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mmmmmbeeer wrote:Seems a lot of folks are pussyfooting around Deebo's tendency to ballhog lately. It's not productive to ice out teammates in clutch situations. The film is out, defenses are keying in on him. Especially with Zach out, he's just not going to get a good shot in the last 2 minutes if he insists on going iso. It wasn't just last night, either. He's been doing this lately and it's becoming infuriating. He's slumping from the line and from the field...GIVE UP THE BALL. Neither Ayo nor Coby, both having outstanding shooting nights, touched the ball down the stretch. I think I saw where it was zero shot attempts from either of them after the 6:00 mark in the 4th. Why????

Vuc had a good shot. I didn't have any issue with him taking it or that the play was drawn up for him. He was wide open and just plain missed it.

All that said, this team showed a TON of heart in this loss. Coby and Ayo understood the situation and stepped up to produce. Hugely encouraging sign to see from them. Hill impressed, too.

There are several possessions in the 3rd, I wished DeMar didn't force it. But come to think again, he is still our best playmaker, and in pressure situation, not even close. He made more right than wrong decisions most of the time. In the 4th he shot started falling so he kept taking them, and he made a lot of key shots. But what I like the most he also conciously try to drew fouls to try to keep us in the game, and sort of mess up Celtics tempo.

The biggest reason we loss IMO was despite better effort on defense, it's still not good enough. There's still leakage here and there and Celtics was able to capitalize on them. Especially Celtics seems to be a pretty tough team to best in clutch situation (just a hunch, haven't checked the data). Robert Williams alley oop, Richardson hit a 3, and that key shot by Brown, I think could've been prevented if we had our key defensive guys.

RSP83 wrote:

CROBulls wrote:Celtics arent anything special. Watched majority of their games this year. They are playing too many close games this year to be anything like that and this is just another one. Racking up wins in last 20 seconds for 15 or so game this year. They have on paper good combo in Tatum and Brown but it doesnt work like true duo. Didnt work with Stevens and doesnt work with Udoka.

But again like I said they specialized this year in close games and it's no wonder they got this one on their side.

Actually Zach and them are not so different. They are tough shot makers. It's almost like Celtics have 2 Zach. Having Derozan paired with Zach is a huge difference maker. I think the Celtics are better off with only one of them, and trade the other one for an established veteran like Dame or maybe Beal.

Issue is they dont make each other necessary better. They are very similar players with similar strenghts and weaknesses. I like them both individually, but not as players on same team. I could be wrong. But again they are very young and they can figure it out. Celtics are in no hurry to make haste trades.

?s=21

Lol

Our defensive rating has been taking a nose dive for a few weeks now. Very concerning..

nitric0 wrote:Our defensive rating has been taking a nose dive for a few weeks now. Very concerning..

I'm way more focused on getting our roster back together and healthy than I am about our ranking or standings (as long as we can get back to the top 5 by the playoffs).

When healthy, IMO, we can go toe-to-toe with the best teams, when missing even one key guy we are sweepable.

sco wrote:

nitric0 wrote:Our defensive rating has been taking a nose dive for a few weeks now. Very concerning..

I'm way more focused on getting our roster back together and healthy than I am about our ranking or standings (as long as we can get back to the top 5 by the playoffs).

When healthy, IMO, we can go toe-to-toe with the best teams, when missing even one key guy we are sweepable.

Isn't that concerning?

nitric0 wrote:

sco wrote:

nitric0 wrote:Our defensive rating has been taking a nose dive for a few weeks now. Very concerning..

I'm way more focused on getting our roster back together and healthy than I am about our ranking or standings (as long as we can get back to the top 5 by the playoffs).

When healthy, IMO, we can go toe-to-toe with the best teams, when missing even one key guy we are sweepable.

Isn't that concerning?

Sure, but true for most teams. Health is an underrated aspect of playoff success. Even if guys are out there, but they're at 80%, it can easily determine a series outcome.

StunnerKO wrote:

Read on Twitter

?s=21

Lol

No name guys don't get calls, big names get favoritism. Just the way it is, and won't be changing.

NBA tried to change this at the start of the season and NBA basketball was the best it's been for ages, but we quickly went back to normal star calls. January isn't even over yet and star calls / non-calls are right back to where they always were.

sco wrote:

nitric0 wrote:Our defensive rating has been taking a nose dive for a few weeks now. Very concerning..

