NBA Trade Thread #12

[Infinity2152]

Prior 4Y imo were times to make moves.

Right now, I’d stand pat. We currently have a RFA, a deluge of expiring UFAs next summer, no roster spots, and an incoming #12 pick.

None of this screams “commit to this roster” with a blockbuster trade. Sounds more like, wait to see what Giddey signs, what Coby signs (or doesn’t)… along with the rest of the decisions. You also should see if Matas actually improves before deciding he’s some championship piece, and you also need to see if Patrick’s game is truly in the dumpster or if he’s just been dealing with phantom injuries.

The expiring contracts are why it's best to make a move now. we have like 70+ mill expiring. What are we going to do with the cap space? Enter 2026 with the most cap space, bidding against a ton of teams with cap space. We're not going to be an attractive team, we'll have no players outside Giddey, Ball, Matas, Smith, Phillips. If we get free agents, we're likely to massively overpay. I promise you guys will be furious with the contracts we sign in 2026 if we go in with 70+ mill cap space. Trading for existing contracts usually yields better deals, especially if the other team HAS to make a move, like the Celtic will. And it allows you to go over the cap, unlike free agency.

I'm not saying automatically trade for Sabonis, Bane, Zion, etc. I'm saying scour the league and add the highest level talent we can now while those expirings have value. I think free agency is more for filling holes, not building a team or finding a star. Think you get better star deals in trade than in FA.

I like Coby, but I do NOT want him long term in the backcourt with Giddey. Period.

Top UFA's 2026: Lebron (41), Durant (38), Van Fleet (32), Irving (34), Harden (37). Then Ayton, Fox, McCullum, Middleton, Porzingas, JJJ, Tobias Harris. Who do you want to throw a max at?

I’d rather make a bid in UFA on JJJ and give up zero assets (or strike out) than make a trade with assets to build around Giddey. If you strike out, then you continue drafting lotto picks.

You want to dump Coby, but we don’t even know his true value vs. Giddey’s. I know that Giddey is more consistent and well-rounded, but Coby’s hot streak was equally responsible for our wins. He averaged 25/4/4 the last 26 games. I don’t know where you replace that production. He’s our best 3P threat by a mile, especially since the 2nd best shooter is a spot-up/C&S guy.

You really want to pay JJJ max? Assuming he doesn't stay with his team (most do) and the Bulls decide to max out a center that gets less than 6 rbs/gm, where is JJJ taking us if we get him? The assets you're talking about are expiring, they wouldn't exist this summer anyway.

Again, I like Coby. Don't see much of a window for him to improve. It's possible he becomes a plus defender, or neutral, but his physical traits are not great. He's basically a scorer. Doesn't generate assists or rebounds at a high level. I'm taking the 20pt, 8 assts, 8 rb guy who frequently gets double/doubles, triple doubles, is far younger and bigger and will probably be cheaper.

You're replacing Coby's production in the trade, lol! Not like you're trading him and getting nothing back. I've said I would attempt to move Coby in a trade to get a better player, not picks or a worse player. And as a catch and shoot guy, Huerter might be a better fit temporarily next to Giddey anyway.

What are you using to call him by far our best shooter? Career he's at .369 on 6.3 attempts, vs Huerter at .375 on 5.7 attempts.

[sco]

The expiring contracts are why it's best to make a move now. we have like 70+ mill expiring. What are we going to do with the cap space? Enter 2026 with the most cap space, bidding against a ton of teams with cap space. We're not going to be an attractive team, we'll have no players outside Giddey, Ball, Matas, Smith, Phillips. If we get free agents, we're likely to massively overpay. I promise you guys will be furious with the contracts we sign in 2026 if we go in with 70+ mill cap space. Trading for existing contracts usually yields better deals, especially if the other team HAS to make a move, like the Celtic will. And it allows you to go over the cap, unlike free agency.

I'm not saying automatically trade for Sabonis, Bane, Zion, etc. I'm saying scour the league and add the highest level talent we can now while those expirings have value. I think free agency is more for filling holes, not building a team or finding a star. Think you get better star deals in trade than in FA.

I like Coby, but I do NOT want him long term in the backcourt with Giddey. Period.

Top UFA's 2026: Lebron (41), Durant (38), Van Fleet (32), Irving (34), Harden (37). Then Ayton, Fox, McCullum, Middleton, Porzingas, JJJ, Tobias Harris. Who do you want to throw a max at?

I’d rather make a bid in UFA on JJJ and give up zero assets (or strike out) than make a trade with assets to build around Giddey. If you strike out, then you continue drafting lotto picks.

You want to dump Coby, but we don’t even know his true value vs. Giddey’s. I know that Giddey is more consistent and well-rounded, but Coby’s hot streak was equally responsible for our wins. He averaged 25/4/4 the last 26 games. I don’t know where you replace that production. He’s our best 3P threat by a mile, especially since the 2nd best shooter is a spot-up/C&S guy.

Again, I like Coby. Don't see much of a window for him to improve. It's possible he becomes a plus defender, or neutral, but his physical traits are not great. He's basically a scorer. Doesn't generate assists or rebounds at a high level. I'm taking the 20pt, 8 assts, 8 rb guy who frequently gets double/doubles, triple doubles.

You're replacing his production in the trade, lol! Not like you're trading him and getting nothing back. I've said I would attempt to move Coby in a trade to get a better player, not picks or a worse player. And as a catch and shoot guy, Huerter might be a better fit temporarily next to Giddey anyway.

