NBA Trade Thread #12

[pipfan]

PG13/#3 for PWill/Vuc/#12/Port pick/Terry/JCarter

HUGE gamble but we go with
White/Ayo/Ball
Giddey/VJ/Ball
PG13/Huerter/Phillips
Matas/JSmith
Collins/JSmith

Sixers add a much needed center, PWill could start there and dump PG13's deal

[Infinity2152]

Man, y'all act like you're getting Lebron with pick #3, lmao! There are four distinct tiers, from what everybody is saying. Everybody agrees Flagg is undisputedly the top pick and best prospect. Not tied with anyone. Tier 1. Pretty much everybody agrees Harper is the undisputed second-best player. People are saying the Spurs would be crazy to trade down to 3 and not draft Harper. Tier 2. Then you have VJ, Bailey, Tre Johnson. Tier 3. Then it's pretty random, guys rising and falling.

Pick #3 in this draft is tier 3. You're getting at best a player that pretty much everybody believes is not one of the top two players in the draft. We can't agree in here who the third best player is. AK could be clever, trade for that pick, oh we have Giddey, Coby, PG13, Matas, now we need a center, I'll draft Maluach. Any more of a reach than Pat Will? Have seen Maluach projected as high as 6 or 7 already. Or draft the highest rated offensive center as a young Vucevic replacement, Derik Queen. We know he loves offensive scorers and screw their defense (Giddey, Lavine, Derozan, Vucevic).

Expecting AK to draft who you want at 3 is really optimistic. Outside of Matas (no brainer), has he drafted a single player you didn't consider over drafted in the first round? Is he drafting VJ or Tre Johnson at 3 if he plans to re-sign Coby? Or make a weird pick, Bailey's dropping down boards too., could easily skip him.

You could move to pick 6 for far less cost and have a good shot at getting Bailey or Tre Johnson, if that's who you want.

[Dan Z]

Man, y'all act like you're getting Lebron with pick #3, lmao! There are four distinct tiers, from what everybody is saying. Everybody agrees Flagg is undisputedly the top pick and best prospect. Not tied with anyone. Tier 1. Pretty much everybody agrees Harper is the undisputed second-best player. People are saying the Spurs would be crazy to trade down to 3 and not draft Harper. Tier 2. Then you have VJ, Bailey, Tre Johnson. Tier 3. Then it's pretty random, guys rising and falling.

Pick #3 in this draft is tier 3. You're getting at best a player that pretty much everybody believes is not one of the top two players in the draft. We can't agree in here who the third best player is. AK could be clever, trade for that pick, oh we have Giddey, Coby, PG13, Matas, now we need a center, I'll draft Maluach. Any more of a reach than Pat Will? Have seen Maluach projected as high as 6 or 7 already. Or draft the highest rated offensive center as a young Vucevic replacement, Derik Queen. We know he loves offensive scorers and screw their defense (Giddey, Lavine, Derozan, Vucevic).

Expecting AK to draft who you want at 3 is really optimistic. Outside of Matas (no brainer), has he drafted a single player you didn't consider over drafted in the first round? Is he drafting VJ or Tre Johnson at 3 if he plans to re-sign Coby? Or make a weird pick, Bailey's dropping down boards too., could easily skip him.

You could move to pick 6 for far less cost and have a good shot at getting Bailey or Tre Johnson, if that's who you want.

I'll be surprised if Philly trades Paul George this off season and my guess is they run it back at least one more year. I know PG is 35, but he was an all-star the two years before he signed with the Sixers. Whatever they end up doing they'll only go as far as Embiid and his health takes them.

If the cost to get PG and the #3 pick was minimal (contracts plus Portland pick) then it'd be something to consider, but I doubt that would interest Philly.

I also don't see Reinsdorf signing off on trading for a big contract like Paul Georges.

[Infinity2152]

Yeah, I'm not knocking PG13, seems like a cool guy, good, player, but he cannot stay healthy and would cost us a ton of assets and lock up our cap space. If we're pretty sure we're drafting a superstar at 3, a Flagg, Wemby, Bron, Luka level prospect I'd take the risk even with the huge cap kill. There aren't three Flagg level prospects in this draft. Apparently there aren't three Dylan Harper level prospects in this class.

Tell you what, I'm a huge fan of going for second year, third year talent with assets rather than spending a lot to draft high. Players like SGA or Giddey, you know they can compete at the NBA level, and you see the flashes of greatness at the NBA level. Lot of the best players were mid-low draft picks. Like Sabonis for Haliburton. Haliburton was at 15pts, 7 assists with the Kings, but Indiana saw the potential. They gave up a lot to get him, but it was worth it.

Jalen Green is one. Has a lot of room to grow, sky high potential.
Derek Lively. Buried on the bench.
Would spend a fair amount to get Dyson Daniels. Don't see superstar, but maybe Herb Jones level starting defensive SG.

A few older, but young guys

RJ Barrett. Has flaws, but still 24 and still room to get better.
Scottie Barnes. Would cost a lot to get, but imagine getting him and he improves that 3 ball.
Zion Williamson. Take the chance. Make a good offer and just get him.

Who's our next Haliburton, Donovan Mitchell, Jalen Brunson, good player ready to be great that we could get? Sometimes its opportunity, Giddey got it and Lively needs it. Wanted Bane, think he could take a jump, but have to feed Banchero and Wagner in Orlando.

