After Melodrama, who's the best shooting guard we can get?

WesleyExChiFan · Post #121 » by **WesleyExChiFan** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 8:42 am

KingCuban wrote:
HomoSapien wrote:Seriously, I'm shocked by how many people are interested in him. He has never averaged 3 rebounds or 2 assists ever in the NBA. That sort of speaks to how disinterested he is in everything that's not scoring.

Doesn't sound to different from Ben Gordon.

this. He's my pick out of the bunch.

qianlong · Post #122 » by **qianlong** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 8:55 am

Now that the melo ship seems to be sailed, afflalo trade hurts more. He was traded for a bag of chips.

ManualRam · Post #123 » by **ManualRam** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 9:03 am

bearadonisdna wrote:
ManualRam wrote:
Benedict Miller wrote:Manram you don't like anybody, what wing available would you prefer?

first page i mentioned stuckey and VC being good value pick ups with a description in a later post as well.
guys like hayward and stephenson are pipe dreams. hayward will either be massively overpaid and/or matched. stephenson will be overpaid and i don't want him.

If u dont think stepehsnon is worth the investment , then ariza surely isnt either who is a lesser prospect and doesnt put u any more over the hump than lace would.
At that point i would be more inclined to make rose the full time sg and sign isiah thomas

isiah thomas ,rose
Rose- Butler
Butler-McDermott
Taj Mirotic
Noah taj

Thats a 7 man rotation with a second team of
Kirk (vet minimum) or rmle
Snell
MDJ
Mirotic
Smith

Does that isiah thomas rotation have potential? Could rose play 2g? It could be about just getting the best 5 man squad possible.

depends what ariza commands, but i like his streamlined game more for the bulls than what stephenson brings.

i do think that derrick can play SOME 2, but i don't like the thought of derrick being at a size disadvantage night in, night out. if he lost a step, which there's a good likelhood that he did, he'd still have his strength and size advantage over PGs. i also don't like the thought of him splitting ball-handling duties with thomas either, who while good for his size is fools gold to me. he produced on a poor team and after SAC traded all their guards, he was virtually the only ball-handler on their team. he had carte blanche which he would not have playing alongside derrick. i wouldn't blow a huge chunk of cash on a PG unless derrick is done.

GMgoran · Post #124 » by **GMgoran** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 9:15 am

ManualRam wrote:
GMgoran wrote:
musketeer wrote:
I don't think he is a good locker room guy in general. He hasn't been particularly well liked at any of his stops.

The real question for me is:

Can Thibs improve Turner in the same way that he has improved Nate Robinson and D.J. Augustin?

The physical tools and the talent are obviously there ... He is still pretty young (25), and he hasn't suffered any significant injuries during his 4 seasons in the league ... If he is available on a cheap contract, I wouldn't mind taking a gamble on him ... A guard rotation of Rose/Augustin/Butler/Turner could be an interesting combination ...

the physical tools and talent AREN'T there though. he's an unathletic slasher. he struggles to turn the corner, doesn't get enough lift around the rim and doesn't have the length to make up for his lack of lift. as nba wings go, he's not very talented.

If you compare him against all star standards, you might be right ... However, I am not talking about all star standards here ... I am talking about a player who's had enough talent to be drafted 2nd overall, who hasn't lived up to his potential, and who might be available on a cheap contract ... A player who might benefit hugely from being coached by one of the best coaches in the league, and who could become a valuable contributor in a guard rotation with Rose, Augustin and Butler ...

ManualRam · Post #125 » by **ManualRam** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 9:21 am

GMgoran wrote:
ManualRam wrote:
GMgoran wrote:
The real question for me is:

Can Thibs improve Turner in the same way that he has improved Nate Robinson and D.J. Augustin?