What are you using to call him by far our best shooter? Career he's at .369 on 6.3 attempts, vs Huerter at .375 on 5.7 attempts.

Great points guys!

We are at an interesting juncture with the emergence of 3 guys in Coby, Giddey and Matas after the Zach trade. What I learned is that sometimes for young guys to take a step forward, you gotta force them into larger roles and see what happens. IMO if didn't trade Zach, those guys wouldn't have made those advances. We still have one wobbly leg of the mid-3 stool remaining in Vuc. To really take the training wheels off, and see what we have, we need to see our new 3 play without him. The biggest and most important part of that is leaning into placing Matas in the 3rd scorer role. I'm torn on Coby. He's provided me with surprising off-season improvements more than once, and I love that about him...OTOH, his lack of defense remains a big problem in terms of constructing a contending team with him as a starter.

I think that bringing in another low-level allstar runs the risk of setting Matas back, and realistically doesn't move us meaningfully closer to contention. Say what you want about AK's mismanagement, but he has put us in a position with the assets we have to take 1 big swing at an elite guy (like Giannis), and if you get that chance, you take it. However, guys like Sabonis, RJ, etc. come with both the opportunity cost of not having enough left to get a true #1 option and the risk of retarding Matas' development.

[MrSparkle]

The expiring contracts are why it's best to make a move now. we have like 70+ mill expiring. What are we going to do with the cap space? Enter 2026 with the most cap space, bidding against a ton of teams with cap space. We're not going to be an attractive team, we'll have no players outside Giddey, Ball, Matas, Smith, Phillips. If we get free agents, we're likely to massively overpay. I promise you guys will be furious with the contracts we sign in 2026 if we go in with 70+ mill cap space. Trading for existing contracts usually yields better deals, especially if the other team HAS to make a move, like the Celtic will. And it allows you to go over the cap, unlike free agency.

I'm not saying automatically trade for Sabonis, Bane, Zion, etc. I'm saying scour the league and add the highest level talent we can now while those expirings have value. I think free agency is more for filling holes, not building a team or finding a star. Think you get better star deals in trade than in FA.

I like Coby, but I do NOT want him long term in the backcourt with Giddey. Period.

Top UFA's 2026: Lebron (41), Durant (38), Van Fleet (32), Irving (34), Harden (37). Then Ayton, Fox, McCullum, Middleton, Porzingas, JJJ, Tobias Harris. Who do you want to throw a max at?

I’d rather make a bid in UFA on JJJ and give up zero assets (or strike out) than make a trade with assets to build around Giddey. If you strike out, then you continue drafting lotto picks.

You want to dump Coby, but we don’t even know his true value vs. Giddey’s. I know that Giddey is more consistent and well-rounded, but Coby’s hot streak was equally responsible for our wins. He averaged 25/4/4 the last 26 games. I don’t know where you replace that production. He’s our best 3P threat by a mile, especially since the 2nd best shooter is a spot-up/C&S guy.

You really want to pay JJJ max? Assuming he doesn't stay with his team (most do) and the Bulls decide to max out a center that gets less than 6 rbs/gm, where is JJJ taking us if we get him? The assets you're talking about are expiring, they wouldn't exist this summer anyway.

Again, I like Coby. Don't see much of a window for him to improve. It's possible he becomes a plus defender, or neutral, but his physical traits are not great. He's basically a scorer. Doesn't generate assists or rebounds at a high level. I'm taking the 20pt, 8 assts, 8 rb guy who frequently gets double/doubles, triple doubles, is far younger and bigger and will probably be cheaper.

You're replacing Coby's production in the trade, lol! Not like you're trading him and getting nothing back. I've said I would attempt to move Coby in a trade to get a better player, not picks or a worse player. And as a catch and shoot guy, Huerter might be a better fit temporarily next to Giddey anyway.

What are you using to call him by far our best shooter? Career he's at .369 on 6.3 attempts, vs Huerter at .375 on 5.7 attempts.

Sabonis is not replacing Coby's production. He doesn't space the floor. He's not an on-ball scoring threat. It's that simple. I don't know why this is hard to understand. You had 3 whole years to watch a "talented" team with few 3P threats struggle to make the play-in. Sabonis/Matas/Giddey/your-defensive-C would be the worst 3P team in the NBA by a mile. It's completely nonsensical.

And yeah, I'd rather max a 25yo DPOY runner-up with high-volume 3P spacing without losing 1 asset, sooner than trading our 2nd best player (24yo) for a 29YO who can't win playoff games, shoot 3Ps or protect the rim. (And owed $50M in 2028). If rebounding is his 1 flaw, then I'd take that over the other guy's (age, 3P, rim protection). Especially since Giddey, Matas and Coby rebound and push the tempo.

[Chi town]

Thanks Sparkle.

Left the chat.

Well said.

[Infinity2152]

I’d rather make a bid in UFA on JJJ and give up zero assets (or strike out) than make a trade with assets to build around Giddey. If you strike out, then you continue drafting lotto picks.

You want to dump Coby, but we don’t even know his true value vs. Giddey’s. I know that Giddey is more consistent and well-rounded, but Coby’s hot streak was equally responsible for our wins. He averaged 25/4/4 the last 26 games. I don’t know where you replace that production. He’s our best 3P threat by a mile, especially since the 2nd best shooter is a spot-up/C&S guy.

