OT: COVID-19 thread #2

PaKii94 · Post #1641 » by **PaKii94** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:53 am

There is no easy solution but I wish we could burn it all down and build our representation for a modern digital era. All the safeguards put in place was for the analog era where not everyone had access to the news and so we needed stability in our representatives.

Uninformed populace isn't the issue anymore. Now it's become misinformed populace

PlayerUp · Post #1642 » by **PlayerUp** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:59 am

PaKii94 wrote:As you said the gov't swamp needs to be drained from all 3 branches but that isn't going to happen anytime soon with the mechanisms in place.

This is 100% correct.

I wish Americans would push for term limits in the house, senate, court systems, etc.

dice · Post #1643 » by **dice** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:59 am

TheStig wrote:
dice wrote:
PaKii94 wrote:
I think it's kind of why Trump got elected in the first place. It was same old politician status quo with Hilary. Why not let Trump burn it down and build a new system for the masses? (Well we see why now)

the irony is that bernie wouldn't have been able to accomplish much more for progressive causes than hillary would have. and possibly less if he was unwilling to compromise

even if people consider biden the lesser of two evils (which i find insane), making decisions with no exciting options is part of being an adult

Sorry, was already guilted in to voting blue no matter who. It's not happening again. Biden's going to actually have to do something to get us to vote for him.

do what, exactly? promise stuff that has no chance in hell of happening like bernie and liz did?

bernie sanders will not hesitate to vote for joe biden. because he understands the basic reality that the gap between biden and trump is much bigger than the gap between himself and biden. and because he understands that the most important function of a president is getting left-of-center judges appointed

for generations now each democratic president has moved the country modestly to the left, while most GOP presidents have moved it sharply to the right. one step forward, two steps back. we can't keep self-sabotaging because the progress isn't as fast as we would like

dice · Post #1644 » by **dice** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 2:09 am

PaKii94 wrote:This system is severely flawed and both parties are there to serve the corps/1%.

which is what happens when GOP-appointed supreme court judges decide that "corporations are people" and can thus flood the political process with money

I personally think all the old people in govt have to die out. I do think the younger generations are ready for mass reform.

exactly what the hippie generation thought. times 10. that generation is now the "old people in government that have to die out." because the idealists didn't want to do the work it takes to actually affect change and so never rose to power

_txchilibowl_ · Post #1645 » by **_txchilibowl_** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 2:11 am

Biden may not be the radical change you want but he's better than the radical changes you're getting with Trump.

PlayerUp · Post #1646 » by **PlayerUp** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 2:13 am

TheStig wrote:Sorry, was already guilted in to voting blue no matter who. It's not happening again. Biden's going to actually have to do something to get us to vote for him.

The problem with Biden is he isn't able to sell his direction. He just expects you vote for him. The #1 reason he is pushing to become president is simply to dethrone Trump. #1 reason should be about your grand plan to fix America. "You ain't black' if you vote for Trump" quote or when people debate with him he just gets nasty and says just vote Trump. He can't sell himself. This is the mindset that Biden has and why he is just a terrible candidate.

_txchilibowl_ · Post #1647 » by **_txchilibowl_** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 2:16 am

PlayerUp wrote:
TheStig wrote:Sorry, was already guilted in to voting blue no matter who. It's not happening again. Biden's going to actually have to do something to get us to vote for him.

The problem with Biden is he isn't able to sell his direction. He just expects you vote for him. The #1 reason he is pushing to become president is simply to dethrone Trump. #1 reason should be about your grand plan to fix America. "You ain't black' if you vote for Trump" quote or when people debate with him he just gets nasty and says just vote Trump. He can't sell himself. This is the mindset that Biden has and why he is just a terrible candidate.

I think you'll see Biden step up with his plan soon. Right now he's just letting Trump burn himself to the ground.

PlayerUp · Post #1648 » by **PlayerUp** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 2:22 am

_txchilibowl_ wrote:Biden may not be the radical change you want but he's better than the radical changes you're getting with Trump.

