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NBA Historical Stats (Since 1984-1985)

Player GP MIN FGM FGA FG% 3PM 3PA 3P% FTM FTA FT% REB AST STL BLK PTS
Karl Malone147654853.01352826210.51685310.274978713188.7421496852472085114336928
Michael Jordan107241013.01219224537.4975811778.32773278772.83566725633251489332292
Kobe Bryant124545568.21105524374.45416404895.33579509489.83866015924183562031700
Shaquille O'Neal120741916.81133019458.582122.045593511252.527130993026739273228596
Hakeem Olajuwon123844222.01074920991.51225124.20254237620.7121374730572163382526946
Dirk Nowitzki118842606.6940719749.47614713843.38365017400.879959531391036109526786

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Incident Involving Mo & Tony Brown

Moderators: MickeyDavis, paulpressey25

Post#1 Incident Involving Mo & Tony Brown
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:21 am by europa

I've been trying to get further confirmation of the incident below before I posted it but Press has also heard about it and talked about it in another thread. Given the magnitude I believe it's worthy of its own discussion and not run the risk of being buried in another thread. The incident I'm about to report comes from an excellent source but again I have not been able to confirm it through any others to date. While I do not have any reason to question the validity of the following, I also cannot state with 100% certainty that it definitely occurred. So I would request that when people read it they do so taking all of this into account.

MD and Press: Feel free to add any other disclaimers you believe are necessary.

So having said all of that here's the info: After a recent game, there reportedly was an altercation in the locker room involving Mo and assistant coach Tony Brown. The altercation was a result of Brown's very harsh criticism of the PG play in the game. He criticized the "point guard play" for about 10 minutes, talking about how they miss the open man, run the wrong plays, hold the ball for too long, hog the ball, take poor shots and so on. Each time he would say something, Mo reportedly would make a smart comment. So when Brown went off about how the point guard defense on this team was the worst he'd seen in his years in the NBA and how "a D-League player on a 10-day contract" could penetrate at will, Mo started to yell back. It reportedly became physical within seconds with several players having to restrain both of them. Brown was reportedly screaming at the players to let Mo's "llittle ass" go and if it reportedly wasn't for Ivey, the two would have come to blows, according to the info I've received.

When Harris came into the room he reportedly said he was glad some things had come to light and agreed with Brown's assessment of the point guard play. That apparently pissed Mo off even more because all he's been told reportedly is how great he's been doing.

So there you have it. It's possible Woelfel has heard about this incident or something about a major event that happened in the locker room that had nothing to do with Redd, hence the reason for his report last night that xTitan talked about in his thread.
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Post#2
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:29 am by Rockmaninoff

Tony Brown for Head Coach? He looked great against the Raptors earlier this season. But seriously, I like everything I've read, heard, or seen so far regarding Tony Brown. He has poise and intelligence, and is appearantly willing to tell the truth.

This team is imploding.
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Post#3
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:30 am by Fort Minor

As i said in the other thread, I find this ridiculous if it did happen. Absolutely counterproductive to criticize a player who is attempting to transform his game and has done a good job thus far. Then to criticize one position for its defense on a team full of putrid defenders is extremely short-sighted.
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Post#4
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:33 am by Andrew34r

Let me first start by saying I find this story very hard to believe.

If Tony Brown singled out the PG position for 10 minutes and made comments like that in front of the entire team than he was out of line, imo. If he felt this way he could have pulled Mo aside and told him how he felt...hopefully in a much more professional manner than was reported.
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Post#5
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:35 am by Rockmaninoff

Fort Minor wrote:As i said in the other thread, I find this ridiculous if it did happen. Absolutely counterproductive to criticize a player who is attempting to transform his game and has done a good job thus far. Then to criticize one position for its defense on a team full of putrid defenders is extremely short-sighted.


But, Tony Brown is smart enough to realize that when the defense breaks down at the point, nothing can really be done to save it. The only other putrid defender on the team is CV, the rest are average or Bogut.
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Post#6
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:36 am by WRau1

It's kind of hard to believe that the Bucks would trade Mo due to a fight with an As.Coach. If anything, Brown will the one leaving, IMO.
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Post#7
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:37 am by paulpressey25

If some of you don't want to believe this information, that is your right......all information on this board comes with qualifiers as to its accuracy.......and all information on this board comes from different sources who want info put out to "spin" things their way. i.e. info from the coaching staff is leaked to put it on the players. Info from players is leaked to put it on the coaching staff. Info from people inside the front office is leaked to put it on others in the front office or coaching staff who they don't perceive are doing their jobs. It is pretty much the way it works on any team or in any business for that matter.

If you are having a hard time buying this information, just ask yourself this.....would Woeffel report "major locker room issues and it isn't Redd" if this was just Charlie V. upset over playing time?

And I think it is a reasonable opinion to believe that Mo's PG play is not a primary problem on this team. But then your reasonable belief would go against the belief of this current coaching staff.

