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Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2

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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1601 » by MrFortune3 » Fri May 22, 2020 8:35 pm

jmajew wrote:
MrFortune3 wrote:
jmajew wrote:
I bet the players are now regretting their decision to take the big jump a few years ago instead of easing it in. The league may have been willing to do that here too.


The cap would still fall quite a bit due to losses in revenue. From the China debacle earlier this season to the pandemic.


I completely forgot about that. Morey has to be hated around the league.


Especially considering China is still not planning to air NBA games when the league returns to play.
That is a massive revenue whole to dig out of to begin with and it's even further exacerbated by the pandemic.
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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1602 » by Southpaw » Sat May 23, 2020 5:05 pm

MrSparkle wrote:
Southpaw wrote:
rtblues wrote:This proposed idea is interesting.
Report: Some NBA executives want amnesty clause to return
https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nba/report-some-nba-executives-want-amnesty-clause-to-return/ar-BB14bMFR
Bye-bye Otto... ;-)

Yeah this could get interesting. A lot of star players could be amnestied (Love, Wall, Paul, Westbrook etc) who could shake up the league. Not to mention the solid roleplayers like Otto.


Another GM bailout.

I’d imagine Felicio gets the axe sooner than Otto. Unless the guy is headed to an early retirement, he’ll have expiring trade value and was pretty good in those 3 last games (albeit limited minutes).

I’m not sure how many guys get amnestied in the short-term. Wasn’t the catch that you still owe however much remaining salary the bidding team didn’t cover? With every team being over the cap, eating 2-3 years of huge salary is unlikely. I imagine most hold on to their clause for atleast 1 or 2 years (like Bulls with Boozer) and save it for when free agency opens up. Could be the difference of $50m.

Agreed about Felicio. Totally forgot about him. Atleast Otto is useful when healthy and I'd imagine he has positive trade value as well.

As for the amnesty, I always it was a "get out of jail free" card in that it clears the salary off the books but I'm not sure.
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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1603 » by MrSparkle » Sat May 23, 2020 5:49 pm

Southpaw wrote:
MrSparkle wrote:
Southpaw wrote:Yeah this could get interesting. A lot of star players could be amnestied (Love, Wall, Paul, Westbrook etc) who could shake up the league. Not to mention the solid roleplayers like Otto.


Another GM bailout.

I’d imagine Felicio gets the axe sooner than Otto. Unless the guy is headed to an early retirement, he’ll have expiring trade value and was pretty good in those 3 last games (albeit limited minutes).

I’m not sure how many guys get amnestied in the short-term. Wasn’t the catch that you still owe however much remaining salary the bidding team didn’t cover? With every team being over the cap, eating 2-3 years of huge salary is unlikely. I imagine most hold on to their clause for atleast 1 or 2 years (like Bulls with Boozer) and save it for when free agency opens up. Could be the difference of $50m.

Agreed about Felicio. Totally forgot about him. Atleast Otto is useful when healthy and I'd imagine he has positive trade value as well.

As for the amnesty, I always it was a "get out of jail free" card in that it clears the salary off the books but I'm not sure.


So you do clear the salary entirely off the cap, however you still owe the player whatever amount was left over from the bidding. So for example, Chicago amnestied Boozer, Lakers won the bid at $3.25m; Bulls owed him the 13.6m left. Chicago did use that cap-space on the Melo offer (ultimately signing Niko and Pau).

https://www.espn.com/los-angeles/nba/story/_/id/11229606/carlos-boozer-join-los-angeles-lakers

So with the shrunk cap, basically nobody can offer anything significant for a guy like Wall. No way in hell a team (like WAS or OKC) is going to eat over $100m of salary just to clean the cap, unless they're in position to sign a star FA and win a chip.
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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1604 » by Southpaw » Sat May 23, 2020 6:40 pm

MrSparkle wrote:
Southpaw wrote:
MrSparkle wrote:
Another GM bailout.

I’d imagine Felicio gets the axe sooner than Otto. Unless the guy is headed to an early retirement, he’ll have expiring trade value and was pretty good in those 3 last games (albeit limited minutes).

I’m not sure how many guys get amnestied in the short-term. Wasn’t the catch that you still owe however much remaining salary the bidding team didn’t cover? With every team being over the cap, eating 2-3 years of huge salary is unlikely. I imagine most hold on to their clause for atleast 1 or 2 years (like Bulls with Boozer) and save it for when free agency opens up. Could be the difference of $50m.

Agreed about Felicio. Totally forgot about him. Atleast Otto is useful when healthy and I'd imagine he has positive trade value as well.