I'd remove the word "radical". I don't support any of these radical movements. I simply support movement in general and getting bipartisan things done in congress. Why do we have a federal government and why are we paying tax dollar money for them to focus on impeachment and just fight with each other?

PlayerUp · Post #1649 » by **PlayerUp** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 2:23 am

_txchilibowl_ wrote:I think you'll see Biden step up with his plan soon. Right now he's just letting Trump burn himself to the ground.

He needs to get out of his house and get on the stage with Trump. No flip flopping with policies like Kerry did. Stick to your plan because you can't please everyone. That's the only way he will convince me and America he is the right man for the job.

dice · Post #1650 » by **dice** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 2:31 am

that potential super spreader event in tulsa that the trump campaign bragged about getting nearly a million requests to attend? turns out that a much of that interest was fake. an iowa teacher who had worked for buttigieg got potentially hundreds of thousands of teens on tiktok to request tickets and, if obtained, fail to show up. 6200 people ended up attending the rally. capacity was 19000. the campaign set up an overflow area because they expected thousands to show up who didn't have tickets. only dozens gathered

Read on Twitter

chitownsalesmen · Post #1651 » by **chitownsalesmen** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 2:32 am

coldfish wrote:
chitownsalesmen wrote:
coldfish wrote:as long as Biden doesn't go hard left and scare off the middle.

yeah go for the middle just like Clinton did in 2016, agreed, play it safe pick up those "reasonable republicans"

My wife used to get emails from the Clinton campaign and bitch to me about them. They amounted to guilt trips demanding that she vote based on sex instead of issues with some heavy feminist propaganda mixed in.

Clinton may not have gone far left but she didn't go for the middle either. She just ran a terrible campaign and treated the whole thing like a victory tour instead of an election.

Yeah clinton definitely played up the identity politics and biden is following in her footsteps in a way, by vowing to pick a female VP. Now with all the BLM protests/riots I also expect Biden to pick a black female as his VP.

dice · Post #1652 » by **dice** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 2:36 am

PlayerUp wrote:
_txchilibowl_ wrote:Biden may not be the radical change you want but he's better than the radical changes you're getting with Trump.

I'd remove the word "radical". I don't support any of these radical movements. I simply support movement in general and getting bipartisan things done in congress. Why do we have a federal government and why are we paying tax dollar money for them to focus on impeachment and just fight with each other?

it helps when the president doesn't commit treasonous, impeachable offenses

PlayerUp · Post #1653 » by **PlayerUp** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 2:36 am

dice wrote:that potential super spreader event in tulsa that the trump campaign bragged about getting nearly a million requests to attend?

Smart people. Why risk COVID-19? Oklahoma is already voting for Trump anyway. Not sure why he needs to have a rally in Oklahoma.

PlayerUp · Post #1654 » by **PlayerUp** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 2:42 am

dice wrote:it helps when the president doesn't commit treasonous, impeachable offenses

What Trump did is really no different from what all these other toxic politicians have done. The entire impeachment thing was a joke as was Clintons impeachment hearings. Cleanhouse is the only way to move forward.

Anyway I have talked enough about politics for the day.

dice · Post #1655 » by **dice** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 2:59 am

PlayerUp wrote:
dice wrote:it helps when the president doesn't commit treasonous, impeachable offenses

What Trump did is really no different from what all these other toxic politicians have done. The entire impeachment thing was a joke

none of this is true. trump illegally held up aid to an ally at war with russia in an attempt to extort them into helping him win re-election. he released the aid when caught, then some of his supporters claimed that it can't be extortion if you don't end up getting what you asked for

and if john bolton is to be believed, trump begged china for help in the upcoming election as well

dice · Post #1656 » by **dice** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 3:00 am

PlayerUp wrote:
dice wrote:it helps when the president doesn't commit treasonous, impeachable offenses