You really want to pay JJJ max? Assuming he doesn't stay with his team (most do) and the Bulls decide to max out a center that gets less than 6 rbs/gm, where is JJJ taking us if we get him? The assets you're talking about are expiring, they wouldn't exist this summer anyway.

Again, I like Coby. Don't see much of a window for him to improve. It's possible he becomes a plus defender, or neutral, but his physical traits are not great. He's basically a scorer. Doesn't generate assists or rebounds at a high level. I'm taking the 20pt, 8 assts, 8 rb guy who frequently gets double/doubles, triple doubles, is far younger and bigger and will probably be cheaper.

You're replacing Coby's production in the trade, lol! Not like you're trading him and getting nothing back. I've said I would attempt to move Coby in a trade to get a better player, not picks or a worse player. And as a catch and shoot guy, Huerter might be a better fit temporarily next to Giddey anyway.

What are you using to call him by far our best shooter? Career he's at .369 on 6.3 attempts, vs Huerter at .375 on 5.7 attempts.

Sabonis is not replacing Coby's production. He doesn't space the floor. He's not an on-ball scoring threat. It's that simple. I don't know why this is hard to understand. You had 3 whole years to watch a "talented" team with few 3P threats struggle to make the play-in. Sabonis/Matas/Giddey/your-defensive-C would be the worst 3P team in the NBA by a mile. It's completely nonsensical.

And yeah, I'd rather max a 25yo DPOY runner-up with high-volume 3P spacing without losing 1 asset, sooner than trading our 2nd best player (24yo) for a 29YO who can't win playoff games, shoot 3Ps or protect the rim. (And owed $50M in 2028). If rebounding is his 1 flaw, then I'd take that over the other guy's (age, 3P, rim protection). Especially since Giddey, Matas and Coby rebound and push the tempo.

So much to unpack. Sabonis scores about as much, rebounds more and assists more than Coby. His PER was over 22. He more than exceeds Coby's production, in many areas by a LOT. Don't know why numbers are hard to understand. 14 rebounds help way more than 4. 7 assists more than 4. The entire game of basketball is not 3pt shots. As for not spacing the floor, he shot 42% from three last year. Please leave him open, and thank you. Grizzlies are 998-1313 if you want to talk about records last three years. They have Ja Morant and Desmond Bane, but JJJ will take Giddey, Matas and your cheap on ball scorer to the promised land. It's completely nonsensical.

25 yr old center who has never averaged 6 rbs a game to a max contract. You're conveniently skipping that like rebounds aren't a major part of defense and center responsibility.

The 24 year old second best player you're mentioning is 25, and will be a 26 yr old unrestricted free agent in 2026. He could literally be on any team, only advantage we have is bird rights. His value is decreasing as soon as free agency starts.

Oh, and Sabonis has been a DPOY candidate, too.

[Infinity2152]

Are we really acting like we still don't know who Coby is? He's probably the player we've seen the most in the NBA the last 4-5 years. His numbers are almost identical the last two years. We know who he is. If you're comfortable paying him $30-$40 mill knowing who he is, fine. But let's not act like we're expecting him to become a different player. Just like Zach and Vuc, if we re-sign him, we know what we're getting. We should expect exactly what he's shown us.

[2weekswithpay]

Naz Reid isn't better than Sabonis, but looking at who's better shouldn't be the only part of the evaluation. Financially, Reid will cost less than Sabonis. I doubt he gets 46M AAV like Sabonis did, and Reid is easier to integrate into a new team due to his shooting ability. Defensively, they're about the same IMO. It's easier to fit Reid into your defensive scheme, though.

I don't think we should be looking to get either player.

Genuinely curious, do you think we should go for any high value, high cost players or should we stand pat? When do you think we should make our move, if any, to add an All Star level player? I think standing pat has costs, just like making moves comes with risk. And I'm really tired of this "keep adding mid players" thought. Reid would probably be good. He's never started, never played over 28 minutes. Averaged .9 blocks/gm. Sabonis shoots better than him. Reid being a good starting center is more hypothetical than Sabonis being a bad defensive PF.

Looking at who's better is a major part for me. Let's say Giannis, Ja and Zion are all actually available this summer. Now let's just say we already had Sabonis. Wouldn't he be a far better trade piece than anything we currently have? A 19pt, 14 rbs, 7 assts 3X All Star vs the best outgoing player being Coby White? Would having Naz Reid at $25 mill or Sabonis at $42 mill be more useful in that trade?

On the money side. Coby's projected to be looking at $40 mill this summer. I'll bring it down to $35. Say Naz Reid gets $25 mill. So $60 mill. Sabonis would be at $46.7. So does White/Reid outplay. out value, out contribute, Sabonis plus another $13.3 mill player. We signed Caruso, Ball and ven Coby for less. Little more than Gafford makes. So White/Reid vs Sabonis/Gafford for roughly the same money.

Stand pat. We should be trying to gain assets, not trade them away. We are not close to being a competitive playoff team. We have no All-NBA players, no All-Stars, and we don't have extra assets.

[Infinity2152]

Naz Reid isn't better than Sabonis, but looking at who's better shouldn't be the only part of the evaluation. Financially, Reid will cost less than Sabonis. I doubt he gets 46M AAV like Sabonis did, and Reid is easier to integrate into a new team due to his shooting ability. Defensively, they're about the same IMO. It's easier to fit Reid into your defensive scheme, though.

