Moderators: HomoSapien, Ice Man, dougthonus, Michael Jackson, Tommy Udo 6 , kulaz3000, fleet, DASMACKDOWN, GimmeDat, RedBulls23, AshyLarrysDiaper, coldfish, Payt10
sco wrote:Andi Obst wrote:Jcool0 wrote:
If John Collins doesn't opt in they will have 30M and they can still move him if he does.
Moving John Collins so you can make an offer that the Bulls will almost certainly match. Sounds fun!
Utah and their need for another great white hope. Maybe we can trade them Huerter and Collins for their Collins?
Andi Obst wrote:Jcool0 wrote:Donkedave wrote:
Utah only 2m under cap to start the season. MLE is all they could offer.
If John Collins doesn't opt in they will have 30M and they can still move him if he does.
Moving John Collins so you can make an offer that the Bulls will almost certainly match. Sounds fun!
Andi Obst wrote:WindyCityBorn wrote:Andi Obst wrote:
Please name a team with capspace that might go after Giddey.
He’ll take qualifying off before getting low-balled. We don’t have the leverage you think we do.
I don't want to low-ball him, I want to be realistic for once. We gifted Vuc and Pat money. Time to stop that.
Andi Obst wrote:Jcool0 wrote:Andi Obst wrote:
I have discussed this too many times to do it again, but looking at percentage only is pretty useless when you want to see how good of a shooter an NBA player is. Giddey is taking 6 threes per 100 possessions and many of them are wide open and not self-created. Defenses don't respect him. Is it encouraging that the percentage is going up? Absolutely! Is Giddey on his way to become a good shooter? I doubt it.
And with his future contract, I'm not giving him 25 mil straight away. Let him hit the RFA market. If he finds it there, you match. But he won't.
Yeah those 17/8/7 guys always have a hard time getting paid.
Please name a team with capspace that might go after Giddey.
WindyCityBorn wrote:Andi Obst wrote:WindyCityBorn wrote:
He’ll take qualifying off before getting low-balled. We don’t have the leverage you think we do.
I don't want to low-ball him, I want to be realistic for once. We gifted Vuc and Pat money. Time to stop that.
I don’t think we gifted Vuc a contract. He likely would have gotten around $20 million on the open market. The problem is that we never should kept him at all, but we were stupidly still in win now mode.
Infinity2152 wrote:Andi Obst wrote:Jcool0 wrote:
Yeah those 17/8/7 guys always have a hard time getting paid.
Please name a team with capspace that might go after Giddey.
Brooklyn, easily our biggest threat to re-sign him right now. Tons of cap space. Giddey totally fits their timeline, and they'll have no starting PG. Maybe SG either. Giddey fits better than any top free agent this summer. If the Bulls don't lock him up early, it would be unlikely for them not to make an offer.
As a Bulls fan and a guy who wants to keep Giddey, I really hope they don't. As the Nets GM, I'd make him a 4yr/$125 mill offer day 1 and force the Bulls to match or give him up. Just over $30 mill a year AAV to really make them think about it.
League Circles wrote:I think you'd find that general attitudes of execs around the league on chasing RFAs is quite mixed. I'm sure a number of them make a general habit of intentionally avoiding it even when it's enticing. Honest question - have the Bulls ever signed an RFA of another team to an offer sheet? I can't recall an instance.
Infinity2152 wrote:League Circles wrote:I think you'd find that general attitudes of execs around the league on chasing RFAs is quite mixed. I'm sure a number of them make a general habit of intentionally avoiding it even when it's enticing. Honest question - have the Bulls ever signed an RFA of another team to an offer sheet? I can't recall an instance.
Didn't the Kings do exactly that with Lavine? Sign our restricted free agent to an offer sheet? Which we then matched? AK has already experienced what you're saying generally doesn't happen with the Bulls.
Look at it another way. Nets will have a ton of cap this summer. Let's say they plan to make 3-4 offers to try to win 2. Do you see 3-4 players they're more likely to offer contracts to in this free agency crop? That fit better with their current team and timeline? Players in the $25-$50 mill range?
Top FA's: Lebron, Irving, Harden, Middleton, Randle, Collins, then you're down to Brook Lopez, Naz Reid, Myles Turner, D Russell., Hardaway Jr, etc. They have Cameron Johnson and Nic Claxton, so all the bigs are probably out. Who's left for them to offer a sheet to?
greenwing wrote:Legit question. We have a big enough sample size at this point. Giddey is tearing it up as the team's first option. Is he an all-star caliber player now?
sco wrote:I'll be optimistic that his ankle is ok.
League Circles wrote:Infinity2152 wrote:League Circles wrote:I think you'd find that general attitudes of execs around the league on chasing RFAs is quite mixed. I'm sure a number of them make a general habit of intentionally avoiding it even when it's enticing. Honest question - have the Bulls ever signed an RFA of another team to an offer sheet? I can't recall an instance.
