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Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season

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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1961 » by BullChit » Thu Apr 8, 2021 4:31 am

Anybody watching Jazz v Suns

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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1962 » by DuckIII » Thu Apr 8, 2021 7:44 am

TheStig wrote:
DuckIII wrote:
Butler4thewin wrote:i think qll your guys responses are pretty fair and reasonable....makes me think that our coach is banking on the hope pat turns into a special player in order to get us over into true contenders.....also adding more pieces next season as well but i think by the time pat hits a strong surge we will be in the 33/35 year range for vuc and i doubt hes as dominant by then


This is part of the issue with the trade, you’re right. For the trade to make sense (going close to all in, but still needing one more big move but with limited assets to do it), the Bulls front office must believe that Patrick Lee Williams will be a star.

The problem is that even if he is, it will take several years and will not overlap much with Vuc. So even in one of the best case scenarios Vuc is a bridge player between eras.

Or the FO was under the gun to get to the playoffs.

Krause had to make the move to get Rose. Who's to say they weren't under pressure to make the move?

You can't worry about timelines. If you're getting an all star for your bench big and a couple of non lotto picks, you just do it. Vuc is a skilled big man and doesn't rely on athleticism, he's not going to drop off much in the next couple of years. The only other way was to tear it down and I just don't think the Reinsdorfs had the patience for that.


No doubt there was pressure. Not just to make the playoffs but also to retain Zach. In fact I am certain urgent overhaul to win now was part of the unwritten agreement in AK’s hiring. But that is not relevant to the wisdom of the trade, which I still question.

Anyway, I’m not against the trade yet. It’s ultimately contingent on how AK completes the task. Standing alone, the trade deadline deals were strong.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1963 » by TheFinishSniper » Thu Apr 8, 2021 8:49 am

Ofcourse there was pressure from owner or management to get better. We were nowhere for 5 years. Still are mind you. But at some point you need to start putting and building a team. AK did exactly a year of "evaluation" and doing "nothing" to see what's happening on a team before he decided to go in. Management also let him do both. Evaluation and going all in on trade deadline so it's not like they pulling strings on his back with certain timeline.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1964 » by TheStig » Thu Apr 8, 2021 2:23 pm

DuckIII wrote:
TheStig wrote:
DuckIII wrote:
This is part of the issue with the trade, you’re right. For the trade to make sense (going close to all in, but still needing one more big move but with limited assets to do it), the Bulls front office must believe that Patrick Lee Williams will be a star.

The problem is that even if he is, it will take several years and will not overlap much with Vuc. So even in one of the best case scenarios Vuc is a bridge player between eras.

Or the FO was under the gun to get to the playoffs.

Krause had to make the move to get Rose. Who's to say they weren't under pressure to make the move?

You can't worry about timelines. If you're getting an all star for your bench big and a couple of non lotto picks, you just do it. Vuc is a skilled big man and doesn't rely on athleticism, he's not going to drop off much in the next couple of years. The only other way was to tear it down and I just don't think the Reinsdorfs had the patience for that.


No doubt there was pressure. Not just to make the playoffs but also to retain Zach. In fact I am certain urgent overhaul to win now was part of the unwritten agreement in AK’s hiring. But that is not relevant to the wisdom of the trade, which I still question.

Anyway, I’m not against the trade yet. It’s ultimately contingent on how AK completes the task. Standing alone, the trade deadline deals were strong.

Personally, I would have rebuilt. But I will say, I'm not disappointed in this path. We gave up very little to get an all star. With the right complimentary pieces, this would have been a contender before the nets super team and philly's emergence. Now, they're still a playoff team with a path to a good playoff team (2nd). Who knows, maybe Pwill becomes a star or someone wants to come here or AK pulls another really good trade out of his ass for another all star.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1965 » by MAQ » Thu Apr 8, 2021 4:16 pm

ATRAIN53 wrote:could you imagine........

https://www.nba.com/news/5-potential-nba-play-in-tournament-matchups:

Chicago Bulls vs. New York Knicks
You can expect a major scrap between the teams if this matchup somehow materializes, especially when you consider the fact these clubs haven’t clashed in the postseason since 1996. This isn’t exactly the playoffs, but it’s close enough. The storyline of Knicks guard Derrick Rose, a Chicago native, facing the team that drafted him No. 1 overall in 2008 adds an extra level of intrigue. Both teams haven’t been in the same playoffs since 2013.


Yes please.

Good ole Thibs and Rose vs our 'new' core in a winner take all game
I will reactivate Noah myself if necessary

:droop:

Had to log in and say I dont want any parts of this...no sir, not at all.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1966 » by TheFinishSniper » Thu Apr 8, 2021 4:25 pm

TheStig wrote:
Personally, I would have rebuilt. But I will say, I'm not disappointed in this path. We gave up very little to get an all star. With the right complimentary pieces, this would have been a contender before the nets super team and philly's emergence. Now, they're still a playoff team with a path to a good playoff team (2nd). Who knows, maybe Pwill becomes a star or someone wants to come here or AK pulls another really good trade out of his ass for another all star.