I don't think we should be looking to get either player.

Genuinely curious, do you think we should go for any high value, high cost players or should we stand pat? When do you think we should make our move, if any, to add an All Star level player? I think standing pat has costs, just like making moves comes with risk. And I'm really tired of this "keep adding mid players" thought. Reid would probably be good. He's never started, never played over 28 minutes. Averaged .9 blocks/gm. Sabonis shoots better than him. Reid being a good starting center is more hypothetical than Sabonis being a bad defensive PF.

Looking at who's better is a major part for me. Let's say Giannis, Ja and Zion are all actually available this summer. Now let's just say we already had Sabonis. Wouldn't he be a far better trade piece than anything we currently have? A 19pt, 14 rbs, 7 assts 3X All Star vs the best outgoing player being Coby White? Would having Naz Reid at $25 mill or Sabonis at $42 mill be more useful in that trade?

On the money side. Coby's projected to be looking at $40 mill this summer. I'll bring it down to $35. Say Naz Reid gets $25 mill. So $60 mill. Sabonis would be at $46.7. So does White/Reid outplay. out value, out contribute, Sabonis plus another $13.3 mill player. We signed Caruso, Ball and ven Coby for less. Little more than Gafford makes. So White/Reid vs Sabonis/Gafford for roughly the same money.

Stand pat. We should be trying to gain assets, not trade them away. We are not close to being a competitive playoff team. We have no All-NBA players, no All-Stars, and we don't have extra assets. B

You don't think holding expirings to expiration instead of trading them is wasting assets? We're mostly talking about trading expirings. We only have until the trade deadline to get anything for them.

If we were somehow able to add Sabonis with the packages suggested, he'd easily be the most valuable asset on the team. That is gaining assets for expiring assets. A 3X All Star is an asset. The argument for why we shouldn't trade for an All Star is because we don't have an All Star?

[jnrjr79]

You really want to pay JJJ max? Assuming he doesn't stay with his team (most do) and the Bulls decide to max out a center that gets less than 6 rbs/gm, where is JJJ taking us if we get him? The assets you're talking about are expiring, they wouldn't exist this summer anyway.

Again, I like Coby. Don't see much of a window for him to improve. It's possible he becomes a plus defender, or neutral, but his physical traits are not great. He's basically a scorer. Doesn't generate assists or rebounds at a high level. I'm taking the 20pt, 8 assts, 8 rb guy who frequently gets double/doubles, triple doubles, is far younger and bigger and will probably be cheaper.

You're replacing Coby's production in the trade, lol! Not like you're trading him and getting nothing back. I've said I would attempt to move Coby in a trade to get a better player, not picks or a worse player. And as a catch and shoot guy, Huerter might be a better fit temporarily next to Giddey anyway.

What are you using to call him by far our best shooter? Career he's at .369 on 6.3 attempts, vs Huerter at .375 on 5.7 attempts.

Sabonis is not replacing Coby's production. He doesn't space the floor. He's not an on-ball scoring threat. It's that simple. I don't know why this is hard to understand. You had 3 whole years to watch a "talented" team with few 3P threats struggle to make the play-in. Sabonis/Matas/Giddey/your-defensive-C would be the worst 3P team in the NBA by a mile. It's completely nonsensical.

And yeah, I'd rather max a 25yo DPOY runner-up with high-volume 3P spacing without losing 1 asset, sooner than trading our 2nd best player (24yo) for a 29YO who can't win playoff games, shoot 3Ps or protect the rim. (And owed $50M in 2028). If rebounding is his 1 flaw, then I'd take that over the other guy's (age, 3P, rim protection). Especially since Giddey, Matas and Coby rebound and push the tempo.

So much to unpack. Sabonis scores about as much, rebounds more and assists more than Coby. His PER was over 22. He more than exceeds Coby's production, in many areas by a LOT. Don't know why numbers are hard to understand. 14 rebounds help way more than 4. 7 assists more than 4. The entire game of basketball is not 3pt shots. As for not spacing the floor, he shot 42% from three last year. Please leave him open, and thank you. Grizzlies are 998-1313 if you want to talk about records last three years. They have Ja Morant and Desmond Bane, but JJJ will take Giddey, Matas and your cheap on ball scorer to the promised land. It's completely nonsensical.

25 yr old center who has never averaged 6 rbs a game to a max contract. You're conveniently skipping that like rebounds aren't a major part of defense and center responsibility.

The 24 year old second best player you're mentioning is 25, and will be a 26 yr old unrestricted free agent in 2026. He could literally be on any team, only advantage we have is bird rights. His value is decreasing as soon as free agency starts.

Oh, and Sabonis has been a DPOY candidate, too.[/quote]

Lol, not really. Here's the context on that, which is pretty funny:

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1cz0rl5/the_same_exact_voter_gave_domatas_sabonis_a_vote/

[Chi town]

Giddey seeking 24M per.

I bet Coby gets the same.

This 2nd apron is changing the game.

[Infinity2152]

Sabonis is not replacing Coby's production. He doesn't space the floor. He's not an on-ball scoring threat. It's that simple. I don't know why this is hard to understand. You had 3 whole years to watch a "talented" team with few 3P threats struggle to make the play-in. Sabonis/Matas/Giddey/your-defensive-C would be the worst 3P team in the NBA by a mile. It's completely nonsensical.