[Infinity2152]

Super Duper mega trade proposal:

Jaylen Brown could be a franchise player if he leaves Tatum. Know it's not likely, but I think it's more possible now than last year. I'd send a Godfather offer: Coby, Vucevic, Ball, Collins, Pat Will, Ayo, Portland pick, 2028 1st, 2030 1st, TPA for Jrue Holiday and Jaylen Brown.

Celtics roster: Derrick White, Coby White, Tatum, Porzingas, Vucevic with Ball, Collins, Williams, Ayo, Pritchard, Hauser.
New owners want to cut cash. Celtics get a ton of younger players, save a ton this year, and a MUCH more cap flexibility next year. They could actually get under the cap. They get off Jrue's contract. And add three first round picks. And they'll win a LOT of games, even with Tatum out.

Bulls roster: Giddey, Holiday, Brown, Matas, Smith with re-signed Tre Jones, Huerter, pick #12, Phillips, Carter, Terry, FA center. Summer 2026 Huerter, Carter, Terry fall off the books, we have some cap space and exceptions to get starting center and fill out the bench. Probably try to trade/dump Holiday then if he's no good. But Jrue's the ideal defender next to Giddey, and Brown's great at defense.

We get a 28yr old franchise level player in Brown to run with Giddey and Matas and I'm not worried about the draft picks since I'd expect Giddey, Brown, Matas and 1 of pick 12 or Holiday to be starters for the next 3-6 years anyway. And those picks should be low picks.

Be even better if we can get White/Brown instead of Holiday Brown. They still save a ton of money and get younger players in Ball, Williams, Ayo, White, picks.

[dpucane]

Super Duper mega trade proposal:

Jaylen Brown could be a franchise player if he leaves Tatum. Know it's not likely, but I think it's more possible now than last year. I'd send a Godfather offer: Coby, Vucevic, Ball, Collins, Pat Will, Ayo, Portland pick, 2028 1st, 2030 1st, TPA for Jrue Holiday and Jaylen Brown.

Celtics roster: Derrick White, Coby White, Tatum, Porzingas, Vucevic with Ball, Collins, Williams, Ayo, Pritchard, Hauser.
New owners want to cut cash. Celtics get a ton of younger players, save a ton this year, and a MUCH more cap flexibility next year. They could actually get under the cap. They get off Jrue's contract. And add three first round picks. And they'll win a LOT of games, even with Tatum out.

Bulls roster: Giddey, Holiday, Brown, Matas, Smith with re-signed Tre Jones, Huerter, pick #12, Phillips, Carter, Terry, FA center. Summer 2026 Huerter, Carter, Terry fall off the books, we have some cap space and exceptions to get starting center and fill out the bench. Probably try to trade/dump Holiday then if he's no good. But Jrue's the ideal defender next to Giddey, and Brown's great at defense.

We get a 28yr old franchise level player in Brown to run with Giddey and Matas and I'm not worried about the draft picks since I'd expect Giddey, Brown, Matas and 1 of pick 12 or Holiday to be starters for the next 3-6 years anyway. And those picks should be low picks.

Why do so many Bulls fans have a 1st round exit kink

[Infinity2152]

Super Duper mega trade proposal:

Jaylen Brown could be a franchise player if he leaves Tatum. Know it's not likely, but I think it's more possible now than last year. I'd send a Godfather offer: Coby, Vucevic, Ball, Collins, Pat Will, Ayo, Portland pick, 2028 1st, 2030 1st, TPA for Jrue Holiday and Jaylen Brown.

Celtics roster: Derrick White, Coby White, Tatum, Porzingas, Vucevic with Ball, Collins, Williams, Ayo, Pritchard, Hauser.
New owners want to cut cash. Celtics get a ton of younger players, save a ton this year, and a MUCH more cap flexibility next year. They could actually get under the cap. They get off Jrue's contract. And add three first round picks. And they'll win a LOT of games, even with Tatum out.

Bulls roster: Giddey, Holiday, Brown, Matas, Smith with re-signed Tre Jones, Huerter, pick #12, Phillips, Carter, Terry, FA center. Summer 2026 Huerter, Carter, Terry fall off the books, we have some cap space and exceptions to get starting center and fill out the bench. Probably try to trade/dump Holiday then if he's no good. But Jrue's the ideal defender next to Giddey, and Brown's great at defense.

We get a 28yr old franchise level player in Brown to run with Giddey and Matas and I'm not worried about the draft picks since I'd expect Giddey, Brown, Matas and 1 of pick 12 or Holiday to be starters for the next 3-6 years anyway. And those picks should be low picks.

Why do so many Bulls fans have a 1st round exit kink

This team is not the finished team. It gets us a franchise player. we finish the team summer 2026, when we have cap space and exceptions. Then you're totally discounting our 2025 rookie and 2026 rookie. How can you predict how good we'll be without even knowing what rookies we draft, how good Giddey and Matas will be this year, who we add in FA to fill out the roster. You're damn good at predicting without information. Already assuming our two first round picks will add nothing.

Now show us your for sure plan to not be a first round exit with this roster this year. Would love to analyze the moves you propose to turn us into contenders. Let me guess. Get a lot of draft picks and pray.

