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Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season

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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#81 » by SkilesTheLimit » Mon Jan 7, 2013 10:01 pm

JBucks wrote:Watch Hammond fire Skiles and go on the sideline himself.


Would be the most hilarious thing I'd see as a Bucks fan....

Also would love to hear what McGlocklin thinks as well off the record. I'm sure, based on his apparent frustration in broadcasts this year, that he has a whole lot to say about the current state of the organization. Main questions for him would be:

a) Does Herb Kohl meddle as much as we think?
b) Should the Bucks blow it up and rebuild?
c) Does Hammond know what he's doing or have a plan?
d) What do you really think of the Jennings/Ellis duo?
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#82 » by LUKE23 » Mon Jan 7, 2013 10:15 pm

GHOSTofSIKMA wrote:hammond has drafted well and taken some decent swings with his trades. other than gooden who was a skiles guy you cant really hate on anything else he did...... it just hasnt worked out.


The Gooden deal was indefensible. Maggette had a huge chance of blowing up. Salmons was coming off an outlier production period. Bogut for Ellis was inexcusable.

The only thing Hammond has done well is draft in the 10+ range. His FA moves and trades have been horrible.
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#83 » by blazza18 » Mon Jan 7, 2013 10:17 pm

"They've played well together," Hammond said


Does not surprise me one bit he thinks that. PPGZZZ
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#84 » by LUKE23 » Mon Jan 7, 2013 10:17 pm

And the team is easily better without Monta. Some of you guys are insane.
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#85 » by JBucks » Mon Jan 7, 2013 10:21 pm

Insanity is thinking that this team has a core worth building around. They can all go.
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#86 » by whatthe_buck!? » Mon Jan 7, 2013 10:28 pm

LUKE23 wrote:
GHOSTofSIKMA wrote:hammond has drafted well and taken some decent swings with his trades. other than gooden who was a skiles guy you cant really hate on anything else he did...... it just hasnt worked out.


The Gooden deal was indefensible. Maggette had a huge chance of blowing up. Salmons was coming off an outlier production period. Bogut for Ellis was inexcusable.

The only thing Hammond has done well is draft in the 10+ range. His FA moves and trades have been horrible.

Bolded for truth.

Edit: And the one trade he couldve done pretty well on (salmons to sactown for beno and a higher draft slot) he squandered the value he would've added in the simultaneous Charlotte trade. Terrible. And telling. And, looking back, i give him little to no credit for the Bulls/Salmons trade because Salmons production post-trade was pure luck and the only reason it was even possible to make that trade was because of the novel situation of the bulls -among other teams- trying to clear cap space for the summer of Lebron's free agency. That was a situation that will never repeat itself and we were probably the only team that was even in the market to get that deal from the bulls because nobody else was dumb enough to try to help the bulls clear cap space to try to get them room to sign Lebron and a second max player. Honestly, if Hammond wasn't incompetent he probably could have gotten more from the bulls, and he was lucky as f*ck that his trade didn't result in the bulls getting Lebron and Wade (or some other combination of Lebron + one of the other max caliber players that summer).
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#87 » by Run-MKE 311 » Mon Jan 7, 2013 10:37 pm

Ugh, this season is getting frustrating. I like some of our young pieces, but both Skiles & Hammond are not encouraging a lot of confidence.

This once proud franchise needs a huge shot in the arm.
Ball so hard.
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#88 » by giraldo5 » Mon Jan 7, 2013 10:52 pm

Baddy Chuck wrote:
paulpressey25 wrote:
Baddy Chuck wrote:but Jennings is a better point guard then either of our two options left for 30 minutes a game.


I'm talking dealing Jennings for Lowry and getting a new starting PG.

And europa is saying if he had to choose between Monta or Brandon, Lowry not involved.


Give me Ellis as I am terrified of them matching a Jennings extension.
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#89 » by InsideOut » Mon Jan 7, 2013 11:37 pm

Bringing Hammond back would be such a typical Bucks move.

Bucks have one winning season.

An NBA best finish of 15th.

Make the playoffs 1 out of 4 (maybe 5) years.

He hasn't added one guy that is a unanimous top 15 player at any position.

