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Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread

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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1741 » by madvillian » Mon Apr 5, 2021 9:55 pm

GoBlue72391 wrote:
madvillian wrote:I don't think you can "Jerami Grant" him because he's not capable of scoring in isolation. God forbid some team really thought he was a 1st option he'd be completely overwhelmed.

Only 44% of Grant's 2 point FGs this season are unassisted. Prior to this season, he's never been higher than 39% for unassisted 2 point FGs.

In 2018-19, 47% of Lauri's 2 point FGs were unassisted. Last year he was at 46% for unassisted 2 point FGs.

I know we have our agendas and biases, but this claim just doesn't jive with reality. Lauri created more of his own offense as a 2nd/3rd year second option big than Grant has this season as a 7th year first option wing.


Grant only has a 16.8 PER now that I just double checked your numbers I'm not even sure he's that good. Anyways, hard to compare them at all, vastly different players.
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I'll go ahead and make a sig bet that Mikal is better by RPM this year than Zach.
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1742 » by ZOMG » Mon Apr 5, 2021 9:56 pm

Ice Man wrote:Not many NBA players are useful when given the ball 12 feet from the basket in an old-fashioned post-up situation, no matter how much Stacey loves those plays. Lauri isn't one of them. What he needs to be able to do is overpower smaller defenders during dynamic plays, when things are moving quickly and he gets the ball near the hoop. He also needs to know how to create those situations. However, I see no sign that such things are happening.

Meaning, I care not about yesterday's post-up baskets, just as I didn't care when Doug McDermott posted some 6' 5" guy, scored, and then Stacey crowed.


Our whole offense is based on slow post-ups now. Pace is down, passes are down, and as a natural consequence, turnovers are down also - which has some people celebrating as if we've cracked some code for succesful NBA basketball. In reality, we're choosing to attack in an inefficient way.

It's very, very hard to win like this.

That said, I have nothing against opportunistic post-ups when there's a clear mismatch. With Lauri often filling the SF spot these days, he has a steady stream of these opportunities. But the recognition has to be team-wide. Often we don't even realize that the IS a mismatch, let alone move the players and the ball into correct positions to take advantage.
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1743 » by CobyWhite0 » Mon Apr 5, 2021 10:02 pm

Ice Man wrote:Not many NBA players are useful when given the ball 12 feet from the basket in an old-fashioned post-up situation, no matter how much Stacey loves those plays. Lauri isn't one of them. What he needs to be able to do is overpower smaller defenders during dynamic plays, when things are moving quickly and he gets the ball near the hoop. He also needs to know how to create those situations. However, I see no sign that such things are happening.

Meaning, I care not about yesterday's post-up baskets, just as I didn't care when Doug McDermott posted some 6' 5" guy, scored, and then Stacey crowed.


And we already have two of the best in Vuc and Thad. Who also happen to be outstanding passers if they draw a double-team in the post.

Lauri is none of these things at this time. He's not good at backing down smaller players, and he's not good at passing out of a double-team - and that's why the team doesn't really look for him if he has a mismatch.
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1744 » by HomoSapien » Mon Apr 5, 2021 10:06 pm

madvillian wrote:
GoBlue72391 wrote:
madvillian wrote:I don't think you can "Jerami Grant" him because he's not capable of scoring in isolation. God forbid some team really thought he was a 1st option he'd be completely overwhelmed.

Only 44% of Grant's 2 point FGs this season are unassisted. Prior to this season, he's never been higher than 39% for unassisted 2 point FGs.

In 2018-19, 47% of Lauri's 2 point FGs were unassisted. Last year he was at 46% for unassisted 2 point FGs.

I know we have our agendas and biases, but this claim just doesn't jive with reality. Lauri created more of his own offense as a 2nd/3rd year second option big than Grant has this season as a 7th year first option wing.


Grant only has a 16.8 PER now that I just double checked your numbers I'm not even sure he's that good. Anyways, hard to compare them at all, vastly different players.


My comparison wasn't about style, I just meant he needs a team to say "hey, we think you're talented, and for at least a year we'll allow this to be your team." Obviously, no one is going to win with Lauri as their focal point, but he needs someone who is willing to go to those lengths to rehab his value/reputation. No one saw it happening with Grant, so maybe there's a team out there for Lauri.
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1745 » by PaKii94 » Mon Apr 5, 2021 11:57 pm

Theis is out against the pacers. Expect to see more lauri again
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1746 » by ZOMG » Tue Apr 6, 2021 5:42 am

PaKii94 wrote:Theis is out against the pacers. Expect to see more lauri again


I dunno, this would be the perfect opportunity to give Aminu the 25 minutes he deserves
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1747 » by Hugi Mancura » Tue Apr 6, 2021 11:13 am

HomoSapien wrote:
madvillian wrote:
GoBlue72391 wrote:Only 44% of Grant's 2 point FGs this season are unassisted. Prior to this season, he's never been higher than 39% for unassisted 2 point FGs.

