Lets talk Zach Lavine

[erasmusmrr]

Lavine for Wiggins and picks.

Otto for Tobias Harris and picks.

[dice]

:banghead: another trade Lavine thread!? Jeez..
You Bulls fans really dont appreciate Zach! He is best player on the team and AK already said we arent rebuilding anymore! So wtf is the reason again to best player away??? For more unknown prospects, for more unknown picks, for more unproven players???
Trade everyone else on roster except Zach, PWill and White.

you appreciate the best player on a garbage team far too much. trade everyone on the roster other than lavine if ya want. unlikely to make much of a difference

[Stratmaster]

it's not paying your best players what they're worth that's the problem. it's OVERpaying them. and i guarantee that zach lavine will be overpaid on his next deal. let someone else do it

The majority in here said he was overpaid the last contract. It is now considered a value contract.

it is considered a value contract by those who don't understand what winning basketball is

Lavine is just entering his prime.

false. the typical player peaks statistically at around lavine's current age. typical exceptions are legit superstars. lavine did not notably improve last season, so at least presently it does not appear that he will be an exception

Not to mention that when the rest of the league sees a guy sign a value contract betting on himself, works his ass off and succeeds, then gets given away so they don't have to pay him, it will be considered business as usual in Chicago.

so your solution is to shoot ourselves in the foot, remain bad and then limp around leaving a trail of blood, waive our arms and say "hey guys, come play here. look what we did to ourselves to reward our hard working, low IQ loss leader!"

free agents ask themselves a number of questions when deciding where to sign (how much are they paying me for the next few years, how good is the team, will i get to showcase my game, how's the weather...). whether they've paid up to RETAIN players is pretty damn far down the list

This thread is just a reminder that the website "RealGM" isn't actually "Real GM'S".

i don't even know what that is supposed to mean

I see. You know what winning basketball is. Anyone who disagrees doesn't.

I tried to agree to disagree. Then I even gave a mea culpa about the beloved, revered Jimmy Butler.

But you're just going to be an ass, so again, Merry Christmas.

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[Stratmaster]

i'll answer one easy question with two more:

1) is there only one skill in basketball?
2) can a player be paid more than he is worth?

backing up the brinks truck for a largely one-dimensional player who isn't even elite at that one dimension is foolhardy. flat out

Agree to disagree. Good luck without him next season.

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team hasn't been any worse with him on the bench, so...good luck with him, good luck without him...six of one, half a dozen of another

not sure how anyone who's been following this team the past few years can think things would be much worse if zach lavine retired tomorrow. particularly coming off getting demolished at home by a mediocre hawks team to kick off the season. the house that jordan built has never been so desecrated

Wow. Ad an asinine statement to acting like one. You're on a roll, so never mind what I said about stopping.

Continue sounding like an idiot.

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[ChicagoSportsFan21]

It comes down to if you believe Zach Lavine deserves a max contract starting around 35 million a year in a couple years when he is a free agent which he will likely get in the market. If you think that’s the way to go for the Bulls to take the next leap and they will be contenders by then, then keep Lavine as part of the future. He will be 27 too. If not then you trade him as his value diminishes day by day. At this very point I would trade him IMO. I would wait till the trade deadline or off-season during draft day the latest though.

[Leslie Forman]

It's not his fault he has always been on garbage teams. Only generational talents like LeBron can will crappy teams to the playoffs. Any team would love to have a player of Zach's caliber on the squad.

Would you trade the Bulls 2021 pick for Zach LaVine, starting shooting guard for the Detroit Pistons?

Zach LaVine won't be going to a rebuilding team like the Bulls.

So contending teams are supposed to give up great assets for him?

Mirotic was playing even better and was on an even better contract. And he got a pile of garbage back.

[DroseReturnChi]

:banghead: another trade Lavine thread!? Jeez..
You Bulls fans really dont appreciate Zach! He is best player on the team and AK already said we arent rebuilding anymore! So wtf is the reason again to best player away??? For more unknown prospects, for more unknown picks, for more unproven players???
Trade everyone else on roster except Zach, PWill and White.

yeah sorry your idol is being shipped but you guys have millions of fans so can pay his max instead. Even if i was a billionaire, paying 40 mil to ACL injured guy?? Big yikers. Also, AK will be the worst gm if he declines Lauri at 20 but pays Zach 40 crazy money.