How is this team a first round exit anyway? Holiday and Brown are All defensive players, Giddey and Matas could be All Stars as soon as next year, and our rookie could be (should be) great. No vucevic at center, Smith could be a very good starter. Plus free agent adds. Where is this team weak?

[dpucane]

Super Duper mega trade proposal:

Jaylen Brown could be a franchise player if he leaves Tatum. Know it's not likely, but I think it's more possible now than last year. I'd send a Godfather offer: Coby, Vucevic, Ball, Collins, Pat Will, Ayo, Portland pick, 2028 1st, 2030 1st, TPA for Jrue Holiday and Jaylen Brown.

Celtics roster: Derrick White, Coby White, Tatum, Porzingas, Vucevic with Ball, Collins, Williams, Ayo, Pritchard, Hauser.
New owners want to cut cash. Celtics get a ton of younger players, save a ton this year, and a MUCH more cap flexibility next year. They could actually get under the cap. They get off Jrue's contract. And add three first round picks. And they'll win a LOT of games, even with Tatum out.

Bulls roster: Giddey, Holiday, Brown, Matas, Smith with re-signed Tre Jones, Huerter, pick #12, Phillips, Carter, Terry, FA center. Summer 2026 Huerter, Carter, Terry fall off the books, we have some cap space and exceptions to get starting center and fill out the bench. Probably try to trade/dump Holiday then if he's no good. But Jrue's the ideal defender next to Giddey, and Brown's great at defense.

We get a 28yr old franchise level player in Brown to run with Giddey and Matas and I'm not worried about the draft picks since I'd expect Giddey, Brown, Matas and 1 of pick 12 or Holiday to be starters for the next 3-6 years anyway. And those picks should be low picks.

Why do so many Bulls fans have a 1st round exit kink

This team is not the finished team. It gets us a franchise player. we finish the team summer 2026, when we have cap space and exceptions. Then you're totally discounting our 2025 rookie and 2026 rookie. How can you predict how good we'll be without even knowing what rookies we draft, how good Giddey and Matas will be this year, who we add in FA to fill out the roster. You're damn good at predicting without information. Already assuming our two first round picks will add nothing.

Now show us your for sure plan to not be a first round exit with this roster this year. Would love to analyze the moves you propose to turn us into contenders. Let me guess. Get a lot of draft picks and pray.

Jaylen is not a franchise player.

If he was, the Celtics wouldn't want to blow it up.

[Infinity2152]

Why do so many Bulls fans have a 1st round exit kink

This team is not the finished team. It gets us a franchise player. we finish the team summer 2026, when we have cap space and exceptions. Then you're totally discounting our 2025 rookie and 2026 rookie. How can you predict how good we'll be without even knowing what rookies we draft, how good Giddey and Matas will be this year, who we add in FA to fill out the roster. You're damn good at predicting without information. Already assuming our two first round picks will add nothing.

Now show us your for sure plan to not be a first round exit with this roster this year. Would love to analyze the moves you propose to turn us into contenders. Let me guess. Get a lot of draft picks and pray.

Jaylen is not a franchise player.

If he was, the Celtics wouldn't want to blow it up.

The Celtics have another supermax player who IS the franchise player in Tatum. They're arguably the same level player. They have new owners. It's been made very clear cutting money is a priority. No matter how you do it, two supermax contracts are damn near impossible to work with. It got them a championship, but by the time Tatum comes back, all the core pieces of that team are old and/or gone. They'll have two supermax players, derrick White and no money to fill out the team if they manage to dump Holiday. If not, still way over the cap. They pay repeater tax every year. Think they paid over $200 mill in tax last year, and will pay more this year with no trades and little chance to win it all without Tatum.

Didn't he get Finals MVP? If they trade Brown it won't be because he's not valuable or a franchise level talent, it will be for the boatload of cash, picks and young players. Super fast rebuild around Tatum and White when Tatum returns.

[Dez]

PG13/#3 for PWill/Vuc/#12/Port pick/Terry/JCarter

HUGE gamble but we go with
White/Ayo/Ball
Giddey/VJ/Ball
PG13/Huerter/Phillips
Matas/JSmith
Collins/JSmith

Sixers add a much needed center, PWill could start there and dump PG13's deal

God no, you only take PG to get #3, if they want #12 it's a straight no.

[Dez]

Man, y'all act like you're getting Lebron with pick #3, lmao! There are four distinct tiers, from what everybody is saying. Everybody agrees Flagg is undisputedly the top pick and best prospect. Not tied with anyone. Tier 1. Pretty much everybody agrees Harper is the undisputed second-best player. People are saying the Spurs would be crazy to trade down to 3 and not draft Harper. Tier 2. Then you have VJ, Bailey, Tre Johnson. Tier 3. Then it's pretty random, guys rising and falling.

Pick #3 in this draft is tier 3. You're getting at best a player that pretty much everybody believes is not one of the top two players in the draft. We can't agree in here who the third best player is. AK could be clever, trade for that pick, oh we have Giddey, Coby, PG13, Matas, now we need a center, I'll draft Maluach. Any more of a reach than Pat Will? Have seen Maluach projected as high as 6 or 7 already. Or draft the highest rated offensive center as a young Vucevic replacement, Derik Queen. We know he loves offensive scorers and screw their defense (Giddey, Lavine, Derozan, Vucevic).