In 2018-19, 47% of Lauri's 2 point FGs were unassisted. Last year he was at 46% for unassisted 2 point FGs.

I know we have our agendas and biases, but this claim just doesn't jive with reality. Lauri created more of his own offense as a 2nd/3rd year second option big than Grant has this season as a 7th year first option wing.


Grant only has a 16.8 PER now that I just double checked your numbers I'm not even sure he's that good. Anyways, hard to compare them at all, vastly different players.


My comparison wasn't about style, I just meant he needs a team to say "hey, we think you're talented, and for at least a year we'll allow this to be your team." Obviously, no one is going to win with Lauri as their focal point, but he needs someone who is willing to go to those lengths to rehab his value/reputation. No one saw it happening with Grant, so maybe there's a team out there for Lauri.


I don't think he needs to be a focal point. Just to get to a team which is more about ball movement. Near what Bulls had earlier in this season. Lauri has been efficient scorer in post this year. More efficient than Thad or Vucevic, but basketball and especially NBA basketball is about opportunity. Do you get opportunity to do things in the court. This is not decided by the player himself. This is decided by coaching staff most of the time. Typical NBA team has maybe 2-3 players who are those people who get to do stuff where they are good at. Rest of them... don't. Unless they are really good at supporting role, but I would think majority of the 'role' players are star's who are just forced to be in supporting role.

If Bulls as a team would have wanted Lauri to improve his post game they would have put him to the post, but they never did this continually. They did these small one game spurts like last game where they did it 3 times, but to really teach someone to play in the post you need to do it 4-5 times in every game. Not 3 times in one game and then 20 games nothing. So Bulls organization never wanted Lauri to build a post game.

I never actually understood why people hate Lauri for not creating his own shots. That is not what bigs do anymore. Maybe in the 80's and 90's. This is first year of AD's career when he assisted basket's is under 70% (didn't really check this, but I think at least last 3-4 year with NOP his basket's were assisted). J.Collins creates about the same amount of his shots as Lauri. List can be continued forever. There are some bigs who create their own shots, but those are few. But it seems for a many people this is a negative thing for Lauri, but for other big's it's acceptable.

Lauri has done lot of things wrong, but he has also played in organization who have never wanted Lauri to be anything else than he is now. Fans maybe have wanted Lauri to be more, but fans don't pay Lauri's salary or decide how many minutes he gets. Lauri has now good/great PnR numbers, both on ball handler and as a big, great post numbers and do Bulls use Lauri in those plays? No. Lebron can choose what he does in court, majority of the NBA players don't and Lauri is one of them.

Lauri is the same situation as 90% of the NBA players. A player who his own organization doesn't really care about as long he does his job (which in Lauri case was to spread the floor for Dunn, Valentine and White). Organizations really cares about their star's and players who they believe will be star's.
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1748 » by chefo » Tue Apr 6, 2021 2:41 pm

Hugi Mancura wrote:
HomoSapien wrote:
madvillian wrote:
Grant only has a 16.8 PER now that I just double checked your numbers I'm not even sure he's that good. Anyways, hard to compare them at all, vastly different players.


My comparison wasn't about style, I just meant he needs a team to say "hey, we think you're talented, and for at least a year we'll allow this to be your team." Obviously, no one is going to win with Lauri as their focal point, but he needs someone who is willing to go to those lengths to rehab his value/reputation. No one saw it happening with Grant, so maybe there's a team out there for Lauri.


I don't think he needs to be a focal point. Just to get to a team which is more about ball movement. Near what Bulls had earlier in this season. Lauri has been efficient scorer in post this year. More efficient than Thad or Vucevic, but basketball and especially NBA basketball is about opportunity. Do you get opportunity to do things in the court. This is not decided by the player himself. This is decided by coaching staff most of the time. Typical NBA team has maybe 2-3 players who are those people who get to do stuff where they are good at. Rest of them... don't. Unless they are really good at supporting role, but I would think majority of the 'role' players are star's who are just forced to be in supporting role.

