Official: DeRozan! Player of the Week p69

[WindyCityBorn]

You all may want to take a look at DeRozan's pre and post All-Star splits from last season. His game really fell off during the second half, and it also appears that he had to take a number of games off just to rest.

Pre All-Star
ORTG: 125
DRTG: 114

Post All-Star
ORTG: 120
DRTG: 119

He also doesn't have a 3 point shot to rely on to carry himself over the finish line as he closes out his career.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/d/derozde01/splits/2021

Well good thing he won’t have to carry the team here. Carrying a bad team will wear you down. It happened with Zach post all-star break as well and he was only 26.

[Portiseyes]

Just looking at the contract from a real high level, DeRozan last season is 25th in pts, 22nd in PER, and 11th in assists... his contract is 3 years and doesn't crack top 40 per/yr. He can run our offense in the half court, score on good efficiency, and gives us a 2nd creator who draws fouls. Arguably this is a better version of DeRozan for the Bulls than the one who was getting regular Allstar selections.

[WindyCityBorn]

Just looking at the contract from a real high level, DeRozan last season is 25th in pts, 22nd in PER, and 11th in assists... his contract is 3 years and doesn't crack top 40 per/yr. He can run our offense in the half court, score on good efficiency, and gives us a 2nd creator who draws fouls. Arguably this is a better version of DeRozan for the Bulls than the one who was getting regular Allstar selections.

This is a better version than the one in Toronto. He has flown under the radar with the Spurs. I would be shocked if he makes the all-star game next season.

[MisterRoy]

So...when does this become official?


Sent from somewhere you've never been.

[dukeespn]

Analytics people seem to really hate what Bulls gave up on to S&T DeRozan AND they also hate the contract itself.

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I'm not one of them but I also don't love the idea to bring him. I'm not sure if DeRozan would still have positive trade value in 2023-24 season but I hope so.

At least Sam Vecenie of the Athletics (draft guru) loves the fit.

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Why would be trying to trade after one season? You all like a 33 year can’t play at high level any more. Looking at the list of top players that clearly isn’t true.

Trying to trade him after one season? What are you talking about? I mentioned 2023-2024 season and that year is the last season of 3-year contract.

His defense is more terrible than people think and it always harms his overall production. He needs to be a very good offensive player to compensate defensive loss.

On offensive end the problem is he has to create most of his own shots to make the buckets. His 3pt shooting is literally non-existent which means we can't use him as a catch-and-shooter. He hasn't cut to the basket that much in his whole career too. In one word his off-ball impact is not good while other notable stars can impact the game playing off the ball. They can knock down 3s after they receive passes or can cut to the basket to score with ease. Some star players can defend too. That's the big difference. DeRozan must get older on the Bulls and his on-ball creation requires lots of energy while he showed little evidence that he can play moving off the ball.

[sco]

I think DD is who he is. I think it's on Billy to utilize him correctly. I saw what Billy did with Thad last season and I have some optimism. Surely DD's defense will be a problem, but his elite playmaking and foul drawing are two things we'll need. I think the biggest opportunity will be to stagger his time with Zach as much as possible. Line-ups like:

Caruso, White, DD, [defensive PF TBD], Bradley
Ball, Green, TBJ, DD, Vuc

Could be very effective.

[MGB8]

I think DD is who he is. I think it's on Billy to utilize him correctly. I saw what Billy did with Thad last season and I have some optimism. Surely DD's defense will be a problem, but his elite playmaking and foul drawing are two things we'll need. I think the biggest opportunity will be to stagger his time with Zach as much as possible. Line-ups like:

Caruso, White, DD, [defensive PF TBD], Bradley
Ball, Green, TBJ, DD, Vuc

Could be very effective.

While I definitely think you'll see staggering, don't underestimate how potent the combo of LaVine plus DeRozan may turn out to be. Has DeRozan ever played with a perimeter scorer as good as Zach. Even 80% of Zach?

The fit between DD, ZL and NV is very, very good. Perimeter oriented with an ability to attack, attack oriented mainly mid or close with high level distribution, and an inside/outside offensively versatile big. You add in two expected "3&D+" type guys in Lonzo and Pat, and that's good spacing, good passing, good attack abilities on offense.