In 4.5 years the guy hasn't brought in a single core asset via trade or FA. Some might say Ellis but he needed Bogut which came from LH to do it.

His best draft pick (BJ) is a guy most want traded and the rest are a couple guys with "potential".

If this guy was a Packer GM the organization would have fired him years ago and if they didn't the fans would literally be storming Lambeau. Ask yourself, would the Packers put up with a GM with Hammonds resume. This is why the Packers are winners and the Bucks are irrelevant in this state. One team won't stand for mediocrity while the other embraces it.
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#90 » by GHOSTofSIKMA » Mon Jan 7, 2013 11:56 pm

InsideOut wrote:
In 4.5 years the guy hasn't brought in a single core asset via trade or FA. Some might say Ellis but he needed Bogut which came from LH to do it.


jennings, monta, sanders, and possibly even ersan when he playing well would all probably be considered around top 15 talents for their positions in the league. i know the board wouldnt agree and theyd probably be mostly right.... but i get the sense that around the league they are valued that way.
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#91 » by LUKE23 » Tue Jan 8, 2013 12:26 am

Two of those are draft picks, he said trade/FA. Sanders is the only one of those three with significant trade value, IMO.

He hasn't done bad in the draft, you could even argue he's done well with respect to position in totality. But there is no way you can argue he's been good in FA/trade. And for a win now team that never drafts high, that's going to remain paramount.
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#92 » by InsideOut » Tue Jan 8, 2013 12:38 am

GHOSTofSIKMA wrote:
InsideOut wrote:
In 4.5 years the guy hasn't brought in a single core asset via trade or FA. Some might say Ellis but he needed Bogut which came from LH to do it.


jennings, monta, sanders, and possibly even ersan when he playing well would all probably be considered around top 15 talents for their positions in the league. i know the board wouldnt agree and theyd probably be mostly right.... but i get the sense that around the league they are valued that way.


"The board would agree they're not top 15 and you agree they'd probably be right..."

Not sure if you are defending Hammond or criticizing him?

Jennings...isn't he the guy you hate and think is a major problem and want gone?
Isn't Ellis like the least efficient 15 ppg scorer in the league?
Ersan...I'll assume that was a joke.
Sanders...got much better but no consistency at this point.


At the end of 5 years if Hammond hasn't added one guy that is a no-brainer top 15 player at a position wouldn't you agree that is a horrendous job of acquiring talent? Off the top of my head the only team that may have done worse is the Bobcats. In 4.5 years please name me Hammonds best move? The move where his biggest fan can point to it and say Hammond can’t be all bad because he got us....
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#93 » by VooDoo7 » Tue Jan 8, 2013 12:53 am

Hammond said last week that the Bucks have already told Jennings, however, that they will match any offer he gets.

Jesus.
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#94 » by GHOSTofSIKMA » Tue Jan 8, 2013 2:02 am

InsideOut wrote:
Not sure if you are defending Hammond or criticizing him?

Jennings...isn't he the guy you hate and think is a major problem and want gone?
Isn't Ellis like the least efficient 15 ppg scorer in the league?
Ersan...I'll assume that was a joke.
Sanders...got much better but no consistency at this point.


At the end of 5 years if Hammond hasn't added one guy that is a no-brainer top 15 player at a position wouldn't you agree that is a horrendous job of acquiring talent? Off the top of my head the only team that may have done worse is the Bobcats. In 4.5 years please name me Hammonds best move? The move where his biggest fan can point to it and say Hammond can’t be all bad because he got us....


not really criticizing or condemning. more like just watching..... theres alot of ways this could go from here in the near future.