You had 3yrs of excuse bc Zach was better than crappy White, Lauri but now that excuse doesnt work now that a superior player in Kawhi Williams appeared. time to clean up 20 win team junk roster. that includes the number 1 guy.

[erasmusmrr]

Minny and GS 21 1sts plus Wiggins for Lavine. Simple enough.

[dice]

Agree to disagree. Good luck without him next season.

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team hasn't been any worse with him on the bench, so...good luck with him, good luck without him...six of one, half a dozen of another

not sure how anyone who's been following this team the past few years can think things would be much worse if zach lavine retired tomorrow. particularly coming off getting demolished at home by a mediocre hawks team to kick off the season. the house that jordan built has never been so desecrated

Wow. Ad an asinine statement to acting like one. You're on a roll, so never mind what I said about stopping.

Continue sounding like an idiot.

you're the only person here resorting to personal insults...while pretending to be above the fray. quite a trick

absolutely nothing that i said there was asinine. not sure what your problem is...nor how a person can act like an asinine statement

[dice]

"we're gonna trade our top scorer monta ellis for an injured andrew bogut and steven jackson? just so we don't have to re-sign him?"

-if GSW fans were anything like some current bulls fans

[DroseReturnChi]

What we need to understand as a board and even as an organization is that 6’6 SG’s who have crazy athleticism and can hit the 3 will ALWAYS be in demand.

what we need to understand as a board is that the best asset on a terrible team is easy to over-value. because we want something to latch onto that provides hope. but the reality is that any team being led by zach lavine is pretty hopeless

Theres nothing to understand. Being 6'6, sg, athletcism has nothing to do with paying max if he was a negative player for 6 straight yrs. And those guys are littered in the street frankly dont want him back even if he scored 30 for rest of his life.
What I want is another big wing that can defend 5 positions like a Simmons/George to pair with Williams.

[Stratmaster]

team hasn't been any worse with him on the bench, so...good luck with him, good luck without him...six of one, half a dozen of another

not sure how anyone who's been following this team the past few years can think things would be much worse if zach lavine retired tomorrow. particularly coming off getting demolished at home by a mediocre hawks team to kick off the season. the house that jordan built has never been so desecrated

Wow. Ad an asinine statement to acting like one. You're on a roll, so never mind what I said about stopping.

Continue sounding like an idiot.

you're the only person here resorting to personal insults...while pretending to be above the fray. quite a trick

absolutely nothing that i said there was asinine. not sure what your problem is...nor how a person can act like an asinine statement

Did you not say this

"it is considered a value contract by those who don't understand what winning basketball is"

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[Stratmaster]

team hasn't been any worse with him on the bench, so...good luck with him, good luck without him...six of one, half a dozen of another

not sure how anyone who's been following this team the past few years can think things would be much worse if zach lavine retired tomorrow. particularly coming off getting demolished at home by a mediocre hawks team to kick off the season. the house that jordan built has never been so desecrated

Wow. Ad an asinine statement to acting like one. You're on a roll, so never mind what I said about stopping.

Continue sounding like an idiot.

you're the only person here resorting to personal insults...while pretending to be above the fray. quite a trick

absolutely nothing that i said there was asinine. not sure what your problem is...nor how a person can act like an asinine statement

Or this:

"not sure how anyone who's been following this team the past few years can think things would be much worse if zach lavine retired tomorrow."

You're the king of passive aggressive thinly veiled insults. You do it every year. Its ok. I just have to learn not to bite when people on my ignore list respond to one of my posts. It's my fault.

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[DroseReturnChi]

I think most realistic options should be Pelicans or Warriors to trade Lavine. A trade centered around Ball for the Pelicans would be what I would prefer. Another option is centered around the 2021 MIN pick with the Warriors. Thoughts?

The best option would be swap Lavine and Carter for Hayes, 2021 unprotected, and Ball S&t.
Ball is a definition of winning player and pure pg Lauri/Williams desperately needs.
Ball is like a mini version of Williams that can guard 3positions.