[sco]

I think DD is who he is. I think it's on Billy to utilize him correctly. I saw what Billy did with Thad last season and I have some optimism. Surely DD's defense will be a problem, but his elite playmaking and foul drawing are two things we'll need. I think the biggest opportunity will be to stagger his time with Zach as much as possible. Line-ups like:

Caruso, White, DD, [defensive PF TBD], Bradley
Ball, Green, TBJ, DD, Vuc

Could be very effective.

While I definitely think you'll see staggering, don't underestimate how potent the combo of LaVine plus DeRozan may turn out to be. Has DeRozan ever played with a perimeter scorer as good as Zach. Even 80% of Zach?

The fit between DD, ZL and NV is very, very good. Perimeter oriented with an ability to attack, attack oriented mainly mid or close with high level distribution, and an inside/outside offensively versatile big. You add in two expected "3&D+" type guys in Lonzo and Pat, and that's good spacing, good passing, good attack abilities on offense.

I think the goal should be to play the big 3 together for the first and last several minutes of the game and keep 2 of them on the floor the whole game while resting the 3rd. I don't hate Zach and DD together, especially with better defense from Zach. Ideally, given their age, I'd prefer to see Vuc, and especially play 30 mpg to keep them healthy.

[mmmmmbeeer]

On offensive end the problem is he has to create most of his own shots to make the buckets. His 3pt shooting is literally non-existent which means we can't use him as a catch-and-shooter. He hasn't cut to the basket that much in his whole career too. In one word his off-ball impact is not good while other notable stars can impact the game playing off the ball. They can knock down 3s after they receive passes or can cut to the basket to score with ease. Some star players can defend too. That's the big difference. DeRozan must get older on the Bulls and his on-ball creation requires lots of energy while he showed little evidence that he can play moving off the ball.

This is an incredibly pessimistic scouting report. Wow.

[FriedRise]

I think DD is who he is. I think it's on Billy to utilize him correctly. I saw what Billy did with Thad last season and I have some optimism. Surely DD's defense will be a problem, but his elite playmaking and foul drawing are two things we'll need. I think the biggest opportunity will be to stagger his time with Zach as much as possible. Line-ups like:

Caruso, White, DD, [defensive PF TBD], Bradley
Ball, Green, TBJ, DD, Vuc

Could be very effective.

While I definitely think you'll see staggering, don't underestimate how potent the combo of LaVine plus DeRozan may turn out to be. Has DeRozan ever played with a perimeter scorer as good as Zach. Even 80% of Zach?

The fit between DD, ZL and NV is very, very good. Perimeter oriented with an ability to attack, attack oriented mainly mid or close with high level distribution, and an inside/outside offensively versatile big. You add in two expected "3&D+" type guys in Lonzo and Pat, and that's good spacing, good passing, good attack abilities on offense.

I'd say Kyle Lowry was probably that when they were both in Toronto, and he did play with a dominant big man in LMA once he was traded to SA. But yeah, I don't think DDR has played with 2 dominant scorers like this on the same team.

This also might be the first time in Bulls history that we have three 20ppg scorers at the same time, even dating back to the MJ & Scotty years. So I don't think we'll have much trouble scoring. But if we can commit and get our **** together on defense, this team should be able to go pretty far.

[StunnerKO]

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[Darius Miles Davis]

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Would be a good get for Phoenix. Is Jalen Smith and the Saric expiring enough for San Antonio though?


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[erlim]

I think DD is who he is. I think it's on Billy to utilize him correctly. I saw what Billy did with Thad last season and I have some optimism. Surely DD's defense will be a problem, but his elite playmaking and foul drawing are two things we'll need. I think the biggest opportunity will be to stagger his time with Zach as much as possible. Line-ups like:

Caruso, White, DD, [defensive PF TBD], Bradley
Ball, Green, TBJ, DD, Vuc

Could be very effective.

While I definitely think you'll see staggering, don't underestimate how potent the combo of LaVine plus DeRozan may turn out to be. Has DeRozan ever played with a perimeter scorer as good as Zach. Even 80% of Zach?