The physical tools and the talent are obviously there ... He is still pretty young (25), and he hasn't suffered any significant injuries during his 4 seasons in the league ... If he is available on a cheap contract, I wouldn't mind taking a gamble on him ... A guard rotation of Rose/Augustin/Butler/Turner could be an interesting combination ...

the physical tools and talent AREN'T there though. he's an unathletic slasher. he struggles to turn the corner, doesn't get enough lift around the rim and doesn't have the length to make up for his lack of lift. as nba wings go, he's not very talented.

If you compare him against all star standards, you might be right ... However, I am not talking about all star standards here ... I am talking about a player who's had enough talent to be drafted 2nd overall, who hasn't lived up to his potential, and who might be available on a cheap contract ... A player who might benefit hugely from being coached by one of the best coaches in the league, and who could become a valuable contributor in a guard rotation with Rose, Augustin and Butler ...

i'm comparing him to average nba player standards. his combination of heavy slashing tendencies but below average athleticism is a very poor mix. he's not a talented player to me. good ball skill, specifically his handle, but not talented imo.

i think he sucks as is, but i think he'd be even worse playing a bench, 2ndary role. he really doesn't know how to play without the ball but he's not good enough to be on the ball. his ineffectiveness without it is exacerbated by his poor catch and shoot ability.

GMgoran · Post #126 » by **GMgoran** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 9:29 am

ManualRam wrote:
GMgoran wrote:
ManualRam wrote:
the physical tools and talent AREN'T there though. he's an unathletic slasher. he struggles to turn the corner, doesn't get enough lift around the rim and doesn't have the length to make up for his lack of lift. as nba wings go, he's not very talented.

If you compare him against all star standards, you might be right ... However, I am not talking about all star standards here ... I am talking about a player who's had enough talent to be drafted 2nd overall, who hasn't lived up to his potential, and who might be available on a cheap contract ... A player who might benefit hugely from being coached by one of the best coaches in the league, and who could become a valuable contributor in a guard rotation with Rose, Augustin and Butler ...

i'm comparing him to average nba player standards. his combination of heavy slashing tendencies but below average athleticism is a very poor mix. he's not a talented player to me. good ball skill, specifically his handle, but not talented imo.

i think he sucks as is, but i think he'd be even worse playing a bench, 2ndary role. he really doesn't know how to play without the ball but he's not good enough to be on the ball. his ineffectiveness without it is exacerbated by his poor catch and shoot ability.

Lets agree to disagree on this one ... We are obviously talking about completely different things ...

WinCity · Post #127 » by **WinCity** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 9:30 am

BR0D1E86 · Post #128 » by **BR0D1E86** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 10:38 am

Ralphb07 wrote:He's not a 2G but why not a Ramon Sessions and then get a cheaper 2G like Anthony Morrow. Sessions isn't much of a 3 point shooter but he can score and attacks the defense. With the shooters we should have in the 2nd unit we need to get a guard who can break the D down. DJ could always return as well but Sessions has more size.

This is kind of the route I'd like to go once Melo takes the money. Get Morrow for his shooting and then get a backup PG, or combo guard like Bayless.

Investing seven figures in Lance (because that's what it's going to take) just seems like too much of a bad risk to me.

IrishBeatdown · Post #129 » by **IrishBeatdown** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 11:13 am

Nick Young sucks, hate him with the wizards, hated him even more with lA. He's a black hole and a teamkiller, brings virtually nothing to the table besides some shooting and penetration. I'm glad someone brought up Ben Gordon.

He makes BG look like a multi-dimensional, complete SG.

Is it a complete surprise that winning teams don't want Nick Young? He had a great scoring postseason run with the clips a few years ago, and they had zero interest in bringing him back.

In retrospect, the best move would have been to trade for Arron Afflalo, but we had to swing for the fences for obvious reasons.

I am disappointed though, Afflalo would have been the absolute perfect fit for our squad of the affordable options.

Post #130 » by **kingkirk** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 12:01 pm

WinCity wrote:

I'd kill to have this guy on the team. Seriously.