Expecting AK to draft who you want at 3 is really optimistic. Outside of Matas (no brainer), has he drafted a single player you didn't consider over drafted in the first round? Is he drafting VJ or Tre Johnson at 3 if he plans to re-sign Coby? Or make a weird pick, Bailey's dropping down boards too., could easily skip him.

You could move to pick 6 for far less cost and have a good shot at getting Bailey or Tre Johnson, if that's who you want.

Nobody thinks that, most people know that the Bulls need talent badly and this is a good way to do it.

The more picks you have, the more chance to hit on a star and that's the only way the Bulls can add one.

The Bulls don't have the assets to get a franchise player, a bunch of middling talent and expiring contracts aren't doing it.

[Infinity2152]

Man, y'all act like you're getting Lebron with pick #3, lmao! There are four distinct tiers, from what everybody is saying. Everybody agrees Flagg is undisputedly the top pick and best prospect. Not tied with anyone. Tier 1. Pretty much everybody agrees Harper is the undisputed second-best player. People are saying the Spurs would be crazy to trade down to 3 and not draft Harper. Tier 2. Then you have VJ, Bailey, Tre Johnson. Tier 3. Then it's pretty random, guys rising and falling.

Pick #3 in this draft is tier 3. You're getting at best a player that pretty much everybody believes is not one of the top two players in the draft. We can't agree in here who the third best player is. AK could be clever, trade for that pick, oh we have Giddey, Coby, PG13, Matas, now we need a center, I'll draft Maluach. Any more of a reach than Pat Will? Have seen Maluach projected as high as 6 or 7 already. Or draft the highest rated offensive center as a young Vucevic replacement, Derik Queen. We know he loves offensive scorers and screw their defense (Giddey, Lavine, Derozan, Vucevic).

Expecting AK to draft who you want at 3 is really optimistic. Outside of Matas (no brainer), has he drafted a single player you didn't consider over drafted in the first round? Is he drafting VJ or Tre Johnson at 3 if he plans to re-sign Coby? Or make a weird pick, Bailey's dropping down boards too., could easily skip him.

You could move to pick 6 for far less cost and have a good shot at getting Bailey or Tre Johnson, if that's who you want.

Nobody thinks that, most people know that the Bulls need talent badly and this is a good way to do it.

The more picks you have, the more chance to hit on a star and that's the only way the Bulls can add one.

The Bulls don't have the assets to get a franchise player, a bunch of middling talent and expiring contracts aren't doing it.

Not having the assets to get a franchise player? How did Cleveland get Donovan Mitchell? FA. How did New York get Brunson (FA), or basically any star that is there now (trade)? OKC got SGA and half the team for PG13. Is it possible to get a franchise player that's not valued as a franchise player? I'd say our assets are better than Anthony Davis and a first, and they got Luka for that. Franchise player thru trade. Most of these franchise players aren't even with the teams that drafted them. Way more teams have stars they did not draft than stars they did. How many teams has Bron been on? Kyrie? Durant? Harden? Westbrook? Top stars in the league.

And trading for PG13 is NOT the only way to add a pick, lol. We could trade a future pick and add a pick. We could likely trade Coby alone and get a pick in this draft. Might be able to trade Ball for a late pick. Might be the only way to add pick 3. Who do you think AK picks at 3 by the way, that's worth us screwing our cap for three years and not being able to sign $60 mill worth FA? Really think he drafts VJ or Tre Johnson with Coby on the team? Really?

People always complain we don't have assets, then don't want to trade for players that would be considered better assets than what we have now, lol. The argument is better players make us a first round knockout. They're also better trade assets. Like the only assets we should have is endless draft picks, never player assets. We have expiring contracts. Turn them into immediate player assets with teams struggling with cap. Improve the asset base. We already have a lottery ticket, pick 12.

[Dan Z]

Man, y'all act like you're getting Lebron with pick #3, lmao! There are four distinct tiers, from what everybody is saying. Everybody agrees Flagg is undisputedly the top pick and best prospect. Not tied with anyone. Tier 1. Pretty much everybody agrees Harper is the undisputed second-best player. People are saying the Spurs would be crazy to trade down to 3 and not draft Harper. Tier 2. Then you have VJ, Bailey, Tre Johnson. Tier 3. Then it's pretty random, guys rising and falling.

Pick #3 in this draft is tier 3. You're getting at best a player that pretty much everybody believes is not one of the top two players in the draft. We can't agree in here who the third best player is. AK could be clever, trade for that pick, oh we have Giddey, Coby, PG13, Matas, now we need a center, I'll draft Maluach. Any more of a reach than Pat Will? Have seen Maluach projected as high as 6 or 7 already. Or draft the highest rated offensive center as a young Vucevic replacement, Derik Queen. We know he loves offensive scorers and screw their defense (Giddey, Lavine, Derozan, Vucevic).

Expecting AK to draft who you want at 3 is really optimistic. Outside of Matas (no brainer), has he drafted a single player you didn't consider over drafted in the first round? Is he drafting VJ or Tre Johnson at 3 if he plans to re-sign Coby? Or make a weird pick, Bailey's dropping down boards too., could easily skip him.

You could move to pick 6 for far less cost and have a good shot at getting Bailey or Tre Johnson, if that's who you want.