The fit between DD, ZL and NV is very, very good. Perimeter oriented with an ability to attack, attack oriented mainly mid or close with high level distribution, and an inside/outside offensively versatile big. You add in two expected "3&D+" type guys in Lonzo and Pat, and that's good spacing, good passing, good attack abilities on offense.

I'd say Kyle Lowry was probably that when they were both in Toronto, and he did play with a dominant big man in LMA once he was traded to SA. But yeah, I don't think DDR has played with 2 dominant scorers like this on the same team.

This also might be the first time in Bulls history that we have three 20ppg scorers at the same time, even dating back to the MJ & Scotty years. So I don't think we'll have much trouble scoring. But if we can commit and get our **** together on defense, this team should be able to go pretty far.

Wasn’t Pau, Buckets, and Rose all 20 ppg?

[FriedRise]

While I definitely think you'll see staggering, don't underestimate how potent the combo of LaVine plus DeRozan may turn out to be. Has DeRozan ever played with a perimeter scorer as good as Zach. Even 80% of Zach?

The fit between DD, ZL and NV is very, very good. Perimeter oriented with an ability to attack, attack oriented mainly mid or close with high level distribution, and an inside/outside offensively versatile big. You add in two expected "3&D+" type guys in Lonzo and Pat, and that's good spacing, good passing, good attack abilities on offense.

I'd say Kyle Lowry was probably that when they were both in Toronto, and he did play with a dominant big man in LMA once he was traded to SA. But yeah, I don't think DDR has played with 2 dominant scorers like this on the same team.

This also might be the first time in Bulls history that we have three 20ppg scorers at the same time, even dating back to the MJ & Scotty years. So I don't think we'll have much trouble scoring. But if we can commit and get our **** together on defense, this team should be able to go pretty far.

Wasn’t Pau, Buckets, and Rose all 20 ppg?

That was our last good team, but Jimmy was the only 20ppg player (and he was right at 20.0 lol). Pau averaged 18.5 while DRose had 17.7.

We shall see if all Zach, Vooch, and DDR are gonna average 20+ here playing together. Usually somebody's production ends up dropping as they take a backseat, but Kyrie, KD, and Harden all managed to average 24+ in Brooklyn.

[Betta Bulleavit]

I'd say Kyle Lowry was probably that when they were both in Toronto, and he did play with a dominant big man in LMA once he was traded to SA. But yeah, I don't think DDR has played with 2 dominant scorers like this on the same team.

This also might be the first time in Bulls history that we have three 20ppg scorers at the same time, even dating back to the MJ & Scotty years. So I don't think we'll have much trouble scoring. But if we can commit and get our **** together on defense, this team should be able to go pretty far.

Wasn’t Pau, Buckets, and Rose all 20 ppg?

That was our last good team, but Jimmy was the only 20ppg player (and he was right at 20.0 lol). Pau averaged 18.5 while DRose had 17.7.

We shall see if all Zach, Vooch, and DDR are gonna average 20+ here playing together. Usually somebody's production ends up dropping as they take a backseat, but Kyrie, KD, and Harden all managed to average 24+ in Brooklyn.

Given how this team is constructed, I don’t know that each of Zach, Vuc and DDR average 20+ would be the most optimal thing. Unless our pace is just super fast. If not, somebody is going to get phased out in that scenario (either Lonzo or PWill). I think 25 for Zach, 20ish for Vuc and 18ish for DDR would be the most optimal scenario to be honest.

[SaNdMiRkS]

You all may want to take a look at DeRozan's pre and post All-Star splits from last season. His game really fell off during the second half, and it also appears that he had to take a number of games off just to rest.

Pre All-Star
ORTG: 125
DRTG: 114

Post All-Star
ORTG: 120
DRTG: 119

He also doesn't have a 3 point shot to rely on to carry himself over the finish line as he closes out his career.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/d/derozde01/splits/2021

Well good thing he won’t have to carry the team here. Carrying a bad team will wear you down. It happened with Zach post all-star break as well and he was only 26.