I'm way more focused on getting our roster back together and healthy than I am about our ranking or standings (as long as we can get back to the top 5 by the playoffs).

When healthy, IMO, we can go toe-to-toe with the best teams, when missing even one key guy we are sweepable.

If missing one key guy (such as Caruso) makes the Bulls "sweepable", then they aren't true contenders in the first place.

Bulls2021 wrote:

sco wrote:

nitric0 wrote:Our defensive rating has been taking a nose dive for a few weeks now. Very concerning..

I'm way more focused on getting our roster back together and healthy than I am about our ranking or standings (as long as we can get back to the top 5 by the playoffs).

When healthy, IMO, we can go toe-to-toe with the best teams, when missing even one key guy we are sweepable.

If missing one key guy (such as Caruso) makes the Bulls "sweepable", then they aren't true contenders in the first place.

think a bigger issue is that we're missing our entire power forward rotation and trotting out two g-leaguers and a sg/sf tweener in their place...maybe a third g-leaguer depending on how you rate tony bradley.

no way around it though, the defense has been really bad from top to bottom. not forcing turnovers to the same extent (and getting transition buckets from it), too many miscommunications resulting in wide open drives to the rim, not even closing out on shooters or fighting over screens particularly well. the offense continues to roll, but it's beginning to look like the pre-season assessment of a turnstile defense was more right than wrong.

kodo wrote:

StunnerKO wrote:

Read on Twitter

?s=21

Lol

No name guys don't get calls, big names get favoritism. Just the way it is, and won't be changing.

NBA tried to change this at the start of the season and NBA basketball was the best it's been for ages, but we quickly went back to normal star calls. January isn't even over yet and star calls / non-calls are right back to where they always were.

I've seen this trend happening lately and it makes me sad for the game of basketball.

SalmonsSuperfan wrote:

Bulls2021 wrote:

sco wrote:I'm way more focused on getting our roster back together and healthy than I am about our ranking or standings (as long as we can get back to the top 5 by the playoffs).

When healthy, IMO, we can go toe-to-toe with the best teams, when missing even one key guy we are sweepable.

If missing one key guy (such as Caruso) makes the Bulls "sweepable", then they aren't true contenders in the first place.

think a bigger issue is that we're missing our entire power forward rotation and trotting out two g-leaguers and a sg/sf tweener in their place...maybe a third g-leaguer depending on how you rate tony bradley.

no way around it though, the defense has been really bad from top to bottom. not forcing turnovers to the same extent (and getting transition buckets from it), too many miscommunications resulting in wide open drives to the rim, not even closing out on shooters or fighting over screens particularly well. the offense continues to roll, but it's beginning to look like the pre-season assessment of a turnstile defense was more right than wrong.

Well, the way they give up 3Ps is really concerning. Teams seem ultra confident shooting 3Ps against us. Our 3P% defense is in tank job territory (25th), with the Magic, Pelicans and Pistons.

So yeah, it’s not the team Billy D was handed in October. But the guys left standing are being exposed. Frankly I didn’t need to be reminded that a team playing Coby/Demar/Vuc (and Zach) would be awful at defense. A 6’5 rookie and G-League signings aren’t gonna turn them into a competent defense. I think at best, they can try to approach competence.

Billy has literally lost every defensive weapon he had besides Ayo.

Pat, Derrick, Javonte, Caruso, Lonzo. Weren’t the latter 2 in conversation for All-Defensive team and a long-shot but reasonable DPOY nomination? But that’s an entire lineup of important defensive pieces missing a lot of weeks.

And we saw the defensive breakdowns early in the season. Caruso was like a monster energy drink who came in and swung momentum back our way. MVP chants were silly, but MVDP would be pretty reasonable.

Really it’s just important the available group makes some improvements. I don’t think they can win much, but it’d be good to see them just improve and atleast win .400.

The bulls need to go 13-5 now to hit 40 before 20.
Starting to look like a long shot after so much promise

sco wrote:

nitric0 wrote:Our defensive rating has been taking a nose dive for a few weeks now. Very concerning..

I'm way more focused on getting our roster back together and healthy than I am about our ranking or standings (as long as we can get back to the top 5 by the playoffs).

When healthy, IMO, we can go toe-to-toe with the best teams, when missing even one key guy we are sweepable.