It's early too tell. On paper this is a team with two All-Stars. I must believe there is path in summer in offseason to add 3rd one or if not add 3rd one to add legit complimentary pieces which will put Bulls being high level basketball team in next 2-3 years. Being contender is hard when you have Nets adding guys like Blake for nothing while having basically 3 superstars. And you are team which actually needs get rid off assets to improve.

Not saying we can compete with Nets and their talent, but you get what I am saying. Our improvements must come internally from PWill becoming high level player almost legit calibre All-Star in really short time or trading him in package for such piece. You can't fault AK for pulling any trigger when price for Vuc was almost laughingly low.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1967 » by jc23 » Thu Apr 8, 2021 5:41 pm

MAQ wrote:
ATRAIN53 wrote:could you imagine........

https://www.nba.com/news/5-potential-nba-play-in-tournament-matchups:

Chicago Bulls vs. New York Knicks
You can expect a major scrap between the teams if this matchup somehow materializes, especially when you consider the fact these clubs haven’t clashed in the postseason since 1996. This isn’t exactly the playoffs, but it’s close enough. The storyline of Knicks guard Derrick Rose, a Chicago native, facing the team that drafted him No. 1 overall in 2008 adds an extra level of intrigue. Both teams haven’t been in the same playoffs since 2013.


Yes please.

Good ole Thibs and Rose vs our 'new' core in a winner take all game
I will reactivate Noah myself if necessary

:droop:

Had to log in and say I dont want any parts of this...no sir, not at all.


Ha Bulls fans would definitely have some conflicted thoughts

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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1968 » by TheStig » Thu Apr 8, 2021 7:28 pm

TheFinishSniper wrote:
TheStig wrote:
Personally, I would have rebuilt. But I will say, I'm not disappointed in this path. We gave up very little to get an all star. With the right complimentary pieces, this would have been a contender before the nets super team and philly's emergence. Now, they're still a playoff team with a path to a good playoff team (2nd). Who knows, maybe Pwill becomes a star or someone wants to come here or AK pulls another really good trade out of his ass for another all star.


It's early too tell. On paper this is a team with two All-Stars. I must believe there is path in summer in offseason to add 3rd one or if not add 3rd one to add legit complimentary pieces which will put Bulls being high level basketball team in next 2-3 years. Being contender is hard when you have Nets adding guys like Blake for nothing while having basically 3 superstars. And you are team which actually needs get rid off assets to improve.

Not saying we can compete with Nets and their talent, but you get what I am saying. Our improvements must come internally from PWill becoming high level player almost legit calibre All-Star in really short time or trading him in package for such piece. You can't fault AK for pulling any trigger when price for Vuc was almost laughingly low.

You can't contend with the Nets and 76ers. They're just way ahead of us in talent. But a team built around Vuc and Lavine can be in that next tier with Miami and Milwaukee. They would need really good complimentary pieces. Sort of like a poor mans Denver.

That's a second round team for me. And that's fine to win 50 games and be fun to watch. Maybe the next time a guy like Harden comes available, you sell the farm for him. It's not a bad team to watch and root for. There are only a handful of teams that contend every year.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1969 » by Ice Man » Thu Apr 8, 2021 7:46 pm

On a different note, the Nuggets just signed Shaq Harrison. I love the guy. I know what level of player he is, a fringe NBAer, but that doesn't stop me form loving his game.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1970 » by sco » Thu Apr 8, 2021 7:55 pm

Ice Man wrote:On a different note, the Nuggets just signed Shaq Harrison. I love the guy. I know what level of player he is, a fringe NBAer, but that doesn't stop me form loving his game.

Me too. Hoping we can bring him or Nwaba next season.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1971 » by Ice Man » Thu Apr 8, 2021 8:01 pm

sco wrote:Me too. Hoping we can bring him or Nwaba next season.


I want both, even though they're the same guy. We can start the two of them, plus Dunn and Temple, and pick up Kris Dunn again. My five little attack dogs. OK so we lose but we would have an ungodly amount of steals.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1972 » by Grodoboldo » Thu Apr 8, 2021 8:56 pm

Thought this was very informative



I honestly haven't really watched many Celtics games this year, so I was wondering why they're struggling so much. It's interesting too see Taytum and Smart, who are generally praised all around the media, get fairly criticized.
Ok, Zach is pretty awesome, we should use capspace to give him a full max next off-season.
We should still trade Lauri, Otto, Young and Sato for the best we can get.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1973 » by MrSparkle » Thu Apr 8, 2021 9:17 pm

Grodoboldo wrote:Thought this was very informative



I honestly haven't really watched many Celtics games this year, so I was wondering why they're struggling so much. It's interesting too see Taytum and Smart, who are generally praised all around the media, get fairly criticized.


