2020 NBA Draft Thread: Bulls pick 4th: PT 2

[Grodoboldo]

Oh god, there's still more than 40 days till the draft.
I miss Draft Express, there was at least more to watch and read.

[kodo]

Ball is going to overtake Hayes pretty soon the way this poll is trending.

Not sure how I would feel if he was available at 4.

[Jvaughn]

Oh god, there's still more than 40 days till the draft.
I miss Draft Express, there was at least more to watch and read.

Yeah, there was no shortage of workout videos and articles when Givony was there. ESPN ruins everything.

[Grodoboldo]

Ball is going to overtake Hayes pretty soon the way this poll is trending.

Not sure how I would feel if he was available at 4.

This is expected. The closer we get to the draft, the more we'll see the hype machine do its thing. They are pushing for Edwards, Ball and Wiseman, so expect to see these three as the preferred prospects, nevermind anything else.

[Bulldog23]

Watch on YouTube

He played on a team with two good players that are being considered in the NBA draft. I think he is a solid prospect. If there was a March Tournament we would probably be talking about him a bit more.

[PlayerUp]

Watch on YouTube

He played on a team with two good players that are being considered in the NBA draft. I think he is a solid prospect. If there was a March Tournament we would probably be talking about him a bit more.

Seems every player in this draft is considered a sleeper, or underrated or steal of the draft.

Reality is nobody really knows. What I saw with Green is as of now he is very undeveloped and nothing is really unique about his game. Looks like a borderline role player ceiling. Not even sure why we're discussing him. He's not worth trading into the draft to get him and isn't going to be a lottery pick either.

[PhilLeotardo]

I feel like Wiseman is gonna be the best player in this draft and the chance he reaches his ceiling increases if the Warriors draft him. I wonder how much it would cost to trade up.

I wouldn't be surprised if Wiseman does end up being the best player in the draft, but I wouldn't trade up for him, either.

The upside/downside spreads on all of these draft picks are just too high, including, and maybe especially, Wiseman. The issues with him are (1) the devaluation of the center position in the NBA, generally, (2) lack of a proven shot from range, (3) while an impressive athlete for a center, particularly straight line and in terms of body control, not quite a "SF in a center's body."

This is a tough draft. No super blue chippers a la Lebron, Durant/Odon, Zion/Morant, Rose, KAT, etc.

Instead, it reminds me a lot of the Jabari Parker / Wiggins / Embiid draft. Talent but questions marks. And you look at those drafts - Parker and Wiggins both effective busts. Embiid the only true superstar from the first round, and he could easily have been a bust. Jokic a random superstar out of the 2nd round. But many solid starter NBA talents out of that draft, LaVine, Warren, Aaron Gordon, Randle, Nurkic, Bogdanovic, Capella, maybe 2nd rounders Dinwiddie and Jerami Grant --- and rotation level players Smart, Gary Harris, Hood, McDermott, Anderson, Saric, Inglis, Powell, Clarkson...

Point being that I think there's actually a lot of NBA talent, but I also think that this particular group is hard to project out (compounded by the lack of a tourney, a large number of non-NCAA higher prospects), and give that higher risk profile, probably not worth much of a cost to move up from 4.

Rose & Morant weren’t anything close to sure bets. Rose’s class was viewed as incredibly weak, there were a ton of questions around his game, and the Bulls couldn’t even decide whether or not they wanted him or Beasley. Many were lampooning them for selecting Rose over Beasley. Morant, same thing, far from a sure bet. They weren’t close to as hyped/viewed as generational as LBJ/Oden/Williamson/Doncic

Also, this draft doesn’t have anything in common with that Wiggins draft. That draft viewed as a potential goldmine & no one would shut up about it. This draft is viewed pure crap & no one is talking about it

[The Chosen one]

If the bulls are able to draft either Edwards, Wiseman, Toppin, Ball, or Adjiva they are going to be in good shape! Edwards, Wiseman and Ball will be gone. I think it will be between Adjiva and Toppin. I don’t think you can go wrong with either one!

[DuckIII]

If the bulls are able to draft either Edwards, Wiseman, Toppin, Ball, or Adjiva they are going to be in good shape! Edwards, Wiseman and Ball will be gone. I think it will be between Adjiva and Toppin. I don’t think you can go wrong with either one!

Unless the Bulls wheel and deal on draft night to trade down and to open a logical roster spot for Toppin, he makes no sense for the Bulls. Nor is he the type of obvious “BPA” guy you just draft no matter what.

[Jvaughn]

If the bulls are able to draft either Edwards, Wiseman, Toppin, Ball, or Adjiva they are going to be in good shape! Edwards, Wiseman and Ball will be gone. I think it will be between Adjiva and Toppin. I don’t think you can go wrong with either one!

Unless the Bulls wheel and deal on draft night to trade down and to open a logical roster spot for Toppin, he makes no sense for the Bulls. Nor is he the type of obvious “BPA” guy you just draft no matter what.

This.

