2025 Draft prospects - thread 2

[League Circles]

That's true.

But do we really have an avenue to get one of those high ceiling stars beyond blind luck? Those guys go top 2 in the draft when it's obvious they're the goods.

#1 Cornerstones are drafted outside top 2 all the time. Look at the playoffs… Brunson, Hali, SGA, Jokic,

Sure, but that reinforces the point. Sometimes you get a predictable #1 star coming into the draft, take that person super high, and it's no surprise. But maybe it's not as much as blind luck, but obviously none of those four players' current teams anticipated those players would become as good as they did. The NBA just involves a lot of luck. So, it can be "oh, I can sign a good player because Dallas doesn't want to pay him" or "this 2nd rounder is worth a flyer," and then all of a sudden that player becomes awesome and now you're a contender.

To some extent, this does suggest that just having a lot of draft picks is good, because picking who is going to "pop" is hard unless you're at the very top (and there are still busts there, too), and since it's tough to actually acquire top picks, just being able to take a lot of swings and see what hits can be a good way to go about things.

Depends on how many roster spots you want to waste in fringe nba players and how strongly you believe that certain guys are destined for greatness before they enter the league (which I don't particularly believe).

And the top of the draft equation isn't nearly just about busts. Take top 3 picks for example. At any moment, there are like 20+ "top 3 picks" in the nba in their prime age range (like like 25 to 32 years of age or so). So even if they all hit, which we know is very far from the truth, having a top 3 pick hit merely suggests that you have a top 20 player, which drives you NO WHERE. That's why IMO, unless you have a literal proven top 3 player in the world (which is who, Jokic, Giannis and SGA maybe right now???), trying to win driven by your top guy (as opposed to your top 2, 3, 4, or 5 guys) is futile.

I think the Jordan Bulls build understandably ruined our perception of what can and should be done for decades now.

[TheSuzerain]

Agreed, but a fair number of NBA "stars" have always actually made for hard ceilings on what their teams can achieve.

That's true.

But do we really have an avenue to get one of those high ceiling stars beyond blind luck? Those guys go top 2 in the draft when it's obvious they're the goods.

#1 Cornerstones are drafted outside top 2 all the time. Look at the playoffs… Brunson, Hali, SGA, Jokic,

Of course they are. But there's a lot of luck involved in those.

[Jvaughn]

Definitely not my favorite prospect, especially with foot issues already, but here's his breakdown:

Watch on YouTube

[Rose2Boozer]

Alperun Sengun basically disproves all the Queen defense fatalism and is a good comp in general.

sengun's offensive game entering the draft was so much more refined than queen's is

Kyle Filipowski had a solid rookie season.

[samwana]

I really miss ManRam this time of year...

Wäre did he go? Yeah Miss him too.

[TheJordanRule]

Honestly, would Coby fetch a mid lotto pick in return? Coby is good, with limited upside. A certified scorer in the NBA, sure, but is he even a starter on a team less desperate for starters? The ability to add a genuinely elite athlete like Fears over Coby is much preferrable to Coby. Not just from a value contract standpoint, but from a core-based standpoint.

[Indomitable]

I think I'm just out on Queen. Would probably have him in the 20s. I just don't believe in his offense enough to justify the defense being what it is. If he's not elite offensively, I don't see how he's more than a backup. I get that you just bet on his offensive ceiling at some point, but I wouldn't be willing to do that in the lottery.

He has always fallen into the category of players who I want to see gone before the Bulls pick (kinda like Cody Williams last year). It sucks that he seems to be "falling" into the Bulls range. I just hope AK has seen enough of a team with zero rim protection.

If we had the shotblocking at the 4 position maybe. Pat is useless and Matais is the guy I am worried about.

[Indomitable]

who are the other hub bigs with even a remotely similar profile to queen who have come out of college and panned out at the nba level? the most recent example i could think of was sabonis nearly a decade ago, and he also was an appreciably better shot-maker than queen was as a prospect (although sabonis didn't play much his freshman year and came out as a sophomore)

it's just not a very common archetype, and even when those players do hit up to an all-star level, there can still be major questions about how much they contribute to winning / whether they place a cap on your ability to contend for a championship if they're a central part of your team

I also don't get using Sengun as a supportive example. The Rockets have arguably the best defensive guard and wing depth in the league. They do about as great a job as possible to minimize how you can exploit the deficiencies of Sengun on defense.

If your hope is that Queen is the starting center going forward, then you're back trying to build the team with a Vuc type of player going forward again. If you have the perimeter defenders, it works. If you don't....well, yeah.