And yeah, I'd rather max a 25yo DPOY runner-up with high-volume 3P spacing without losing 1 asset, sooner than trading our 2nd best player (24yo) for a 29YO who can't win playoff games, shoot 3Ps or protect the rim. (And owed $50M in 2028). If rebounding is his 1 flaw, then I'd take that over the other guy's (age, 3P, rim protection). Especially since Giddey, Matas and Coby rebound and push the tempo.

So much to unpack. Sabonis scores about as much, rebounds more and assists more than Coby. His PER was over 22. He more than exceeds Coby's production, in many areas by a LOT. Don't know why numbers are hard to understand. 14 rebounds help way more than 4. 7 assists more than 4. The entire game of basketball is not 3pt shots. As for not spacing the floor, he shot 42% from three last year. Please leave him open, and thank you. Grizzlies are 998-1313 if you want to talk about records last three years. They have Ja Morant and Desmond Bane, but JJJ will take Giddey, Matas and your cheap on ball scorer to the promised land. It's completely nonsensical.

25 yr old center who has never averaged 6 rbs a game to a max contract. You're conveniently skipping that like rebounds aren't a major part of defense and center responsibility.

The 24 year old second best player you're mentioning is 25, and will be a 26 yr old unrestricted free agent in 2026. He could literally be on any team, only advantage we have is bird rights. His value is decreasing as soon as free agency starts.

Oh, and Sabonis has been a DPOY candidate, too.[/quote]

Lol, not really. Here's the context on that, which is pretty funny:

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1cz0rl5/the_same_exact_voter_gave_domatas_sabonis_a_vote/

That's hilarious! I don't think Sabonis is as good a defender or nearly as good rim protector as JJJ. He's a superior offensive player and far superior rebounder. I think both should play PF, they're most effective there, and are about equal. Getting JJJ in free agency with a lot of teams having cap space is a long shot at best. They'd actually be great together, compensate for the other's weaknesses. Could be easily done even after adding Sabonis if Williams is used in S&T. But that's a super long shot. Who else you going after if you don't get him? Lot of cap space, free agent Coby, Giddey, Matas, Smith, Phillips, Ball your signed players.

Really don't think people understand the implications of standing pat. 100% guaranteed we sign Coby to a big contract and 100% the remaining money is spent on 2026 free agents in a much more competitive market. How many seasons have we entered the season with cap space? The money is getting spent anyway, and we're not getting our 1A in 2026 free agency.

Great info on Giddey, Chi. Don't think Coby is looking at the same market. Nobody has money to pay Giddey now except one team, will be way different next summer. second apron isn't stopping teams from signing Giddey, not lack of desire. They have no cap space. But good news about Giddey.

Sco, I hear you about Giddey and Matas getting shots. Coby's high usage, his only value is as a high usage scorer. Figure any trade for sabonis probably includes Coby. Giddey/White/Matas vs Giddey/Matas/Sabonis, imagine Matas get the same number of shots if not more. Sabonis is a better passer than White and looks to assist more.

[Dan Z]

Sabonis is not replacing Coby's production. He doesn't space the floor. He's not an on-ball scoring threat. It's that simple. I don't know why this is hard to understand. You had 3 whole years to watch a "talented" team with few 3P threats struggle to make the play-in. Sabonis/Matas/Giddey/your-defensive-C would be the worst 3P team in the NBA by a mile. It's completely nonsensical.

And yeah, I'd rather max a 25yo DPOY runner-up with high-volume 3P spacing without losing 1 asset, sooner than trading our 2nd best player (24yo) for a 29YO who can't win playoff games, shoot 3Ps or protect the rim. (And owed $50M in 2028). If rebounding is his 1 flaw, then I'd take that over the other guy's (age, 3P, rim protection). Especially since Giddey, Matas and Coby rebound and push the tempo.

So much to unpack. Sabonis scores about as much, rebounds more and assists more than Coby. His PER was over 22. He more than exceeds Coby's production, in many areas by a LOT. Don't know why numbers are hard to understand. 14 rebounds help way more than 4. 7 assists more than 4. The entire game of basketball is not 3pt shots. As for not spacing the floor, he shot 42% from three last year. Please leave him open, and thank you. Grizzlies are 998-1313 if you want to talk about records last three years. They have Ja Morant and Desmond Bane, but JJJ will take Giddey, Matas and your cheap on ball scorer to the promised land. It's completely nonsensical.

25 yr old center who has never averaged 6 rbs a game to a max contract. You're conveniently skipping that like rebounds aren't a major part of defense and center responsibility.

The 24 year old second best player you're mentioning is 25, and will be a 26 yr old unrestricted free agent in 2026. He could literally be on any team, only advantage we have is bird rights. His value is decreasing as soon as free agency starts.

Oh, and Sabonis has been a DPOY candidate, too.[/quote]

Lol, not really. Here's the context on that, which is pretty funny:

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1cz0rl5/the_same_exact_voter_gave_domatas_sabonis_a_vote/

What's the deal that is being discussed here? Coby, filler and picks for Sabonis? What picks?

I like Sabonis, but I don't think the Bulls are in a position right now to give up future assets for him. Okay...you make that trade and now the center spot is better, but the SG position is weaker. The team improves a little and now the Bulls are where...the Hawks or Heat's level? Better? Worse?