I agree, with the obvious parity now being displayed in spurts in the EC you never know who is going to lose on any given night. Case in point, the Nets are now down Durant again and Irving is not playing home games making them totally beatable at the Barclays Center during home games. You just never know.

mmmmmbeeer wrote:Seems a lot of folks are pussyfooting around Deebo's tendency to ballhog lately. It's not productive to ice out teammates in clutch situations. The film is out, defenses are keying in on him. Especially with Zach out, he's just not going to get a good shot in the last 2 minutes if he insists on going iso. It wasn't just last night, either. He's been doing this lately and it's becoming infuriating. He's slumping from the line and from the field...GIVE UP THE BALL. Neither Ayo nor Coby, both having outstanding shooting nights, touched the ball down the stretch. I think I saw where it was zero shot attempts from either of them after the 6:00 mark in the 4th. Why????

Vuc had a good shot. I didn't have any issue with him taking it or that the play was drawn up for him. He was wide open and just plain missed it.

All that said, this team showed a TON of heart in this loss. Coby and Ayo understood the situation and stepped up to produce. Hugely encouraging sign to see from them. Hill impressed, too.

Your type regain from commentating until a player has a bad game. It wasn’t ball hogging when those shots fell right? This is the same board that called lavine a low IQ player for years so I’m not shocked.

Ayo did all of his damage on uncontested jumpers. Why should that guy have anything ran through him? Coby white I’d understand he’s shown the ability but not ayo.

1) We can't be overly reliant on DeMar creating offense in the playoffs.
2) We need a PF with great size and shot blocking.

We might win in first round without fixing these problems, but probably lose in 2nd round.

johanliebert wrote:

mmmmmbeeer wrote:Seems a lot of folks are pussyfooting around Deebo's tendency to ballhog lately. It's not productive to ice out teammates in clutch situations. The film is out, defenses are keying in on him. Especially with Zach out, he's just not going to get a good shot in the last 2 minutes if he insists on going iso. It wasn't just last night, either. He's been doing this lately and it's becoming infuriating. He's slumping from the line and from the field...GIVE UP THE BALL. Neither Ayo nor Coby, both having outstanding shooting nights, touched the ball down the stretch. I think I saw where it was zero shot attempts from either of them after the 6:00 mark in the 4th. Why????

Vuc had a good shot. I didn't have any issue with him taking it or that the play was drawn up for him. He was wide open and just plain missed it.

All that said, this team showed a TON of heart in this loss. Coby and Ayo understood the situation and stepped up to produce. Hugely encouraging sign to see from them. Hill impressed, too.

Your type regain from commentating until a player has a bad game. It wasn’t ball hogging when those shots fell right? This is the same board that called lavine a low IQ player for years so I’m not shocked.

Ayo did all of his damage on uncontested jumpers. Why should that guy have anything ran through him? Coby white I’d understand he’s shown the ability but not ayo.

He's had several bad games recently. He was on a heater, the MVP chants started raining down on him, and his ts% has dropped since.

Ayo hitting wide open shots is EXACTLY my point. If Deebo is immediately getting double and triple teamed, that means there are guys standing around wide open ready to take quality shots. Instead, he's been trying to dribble his way out of trouble and taking dumb shots or missing easy shots (like his point blank layup miss last night with like 2 mins left).

Don't get so defensive about some criticism of your favorite player. The dude isn't infallible. I love him as a piece on the Bulls, love the veteran leadership and mentorship he's brought to the team, and appreciate how deadly he was in the fourth for much of this season. I think he's going to help lead us to a good place in the playoffs. But I guarandamntee you if you asked him after the game last night if he should've given up the ball more, he would've said, "yes".

This is why those "MVP" chants are so freaking stupid. Let these guys just play their games instead of putting players up on some pedestal they feel they have to live up to. I'm not blaming the MVP chants for his recent slide but it sure as hell doesn't help.

bearadonisdna wrote:The bulls need to go 13-5 now to hit 40 before 20.
Starting to look like a long shot after so much promise

If we can get Caruso and green back with us we will get some wins. Our defense just has to get fixed.

mmmmmbeeer wrote:He's had several bad games recently. He was on a heater, the MVP chants started raining down on him, and his ts% has dropped since.

Yep. By DDR's standards, he is going through a rough patch. A basketball-reference score of 20+ indicates that the player had a very good game, as measured by box score. DeMar had scores exceeding 20 in 14 of his first 28 games, that is half his games. Typical for the type of player who is an All Star starter. But he has had none in any of the past 10 games.