Nobody thinks that, most people know that the Bulls need talent badly and this is a good way to do it.

The more picks you have, the more chance to hit on a star and that's the only way the Bulls can add one.

The Bulls don't have the assets to get a franchise player, a bunch of middling talent and expiring contracts aren't doing it.

Not having the assets to get a franchise player? How did Cleveland get Donovan Mitchell? FA. How did New York get Brunson (FA), or basically any star that is there now (trade)? OKC got SGA and half the team for PG13. Is it possible to get a franchise player that's not valued as a franchise player? I'd say our assets are better than Anthony Davis and a first, and they got Luka for that. Most of these franchise players aren't even with the teams that drafted them. Way more teams have stars they did not draft than stars they did. How many teams has Bron been on? Durant? Harden? Westbrook? Top stars in the league.

And trading for PG13 is NOT the only way to add a pick, lol. We could trade a future pick and add a pick. We could likely trade Coby alone and get a pick in this draft. Might be able to trade Ball for a late pick. Might be the only way to add pick 3. Who do you think AK picks at 3 by the way, that's worth us screwing our cap for three years and not being able to sign $60 mill worth FA? Really think he drafts VJ or Tre Johnson with Coby on the team? Really?

The Cavs traded Collins Sexton, Lauri Markkanen, Ochai Agbaji, picks (2025, 2027, and 2028) plus two swaps (2026 and 2029) for Donovan Mitchell.

They did so because after the trade they still have a good team (Garland, Allen, Mobley, etc.).

The Bulls have assets to do a trade like this? For who?

The Luka trade is an outlier and not worth mentioning as an example. On top of that the Bulls don't have an Anthony Davis level player to trade.

I'm not suggesting that the Bulls should go after PG, but I don't think they have assets to make a trade for a star. Maybe a 2nd tier guy like Sabonis, but I don't think they should.

[Infinity2152]

Nobody thinks that, most people know that the Bulls need talent badly and this is a good way to do it.

The more picks you have, the more chance to hit on a star and that's the only way the Bulls can add one.

The Bulls don't have the assets to get a franchise player, a bunch of middling talent and expiring contracts aren't doing it.

Not having the assets to get a franchise player? How did Cleveland get Donovan Mitchell? FA. How did New York get Brunson (FA), or basically any star that is there now (trade)? OKC got SGA and half the team for PG13. Is it possible to get a franchise player that's not valued as a franchise player? I'd say our assets are better than Anthony Davis and a first, and they got Luka for that. Most of these franchise players aren't even with the teams that drafted them. Way more teams have stars they did not draft than stars they did. How many teams has Bron been on? Durant? Harden? Westbrook? Top stars in the league.

And trading for PG13 is NOT the only way to add a pick, lol. We could trade a future pick and add a pick. We could likely trade Coby alone and get a pick in this draft. Might be able to trade Ball for a late pick. Might be the only way to add pick 3. Who do you think AK picks at 3 by the way, that's worth us screwing our cap for three years and not being able to sign $60 mill worth FA? Really think he drafts VJ or Tre Johnson with Coby on the team? Really?

The Cavs traded Collins Sexton, Lauri Markkanen, Ochai Agbaji, picks (2025, 2027, and 2028) plus two swaps (2026 and 2029) for Donovan Mitchell.

They did so because after the trade they still have a good team (Garland, Allen, Mobley, etc.).

The Bulls have assets to do a trade like this? For who?

The Luka trade is an outlier and not worth mentioning as an example. On top of that the Bulls don't have an Anthony Davis level player to trade.

I'm not suggesting that the Bulls should go after PG, but I don't think they have assets to make a trade for a star. Maybe a 2nd tier guy like Sabonis, but I don't think they should.

Not going to bother to suggest who they could get with their best trade package, you'll refute it and neither of us can prove the point. Getting a "second tier" guy like Sabonis is what I'm talking about. We need those second tier guys to get into trade discussions for the first tier guys. You guys keep wanting to skip a step. Guys like Sabonis, Ingram, Bane, Barnes are much more likely to get us in the discussion on star trades than when the best players we can send out are expiring Coby or Vucevic. Great catch, looking at the Mitchell trade, two second tier players went.

I'm not trying to fix us this year. Half these arguments I'm having with people, they're focused on player names, player fit and I'm focused on short-term and long-term value. As a piece, not a player. Not even all that worried about fit, nobody here is guaranteed to be here.

[Dan Z]

Not having the assets to get a franchise player? How did Cleveland get Donovan Mitchell? FA. How did New York get Brunson (FA), or basically any star that is there now (trade)? OKC got SGA and half the team for PG13. Is it possible to get a franchise player that's not valued as a franchise player? I'd say our assets are better than Anthony Davis and a first, and they got Luka for that. Most of these franchise players aren't even with the teams that drafted them. Way more teams have stars they did not draft than stars they did. How many teams has Bron been on? Durant? Harden? Westbrook? Top stars in the league.

And trading for PG13 is NOT the only way to add a pick, lol. We could trade a future pick and add a pick. We could likely trade Coby alone and get a pick in this draft. Might be able to trade Ball for a late pick. Might be the only way to add pick 3. Who do you think AK picks at 3 by the way, that's worth us screwing our cap for three years and not being able to sign $60 mill worth FA? Really think he drafts VJ or Tre Johnson with Coby on the team? Really?