[Infinity2152]

So much to unpack. Sabonis scores about as much, rebounds more and assists more than Coby. His PER was over 22. He more than exceeds Coby's production, in many areas by a LOT. Don't know why numbers are hard to understand. 14 rebounds help way more than 4. 7 assists more than 4. The entire game of basketball is not 3pt shots. As for not spacing the floor, he shot 42% from three last year. Please leave him open, and thank you. Grizzlies are 998-1313 if you want to talk about records last three years. They have Ja Morant and Desmond Bane, but JJJ will take Giddey, Matas and your cheap on ball scorer to the promised land. It's completely nonsensical.

25 yr old center who has never averaged 6 rbs a game to a max contract. You're conveniently skipping that like rebounds aren't a major part of defense and center responsibility.

The 24 year old second best player you're mentioning is 25, and will be a 26 yr old unrestricted free agent in 2026. He could literally be on any team, only advantage we have is bird rights. His value is decreasing as soon as free agency starts.

Oh, and Sabonis has been a DPOY candidate, too.[/quote]

Lol, not really. Here's the context on that, which is pretty funny:

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1cz0rl5/the_same_exact_voter_gave_domatas_sabonis_a_vote/

What's the deal that is being discussed here? Coby, filler and picks for Sabonis? What picks?

I like Sabonis, but I don't think the Bulls are in a position right now to give up future assets for him. Okay...you make that trade and now the center spot is better, but the SG position is weaker. The team improves a little and now the Bulls are where...the Hawks or Heat's level? Better? Worse?

The SG spot is going to be weakened anyway. Both our SG's are unrestricted free agents. They are not our players anymore. They can sign anywhere. Coby's not signing an extension. It's not future assets, it's mostly expiring assets with maybe some picks. Vucevic is expiring, Huerter is expiring, Collins is expiring. They're basically not our players past the deadline and can go anywhere they please. We get nothing.

Y'all are way more passive GM's than I would be, lmao! I'm opposed to letting ANY player expire without my team getting something back let alone 5-6 players.

[jnrjr79]

So much to unpack. Sabonis scores about as much, rebounds more and assists more than Coby. His PER was over 22. He more than exceeds Coby's production, in many areas by a LOT. Don't know why numbers are hard to understand. 14 rebounds help way more than 4. 7 assists more than 4. The entire game of basketball is not 3pt shots. As for not spacing the floor, he shot 42% from three last year. Please leave him open, and thank you. Grizzlies are 998-1313 if you want to talk about records last three years. They have Ja Morant and Desmond Bane, but JJJ will take Giddey, Matas and your cheap on ball scorer to the promised land. It's completely nonsensical.

25 yr old center who has never averaged 6 rbs a game to a max contract. You're conveniently skipping that like rebounds aren't a major part of defense and center responsibility.

The 24 year old second best player you're mentioning is 25, and will be a 26 yr old unrestricted free agent in 2026. He could literally be on any team, only advantage we have is bird rights. His value is decreasing as soon as free agency starts.

Oh, and Sabonis has been a DPOY candidate, too.[/quote]

Lol, not really. Here's the context on that, which is pretty funny:

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1cz0rl5/the_same_exact_voter_gave_domatas_sabonis_a_vote/

That's hilarious! I don't think Sabonis is as good a defender or nearly as good rim protector as JJJ. He's a superior offensive player and far superior rebounder. I think both should play PF, they're most effective there, and are about equal. Getting JJJ in free agency with a lot of teams having cap space is a long shot at best. They'd actually be great together, compensate for the other's weaknesses. Could be easily done even after adding Sabonis if Williams is used in S&T. But that's a super long shot. Who else you going after if you don't get him? Lot of cap space, free agent Coby, Giddey, Matas, Smith, Phillips, Ball your signed players.

Really don't think people understand the implications of standing pat. 100% guaranteed we sign Coby to a big contract and 100% the remaining money is spent on 2026 free agents in a much more competitive market. How many seasons have we entered the season with cap space? The money is getting spent anyway, and we're not getting our 1A in 2026 free agency.

Great info on Giddey, Chi. Don't think Coby is looking at the same market. Nobody has money to pay Giddey now except one team, will be way different next summer. second apron isn't stopping teams from signing Giddey, not lack of desire. They have no cap space. But good news about Giddey.

Sco, I hear you about Giddey and Matas getting shots. Coby's high usage, his only value is as a high usage scorer. Figure any trade for sabonis probably includes Coby. Giddey/White/Matas vs Giddey/Matas/Sabonis, imagine Matas get the same number of shots if not more. Sabonis is a better passer than White and looks to assist more.

I like Sabonis, but am concerned he wouldn't be the right fit for the remaining roster. The one thing I do agree with is it's pretty unlikely that the anticipated 2026 cap space is going to be useful in terms of just making an outright signing of a free agent player, so the better plan is probably either trading some expirings this offseason/at the deadline or using the 2026 cap space to absorb a contract via a trade where you won't have to match salaries. I'd imagine most of the players that could hit free agency that offseason that you'd actually want to spend big bucks on are going to re-sign with their existing teams (unless Luka is miserable in L.A.).

