Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season

[kodo]

Jokes aside, did he not play any young players that actually deserved to play for us? I know McDermott at the time was cited but obviously he never really became a good player.

It did take Lu getting hurt for him to really trust Jimmy, and then once he did he never took him out of the game again

The main guy that Thibs had a personal vendetta against that we should have used was Korver, especially since we basically lost to Miami because they had all 5 guys collapse the paint on Rose and we couldn't hit the kick out passes for 3s. Korver went on to Atlanta had his best year as probably the most important guy on their 60W squad.

Buuuut...that's ancient history. All defense Thibs is long gone, his rotations absolutely value offense these days and he play guys like KAT & Randle & Kemba Walker plenty.

[Red8911]

Did the Knicks think they deserved to be in the finals or a champion this year ? This makes absolutely no sense and they will regret this decision.

Believe it or not the bulls have yet to find a better coach than Thibs even though it was the right decision to move on from him at the time.

[Susan]

Knicks are gonna go back to being the Knicks just like the Bulls went right back to being the Bulls when he left.

[Dan Z]

Read on Twitter

i just saw that and guess I shouldn't be surprised. My initial thought is that the grass isn't always greener on the other side.

Those were my thoughts. I understand the firing, doubt they will get anyone better. On the other hand, if the goal is title or bust, Tom doesn't seem to be the guy

I saw a podcast by Bill Simmons and he said that World Wide Wes (William Wesley) had something to do with Detroit when they fired Carlile and hired Larry Brown (who went on to win a championship in 2004). Wes is an adviser for the Knicks, so they probably were thinking of that situation when they fired Thibs.

[kulaz3000]

5 years is a pretty long time for a head coach, and considering how talented their roster is, despite not having lots of depth, I don't think it's necessarily a harsh firing in the slightest.

He is a really good coach, and I know a lot of Bulls fans are nostalgic due to the the seasons with him as the Bulls head coach, but he has his glaring faults and to be honest, I'm surprised he even lasted the 5 seasons with the Knicks.

I think they made the right move. But who they hire to replace him is going to be interesting, because I think going from Thib's directly to a coach like Malone I think would be a mistake. because they are rather similar.

[DASMACKDOWN]

Thibs is similar to Skiles to where he actually overachieves so much with the team early, that you take it for granted.

That last year with us and Thibs, we won 50 games and 2nd round. We fire him and bring in Hoiberg. We win 42 games and didnt even make the playoffs and it was pretty much the same squad.

[Ice Man]

The main reason to fire Thibs is because he overplays his starters during the regular season, which risks injury during the playoffs. I could see that being a legit reason. But if so, the time to fire Thibs was after the 2024 season, where the Knicks were hobbled with injury during the post-season. Not now, when the Knicks were as healthy as a team can be during the playoffs, and oh they also outperformed their seeding. Just weird.

[Red Larrivee]

Did the Knicks think they deserved to be in the finals or a champion this year ? This makes absolutely no sense and they will regret this decision.

Believe it or not the bulls have yet to find a better coach than Thibs even though it was the right decision to move on from him at the time.

Just like Chicago (and Minnesota), reports are coming out that players were tired of Thibs and his voice had waned out. If your core players are saying that, you really don't have much of a choice.

[Susan]

Did the Knicks think they deserved to be in the finals or a champion this year ? This makes absolutely no sense and they will regret this decision.

Believe it or not the bulls have yet to find a better coach than Thibs even though it was the right decision to move on from him at the time.

Just like Chicago (and Minnesota), reports are coming out that players were tired of Thibs and his voice had waned out. If your core players are saying that, you really don't have much of a choice.

If you lead with the right questions you can get people to say whatever to justify whatever decision you want


The reality is the Knicks have one playoff series victory since 2000 outside of the Thibs era, just like the Bulls and they're more likely than not to go back to being the bum ass Knicks just like the Bulls immediately went back to being **** bums once they shipped him out.

Go ahead, take the easy to get along with loser who will be easy on the players, I'll take Thibs because the dude actually wins playoff series.