What Trump did is really no different from what all these other toxic politicians have done. The entire impeachment thing was a joke

none of this is true. trump illegally held up aid to an ally at war with russia in an attempt to extort them into helping him win re-election. he released the aid when caught, then some of his supporters claimed that it can't be extortion if you don't end up getting what you asked for

and if john bolton is to be believed, trump begged china for help in the upcoming election as well

dice · Post #1657 » by **dice** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 3:04 am

apparently there have been eight flu epidemics since the mid-1700s, all of which had a deadlier 2nd wave. hopefully we're more evolved in our approach now

TheStig · Post #1658 » by **TheStig** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 3:50 am

dice wrote:
TheStig wrote:
dice wrote:the irony is that bernie wouldn't have been able to accomplish much more for progressive causes than hillary would have. and possibly less if he was unwilling to compromise

even if people consider biden the lesser of two evils (which i find insane), making decisions with no exciting options is part of being an adult

Sorry, was already guilted in to voting blue no matter who. It's not happening again. Biden's going to actually have to do something to get us to vote for him.

do what, exactly? promise stuff that has no chance in hell of happening like bernie and liz did?

bernie sanders will not hesitate to vote for joe biden. because he understands the basic reality that the gap between biden and trump is much bigger than the gap between himself and biden. and because he understands that the most important function of a president is getting left-of-center judges appointed

for generations now each democratic president has moved the country modestly to the left, while most GOP presidents have moved it sharply to the right. one step forward, two steps back. we can't keep self-sabotaging because the progress isn't as fast as we would like

Why does it have no chance? Because we've been increasing military spending and tax cuts for corps and the rich for decades? It's how you end up with companies like amazon paying no federal income taxes or the state subsidizing walmart's employees getting pt and minumum wages.

Really? FDR was the most progressive/left president we had and that was about 90 years ago.

TheStig · Post #1659 » by **TheStig** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 3:55 am

PlayerUp wrote:
dice wrote:it helps when the president doesn't commit treasonous, impeachable offenses

What Trump did is really no different from what all these other toxic politicians have done. The entire impeachment thing was a joke as was Clintons impeachment hearings. Cleanhouse is the only way to move forward.

Anyway I have talked enough about politics for the day.

So first the Russians helped him, then Ukraine and the next one will be china. He must be the greatest diplomat ever!

The impeachments were an absolute joke. It's like the wire. Follow the money and then you'll get the boss. But Washington won't follow the money because most of them are corrupt. It's a indebt Clinton family leaving the WH becomes a hundreds of millions dollars richer giving speech and running a foundation.

Gotta get the money out of politics!

dice · Post #1660 » by **dice** » Mon Jun 22, 2020 4:40 am

TheStig wrote:
dice wrote:
TheStig wrote:Sorry, was already guilted in to voting blue no matter who. It's not happening again. Biden's going to actually have to do something to get us to vote for him.

do what, exactly? promise stuff that has no chance in hell of happening like bernie and liz did?

bernie sanders will not hesitate to vote for joe biden. because he understands the basic reality that the gap between biden and trump is much bigger than the gap between himself and biden. and because he understands that the most important function of a president is getting left-of-center judges appointed

for generations now each democratic president has moved the country modestly to the left, while most GOP presidents have moved it sharply to the right. one step forward, two steps back. we can't keep self-sabotaging because the progress isn't as fast as we would like

Why does it have no chance? Because we've been increasing military spending and tax cuts for corps and the rich for decades? It's how you end up with companies like amazon paying no federal income taxes or the state subsidizing walmart's employees getting pt and minumum wages.

agreed. doesn't change the reality that what they were proposing had no chance

i supported bernie not because i thought he'd get much done as president, but because his voice is important. wish we could have seen that experiment take place with him in the oval office, but he's just too radical for america right now, apparently

Really? FDR was the most progressive/left president we had and that was about 90 years ago.

what are you arguing about here? FDR, like bernie, would have accomplished nothing without a congressional supermajority in congress. we don't have that, so no major change is going to happen. that's the way it works. and with the ridiculous geographical distribution of senators, it's very hard to have that