2017 BkRef on/off stats just released

teerfour+40LG · Post #1 » by **teerfour+40LG** » Sun Nov 13, 2016 3:12 am

Source: http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/SAC/2017/on-off/

What strikes you?

I like to look at all the ORTGs. Willie's DRTG (opponent ORTG) is 115.8. When Willie is off the floor, our team's DRTG improves by 9 points to 106.5. That means Willie is a really bad defender, BUT we can forgive Willie if his ORTG is higher than his DRTG (because if you score more points than you give up, you win). Unfortunately, Willie's ORTG is 100.0, 15.8 points below his DRTG, so he is not making up for bad defense with good offense. What's sadder is that when Willie is off the floor, the team has a positive NRTG. That means we play winning basketball without him, while he is like a boat anchor weighing us down any time he steps on the court.

These stats show that we must bench Willie.

SacKingZZZ · Post #2 » by **SacKingZZZ** » Sun Nov 13, 2016 8:27 pm

Eh, on/off stats, still not a fan. Replace Kosta with Willie in the starting unit and watch his numbers mysteriously improve.

It's hard to get a firm grasp of what the team is yet the way Joerger is using players. He's either showcasing everyone, or he's just flying by the seat of his pants. I'm not sure which.

They said the other night that the Kings starting 5 is near the top of the defensive charts, well... I think they were last year under Karl as well, yet the results are what they are.

Post #3 » by **City of Trees** » Sun Nov 13, 2016 9:09 pm

It's hard to imagine Kings starting unit getting worse defensively by swapping Koufos for WCS. Give Trill the playing time and he will improve.

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SactoKingsFan · Post #4 » by **SactoKingsFan** » Sun Nov 13, 2016 9:55 pm

City of Trees wrote:It's hard to imagine Kings starting unit getting worse defensively by swapping Koufos for WCS. Give Trill the playing time and he will improve.

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It's not that hard to imagine if Willie continues with weak defensive rebounding, gets pushed around by stronger bigs and doesn't have significant impact on PnR defense. The problem with Koufos is his offense.

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Post #5 » by **City of Trees** » Sun Nov 13, 2016 10:01 pm

SactoKingsFan wrote:
City of Trees wrote:It's hard to imagine Kings starting unit getting worse defensively by swapping Koufos for WCS. Give Trill the playing time and he will improve.

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It's not that hard to imagine if Willie continues with weak defensive rebounding, gets pushed around by stronger bigs and doesn't have significant impact on PnR defense. The problem with Koufos is his offense.

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Willie is never going to be a bully like Boogie nor will he rack up defensive rebounds... Look I get he has struggled so far but I think you're wanting him to be something he is not. WCS was drafted to compliment Boogie, not do the same things Boogie does.

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SacKingZZZ · Post #6 » by **SacKingZZZ** » Sun Nov 13, 2016 10:02 pm

SactoKingsFan wrote:
City of Trees wrote:It's hard to imagine Kings starting unit getting worse defensively by swapping Koufos for WCS. Give Trill the playing time and he will improve.

Sent from my SM-J700T using RealGM mobile app

It's not that hard to imagine if Willie continues with weak defensive rebounding, gets pushed around by stronger bigs and doesn't have significant impact on PnR defense. The problem with Koufos is his offense.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

Actually it's looked like it's been quite the opposite to me. If anything Koufos has been destroyed in pick and roll (see: Lakers game) and it's his ability to score near the rim that the team has been getting out of him with the starting unit. Willie's pick and roll defense is much better than Koufos. He can come out, show, and recover. Koufos just plays back and gives the guard whatever look they want. Cuz does the same half the time and it's hard enough having one big play that way, but two? No way.

However, when playing as the lone C with Cuz off the floor Kosta has been more impactful. The combo if Cuz and Koufos just can't pressure the perimeter like you have to be able to to be considered even a decent defensive team.

The best unit we've seen thus far on both ends simultaneously was the lineup that finished the game in Portland: DC, Temple, Afflalo, Gay, and Cuz.

tyguy · Post #7 » by **tyguy** » Tue Nov 22, 2016 2:52 am

City of Trees wrote:
SactoKingsFan wrote:
City of Trees wrote:It's hard to imagine Kings starting unit getting worse defensively by swapping Koufos for WCS. Give Trill the playing time and he will improve.

Sent from my SM-J700T using RealGM mobile app

It's not that hard to imagine if Willie continues with weak defensive rebounding, gets pushed around by stronger bigs and doesn't have significant impact on PnR defense. The problem with Koufos is his offense.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

Willie is never going to be a bully like Boogie nor will he rack up defensive rebounds... Look I get he has struggled so far but I think you're wanting him to be something he is not. WCS was drafted to compliment Boogie, not do the same things Boogie does.

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The problem is he doesn't compliment boogie.

Cousins on- willie on
ORTG 108 DRTG112 NETRTG -4 in 621 minutes 1280 possesions

Cousins on-willie off- kosta off
ORTG 110 DRTG 106 NETRTG +4 1606 minutes 3334 possessions.

We are both better on offense and defense when we play a bigger wing at PF next to Cousins over a large sample size. Let's keep on drafting more big men though to compliment cuz.

teerfour+40LG · Post #8 » by **teerfour+40LG** » Wed Nov 23, 2016 2:22 am

When I started this thread, Willie's ORTG/DRTG was 100/115.8. Now it's 99.7/122.2.

SacKingZZZ · Post #9 » by **SacKingZZZ** » Wed Nov 23, 2016 5:19 am

Don't underestimate the difference between being a universally bad fit for a particular player, or a just being bad fit for the type of offensive and defensive system that a team is running when next to that player. Right now a two C lineup is not going to cut it for the way Joerger wants to play on both ends but they could run different offensive and defensive sets to make someone like Willie fit. Willie was drafted based on his potential in a switch scheme and right now he's on a team that doesn't really value that as an asset unless there is no other choice. Defensively as a center he gets overpowered and doesn't bring enough on the boards, two things that were obviously potential issues at the NBA level for him considering his college productivity. Offensively with two centers the lane is full of bodies which means Cuz stays up near the 3 point like just like under Karl. If you want to be a PF in todays NBA you have to be able to spread the floor, that will ultimately determine what Willie is at the NBA level but I still think there are multiple ways on both ends that Willie could theoretically compliment Cuz.