Not sure why people watch sports but I watch them to see my teams compete and overcome adversity. Nobody does that better than Thibs.

[MGB8]

The main reason to fire Thibs is because he overplays his starters during the regular season, which risks injury during the playoffs. I could see that being a legit reason. But if so, the time to fire Thibs was after the 2024 season, where the Knicks were hobbled with injury during the post-season. Not now, when the Knicks were as healthy as a team can be during the playoffs, and oh they also outperformed their seeding. Just weird.

I agree, but the counterpoint is that the Knicks issues on defense with KAT and Brunson, as well as with Mikal and even OK not being reliable enough on offense, where foreseeable and should have been hedged against. They barely tied using Precious (and if not usable, should have moved to address). They should have known that McBride, Wright, Payne, Shamet weren't enough and made moves to pick up help - this year's Alec Burks or Bullock. Sims for Wright was a nice idea but when it didn't work, they needed to be active with the garbage heap as a hedge - PJ Tucker wasn't that

Not sure how much of that was Rose vs. Thibs, or how much KAT's relationship with Rose killed Thibs... But Thibs def shares some of the blame.

[Red Larrivee]

Did the Knicks think they deserved to be in the finals or a champion this year ? This makes absolutely no sense and they will regret this decision.

Believe it or not the bulls have yet to find a better coach than Thibs even though it was the right decision to move on from him at the time.

Just like Chicago (and Minnesota), reports are coming out that players were tired of Thibs and his voice had waned out. If your core players are saying that, you really don't have much of a choice.

If you lead with the right questions you can get people to say whatever to justify whatever decision you want


The reality is the Knicks have one playoff series victory since 2000 outside of the Thibs era, just like the Bulls and they're more likely than not to go back to being the bum ass Knicks just like the Bulls immediately went back to being **** bums once they shipped him out.

Go ahead, take the easy to get along with loser who will be easy on the players, I'll take Thibs because the dude actually wins playoff series.

Not sure why people watch sports but I watch them to see my teams compete and overcome adversity. Nobody does that better than Thibs.

He's 48-55 in the postseason. It's not terrible, but let's not act like he's a top tier coach in the playoffs.

But at the end of the day, coaching isn't just about wins and losses, and he's consistently failed with the other side of things. He's a great coach to get you back on track, but he burns players and organizations out in the process. If players are tuning you out, you're not doing a great job anymore.

[DuckIII]

If you lead with the right questions you can get people to say whatever to justify whatever decision you want

Except of course this has happened at multiple stops now and you have no idea what questions were asked or how they answered. Just totally made up out of nothing.

The reality is the Knicks have one playoff series victory since 2000 outside of the Thibs era, just like the Bulls and they're more likely than not to go back to being the bum ass Knicks just like the Bulls immediately went back to being **** bums once they shipped him out.

Go ahead, take the easy to get along with loser who will be easy on the players, I'll take Thibs because the dude actually wins playoff series.

Not sure why people watch sports but I watch them to see my teams compete and overcome adversity. Nobody does that better than Thibs.

I don't disagree with any of this, but the argument that management and players should just "deal with it" because Thibs gets results isn't really how the NBA works anymore. Even if you are succeeding, if there is a perception that you could be doing even better, you'll get booted if people don't like you. Ironically including when the perception of being able to do better only exists because you, the unliked coach, have already gotten them to max out.

Thibs will eventually have to change something on the human-interaction front or this will probably keep happening.

[Susan]

Just like Chicago (and Minnesota), reports are coming out that players were tired of Thibs and his voice had waned out. If your core players are saying that, you really don't have much of a choice.

If you lead with the right questions you can get people to say whatever to justify whatever decision you want


The reality is the Knicks have one playoff series victory since 2000 outside of the Thibs era, just like the Bulls and they're more likely than not to go back to being the bum ass Knicks just like the Bulls immediately went back to being **** bums once they shipped him out.