The Cavs traded Collins Sexton, Lauri Markkanen, Ochai Agbaji, picks (2025, 2027, and 2028) plus two swaps (2026 and 2029) for Donovan Mitchell.

They did so because after the trade they still have a good team (Garland, Allen, Mobley, etc.).

The Bulls have assets to do a trade like this? For who?

The Luka trade is an outlier and not worth mentioning as an example. On top of that the Bulls don't have an Anthony Davis level player to trade.

I'm not suggesting that the Bulls should go after PG, but I don't think they have assets to make a trade for a star. Maybe a 2nd tier guy like Sabonis, but I don't think they should.

Not going to bother to suggest who they could get with their best trade package, you'll refute it and neither of us can prove the point. Getting a "second tier" guy like Sabonis is what I'm talking about. We need those second tier guys to get into trade discussions for the first tier guys. You guys keep wanting to skip a step. Guys like Sabonis, Ingram, Bane, Barnes are much more likely to get us in the discussion on star trades than when the best players we can send out are expiring Coby or Vucevic.

Why do the Bulls need Bane, Sabonis or Ingram? Are you suggesting that they'd make the team a contender? Or at least at middle level team and then a star player will say he wants to be traded here? Good luck with that.

How many times has a player ever said he wants to be traded to Chicago? I can't remember one time.

Give up our assets for a second tier player and then what assets are left for a star?

[Infinity2152]

The Cavs traded Collins Sexton, Lauri Markkanen, Ochai Agbaji, picks (2025, 2027, and 2028) plus two swaps (2026 and 2029) for Donovan Mitchell.

They did so because after the trade they still have a good team (Garland, Allen, Mobley, etc.).

The Bulls have assets to do a trade like this? For who?

The Luka trade is an outlier and not worth mentioning as an example. On top of that the Bulls don't have an Anthony Davis level player to trade.

I'm not suggesting that the Bulls should go after PG, but I don't think they have assets to make a trade for a star. Maybe a 2nd tier guy like Sabonis, but I don't think they should.

Not going to bother to suggest who they could get with their best trade package, you'll refute it and neither of us can prove the point. Getting a "second tier" guy like Sabonis is what I'm talking about. We need those second tier guys to get into trade discussions for the first tier guys. You guys keep wanting to skip a step. Guys like Sabonis, Ingram, Bane, Barnes are much more likely to get us in the discussion on star trades than when the best players we can send out are expiring Coby or Vucevic.

Why do the Bulls need Bane, Sabonis or Ingram? Are you suggesting that they'd make the team a contender? Or at least at middle level team and then a star player will say he wants to be traded here? Good luck with that.

How many times has a player ever said he wants to be traded to Chicago? I can't remember one time.

Give up our assets for a second tier player and then what assets are left for a star?

I AM NOT SAYING THEY WILL MAKE US A CONTENDER. I keep trying to make that point. No single move is going to make us a contender. If we do all that and get pick 3, unless he's Lebron James reborn, he's not making us a contender. Almost every asset I'm talking about in most of these trades are expiring. They're going to be gone.

If we don't give up these expiring assets to get the second tier player. By your assertion, we don't have the assets to get a star anyway, so what's really changed? Except we have a second tier star to trade instead of cap space or multiple expiring contracts.

It seems y'all assume we're supposed to lose every deal we're in. The reason you look at 6 or 7 options is even if the chance of each is only 15% for you to get a great deal, 6 or 7 proposals gives you a damned good chance to get one. We should only take the deals we feel we're winning on the asset side. The Bulls have no desperation, no expectations, no cap problems right now. We can afford to only take the best deal available. Every team is not in the same position. Some probably have very serious mandates for change right now, whether it be salary or talent acquisition. We're in a pretty good position to get out-sized value for our trade pieces if we find the desperate suitors.

We have two tier 2 players now. Giddey and Coby I'd consider tier 2. Don't want to trade Giddey unless it's for a great return. Any trade involving Coby is basically swapping an expiring tier 2 for a non-expiring hopefully better fitting tier 2. Or we pay Coby next summer and have him as our "new" tier 2 at $30-$40 mill or more.

[Dan Z]

Not going to bother to suggest who they could get with their best trade package, you'll refute it and neither of us can prove the point. Getting a "second tier" guy like Sabonis is what I'm talking about. We need those second tier guys to get into trade discussions for the first tier guys. You guys keep wanting to skip a step. Guys like Sabonis, Ingram, Bane, Barnes are much more likely to get us in the discussion on star trades than when the best players we can send out are expiring Coby or Vucevic.

Why do the Bulls need Bane, Sabonis or Ingram? Are you suggesting that they'd make the team a contender? Or at least at middle level team and then a star player will say he wants to be traded here? Good luck with that.

How many times has a player ever said he wants to be traded to Chicago? I can't remember one time.

Give up our assets for a second tier player and then what assets are left for a star?

I AM NOT SAYING THEY WILL MAKE US A CONTENDER. I keep trying to make that point. No single move is going to make us a contender. If we do all that and get pick 3, unless he's Lebron James reborn, he's not making us a contender. Almost every asset I'm talking about in most of these trades are expiring. They're going to be gone.