It's not happening, though.

ikeziskash · Post #131 » by **ikeziskash** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 12:27 pm

qianlong wrote:Now that the melo ship seems to be sailed, afflalo trade hurts more. He was traded for a bag of chips.

ikeziskash · Post #132 » by **ikeziskash** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 12:35 pm

Our best current options are as follows:
Bledsoe (I know he isn't a 2)
Lance
Burks of Utah
Ariza

Because I think we really only need one more piece to contend with anyone I'd overpay.

TheGameChanger · Post #133 » by **TheGameChanger** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 12:36 pm

What about JJ or Crawford from the Clippers. Clippers seem to want to move some players.

Hans Embiid · Post #134 » by **Hans Embiid** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 12:38 pm

ikeziskash wrote:Our best current options are as follows:
Bledsoe (I know he isn't a 2)
Lance
Burks of Utah
Ariza

Because I think we really only need one more piece to contend with anyone I'd overpay.

The thing is we have to offer PHX a lot of assets. I would settle for Lance. We can sign him outright.

Magilla_Gorilla · Post #135 » by **Magilla_Gorilla** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 12:42 pm

TheGameChanger wrote:What about JJ or Crawford from the Clippers. Clippers seem to want to move some players.

I'd love JJ Reddick - but LA isn't moving him.

Ralphb07 · Post #136 » by **Ralphb07** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 1:00 pm

Why are we looking for a 2G to start? Don't we have Jimmy? If we can't get Melo, I want McDermott starting at SF day one. I am looking for bench 2G, guys to play 15-25 minutes a night.

Stuckey with DJ, Snell and Nikola could be a great 2nd unit.

Heck closing out games with Rose, Stuckey, McDermott, Nikola and Noah would be pretty nasty too.

Post #137 » by **kingkirk** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 1:03 pm

I actually would have killed someone, most likely fleet, for Evan Fournier.

I am more bummed about him being moved than Afflalo tbh.

He was my Plan W.

nitetrain8603 · Post #138 » by **nitetrain8603** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 1:11 pm

Ralphb07 wrote:Why are we looking for a 2G to start? Don't we have Jimmy? If we can't get Melo, I want McDermott starting at SF day one. I am looking for bench 2G, guys to play 15-25 minutes a night.

Stuckey with DJ, Snell and Nikola could be a great 2nd unit.

Heck closing out games with Rose, Stuckey, McDermott, Nikola and Noah would be pretty nasty too.

Disagree. Butler is a guy who should be playing with another dominant wing player, preferably a SG who can shoot and get his shot off whenever he wants.

GMgoran · Post #139 » by **GMgoran** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 1:13 pm

jc23 wrote:
nitetrain8603 wrote:
GMgoran wrote:Could Evan Turner be the answer, and at what price?

He's not. Besides not getting along with Derrick, he's just a 8th man at best. Even then, he couldn't get off the Pacer bench which starved for playmaking.

Sent from my SPH-L720 using RealGM Forums mobile app

not a fan of Turner, but to be fair DJ and green both looked terrible in Indy the season before last and look at them now.

Yes, Gerald Green and D.J. Augustin from Indiana's 2012/13 team represent good examples ... They have both improved significantly in the 2013/14 season when they went to teams that represent a better fit for them ... I am not saying that Turner will be the solution for our starting SG spot, but he definitely has some characteristics that make him an interesting prospect, especially in this line up:

Rose/Augustin
Butler/Turner/Snell
Dunleavy/McDermott
Gibson/Mirotic/Bairstow
Noah/Smith

Post #140 » by **Rerisen** » Sat Jul 5, 2014 1:20 pm

Setting Stephenson aside for a moment, who is the obvious choice, I would go for Parsons next.

At minimum make Morey pay up the yin yang to get him back.

We don't have to find a SG, it can be a SG or SF, because Jimmy can play both.

Then we should call Minny and right after talking about Love, ask about Kevin Martin.

If they are still trying to win, call again if they move Love to some other team. if Klay Thompson is in Sota, well there you go, deal ready.