373
General Manager
Posts: 9,184
And1: 517
Joined: Mar 01, 2011
   

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#2 » by smith2373 » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:09 pm

That title run has really made people overrate Dirk.
ImageImage ImageImage ImageImage ImageImage
User avatar
Sedale Threatt
RealGM
Posts: 23,061
And1: 1,458
Joined: Feb 06, 2007
Location: Clearing space in the trophy case.

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#3 » by Sedale Threatt » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:11 pm

I like Bill, but where the hell is Kevin Garnett?
JF5 wrote:Real fans don't cry about refs.


http://wtfismikewearing.tumblr.com/
User avatar
Sasaki
Veteran
Posts: 2,675
And1: 618
Joined: May 30, 2010
 

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#4 » by Sasaki » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:13 pm

Sedale Threatt wrote:I like Bill, but where the hell is Kevin Garnett?

My thinking. Garnett may be debated, but I'd say he clearly outranks Barkley at least.
But do you know what they call a fool, who's full of himself and jumps into the path of death because it's cool?
User avatar
Kobe2ndFiddle
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,545
And1: 1
Joined: Oct 18, 2011

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#5 » by Kobe2ndFiddle » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:14 pm

McHale
Barkely
Malone
Garnett
Duncan (yes he's a PF)


so which one of these guys is Dirk better than ? I'll wait all day.
bmx
Freshman
Posts: 88
And1: 0
Joined: Aug 05, 2005
Location: Germany

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#6 » by bmx » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:16 pm

Dirk IS the 2nd best PF ever.
User avatar
Bertrob
RealGM
Posts: 20,328
And1: 1,392
Joined: Sep 08, 2011
Location: Free Clinic
 

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#7 » by Bertrob » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:17 pm

WHAT
WHAT
THAT THAT THAT IS BLASPHEMOUS
THAT IS BLASPHEMOUS
BILL SIMMONS SHOULD BE BANNED FROM THE THE US FOR A DAY
FOR A DAY
DIRK IS THE 2ND GREATEST PF OF ALL TIME?
Now don't get me wrong, Dirk is an amazing player and easily a Top 10 PF, BUT TO SAY HES THE 2ND GREATEST PF OF ALL TIME? DID WE FORGET ABOUT KEVIN GARNETT? KARL MALONE? CHARLES BARKLEY? AND DON'T TELL ME KEVIN MCHALE ISN'T GETTING ANY LOVE
Dirk's resume is very impressive and its certainly not complete yet but theres no way hes the 2nd best PF of all time as of yet
~( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)~
User avatar
PippenAintEasy
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,467
And1: 2
Joined: Jan 26, 2009

Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#8 » by PippenAintEasy » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:17 pm

Kobe2ndFiddle wrote:McHale
Barkely
Malone
Garnett
Duncan (yes he's a PF)


so which one of these guys is Dirk better than ? I'll wait all day.

Mchale easily. Barkley maybe. Malone, probably not.
From the "Story behind certain jersey numbers" thread...
C'mon Cavs wrote:Larry Hughes wears #32 because he sucks.
User avatar
5DOM
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 39,933
And1: 1,695
Joined: Aug 30, 2004
Contact:
       

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#9 » by 5DOM » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:17 pm

Kobe2ndFiddle wrote:McHale
Barkely
Malone
Garnett
Duncan (yes he's a PF)


so which one of these guys is Dirk better than ? I'll wait all day.


McHale?
Image
richboy
RealGM
Posts: 23,833
And1: 790
Joined: Sep 01, 2003

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#10 » by richboy » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:18 pm

He probably just forgot KG. I would say that Dirk is in the conversation. He has a strong case to be pretty much equal to KG in his career. Many people have KG as the second best PF ever. I would take Dirk over Malone. IMO Karl Malone the most un clutch player in league history maybe. I might take him over Barkley as well.
"Talent is God-given. Be humble. Fame is man-given. Be grateful. Conceit is self-given. Be careful." John Wooden
Jay10
RealGM
Posts: 22,962
And1: 2,029
Joined: Feb 01, 2010
Location: New York

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#11 » by Jay10 » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:19 pm

isn't duncan better than garnett?
User avatar
Bertrob
RealGM
Posts: 20,328
And1: 1,392
Joined: Sep 08, 2011
Location: Free Clinic
 

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#12 » by Bertrob » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:19 pm

Jay10 wrote:isn't duncan better than garnett?


yes, definitely
~( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)~
User avatar
Sedale Threatt
RealGM
Posts: 23,061
And1: 1,458
Joined: Feb 06, 2007
Location: Clearing space in the trophy case.