As for the amnesty, I always it was a "get out of jail free" card in that it clears the salary off the books but I'm not sure.


So you do clear the salary entirely off the cap, however you still owe the player whatever amount was left over from the bidding. So for example, Chicago amnestied Boozer, Lakers won the bid at $3.25m; Bulls owed him the 13.6m left. Chicago did use that cap-space on the Melo offer (ultimately signing Niko and Pau).

https://www.espn.com/los-angeles/nba/story/_/id/11229606/carlos-boozer-join-los-angeles-lakers

So with the shrunk cap, basically nobody can offer anything significant for a guy like Wall. No way in hell a team (like WAS or OKC) is going to eat over $100m of salary just to clean the cap, unless they're in position to sign a star FA and win a chip.

Gothca! And yeah, it'd be tough to eat up a 100mil contract for those franchise who are unlikely to sign anyone in FA anyway. Still, an amnesty would make FA2021 more interesting.
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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1605 » by Dan Z » Mon May 25, 2020 7:57 pm

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/258245/Nikola-Mirotic-Says-He-Turned-Down-Three-Year-Offer-From-Jazz-Last-Offseason

Mirotic ended up signing with Barcelona.

“I wanted to spend free agency while on vacation in Greece with my family. Utah wanted to have a meeting on June 30 to sign me as the first player in free agency. They offered me three years guaranteed, a great contract. I spoke to my wife and she told me to take what made me happy. I took a ticket for two days, a round trip, and I left.
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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1606 » by step » Tue May 26, 2020 12:06 am

The offer from Utah is nothing new - but this was interesting:
"My role was always the same [in the NBA]. I was a player who was open to take the shots, who made a ‘pick-and-pop’ among the big guys… I was expected to score 10 points, take a couple of rebounds and that’s it. I felt that time was passing and I had not played the best basketball of my life, although it was very good. As soon as I didn’t feel that joy and happiness to improve, I said it was time to go back and do something bigger in Europe."
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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1607 » by Southpaw » Tue May 26, 2020 8:28 am

I always thought we should've rebuilt with Jimmy and Niko as the core pieces. Admittedly it's not a great core but it probably would've been better than the "Big 3" of Jimmy, Wade and Rondo.
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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1608 » by MrFortune3 » Tue May 26, 2020 7:26 pm

Southpaw wrote:I always thought we should've rebuilt with Jimmy and Niko as the core pieces. Admittedly it's not a great core but it probably would've been better than the "Big 3" of Jimmy, Wade and Rondo.


The problem was roster balance. We kept signing ball handlers and no shooters. Even now the roster lacks balance for the modern NBA. Until you figure out that balance and place guys in a position to develop, the team will suffer.
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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1609 » by Benedict Miller » Wed May 27, 2020 12:38 pm

Ayesha Curry will destroy Steph's home if he doesn't put a stop to her
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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1610 » by StunnerKO » Wed May 27, 2020 2:59 pm

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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1611 » by MrSparkle » Wed May 27, 2020 6:45 pm

Southpaw wrote:I always thought we should've rebuilt with Jimmy and Niko as the core pieces. Admittedly it's not a great core but it probably would've been better than the "Big 3" of Jimmy, Wade and Rondo.


+1

One guy I thought would've been a great half-bargain target for the Jimmy/Niko Bulls was Gallinari. Before the Clippers, he was having up-and-down seasons, but really I think he just needed a better team fit to maximize his game. Coupled with a pursuit for a PG (Jimmy was talking about recruiting Lowry or Kyrie), I really think we would've had a decent playoff team. I get the temptation to "dream big", in fact it's kind of mandatory in this league... But if you have one legitimate two-way all-star on the roster, it's not blasphemous to try and compete even if it's expensive with minimal championship odds. More than anything, it pays to be relevant, so long you don't blow all your draft chips and cap on bloated salaries.

As a Bulls fan, if there is one thing I hate... it's sitting on a large pool of losing young players who clearly have no star upside. I simply didn't get the point of holding onto all these picks who were projecting to be 1-way bench players at best (out of the league, at worst). I got fooled once with the 04-08 Bulls - building a tower on sand. Once the contract extensions, RFA offers or QOs come around, it crashes. Every time. So you look at all those picks from Marquis right up to Coby, and you ask yourself if the draft investments were better than simply consolidating and trading the picks (draft picks have higher value before their first NBA game besides for the 2 or 3 steals in each draft, which would amount to a 3% chance at best, FWIW).