Didn't the Kings do exactly that with Lavine? Sign our restricted free agent to an offer sheet? Which we then matched? AK has already experienced what you're saying generally doesn't happen with the Bulls.
Look at it another way. Nets will have a ton of cap this summer. Let's say they plan to make 3-4 offers to try to win 2. Do you see 3-4 players they're more likely to offer contracts to in this free agency crop? That fit better with their current team and timeline? Players in the $25-$50 mill range?
Top FA's: Lebron, Irving, Harden, Middleton, Randle, Collins, then you're down to Brook Lopez, Naz Reid, Myles Turner, D Russell., Hardaway Jr, etc. They have Cameron Johnson and Nic Claxton, so all the bigs are probably out. Who's left for them to offer a sheet to?
I wasn't saying it doesn't generally happen. I was just saying that I'd bet different execs have notably different feelings on using RFA offer sheets as a tool (as opposed to using that time to pursue other free agents). I was asking if the Bulls have ever signed a player from another team to an offer sheet as an RFA. I don't remember any instances. I do of course remember other teams signing our guys: Zach, Chris Duhon, etc.
Edit: oh wait, I think I remembered one that the Bulls did way back in the day I think they signed JJ Reddick to an offer sheet that the Magic matched. I don't remember any other times.
Infinity2152 wrote:League Circles wrote:Infinity2152 wrote:
Didn't the Kings do exactly that with Lavine? Sign our restricted free agent to an offer sheet? Which we then matched? AK has already experienced what you're saying generally doesn't happen with the Bulls.
Look at it another way. Nets will have a ton of cap this summer. Let's say they plan to make 3-4 offers to try to win 2. Do you see 3-4 players they're more likely to offer contracts to in this free agency crop? That fit better with their current team and timeline? Players in the $25-$50 mill range?
Top FA's: Lebron, Irving, Harden, Middleton, Randle, Collins, then you're down to Brook Lopez, Naz Reid, Myles Turner, D Russell., Hardaway Jr, etc. They have Cameron Johnson and Nic Claxton, so all the bigs are probably out. Who's left for them to offer a sheet to?
I wasn't saying it doesn't generally happen. I was just saying that I'd bet different execs have notably different feelings on using RFA offer sheets as a tool (as opposed to using that time to pursue other free agents). I was asking if the Bulls have ever signed a player from another team to an offer sheet as an RFA. I don't remember any instances. I do of course remember other teams signing our guys: Zach, Chris Duhon, etc.
Edit: oh wait, I think I remembered one that the Bulls did way back in the day I think they signed JJ Reddick to an offer sheet that the Magic matched. I don't remember any other times.
Which would make you more cautious: being the team other teams keep offering sheets to your players, or the other way around? Especially if it already happened to you personally as GM? You're 100% right it's a tough move and doesn't happen often.
Again, who do you think they'd more likely go after in FA? The market is pretty dry for young good players this offseason. That probably makes a difference in what teams will do. Most teams try not to let guys like Giddey even reach restricted free agency.
Not saying it's going to happen but it's a huge gamble either way. If they do make an offer, it will undoubtedly be huge, and we will undoubtedly match. More than we probably could have negotiated.
League Circles wrote:Infinity2152 wrote:League Circles wrote:I wasn't saying it doesn't generally happen. I was just saying that I'd bet different execs have notably different feelings on using RFA offer sheets as a tool (as opposed to using that time to pursue other free agents). I was asking if the Bulls have ever signed a player from another team to an offer sheet as an RFA. I don't remember any instances. I do of course remember other teams signing our guys: Zach, Chris Duhon, etc.
Edit: oh wait, I think I remembered one that the Bulls did way back in the day I think they signed JJ Reddick to an offer sheet that the Magic matched. I don't remember any other times.
Which would make you more cautious: being the team other teams keep offering sheets to your players, or the other way around? Especially if it already happened to you personally as GM? You're 100% right it's a tough move and doesn't happen often.
Again, who do you think they'd more likely go after in FA? The market is pretty dry for young good players this offseason. That probably makes a difference in what teams will do. Most teams try not to let guys like Giddey even reach restricted free agency.
Not saying it's going to happen but it's a huge gamble either way. If they do make an offer, it will undoubtedly be huge, and we will undoubtedly match. More than we probably could have negotiated.
Not sure who Brooklyn would go after. I took a look at their cap situation but it didn't help me too much cause they have at least 3 free agents of their own so basically I don't have a good sense of what kind of cap space they'll really have. Not sure if it was you but somebody suggested they'd offer like 30-50 each million to loke 3-4 different free agents. I can't see them making more than 2 big deals. The likelihood of us matching may very well cause a team like them to just the RFA matching delay and chase UFAs instead right away.