Go ahead, take the easy to get along with loser who will be easy on the players, I'll take Thibs because the dude actually wins playoff series.

Not sure why people watch sports but I watch them to see my teams compete and overcome adversity. Nobody does that better than Thibs.

He's 48-55 in the postseason. It's not terrible, but let's not act like he's a top tier coach in the playoffs.

But at the end of the day, coaching isn't just about wins and losses, and he's consistently failed with the other side of things. He's a great coach to get you back on track, but he burns players and organizations out in the process. If players are tuning you out, you're not doing a great job anymore.

Since he got fired the Bulls are 3-8 in the postseason in a decade. Averaging just about a playoff game per year here. Give me Thibs' playoff record over whatever you call this last decade has been and whatever the dozen years were before he came to town.

Here's the reality - there's not a coach on this planet that's going to win a championship with Jalen Brunson as their best player. Sure he wears on players because he's pushing them to be their best - that's an uncomfortable relationship by definition but to use that as justification to fire him leads you to a decade of basketball impotence.

GMs have massive egos and rarely are they as great as they think they are. Citing a slightly below .500 playoff record as proof that he's bad when this bum ass franchise can't even get to the playoffs to get swept is top notch. Good work!

[Susan]

If you lead with the right questions you can get people to say whatever to justify whatever decision you want

Except of course this has happened at multiple stops now and you have no idea what questions were asked or how they answered. Just totally made up out of nothing.

The reality is the Knicks have one playoff series victory since 2000 outside of the Thibs era, just like the Bulls and they're more likely than not to go back to being the bum ass Knicks just like the Bulls immediately went back to being **** bums once they shipped him out.

Go ahead, take the easy to get along with loser who will be easy on the players, I'll take Thibs because the dude actually wins playoff series.

Not sure why people watch sports but I watch them to see my teams compete and overcome adversity. Nobody does that better than Thibs.

I don't disagree with any of this, but the argument that management and players should just "deal with it" because Thibs gets results isn't really how the NBA works anymore. Even if you are succeeding, if there is a perception that you could be doing even better, you'll get booted if people don't like you. Ironically including when the perception of being able to do better only exists because you, the unliked coach, have already gotten them to max out.

Thibs will eventually have to change something on the human-interaction front or this will probably keep happening.

We don't know anything officially regarding what the players said to the GM but a skilled politician can absolutely skew a conversation by asking the right questions with enough frequency to undermine a coach or to get them fired.

Thibs probably won't get hired again because of his age but if he does, I reckon his team will fare better than the Bulls or Knicks because both franchises are proven clown shows both incapable of any semblance of success or meaningful basketball.

[kodo]

https://sny.tv/articles/knicks-tom-thibodeau-firing-next-coach-candidates

The decision, ultimately, was Rose’s to make. Yes, owner James Dolan supported the decision to fire Thibodeau...
If Rose didn’t want to fire Thibodeau, he would have resigned alongside his head coach on Tuesday. He didn’t do that, which tells you that he wasn’t forced to do anything against his will here.
...
As SNY noted Sunday, the Knicks conducted a review of players and coaches in the post-mortem of this season. The setup of these meetings was different than the traditional exit meeting. Based on what I know, these exit meetings are traditionally conducted by the leading executive. Each player meets individually with the top executive. Sometimes other front office members are present. I’ve heard of at least two instances where the head coach was present.

But this assessment was different. It didn’t involve all of the players. Only a select few were interviewed. I believe Thibodeau was interviewed as well as members of his coaching staff. Dolan was present as well.

So this was less an exit meeting and more of an assessment of what went wrong and what needed to be fixed. Obviously, the end result was Thibodeau getting let go.

If Thibs lost the support of the core players, it doesn't matter how good of a coach he is if the players aren't doing what he's telling them to do. Pops, Kerr, and most recently Malone said the Xs & Os are easy and basically completely homogenous in the modern NBA. Pops said everyone running the same plays, there are no "secret" plays out there that only 1 coach knows, no coaching is unique or all that special. Coaching is about actually getting the incredible egos of all these players to actually do what a coach wants them to.