You would need to trade Lauri at the very least to even open up minutes for Toppin. Plus your defense gets significantly worse if he's your 4. And that's saying a lot since Lauri isn't a great defender. I also don't see any scenario where he'd be BPA. I'd take Ball, Edwards, Wiseman, Deni, Hayes, Onyeka, and Vassell before him.

[The Chosen one]

If the bulls are able to draft either Edwards, Wiseman, Toppin, Ball, or Adjiva they are going to be in good shape! Edwards, Wiseman and Ball will be gone. I think it will be between Adjiva and Toppin. I don’t think you can go wrong with either one!

Unless the Bulls wheel and deal on draft night to trade down and to open a logical roster spot for Toppin, he makes no sense for the Bulls. Nor is he the type of obvious “BPA” guy you just draft no matter what.

Toppin has game! He can honestly go top 3. There’s mention of Charlotte being interested. I know Toppin plays Lauri position but who knows if Lauri is going to be here long term? All the top prospects play a position that the bulls have young talent at. Wiseman plays Carter position, Edwards plays Lavine position, Ball,Haliburton and Hayes play Coby position. Deni plays Porter position. I don’t really see any rookie drafted this year starting over any of the bulls projected starters of Coby Lavine Porter Lauri Carter.

[The Chosen one]

I’ve watched a lot Hayes last season but wasn’t that impressed with him. For a point guard he was to turnover prone. He tries a lot of risky passes that are not there. I also saw some guards get into his space and speed him up. He had trouble turning the corner on guards that applied heavy ball pressure. His shot was kind’ve streaky especially from the 3 point range. He’s a very good passer though and has range on his floaters when driving to the basket. He wouldn’t be my pick if I’m the bulls. I’m not the biggest Lamelo fan but he is superior to Hayes as a point guard imo.

[drosestruts]

Looking at the free agent targets thread and it's clear everyone wants one thing - shooting. With the emphasis on shooting as anyone rethought of Aaron Nesmith has a potential target at 4?

6'6" guard with at 6'10" wingspan who shot 52% on a 115 3PA

His scouting report claims he isn't just limited to the catch and shoot but can hit the three curling off of screen, can pull-up, and has a good step back.

Struggles finishing at the rim and isn't an explosive athlete, but those shooting numbers leap off the page, and his wingspan suggests he could be a good defender.

This is a long video covering a lot of backstory of Nesmith, really his college career background comes in around 6 minutes

Watch on YouTube

[Jvaughn]

Looking at the free agent targets thread and it's clear everyone wants one thing - shooting. With the emphasis on shooting as anyone rethought of Aaron Nesmith has a potential target at 4?

6'6" guard with at 6'10" wingspan who shot 52% on a 115 3PA

His scouting report claims he isn't just limited to the catch and shoot but can hit the three curling off of screen, can pull-up, and has a good step back.

Struggles finishing at the rim and isn't an explosive athlete, but those shooting numbers leap off the page, and his wingspan suggests he could be a good defender.

This is a long video covering a lot of backstory of Nesmith, really his college career background comes in around 6 minutes

Watch on YouTube

4 would be a hell of a reach. If you're going to trade to the back end of the lottery, he might be an option, but he wouldn't be my first choice for wings.

[drosereturn]

If the bulls are able to draft either Edwards, Wiseman, Toppin, Ball, or Adjiva they are going to be in good shape! Edwards, Wiseman and Ball will be gone. I think it will be between Adjiva and Toppin. I don’t think you can go wrong with either one!

Unless the Bulls wheel and deal on draft night to trade down and to open a logical roster spot for Toppin, he makes no sense for the Bulls. Nor is he the type of obvious “BPA” guy you just draft no matter what.

This.

You would need to trade Lauri at the very least to even open up minutes for Toppin. Plus your defense gets significantly worse if he's your 4. And that's saying a lot since Lauri isn't a great defender. I also don't see any scenario where he'd be BPA. I'd take Ball, Edwards, Wiseman, Deni, Hayes, Onyeka, and Vassell before him.

I wouldnt trade Lauri right away although I understand what your saying. I would try to make an open competition between Toppin, Lauri, Carter, Gafford starting from training camp whose the better 4/5.
As much as I have strereotypes, I dont mind giving them a fair chance to start at their favorite positions whether its Gafford and Carter as a 4 or Lauri as a 5 if they prove training camp and showcase skills.
Carter claims he is a better 4 so if thats true he could potentially start at 4 and Toppin at the 5 if they really beat out Lauri and Gafford. I wouldnt mind trading both but trade at least 1 after enough sample size. Whoever injured loses.

[Grodoboldo]

Looking at the free agent targets thread and it's clear everyone wants one thing - shooting. With the emphasis on shooting as anyone rethought of Aaron Nesmith has a potential target at 4?

6'6" guard with at 6'10" wingspan who shot 52% on a 115 3PA

His scouting report claims he isn't just limited to the catch and shoot but can hit the three curling off of screen, can pull-up, and has a good step back.

Struggles finishing at the rim and isn't an explosive athlete, but those shooting numbers leap off the page, and his wingspan suggests he could be a good defender.