[Dan Z]

So much to unpack. Sabonis scores about as much, rebounds more and assists more than Coby. His PER was over 22. He more than exceeds Coby's production, in many areas by a LOT. Don't know why numbers are hard to understand. 14 rebounds help way more than 4. 7 assists more than 4. The entire game of basketball is not 3pt shots. As for not spacing the floor, he shot 42% from three last year. Please leave him open, and thank you. Grizzlies are 998-1313 if you want to talk about records last three years. They have Ja Morant and Desmond Bane, but JJJ will take Giddey, Matas and your cheap on ball scorer to the promised land. It's completely nonsensical.

25 yr old center who has never averaged 6 rbs a game to a max contract. You're conveniently skipping that like rebounds aren't a major part of defense and center responsibility.

The 24 year old second best player you're mentioning is 25, and will be a 26 yr old unrestricted free agent in 2026. He could literally be on any team, only advantage we have is bird rights. His value is decreasing as soon as free agency starts.

Oh, and Sabonis has been a DPOY candidate, too.[/quote]

Lol, not really. Here's the context on that, which is pretty funny:

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1cz0rl5/the_same_exact_voter_gave_domatas_sabonis_a_vote/

What's the deal that is being discussed here? Coby, filler and picks for Sabonis? What picks?

I like Sabonis, but I don't think the Bulls are in a position right now to give up future assets for him. Okay...you make that trade and now the center spot is better, but the SG position is weaker. The team improves a little and now the Bulls are where...the Hawks or Heat's level? Better? Worse?

The SG spot is going to be weakened anyway. Both our SG's are unrestricted free agents. They are not our players anymore. They can sign anywhere. Coby's not signing an extension. It's not future assets, it's mostly expiring assets with maybe some picks. Vucevic is expiring, Huerter is expiring, Collins is expiring. They're basically not our players past the deadline and can go anywhere they please. We get nothing.

Y'all are way more passive GM's than I would be, lmao! I'm opposed to letting ANY player expire without my team getting something back let alone 5-6 players.

What do you mean by "some picks"?

The Kings aren't trading Sabonis (who is their best player) for Coby, expiring contracts and picks like the #12 and Portland pick. They don't need another scoring guard and those picks aren't enough to downgrade at C.

[2weekswithpay]

Genuinely curious, do you think we should go for any high value, high cost players or should we stand pat? When do you think we should make our move, if any, to add an All Star level player? I think standing pat has costs, just like making moves comes with risk. And I'm really tired of this "keep adding mid players" thought. Reid would probably be good. He's never started, never played over 28 minutes. Averaged .9 blocks/gm. Sabonis shoots better than him. Reid being a good starting center is more hypothetical than Sabonis being a bad defensive PF.

Looking at who's better is a major part for me. Let's say Giannis, Ja and Zion are all actually available this summer. Now let's just say we already had Sabonis. Wouldn't he be a far better trade piece than anything we currently have? A 19pt, 14 rbs, 7 assts 3X All Star vs the best outgoing player being Coby White? Would having Naz Reid at $25 mill or Sabonis at $42 mill be more useful in that trade?

On the money side. Coby's projected to be looking at $40 mill this summer. I'll bring it down to $35. Say Naz Reid gets $25 mill. So $60 mill. Sabonis would be at $46.7. So does White/Reid outplay. out value, out contribute, Sabonis plus another $13.3 mill player. We signed Caruso, Ball and ven Coby for less. Little more than Gafford makes. So White/Reid vs Sabonis/Gafford for roughly the same money.

Stand pat. We should be trying to gain assets, not trade them away. We are not close to being a competitive playoff team. We have no All-NBA players, no All-Stars, and we don't have extra assets. B

You don't think holding expirings to expiration instead of trading them is wasting assets? We're mostly talking about trading expirings. We only have until the trade deadline to get anything for them.

If we were somehow able to add Sabonis with the packages suggested, he'd easily be the most valuable asset on the team. That is gaining assets for expiring assets. A 3X All Star is an asset. The argument for why we shouldn't trade for an All Star is because we don't have an All Star?

We can trade expirings for bad contracts + assets, or use the money we'll have to go after free agents.

I've shared my thoughts on Sabonis elsewhere, but I just don't think he's worth trading for. Good player, but his boxscore numbers overstate his impact. He's an awkward fit and isn't good enough to justify the amount of resources needed to maximize his playstyle.

Not all All-Stars are equal, and the Bulls have invested in the wrong kind of All-Star (Demar, Zach,Vuc) in the last 5 seasons.

[Dan Z]

So much to unpack. Sabonis scores about as much, rebounds more and assists more than Coby. His PER was over 22. He more than exceeds Coby's production, in many areas by a LOT. Don't know why numbers are hard to understand. 14 rebounds help way more than 4. 7 assists more than 4. The entire game of basketball is not 3pt shots. As for not spacing the floor, he shot 42% from three last year. Please leave him open, and thank you. Grizzlies are 998-1313 if you want to talk about records last three years. They have Ja Morant and Desmond Bane, but JJJ will take Giddey, Matas and your cheap on ball scorer to the promised land. It's completely nonsensical.

25 yr old center who has never averaged 6 rbs a game to a max contract. You're conveniently skipping that like rebounds aren't a major part of defense and center responsibility.

The 24 year old second best player you're mentioning is 25, and will be a 26 yr old unrestricted free agent in 2026. He could literally be on any team, only advantage we have is bird rights. His value is decreasing as soon as free agency starts.