And that Spurs team last seasons was indeed *baaaaad*. Really poorly put together & chock full of young, green players who just sort of stood around while DDR went to work. He was asked to do too much

This will be the best starting 5 he's ever played with by a country mile, and it'll be the very first time in his career that he will have the luxury of being a 3rd option

[sco]

Wasn’t Pau, Buckets, and Rose all 20 ppg?

That was our last good team, but Jimmy was the only 20ppg player (and he was right at 20.0 lol). Pau averaged 18.5 while DRose had 17.7.

We shall see if all Zach, Vooch, and DDR are gonna average 20+ here playing together. Usually somebody's production ends up dropping as they take a backseat, but Kyrie, KD, and Harden all managed to average 24+ in Brooklyn.

Given how this team is constructed, I don’t know that each of Zach, Vuc and DDR average 20+ would be the most optimal thing. Unless our pace is just super fast. If not, somebody is going to get phased out in that scenario (either Lonzo or PWill). I think 25 for Zach, 20ish for Vuc and 18ish for DDR would be the most optimal scenario to be honest.

I think the biggest barrier for those guys scoring 20+ each will be more about how many shots Ball, White and Pat get. I'd be happier with those other 3 scoring in the low-mid-teens than having 3 20pt scorers.

[Betta Bulleavit]

That was our last good team, but Jimmy was the only 20ppg player (and he was right at 20.0 lol). Pau averaged 18.5 while DRose had 17.7.

We shall see if all Zach, Vooch, and DDR are gonna average 20+ here playing together. Usually somebody's production ends up dropping as they take a backseat, but Kyrie, KD, and Harden all managed to average 24+ in Brooklyn.

Given how this team is constructed, I don’t know that each of Zach, Vuc and DDR average 20+ would be the most optimal thing. Unless our pace is just super fast. If not, somebody is going to get phased out in that scenario (either Lonzo or PWill). I think 25 for Zach, 20ish for Vuc and 18ish for DDR would be the most optimal scenario to be honest.

I think the biggest barrier for those guys scoring 20+ each will be more about how many shots Ball, White and Pat get. I'd be happier with those other 3 scoring in the low-mid-teens than having 3 20pt scorers.

I agree with this 100%. The more we can get out of our complimentary guys going, the harder it will be for opposing defenses to double and triple team whenever they feel like it. And given that we have two elite iso scorers, that should bode well for the offense as a whole.

I think this team will definitely figure it out offensively. Our big key is going to be whether or not we can consistently bring intensity on the defensive side of the ball. We don’t need to be a top 5 defensive team. But we gotta figure out a way to be middle of the pack in that regard. Otherwise we will find ourselves playing catch up more often than not. And that’s when guys will start to press offensively.

[sco]

Given how this team is constructed, I don’t know that each of Zach, Vuc and DDR average 20+ would be the most optimal thing. Unless our pace is just super fast. If not, somebody is going to get phased out in that scenario (either Lonzo or PWill). I think 25 for Zach, 20ish for Vuc and 18ish for DDR would be the most optimal scenario to be honest.

I think the biggest barrier for those guys scoring 20+ each will be more about how many shots Ball, White and Pat get. I'd be happier with those other 3 scoring in the low-mid-teens than having 3 20pt scorers.

I agree with this 100%. The more we can get out of our complimentary guys going, the harder it will be for opposing defenses to double and triple team whenever they feel like it. And given that we have two elite iso scorers, that should bode well for the offense as a whole.

I think this team will definitely figure it out offensively. Our big key is going to be whether or not we can consistently bring intensity on the defensive side of the ball. We don’t need to be a top 5 defensive team. But we gotta figure out a way to be middle of the pack in that regard. Otherwise we will find ourselves playing catch up more often than not. And that’s when guys will start to press offensively.

Yeah, defense will be a challenge, but if Billy is smart, we won't keep our big 3 out together for more than 18-20MPG, resting one at a time for most of the game. We lack shot blocking, but having guys like Ball, Caruso, Ayo, Brown, Green, Williams and Bradley to sprinkle in to line-ups can be really helpful. I like line-ups like:

Ball, Lavine, Brown, Pat, Vuc
Ball, Green, Brown, DD, Vuc
Caruso, White, Brown, DD, Bradley
Caruso, Lavine, Green, Pat, Vuc

[StunnerKO]

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