If we don't give up these expiring assets to get the second tier player. By your assertion, we don't have the assets to get a star anyway, so what's really changed? Except we have a second tier star to trade instead of cap space or multiple expiring contracts.

It seems y'all assume we're supposed to lose every deal we're in. The reason you look at 6 or 7 options is even if the chance of each is only 15% for you to get a great deal, 6 or 7 proposals gives you a damned good chance to get one. We should only take the deals we feel we're winning on the asset side. The Bulls have no desperation, no expectations, no cap problems right now. We can afford to only take the best deal available. Every team is not in the same position. Some probably have very serious mandates for change right now, whether it be salary or talent acquisition. We're in a pretty good position to get out-sized value for our trade pieces if we find the desperate suitors.

Of course I think the Bulls should get the best deal they can. I'm a fan of the team and want them to do well.

If they trade for a 2nd tier star, or even a star, it won't be for expiring contracts only. The other team will ask for assets...Matas, picks...whatever that is.

I'd rather not give up future picks for someone like Sabonis. He's better than Vucevic, but it would feel like the Vuc trade 2.0.

[Infinity2152]

Why do the Bulls need Bane, Sabonis or Ingram? Are you suggesting that they'd make the team a contender? Or at least at middle level team and then a star player will say he wants to be traded here? Good luck with that.

How many times has a player ever said he wants to be traded to Chicago? I can't remember one time.

Give up our assets for a second tier player and then what assets are left for a star?

I AM NOT SAYING THEY WILL MAKE US A CONTENDER. I keep trying to make that point. No single move is going to make us a contender. If we do all that and get pick 3, unless he's Lebron James reborn, he's not making us a contender. Almost every asset I'm talking about in most of these trades are expiring. They're going to be gone.

If we don't give up these expiring assets to get the second tier player. By your assertion, we don't have the assets to get a star anyway, so what's really changed? Except we have a second tier star to trade instead of cap space or multiple expiring contracts.

It seems y'all assume we're supposed to lose every deal we're in. The reason you look at 6 or 7 options is even if the chance of each is only 15% for you to get a great deal, 6 or 7 proposals gives you a damned good chance to get one. We should only take the deals we feel we're winning on the asset side. The Bulls have no desperation, no expectations, no cap problems right now. We can afford to only take the best deal available. Every team is not in the same position. Some probably have very serious mandates for change right now, whether it be salary or talent acquisition. We're in a pretty good position to get out-sized value for our trade pieces if we find the desperate suitors.

Of course I think the Bulls should get the best deal they can. I'm a fan of the team and want them to do well.

If they trade for a 2nd tier star, or even a star, it won't be for expiring contracts only. The other team will ask for assets...Matas, picks...whatever that is.

I'd rather not give up future picks for someone like Sabonis. He's better than Vucevic, but it would feel like the Vuc trade 2.0.

Yeah, I think we had a disconnect. There are very few players I'm giving up picks for. Bane I'd considered because of his age, contract length etc but that's gone. I believe highly Jaylen Brown can be a top 10 player. He very well may show that this year with the Celtics, but it will be too late for us then.

Expirings, Coby and Portland pick have been the bulk of my trade proposals and that's because I don't believe in letting contracts expire. I think we could use those assets to get better long term pieces than say PG13 and #3. Let's be real, they're going to want pick 12. Taking on that much money to move up 9 spots in a draft where there's not even a consensus third best player is just gambling to me.

I think we're in a GREAT place to make value moves without worrying so much about fit and permanent players. A lot of teams are cap needy. Like the Nets are not using their cap space in free agency and they're hoping to stack assets thru being a third team.

Would like us to enter summer 2026 with Giddey ($25-$30 mill), Matas ($5 mill), Tier two Coby replacement ($12-30 mill) and hopefully another tier 2 ($20-$40 mill) plus our 2025 rookie and 2026 rookie.

Example (Just an example, don't say they can't happen)
Maybe Coby plus expiring traded for Tier two coby replacement. Coby and Collins got to Rockets , we get Jalen Green ($33 mill) back as third part in Durant trade as in rumors.

Vucevic, Ball for second Tier two replacement) Kuminga ($25 mill), Moody 12 mill

I still have the same number of picks, plus my rookies, but I have 2 tier two pieces in 2026 I can send out other than Giddey and Matas. I'm not looking for guys to stay forever, unless we do the Jaylen Brown one.

They could be tier 2, tier 3, but I think they're more valuable next summer than our pieces that we're sending out

And I refuse to believe AK would pick the best player with pick 3. I saw what he did with pick 4. He's not drafting who you think. Y'all would be so mad when we take on PG13 and draft Derick McQueen or Maluach, lmao! I'm trying to save you some heartache!

[Dan Z]

I AM NOT SAYING THEY WILL MAKE US A CONTENDER. I keep trying to make that point. No single move is going to make us a contender. If we do all that and get pick 3, unless he's Lebron James reborn, he's not making us a contender. Almost every asset I'm talking about in most of these trades are expiring. They're going to be gone.

If we don't give up these expiring assets to get the second tier player. By your assertion, we don't have the assets to get a star anyway, so what's really changed? Except we have a second tier star to trade instead of cap space or multiple expiring contracts.