If I had to write a book on how not to GM in the NBA, it'd be about marrying all 3+ home-drafted rookie salaries. Unless they're Durant, Westbrook, Harden.

So again, I look forward to this new FO hopefully wheeling and dealing pro-actively instead of standing pat with every draft pick and making the hard decision on 2-3 guys each summer: resigning a project, trading for mediocre/lateral talent, letting them walk.
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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1612 » by TheStig » Wed May 27, 2020 9:14 pm

MrSparkle wrote:Wow - cap might fall by $30m for next season. Otto is thanking the clouds for that player option.

Rough times for Dunn, Valentine and any other RFA. They might be best off taking the QO.

I don’t know if I can handle another year of PG log jam.

You're going to see a lot of guys take the option this year. Even a max guy doesn't want his extension to start at 30% less. Guys like AD will be picking up PO's.
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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1613 » by TheSuzerain » Wed May 27, 2020 9:38 pm

We probably shouldn't even offer the QO to those guys.

Certainly not Dunn. Valentine has an outside chance of fitting what AK wants to do, but if we're going that route, then sign him to a deal with a team option at the end.
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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1614 » by StunnerKO » Wed May 27, 2020 10:12 pm

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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1615 » by StunnerKO » Wed May 27, 2020 11:51 pm

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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1616 » by jc23 » Thu May 28, 2020 12:40 am

StunnerKO wrote:
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The Lakers bracket is a cake walk unless KD s back at 100%, which they say he will not be playing.
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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1617 » by dice » Thu May 28, 2020 12:55 am

jc23 wrote:
StunnerKO wrote:
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The Lakers bracket is a cake walk unless KD s back at 100%, which they say he will not be playing.

the only important change is that the bucks would have to face the clippers in the conference finals instead of the lakers facing the clippers. which is unfair given that the bucks have had a significantly better regular season than the lakers
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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1618 » by TheStig » Thu May 28, 2020 1:20 am

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The Lakers make out like bandits in that scenario. No Clippers in the WCF and no Bucks in the finals.
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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1619 » by StunnerKO » Thu May 28, 2020 2:02 am

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Re: Around The NBA: 2019-20 Season #2 

Post#1620 » by Southpaw » Thu May 28, 2020 8:05 am

MrSparkle wrote:
Southpaw wrote:I always thought we should've rebuilt with Jimmy and Niko as the core pieces. Admittedly it's not a great core but it probably would've been better than the "Big 3" of Jimmy, Wade and Rondo.


+1

One guy I thought would've been a great half-bargain target for the Jimmy/Niko Bulls was Gallinari. Before the Clippers, he was having up-and-down seasons, but really I think he just needed a better team fit to maximize his game. Coupled with a pursuit for a PG (Jimmy was talking about recruiting Lowry or Kyrie), I really think we would've had a decent playoff team. I get the temptation to "dream big", in fact it's kind of mandatory in this league... But if you have one legitimate two-way all-star on the roster, it's not blasphemous to try and compete even if it's expensive with minimal championship odds. More than anything, it pays to be relevant, so long you don't blow all your draft chips and cap on bloated salaries.

As a Bulls fan, if there is one thing I hate... it's sitting on a large pool of losing young players who clearly have no star upside. I simply didn't get the point of holding onto all these picks who were projecting to be 1-way bench players at best (out of the league, at worst). I got fooled once with the 04-08 Bulls - building a tower on sand. Once the contract extensions, RFA offers or QOs come around, it crashes. Every time. So you look at all those picks from Marquis right up to Coby, and you ask yourself if the draft investments were better than simply consolidating and trading the picks (draft picks have higher value before their first NBA game besides for the 2 or 3 steals in each draft, which would amount to a 3% chance at best, FWIW).

If I had to write a book on how not to GM in the NBA, it'd be about marrying all 3+ home-drafted rookie salaries. Unless they're Durant, Westbrook, Harden.

So again, I look forward to this new FO hopefully wheeling and dealing pro-actively instead of standing pat with every draft pick and making the hard decision on 2-3 guys each summer: resigning a project, trading for mediocre/lateral talent, letting them walk.


Agreed, even signing Rondo at the time wasn't such a bad move because it gave us a playmaker and distributor that we really lacked. Signing Wade was the big mistake and it made our team too ball dominant.

That's why I'm not really sold on our current core and I'd be open to trading them for top picks in the next 2-3 years. I feel like with the new FO, fans would be more patient so it's the perfect time to reset the core because dealse are coming up for Lauri then Zach and Wendell then Coby and we still don't have a surefire player to build around.
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