This is a long video covering a lot of backstory of Nesmith, really his college career background comes in around 6 minutes

Watch on YouTube

4 would be a hell of a reach. If you're going to trade to the back end of the lottery, he might be an option, but he wouldn't be my first choice for wings.

Yeah, I really like Nesmith, but wouldn't pick him at 4.
If we get a late lottery pick though, I'd be in on the idea of drafting him.

[Jvaughn]

Unless the Bulls wheel and deal on draft night to trade down and to open a logical roster spot for Toppin, he makes no sense for the Bulls. Nor is he the type of obvious “BPA” guy you just draft no matter what.

This.

You would need to trade Lauri at the very least to even open up minutes for Toppin. Plus your defense gets significantly worse if he's your 4. And that's saying a lot since Lauri isn't a great defender. I also don't see any scenario where he'd be BPA. I'd take Ball, Edwards, Wiseman, Deni, Hayes, Onyeka, and Vassell before him.

I wouldnt trade Lauri right away although I understand what your saying. I would try to make an open competition between Toppin, Lauri, Carter, Gafford starting from training camp whose the better 4/5.
As much as I have strereotypes, I dont mind giving them a fair chance to start at their favorite positions whether its Gafford and Carter as a 4 or Lauri as a 5 if they prove training camp and showcase skills.
Carter claims he is a better 4 so if thats true he could potentially start at 4 and Toppin at the 5 if they really beat out Lauri and Gafford. I wouldnt mind trading both but trade at least 1 after enough sample size. Whoever injured loses.

I don't know about the open competition. I understand it was different times, but we saw how the Niko/Bobby competition fractured our already messy team. I'm all for players earning their starting spot, but the 4/5 is Lauri and Wendell's to lose.

And if you're going to invest in Toppin, you really are going to have to force feed him minutes, which is going to be impossible with Lauri/Thad/Wendell/Gafford on the depth chart. I just don't conceivably see anyway to make it happen without a trade. I also don't see how Toppin beats anyone out in that group with his horrible defense and rebounding.

[kodo]

You would need to trade Lauri at the very least to even open up minutes for Toppin. Plus your defense gets significantly worse if he's your 4. And that's saying a lot since Lauri isn't a great defender. I also don't see any scenario where he'd be BPA. I'd take Ball, Edwards, Wiseman, Deni, Hayes, Onyeka, and Vassell before him.

Agreed. Lauri did a good job considering he's bigger than most centers at 7'. He was -0.4 DRPM which is basically neutral. A lot of the younger, big players around his size are worse on DRPM. Bagley is -1.24, Mo Bamba -1.8, Jaren Jackson Jr -2.9, Michael Porter Jr -3.13, KAT -3.6.

Lauri isn't a standout defensive stud, but you could do a lot worse than him. Toppin could easily turn out to be that kind of defensive liability.

[MrFortune3]

Looking at the free agent targets thread and it's clear everyone wants one thing - shooting. With the emphasis on shooting as anyone rethought of Aaron Nesmith has a potential target at 4?

6'6" guard with at 6'10" wingspan who shot 52% on a 115 3PA

His scouting report claims he isn't just limited to the catch and shoot but can hit the three curling off of screen, can pull-up, and has a good step back.

Struggles finishing at the rim and isn't an explosive athlete, but those shooting numbers leap off the page, and his wingspan suggests he could be a good defender.

This is a long video covering a lot of backstory of Nesmith, really his college career background comes in around 6 minutes

Watch on YouTube

Everyone gets fired...EVERYONE. AK, Evs, Donovan, the scouts, the trainers...everybody.

That would be God awful value for the #4 spot.

People keep looking over the fact that AK stated after getting the #4 that moving up in the draft shortens your draft board.
Once you are at a certain draft pick, you cannot justify taking players. You cannot justify taking Nesmith at #4, I don't even then you can justify taking him top 10 for real.

[MrFortune3]

If the bulls are able to draft either Edwards, Wiseman, Toppin, Ball, or Adjiva they are going to be in good shape! Edwards, Wiseman and Ball will be gone. I think it will be between Adjiva and Toppin. I don’t think you can go wrong with either one!

Unless the Bulls wheel and deal on draft night to trade down and to open a logical roster spot for Toppin, he makes no sense for the Bulls. Nor is he the type of obvious “BPA” guy you just draft no matter what.

Toppin has game! He can honestly go top 3. There’s mention of Charlotte being interested. I know Toppin plays Lauri position but who knows if Lauri is going to be here long term? All the top prospects play a position that the bulls have young talent at. Wiseman plays Carter position, Edwards plays Lavine position, Ball,Haliburton and Hayes play Coby position. Deni plays Porter position. I don’t really see any rookie drafted this year starting over any of the bulls projected starters of Coby Lavine Porter Lauri Carter.

Rumors of Toppin's draft value fluctuates. First the Warriors were a lock to take him early in the process, now it's the Hornets.
Toppin does not fit the needs of the Hornets. They already have a glut of 6-6 to 6-7 PF's in Bridges(granted Bridges plays SF too) and Washington.
They need rim protection and size. Wiseman is the perfect fit for what they need.