It seems y'all assume we're supposed to lose every deal we're in. The reason you look at 6 or 7 options is even if the chance of each is only 15% for you to get a great deal, 6 or 7 proposals gives you a damned good chance to get one. We should only take the deals we feel we're winning on the asset side. The Bulls have no desperation, no expectations, no cap problems right now. We can afford to only take the best deal available. Every team is not in the same position. Some probably have very serious mandates for change right now, whether it be salary or talent acquisition. We're in a pretty good position to get out-sized value for our trade pieces if we find the desperate suitors.

Of course I think the Bulls should get the best deal they can. I'm a fan of the team and want them to do well.

If they trade for a 2nd tier star, or even a star, it won't be for expiring contracts only. The other team will ask for assets...Matas, picks...whatever that is.

I'd rather not give up future picks for someone like Sabonis. He's better than Vucevic, but it would feel like the Vuc trade 2.0.

Yeah, I think we had a disconnect. There are very few players I'm giving up picks for. Bane I'd considered because of his age, contract length etc but that's gone. I believe highly Jaylen Brown can be a top 10 player. He very well may show that this year with the Celtics, but it will be too late for us then.

Expirings, Coby and Portland pick have been the bulk of my trade proposals and that's because I don't believe in letting contracts expire. I think we could use those assets to get better long term pieces than say PG13 and #3. Let's be real, they're going to want pick 12. Taking on that much money to move up 9 spots in a draft where there's not even a consensus third best player is just gambling to me.

I think we're in a GREAT place to make value moves without worrying so much about fit and permanent players. A lot of teams are cap needy. Like the Nets are not using their cap space in free agency and they're hoping to stack assets thru being a third team.

Would like us to enter summer 2026 with Giddey ($25-$30 mill), Matas ($5 mill), Tier two Coby replacement ($12-30 mill) and hopefully another tier 2 ($20-$40 mill) plus our 2025 rookie and 2026 rookie.

Example (Just an example, don't say they can't happen)
Maybe Coby plus expiring traded for Tier two coby replacement. Coby sent to Dallas for extended Gafford and a pick. He's only 27, PER 24 last year, will be cheaper to extend than Coby. Maybe $20 mill, or around half.

Vucevic, Ball and Portland pick for second Tier two replacement) Kuminga ($25 mill), Moody 12 mill

I still have the same number of picks, plus my rookies, but I have 2 tier two pieces in 2026 I can send out other than Giddey and Matas. I'm not looking for guys to stay forever, unless we do the Jaylen Brown one.

They could be tier 2, tier 3, but I think they're more valuable next summer than our pieces that we're sending out

I agree with you that they shouldn't let the expiring contacts expire, but think they should use them to take on salary and get future picks in the process (OKC style...or what Charlotte has done with Josh Green/Grant Williams).

I have my doubts that Coby, the Portland pick and expiring contract would bring back much in a trade. Coby + expiring contracts for Gafford and a pick...that might be okay depending on the pick. The Bulls would lose a lot of offense without Coby, but I've often though that AK should think about the teams future more than the the immediate present.

Kuminga I'm not sure about. Why isn't he doing better? Why does GSW want to trade him? I said this in another post, but I might do it if it's PW for Kuminga straight up. I'd hate to get Kuminga and then if he doesn't work out the Bulls now have two duds on the roster (PW and Kuminga...of course they could also improve and it works out).

[Ccwatercraft]

Yeah, I'm not knocking PG13, seems like a cool guy, good, player, but he cannot stay healthy and would cost us a ton of assets and lock up our cap space. If we're pretty sure we're drafting a superstar at 3, a Flagg, Wemby, Bron, Luka level prospect I'd take the risk even with the huge cap kill. There aren't three Flagg level prospects in this draft. Apparently there aren't three Dylan Harper level prospects in this class.

Tell you what, I'm a huge fan of going for second year, third year talent with assets rather than spending a lot to draft high. Players like SGA or Giddey, you know they can compete at the NBA level, and you see the flashes of greatness at the NBA level. Lot of the best players were mid-low draft picks. Like Sabonis for Haliburton. Haliburton was at 15pts, 7 assists with the Kings, but Indiana saw the potential. They gave up a lot to get him, but it was worth it.

Jalen Green is one. Has a lot of room to grow, sky high potential.
Derek Lively. Buried on the bench.
Would spend a fair amount to get Dyson Daniels. Don't see superstar, but maybe Herb Jones level starting defensive SG.

A few older, but young guys

RJ Barrett. Has flaws, but still 24 and still room to get better.
Scottie Barnes. Would cost a lot to get, but imagine getting him and he improves that 3 ball.
Zion Williamson. Take the chance. Make a good offer and just get him.

Who's our next Haliburton, Donovan Mitchell, Jalen Brunson, good player ready to be great that we could get? Sometimes its opportunity, Giddey got it and Lively needs it. Wanted Bane, think he could take a jump, but have to feed Banchero and Wagner in Orlando.

You're not wrong. I do think people have legit fear that it would be another vuc like overpay, but I have no issue with them taking a stab at semi established player that has upside. Kuminga is the only one that gets mentioned often but there have to be others that our FO have targeted. Green seems like a risky lateral move but I haven't seen enough to speak on it. I really like the idea of lively

Bottom line, im not going to whine much if they make another 2 pick trade, just nail it yhis time.

Since I have no vote on their decisions I'll just roll with it.