..jennings and monta have value around the league..... not to me or any metrics guys but they have it regardless
..ersan is coveted by contending teams presumably as a starter
..sanders has basically turned into a stud... top 15 if i was drafting starting centers in the league
..putting mam on the block would draw massive interest from all over
..dunleavy is a 6th man of the year candidate again. id assume we get calls for him
..udoh and harris could be packaged for a top 15 starter if they were overpaid on the wrong team. they could be kept and developed if the right coach was in place
..henson seems like a solid player
..udrih and dalembert are the exact kind of expiring trade assets teams would like to have

so were positioned really well in alot of ways. saying weve assemebled more than only the bobcats is a crock. id say were in better shape than about 1/2 the league without mortgaging one cent of our future or cash position to do it. we need to consolidate some guys, get a better blend on offense, and we need a true number #1 like all really decent teams inevitably have.

this team needs some work and a little more time. its not all bad despite the recent losing streak. i can think of some things to compliment hammond on considering his working orders. alot of win now .500 teams in backside of the playoff hunt would have arrived where we are with alot worse options. alot of teams with an owners win now mandate arent even sniffing where we are. who should take a little credit for that in our front office exactly?
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#95 » by InsideOut » Tue Jan 8, 2013 3:05 am

GHOSTofSIKMA wrote:
InsideOut wrote:
In 4.5 years please name me Hammonds best move? The move where his biggest fan can point to it and say Hammond can’t be all bad because he got us....



id say were in better shape than about 1/2 the league



As usual I feel the exact opposite. Last I saw ESPN had our futures ranking at 25th.

You never answered my question. In 4.5 years what has has been Hammond's best move?
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#96 » by Baddy Chuck » Tue Jan 8, 2013 3:15 am

InsideOut wrote:You never answered my question. In 4.5 years what has has been Hammond's best move?

Drafting the Sanders we've seen for 30 games.
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#97 » by InsideOut » Tue Jan 8, 2013 3:49 am

Baddy Chuck wrote:
InsideOut wrote:You never answered my question. In 4.5 years what has has been Hammond's best move?

Drafting the Sanders we've seen for 30 games.


Or the 30 games of Salmons?
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#98 » by Baddy Chuck » Tue Jan 8, 2013 3:52 am

InsideOut wrote:
Baddy Chuck wrote:
InsideOut wrote:You never answered my question. In 4.5 years what has has been Hammond's best move?

Drafting the Sanders we've seen for 30 games.


Or the 30 games of Salmons?

Maybe. In the end that ended up as a first round knockout and a bad contact (which turned into Stephen Jackson). Larry looks like he could be our starting center for a while. I'd put that ahead when you're looking at it 10 years from now.
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#99 » by Baddy Chuck » Tue Jan 8, 2013 4:53 am

I just don't really see how see we have great assets. If you want to make a true push and go all in, you probably make it to the second round and that's about it. If you try to blow it up, you really don't have a whole lot of value.

Pryzbilla and Daniels are completely worthless.
Gooden has ridiculously negative value. I'm not even sure you could add him in any deal without there being an overpaid 3+ year player in it.
Lamb, Dalembert and Udrih are probably second round picks and a meh expiring.
Dunleavy as an expiring is probably a pretty easy second or a B/C list prospect, I doubt many teams are giving you a first for 30 games of him.
Udoh is probably a similar type B/C list prospect at a different position (Brooks maybe) or maybe a late first/early second.
I don't think Ersan has as much value as you think. Would he look good on a contender or an all in team? Yes, but they aren't going to give much for him. With the deal he signed you'd probably be lucky to get an expiring with nothing else or more then likely a bad/meh contract and some type of pick or prospect.
Henson and Tobes are players most of us obviously like, but I doubt their values around the league are very high. I doubt you'd get a higher of a pick then either of them were taken at (mid first).
Brandon and Monta are probably around the same type of value. I doubt either are getting you a top 10 pick or a good prospect. You'd probably get some package of a mid first with maybe a prospect or two.
Sanders is probably your best bet at a lottery pick. You'd likely get into the later lottery with him but if you are rebuilding do you really trade him?

We have a lot of pieces, but we really don't have a whole lot of value. I mean, he had a mess when we came here with contracts, but Redd and Bogut at the time Hammond got them would be by far our best two pieces then we have now. He did a good job at clearing the books and picking up decent prospects, but we really don't have a whole lot to show for the time he's been here.
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Re: Aldridge: Skiles Unlikely To Return Next Season 

Post#100 » by Kerb Hohl » Tue Jan 8, 2013 5:33 am

Getting the trump card, Livingston, secretly in that Charlotte deal IMO was his best move.

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