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#13 » by Sedale Threatt » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:19 pm

5DOM wrote:McHale?


I'll second that. McHale was a great player when he was healthy and in his prime, but unfortunately for him that wasn't very often. Nowitzki's on a completely different level -- better and way, way more durable.
JF5 wrote:Real fans don't cry about refs.


http://wtfismikewearing.tumblr.com/
mysticbb
Banned User
Posts: 8,205
And1: 698
Joined: May 28, 2007
Contact:
   

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#14 » by mysticbb » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:20 pm

Kobe2ndFiddle wrote:McHale
Barkely
Malone
Garnett
Duncan (yes he's a PF)


so which one of these guys is Dirk better than ? I'll wait all day.


Is that a joke? McHale does not belong in that list by any means. And Nowitzki had overtaken Barkley before the championship run. It is always funny when people are talking about defense and then completely overlook that Barkley was as good defensively as a guy like Stoudemire with the exception that Barkley was at least a great defensive rebounder.

Duncan, Malone and Garnett are ahead of Nowitzki. Neither was really that much better in terms of peak level impact, but all three have an edge in terms of longevity. And as it looks right now Nowitzki is not going to continue very long on his current level. But well, maybe Nowitzki is picking it up again in the playoffs like he did the last view seasons.
Doctor MJ
Senior Mod
Senior Mod
Posts: 33,376
And1: 3,129
Joined: Mar 10, 2005
Location: Treys are for Kicks!
     

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#15 » by Doctor MJ » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:20 pm

In other words, Simmons doesn't really think like a logical, rational analyst...which we already knew. He's still funny.
User avatar
Kobe2ndFiddle
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,545
And1: 1
Joined: Oct 18, 2011

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#16 » by Kobe2ndFiddle » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:20 pm

PippenAintEasy wrote:
Kobe2ndFiddle wrote:McHale
Barkely
Malone
Garnett
Duncan (yes he's a PF)


so which one of these guys is Dirk better than ? I'll wait all day.

Mchale easily. Barkley maybe. Malone, probably not.

is this a joke ?

I am now starting to realize that any superstar who wins a championship in this era will become GREATLY overrated. Even my favorite player has fallen victim to the media and fans overrating him to high heavens.


This bullshh has to stop immediately, Dirk is not better than ANYONE I listed, at all.
User avatar
Bertrob
RealGM
Posts: 20,328
And1: 1,392
Joined: Sep 08, 2011
Location: Free Clinic
 

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#17 » by Bertrob » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:20 pm

richboy wrote:He probably just forgot KG. I would say that Dirk is in the conversation. He has a strong case to be pretty much equal to KG in his career. Many people have KG as the second best PF ever. I would take Dirk over Malone. IMO Karl Malone the most un clutch player in league history maybe. I might take him over Barkley as well.


:o Does him not being clutch, a term that is subject to anyone's interpretation, cancel out his massive career achievements?
~( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)~
User avatar
Chocobanana
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,733
And1: 210
Joined: Dec 16, 2011
 

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#18 » by Chocobanana » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:23 pm

so he had
1)bird
2)duncan
3)Havlicek
4)Baylor
5)Erving
6)Pettit
7)Malone
8)Barkley
9)Nowitzki
and has dirk just jumping the last 3. if he leadfrogs 3 more, doesnt that put him at 3rd best?
User avatar
Jeff23
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,929
And1: 221
Joined: Apr 14, 2010

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#19 » by Jeff23 » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:23 pm

5DOM wrote:
Kobe2ndFiddle wrote:McHale
Barkely
Malone
Garnett
Duncan (yes he's a PF)


so which one of these guys is Dirk better than ? I'll wait all day.


McHale?


Agreed.

There is just no way Dirk is better than KG, Barkley or Malone.
User avatar
Kobe2ndFiddle
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,545
And1: 1
Joined: Oct 18, 2011

Re: Bill Simmons now ranks Dirk the 2nd greatest PF ever. 

Post#20 » by Kobe2ndFiddle » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:24 pm

the fact that Dirk was referred to as a "bust" early on in his career should disqualify him from even being mentioned in the top 3.

Return to Player Comparisons