The next coach will probably be having NY do almost the exact same actions as Thibs which is the exact same actions as the rest of the NBA. It's just a matter if the players will listen to the next guy.

[DuckIII]

If you lead with the right questions you can get people to say whatever to justify whatever decision you want

Except of course this has happened at multiple stops now and you have no idea what questions were asked or how they answered. Just totally made up out of nothing.

The reality is the Knicks have one playoff series victory since 2000 outside of the Thibs era, just like the Bulls and they're more likely than not to go back to being the bum ass Knicks just like the Bulls immediately went back to being **** bums once they shipped him out.

Go ahead, take the easy to get along with loser who will be easy on the players, I'll take Thibs because the dude actually wins playoff series.

Not sure why people watch sports but I watch them to see my teams compete and overcome adversity. Nobody does that better than Thibs.

I don't disagree with any of this, but the argument that management and players should just "deal with it" because Thibs gets results isn't really how the NBA works anymore. Even if you are succeeding, if there is a perception that you could be doing even better, you'll get booted if people don't like you. Ironically including when the perception of being able to do better only exists because you, the unliked coach, have already gotten them to max out.

Thibs will eventually have to change something on the human-interaction front or this will probably keep happening.

We don't know anything officially regarding what the players said to the GM but a skilled politician can absolutely skew a conversation by asking the right questions with enough frequency to undermine a coach or to get them fired.

Thibs probably won't get hired again because of his age but if he does, I reckon his team will fare better than the Bulls or Knicks because both franchises are proven clown shows both incapable of any semblance of success or meaningful basketball.

I have zero doubt he will get hired again if he wants to keep coaching. His track record for improving teams is very well established, despite the hiccup in Minny, and there are always teams looking for coaches to get them from point B to point C.

The only way he isn’t offered another head coaching job down the road is if the behind the scenes word is that you just can’t work with the guy. Which I am not saying is the case.

[Am2626]

i just saw that and guess I shouldn't be surprised. My initial thought is that the grass isn't always greener on the other side.

Those were my thoughts. I understand the firing, doubt they will get anyone better. On the other hand, if the goal is title or bust, Tom doesn't seem to be the guy

He’s never really coached a championship quality team. The Bulls weren’t beating Miami. That’s the closest chance he’s ever had.

Thibs is less than his super-fans make him out to be, but I can’t say anything negative about his results. He seems to get his teams to go about as far as they can be expected to go. The issue with him appears to be one of personality, not ability.

I think the Bulls beat Miami if Rose doesn’t blow out his knee. They had home court advantage and learned a lot playing against Miami the previous year. I don’t think they beat OKC in the Finals though. If OKC wins the championship that year maybe they keep Harden and form a new dynasty.

Going back to the topic being discussed Thibs over plays his guys to a fault but I can see him being able to coach a team to a championship.

[HomoSapien]

Has anyone pointed out that Brunson was seemingly against the firing?

[Red Larrivee]

Since he got fired the Bulls are 3-8 in the postseason in a decade. Averaging just about a playoff game per year here. Give me Thibs' playoff record over whatever you call this last decade has been and whatever the dozen years were before he came to town.

Here's the reality - there's not a coach on this planet that's going to win a championship with Jalen Brunson as their best player. Sure he wears on players because he's pushing them to be their best - that's an uncomfortable relationship by definition but to use that as justification to fire him leads you to a decade of basketball impotence.

GMs have massive egos and rarely are they as great as they think they are. Citing a slightly below .500 playoff record as proof that he's bad when this bum ass franchise can't even get to the playoffs to get swept is top notch. Good work!

It's possible to be a hard ass and for players to never tune you out. Thibs has never found that balance.

No team is going to prioritize a coach like Thibs over a talented, albeit flawed roster of players who don't want to play for him. It's unreasonable.

[MAQ]

Has anyone pointed out that Brunson was seemingly against the firing?

I could be wrong for sure, but I'm pinning this on KAT.