I don't think this mean Mo gets traded or anything of the sort. It just is typical NBA locker room stuff in the heat of battle. But it is indicative of the challenges this entire team is having in trying to play the way Larry K. wants them to play.
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Post#8
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:38 am by WRau1

Lets ask Flintstone!
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Post#9
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:38 am by Andrew34r

Rockmaninoff wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



But, Tony Brown is smart enough to realize that when the defense breaks down at the point, nothing can really be done to save it. The only other putrid defender on the team is CV, the rest are average or Bogut.


Your very wrong. The only average to slightly above average defenders on the team are Ivey, Bell and Bogut.

Edited to add...and maybe Ruffin.
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Post#10
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:38 am by blkout

Rockmaninoff wrote:Tony Brown for Head Coach? He looked great against the Raptors earlier this season. But seriously, I like everything I've read, heard, or seen so far regarding Tony Brown. He has poise and intelligence, and is appearantly willing to tell the truth.


No no no no no... no more assistant coaches being promoted. This team needs a real NBA head coach. Unless the Bucks plan to enter March Madness every year I don't want any more of these guys.
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Post#11
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:38 am by Chapter29

I also find it counter productive.

Why? Not because its false or because Mo is trying transform his game, but because it really doesn't matter.

Mo in not very good at making his teammates better and he is in fact one of the worst defenders in the league, at least ones that get big minutes.

Why bother yelling at him about it? It wont help and can only hurt by further segmenting this team. He cannot defend and though he is doing a decent job trying to transform his game, he is in truth a combo guard that is better utilized as a scorer who can fill in at PG.

Bottom line in my mind is we will not be successful with him as our starting PG. Don't yell at him, do something about it. Bench him, trade him do something.

So lets do the same thing over and over expecting different results. That sounds like a good plan. Mo knows we want him to be a better leader and distributor. And he certainly knows he needs to defend a whole lot better.

I will say that I feel ill watching our ever switching defense. I would guess that Larry K feels we are such poor defenders and cannot fight through the screens (Hey Mo!) and such, but other teams exploit the mismatches easily.
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Post#12
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:44 am by Debit One

While I'm disappointed to hear of this particular confrontation, I am somewhat heartened to hear that at least someone on the Bucks staff sees the problem at PG.
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Post#13
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:44 am by Rockmaninoff

Andrew34r wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Your very wrong. The only average to slightly above average defenders on the team are Ivey, Bell and Bogut.

Edited to add...and maybe Ruffin.


I really don't think so. Simmons, Yi, Voskuhl, definately Ruffin, and Redd all play average defense. Williams and Villanueva repeatedly get burnt on dribble penatration, neither of them understand defensive positioning, neither is physical on defense.
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Post#14
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:44 am by dunhill

Isn't it a coaches job to be critical? Ok maybe calling him out in public was poor form but so is being a smart a$$. But I don't see this as the worst thing. A fight shows to they still care.
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Post#15
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:46 am by Rockmaninoff

Maybe Tony Brown wasn't speaking only for himself.

Maybe honesty speeds up the process.
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Post#16
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:47 am by Debit One

Rockmaninoff wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



I really don't think so. Simmons, Yi, Voskuhl, definately Ruffin, and Redd all play average defense. Williams and Villanueva repeatedly get burnt on dribble penatration, neither of them understand defensive positioning, neither is physical on defense.


Simmons - below average (too slow)
Yi - below average (too weak)
Voskuhl - what's the point, he gets no minutes
Ruffin - see Voskuhl
Redd - below average (non-athletic + lack of effort)
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Post#17
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:49 am by europa

I failed to add that when Harris came into the room he reportedly said he was glad some things had come to light and agreed with Brown's assessment of the point guard play. That apparently pissed Mo off even more because all he's been told reportedly is how great he's been doing.

I'll add this to the original post.
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Post#18
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:49 am by trwi7

Uhhhh....uhh go team?
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Post#19
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:51 am by paulpressey25

Rockmaninoff wrote:-=Williams and Villanueva repeatedly get burnt on dribble penatration, neither of them understand defensive positioning, neither is physical on defense.


I'm the original CV fan from two years ago.....but even I've got to admit that his defense is beyond horrible and the primary reason why he doesn't get minutes that you'd think his offensive game would deserve.

I know Yi also gets burned a lot, but the difference is that Yi many times can recover and get those hands working to at least alter the shot.

With the combination of CV and Mo on defense, it just is a mess out there. I'll take the flack for my gratitious Andre Miller comments but I really think if we had Miller at PG and Haslem at PF we'd be a better team. Not a long-term 50-win contender but maybe a 43-45 win team. It's taken me two years of being infatuated with offensive shooting skills of CV (and Mo to a lesser extent) to come to that conclusion.
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Post#20
Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:59 am by jerrod

yeah, normally cv's defense is bad, but it wasn't last night


what better way to send a message than to give him the playing time he wants when he is playing d, rebounding, and taking the ball to the basket
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