His criticisms are fair, but it gets back to this idea of picking on the wrong guy (to blame for the team’s woes).

Nobody ever expected Marcus to play like an elite two-way player when he signed his current contract. Tatum was sooner underrated than overrated, as far as his 2nd & 3rd years went - similarly, no one expected him to become Lebron’s equivalent.

They’ve achieved a solid bit of success as a very young core. Simple truth is they weren’t cut out to lead a team of young scrubs, like Pierce and Garnett could. Ainge’s depth chart has gone to ****, if not beyond after trading Theis for Mo Wagner. Did he get possessed by the GM ghost of GarPax?

Their bench is absolutely awful - reminds me of the 16-19 Bulls. And Kemba has been a shadow of his Charlotte self since his injuries flared up.

People seem to underestimate 5-12 rotations. Let’s not forget Lebron had a lottery team 2 years ago, despite some signed players and lotto picks. Obviously wasn’t his fault. IMO the 17 Bulls could’ve gone to ECFs if Rondo was healthy and there was a competent bench, instead of Jerian, Payne, MCW, Zipser and Isaiah freaking Caanon carrying the PG position.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1974 » by Mk0 » Thu Apr 8, 2021 10:02 pm

Grodoboldo wrote:Thought this was very informative



I honestly haven't really watched many Celtics games this year, so I was wondering why they're struggling so much. It's interesting too see Taytum and Smart, who are generally praised all around the media, get fairly criticized.

Not gonna lie, watching them plummet pleases me. I want into the playoffs and even though Brown is one of my favorite players I hate watching that team.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1975 » by Grodoboldo » Fri Apr 9, 2021 1:58 am

Surprised at how much I like this Mavs green jersey.
Ok, Zach is pretty awesome, we should use capspace to give him a full max next off-season.
We should still trade Lauri, Otto, Young and Sato for the best we can get.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1976 » by MGB8 » Fri Apr 9, 2021 2:56 am

MrSparkle wrote:
Grodoboldo wrote:Thought this was very informative



I honestly haven't really watched many Celtics games this year, so I was wondering why they're struggling so much. It's interesting too see Taytum and Smart, who are generally praised all around the media, get fairly criticized.


His criticisms are fair, but it gets back to this idea of picking on the wrong guy (to blame for the team’s woes).

Nobody ever expected Marcus to play like an elite two-way player when he signed his current contract. Tatum was sooner underrated than overrated, as far as his 2nd & 3rd years went - similarly, no one expected him to become Lebron’s equivalent.

They’ve achieved a solid bit of success as a very young core. Simple truth is they weren’t cut out to lead a team of young scrubs, like Pierce and Garnett could. Ainge’s depth chart has gone to ****, if not beyond after trading Theis for Mo Wagner. Did he get possessed by the GM ghost of GarPax?

Their bench is absolutely awful - reminds me of the 16-19 Bulls. And Kemba has been a shadow of his Charlotte self since his injuries flared up.

People seem to underestimate 5-12 rotations. Let’s not forget Lebron had a lottery team 2 years ago, despite some signed players and lotto picks. Obviously wasn’t his fault. IMO the 17 Bulls could’ve gone to ECFs if Rondo was healthy and there was a competent bench, instead of Jerian, Payne, MCW, Zipser and Isaiah freaking Caanon carrying the PG position.


I think that the only reason that Theis is out and Kornet/Wagner in is that was the actual price of getting Fournier. You can’t look at the Boston - Orlando - Miami trades independently —- AK doesn’t give up two firsts and WCJ without getting both Vuc and Theis back. Fournier isn’t gotten for peanuts without the firsts going for Vuc. Separate transactions, but all one deal.

The only “optional” part was the involvement of the Wiz - the Hutch and Gafford for Brown and Wagner part.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1977 » by Repeat 3-peat » Fri Apr 9, 2021 4:47 am

Trading for Rondo was such a great move by the Clips. They needed his BBIQ late in games.

15 & 9 + defense off the bench
Take the red pill.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1978 » by Repeat 3-peat » Sat Apr 10, 2021 6:35 am

Take the red pill.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1979 » by Ice Man » Sat Apr 10, 2021 12:36 pm

Repeat 3-peat wrote:


Zion with 37/15/8, against Philly, where he completely outplayed both Embiid and Simmons. This was his second coming out party. He already was an All Star. Now he's a superstar.
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Re: Around the NBA: 2020-21 Season 

Post#1980 » by Ice Man » Sat Apr 10, 2021 12:37 pm

Repeat 3-peat wrote:Trading for Rondo was such a great move by the Clips. They needed his BBIQ late in games.

15 & 9 + defense off the bench


He sure didn't play like that for Atlanta.

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