Oh, and Sabonis has been a DPOY candidate, too.[/quote]

Lol, not really. Here's the context on that, which is pretty funny:

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1cz0rl5/the_same_exact_voter_gave_domatas_sabonis_a_vote/

That's hilarious! I don't think Sabonis is as good a defender or nearly as good rim protector as JJJ. He's a superior offensive player and far superior rebounder. I think both should play PF, they're most effective there, and are about equal. Getting JJJ in free agency with a lot of teams having cap space is a long shot at best. They'd actually be great together, compensate for the other's weaknesses. Could be easily done even after adding Sabonis if Williams is used in S&T. But that's a super long shot. Who else you going after if you don't get him? Lot of cap space, free agent Coby, Giddey, Matas, Smith, Phillips, Ball your signed players.

Really don't think people understand the implications of standing pat. 100% guaranteed we sign Coby to a big contract and 100% the remaining money is spent on 2026 free agents in a much more competitive market. How many seasons have we entered the season with cap space? The money is getting spent anyway, and we're not getting our 1A in 2026 free agency.

Great info on Giddey, Chi. Don't think Coby is looking at the same market. Nobody has money to pay Giddey now except one team, will be way different next summer. second apron isn't stopping teams from signing Giddey, not lack of desire. They have no cap space. But good news about Giddey.

Sco, I hear you about Giddey and Matas getting shots. Coby's high usage, his only value is as a high usage scorer. Figure any trade for sabonis probably includes Coby. Giddey/White/Matas vs Giddey/Matas/Sabonis, imagine Matas get the same number of shots if not more. Sabonis is a better passer than White and looks to assist more.

I like Sabonis, but am concerned he wouldn't be the right fit for the remaining roster. The one thing I do agree with is it's pretty unlikely that the anticipated 2026 cap space is going to be useful in terms of just making an outright signing of a free agent player, so the better plan is probably either trading some expirings this offseason/at the deadline or using the 2026 cap space to absorb a contract via a trade where you won't have to match salaries. I'd imagine most of the players that could hit free agency that offseason that you'd actually want to spend big bucks on are going to re-sign with their existing teams (unless Luka is miserable in L.A.).

Do you mean taking on a bad (or medicore) contract to get an asset for doing so?

Good idea, but I'd be surprised if AK did that.

[Infinity2152]

Does anybody dispute that Vucevic, Coby, Huerter, and Collins are no longer assets past the trade deadline? They're absolutely unrestricted free agents who could go anywhere?

Typing this while watching the team with probably the best defensive center in the league plus Randle and Naz Reid and a true 1A get blown out and down 3-1 to a team starting Hartenstein and a 7 footer at PF.

Again, Sabonis would not be my top target. I'm not focused on how the Bulls look this year. Sabonis would be one of the highest value assets I can see us getting for our expirings before they expire. His value is likely to remain static, he's a great trade asset and player asset. Too much focus on how he'd fit with the current squad. Half the team is gone next year.

Not trying to use our assets to gain future picks when we're paying Giddey $25-$30 mill and we're burning Matas second rookie contract year and our 2025 rookie's first cheap year to gain nothing. the options are go forward or go backwards. I thought everybody hated staying in the middle. Either commit to tanking (don't think we can without a LOT of trades) or get better. Don't stay in the middle. We have to take SOME chances, no trade is for sure.

My favorite move would actually be for a defensive beast. I suggested Butler when he was on the market, was not received well. Immediately turned the Warriors around, exactly the player type we need, top tier defender, 1A type player. Nobody's good enough for us, lol. Same for Jaylen Brown, exactly the type of player we need. He's never going to be traded, we don't want him, he costs too much. Now he's in trade rumors. I'm putting up names, if the best the opposing council can put up is a long shot to get JJJ in free agency or adding 2028 draft picks, I'll keep taking my shots.

So people don't want Sabonis, but want to take on bad contracts to add picks? OMG.

[Dez]

There is zero point to getting Sabonis, he needs the ball in his hands to be effective which takes the ball out of the hands of Giddey.

The Kings aren't going to trade him away for expirings and it makes zero sense for the Bulls to be trading firsts for him.

[Infinity2152]

There is zero point to getting Sabonis, he needs the ball in his hands to be effective which takes the ball out of the hands of Giddey.

The Kings aren't going to trade him away for expirings and it makes zero sense for the Bulls to be trading firsts for him.

Well, I said Coby would have to probably go in that trade, that's worth a couple of picks. Eliminates the $30-$40 mill we'd be looking to re-sign him as well. Not going to argue what the Kings will want for him. Our first round picks have really been killing it for us. We've gotten way better players than Sabonis. Oh, wait. You could probably get 3 non top 5 draft picks and not come up with a player as good as Sabonis. How about it makes sense to add talented players now, rather than longshot lottery shots years from now? You can disagree, but to say it makes no sense is confusing.

When you say there's zero point to adding a player that averaged 19pts, 14 rbs, 6 assts to a team that has ZERO Allstars is also just insulting. He got those numbers playing with De' Aaron Fox, he had the ball in his hands as much/more than Giddey. Unless you mean there's no point to winning more games. Which is supposed to be what the league is about. Are you seriously arguing we don't win more games swapping Vucevic/Coby/Ayo for Sabonis and starting Smith at center and Huerter at SG? Assuming we don't draft a great SG, making Coby even less needed. Or a defensive center.