Draft Cade with own pick and nab Suggs with consolidating other assets.
Suggs/Ball/Cade/Williams/Lauri is a dream come true for any rebuilding team.

[dice]

Wow. Ad an asinine statement to acting like one. You're on a roll, so never mind what I said about stopping.

Continue sounding like an idiot.

you're the only person here resorting to personal insults...while pretending to be above the fray. quite a trick

absolutely nothing that i said there was asinine. not sure what your problem is...nor how a person can act like an asinine statement

Did you not say this

"it is considered a value contract by those who don't understand what winning basketball is"

i did. which is not a personal insult. because you said "his contract is now CONSIDERED a good one" (by many people, anyway) as opposed to "i consider his contract a good one"

[Stratmaster]

you're the only person here resorting to personal insults...while pretending to be above the fray. quite a trick

absolutely nothing that i said there was asinine. not sure what your problem is...nor how a person can act like an asinine statement

Did you not say this

"it is considered a value contract by those who don't understand what winning basketball is"

i did. which is not a personal insult. because you said "his contract is now CONSIDERED a good one" (by many people, anyway) as opposed to "i consider his contract a good one"

Perfect!

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[dice]

Wow. Ad an asinine statement to acting like one. You're on a roll, so never mind what I said about stopping.

Continue sounding like an idiot.

you're the only person here resorting to personal insults...while pretending to be above the fray. quite a trick

absolutely nothing that i said there was asinine. not sure what your problem is...nor how a person can act like an asinine statement

Or this:

"not sure how anyone who's been following this team the past few years can think things would be much worse if zach lavine retired tomorrow."

You're the king of passive aggressive thinly veiled insults. You do it every year. Its ok. I just have to learn not to bite when people on my ignore list respond to one of my posts. It's my fault.

so...you think the bulls WOULD be much worse w/o lavine? despite all evidence to the contrary? i didn't think you were going that far

if you want to take that position and then pretend to be mortally insulted when people inevitably and rationally push back against it, that's your prerogative. but you won't find me saying that you sound like an idiot when you do

speaking of passive aggressive, what do you call it when you put someone on ignore and then tell them about it...while continuing to hate-read their posts?

pretty tough to accuse me of being less than direct...

[Stratmaster]

you're the only person here resorting to personal insults...while pretending to be above the fray. quite a trick

absolutely nothing that i said there was asinine. not sure what your problem is...nor how a person can act like an asinine statement

Or this:

"not sure how anyone who's been following this team the past few years can think things would be much worse if zach lavine retired tomorrow."

You're the king of passive aggressive thinly veiled insults. You do it every year. Its ok. I just have to learn not to bite when people on my ignore list respond to one of my posts. It's my fault.

so...you do think the bulls WOULD be much worse w/o lavine? despite all evidence to the contrary?

if you want to take that position and then pretend to be mortally insulted when people push back against it, feel free. but you won't find me saying that you sound like an idiot when you do

Ok. One more response. Then tell me I am an idiot so you get the last word and we can both **** off.

In all of these posts of mine you were responding to, are you asking me to believe that you did not suspect that I believed Lavine's contract to be a value contract. Or that I do not believe the Bulls are better with Lavine on the court than without him?

And then you accuse me of doing exactly what you just did... and what you always do when someone disagrees with you?

Pull the other one.

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[Wingy]

I get the logic behind trading Zach now, but I’d rather keep him, and shed everyone else except Pat Will.

You gotta have some good pieces already in place if you want to attract free agents.

Look at how bad the Warriors are with just Steph. Zach can’t save a team full of nobodies. I wouldn’t be afraid to dump the whole rest of the roster for best offer, even Coby.

Dumping Zach says “business as usual in Chicago” - which is a dangerous look. Combine that with the new lotto odds...you keep Zach, let him know it’s him/Pat/2021 pick as the new foundation, and FA help with AKME’s guys will be on the way.

[cjbulls]

I thought people we were past the idea Zach was the problem. I get the trade, and that is a reasonable path, but the idea that Zach is Monta or someone holding back the team is just laughable at this point.