They started Adams to help with his
deficiencies. We need a defensive presence or a potential lockdown defender.

[kulaz3000]

Just to be clear, I don't hate Queen as a prospect. He just comes with risks, though many of them do, but especially when it comes to weight and conditioning for a big man, I'm always weary. That said, for a big man he has some unique skills, he is quick on his feet, rather nimble, albeit lumbering, has legit play-making skills for his size and has a high basketball IQ, makes quick decisions with the ball and usually for a big man, fantastic foot work both in the post and out in the perimeter, play-making/passing and decision making is one of the last things they learn.

I'd go as far as to say, considering his skill level, if he was a better conditioned player, he would be a top 3 draft pick, possibly a clear-cut number two because I could see him playing perfectly along side of Wemby, and that's even despite his relatively poor athleticism, he just has that much skill. That all said though, he would really need to make a 180 as far as his conditioning goes, and though there are many that have gone from thin to strong, not many have gone from fat to lean. And though he isn't fat in the traditional sense, it makes me nervous that conditioning is going to either make or break his career.

If he were to fall to 12, and the Bulls select him, I wouldn't hate it, but I certainly wouldn't love it, because he isn't a fit as far as style of play we seem to have settled on, but my pessimism that he would turn things around with his weight and conditioning by the time we would need to decide whether to extend him or not.

[TheSuzerain]

I think I'm just out on Queen. Would probably have him in the 20s. I just don't believe in his offense enough to justify the defense being what it is. If he's not elite offensively, I don't see how he's more than a backup. I get that you just bet on his offensive ceiling at some point, but I wouldn't be willing to do that in the lottery.

He has always fallen into the category of players who I want to see gone before the Bulls pick (kinda like Cody Williams last year). It sucks that he seems to be "falling" into the Bulls range. I just hope AK has seen enough of a team with zero rim protection.

If we had the shotblocking at the 4 position maybe. Pat is useless and Matais is the guy I am worried about.

We do have shot blocking at the 4?

The fit with Matas is a big part of Queen's appeal.

[2weekswithpay]

Read on Twitter

I wouldn't call Fleming over Yaxel wings, but still good history for long armed wings.

[boozapalooza]

Read on Twitter

I wouldn't call Fleming over Yaxel wings, but still good history for long armed wings.

Cedric Coward stock to the moon. Massive upside if hes there 12.

[Indomitable]

I think I'm just out on Queen. Would probably have him in the 20s. I just don't believe in his offense enough to justify the defense being what it is. If he's not elite offensively, I don't see how he's more than a backup. I get that you just bet on his offensive ceiling at some point, but I wouldn't be willing to do that in the lottery.

He has always fallen into the category of players who I want to see gone before the Bulls pick (kinda like Cody Williams last year). It sucks that he seems to be "falling" into the Bulls range. I just hope AK has seen enough of a team with zero rim protection.

If we had the shotblocking at the 4 position maybe. Pat is useless and Matais is the guy I am worried about.

We do have shot blocking at the 4?

The fit with Matas is a big part of Queen's appeal.

Matais will end up a 3 or 4. Queen is not relevant to me.

[jump]

Anyone have a line on who the Bulls have meet with so far. Only name I've heard is Sorber.

[League Circles]

Honestly, would Coby fetch a mid lotto pick in return? Coby is good, with limited upside. A certified scorer in the NBA, sure, but is he even a starter on a team less desperate for starters? The ability to add a genuinely elite athlete like Fears over Coby is much preferrable to Coby. Not just from a value contract standpoint, but from a core-based standpoint.

I'd bet a lot that Fears is never the player Coby was last season.

[kulaz3000]

Anyone have a line on who the Bulls have meet with so far. Only name I've heard is Sorber.

Sober, Tre Johnson, Asa, and Collin Murray-Boyles that I've read reports on.

[WesPeace]

Definitely not my favorite prospect, especially with foot issues already, but here's his breakdown:

Watch on YouTube

Give me his two way game everyday over Queen

[Muzbar]

Definitely not my favorite prospect, especially with foot issues already, but here's his breakdown:

Watch on YouTube

Give me his two way game everyday over Queen

I've got Sorber tied for my top choice with Carter Bryant. I'd be quite happy with either one of these.

[Jvaughn]

I really miss ManRam this time of year...

Wäre did he go? Yeah Miss him too.

No idea. Haven't seen him post in years now.

[AshyLarrysDiaper]

I really miss ManRam this time of year...

Wäre did he go? Yeah Miss him too.

No idea. Haven't seen him post in years now.

Think it’s been over a decade. He was awesome. Hope he’s well.