If Bulls as a team would have wanted Lauri to improve his post game they would have put him to the post, but they never did this continually. They did these small one game spurts like last game where they did it 3 times, but to really teach someone to play in the post you need to do it 4-5 times in every game. Not 3 times in one game and then 20 games nothing. So Bulls organization never wanted Lauri to build a post game.

I never actually understood why people hate Lauri for not creating his own shots. That is not what bigs do anymore. Maybe in the 80's and 90's. This is first year of AD's career when he assisted basket's is under 70% (didn't really check this, but I think at least last 3-4 year with NOP his basket's were assisted). J.Collins creates about the same amount of his shots as Lauri. List can be continued forever. There are some bigs who create their own shots, but those are few. But it seems for a many people this is a negative thing for Lauri, but for other big's it's acceptable.

Lauri has done lot of things wrong, but he has also played in organization who have never wanted Lauri to be anything else than he is now. Fans maybe have wanted Lauri to be more, but fans don't pay Lauri's salary or decide how many minutes he gets. Lauri has now good/great PnR numbers, both on ball handler and as a big, great post numbers and do Bulls use Lauri in those plays? No. Lebron can choose what he does in court, majority of the NBA players don't and Lauri is one of them.

Lauri is the same situation as 90% of the NBA players. A player who his own organization doesn't really care about as long he does his job (which in Lauri case was to spread the floor for Dunn, Valentine and White). Organizations really cares about their star's and players who they believe will be star's.


The biggest mystery to me, post FebruLauri, was why the Bulls' coaching staffs insisted on moving him to the weak-side spacer role almost exclusively. I know why, but it was a crappy choice for the reasons I'll describe in the paragraphs below. He stopped being used as a P&P and P&R player, his touches dropped in half--after he had what looked like a breakout season no less. So, in typical fashion, they finally found something that worked very well... and then promptly threw it in the garbage bin... because? FebruLauri was as good an offensive player as Zach is right now. Let that sink in for a second.

As I've written countless times, you've got to pimp your players out. Just have to. If that means that Lauri is guaranteed 70 touches to score 22-23 ppg, you do it, especially on a young team. Zach deserved his touches. Coby definitely didn't deserve his. Neither did WCJ. Lauri was the ONLY other player where we knew what he can do with more touches... and Boylen never gave them to him (if you remember, Boylen's comment that if Lauri wanted more touches, he needed to make up the 40-touch difference by rebounding more). That's just dumba$$ery in not understanding what you've got on the roster. Our team was so young it lacked discipline--Blah, blah, whatever. If you can't execute what the coaches tell you to--ride the effin' pine.

This season, schematically, isn't that much different than last, with the major change being that Lauri does get 3-4 plays run for him every game and, to start the season, he was allowed to roam outside of weak-side corner jail. He responded well and had a really good stretch to open the season.

Now that teams have started sitting on the Bulls passing lanes, and especially on our shooters (it's not a coincidence that we're shooting much worse from 3 the last 15 or so games--people are letting Thad score more and staying home more often than before; better for cutters like PaW, worse for our shooters, in theory).

Anyhow, back to Lauri.

A FebruLauri-lite at 23 ppg and 60%+ TS (say last year) was either going to make the team vastly more attractive to potential FAs because the Bulls would have had 2 "stars" (if we wanted to keep Lauri), or he would have fetched a (semi)star in return in the trade market, if they didn't want to pay him. Either way, the Bulls would have been better off with Lauri getting 70+ touches / game instead of 40 like last year and this year.

Instead, this year we opened up by giving Coby 75 / game and Wendell and Thad darn near 60. Yeah, given that Zach deserved his 70, there's nothing left for anybody else. In retrospect the 20 ppg Lauri managed to pull off on 40 was some sort of mini-NBA-miracle.

That's one of the problem with young teams that don't have guys who've already been paid but also understand a bit better their place in the pecking order. Even if Lauri was FebruLauri-lite (which he was to open the year), why would Coby, Wendell or Denzel go out of their way to give up their touches and opportunities to him, unless the coach stressed it to them and if they don't, they won't see the floor? That's true for every other young player on the team.

A single very smart player like Chris Paul or Mike Conley could have made a TON of difference on our team the last 2 years, and they both could have been had. Just somebody to keep feeding the hot hand and bring some structure to the team where it has been "lord-of-the-flies" after Zach gets his touches for 2 years running now.

Anyways, that shipped looked to have sailed. Sucks they blew it, IMO. Lauri could have been much better, or could have been sold for a king's ransom.
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1749 » by sco » Tue Apr 6, 2021 3:09 pm

chefo wrote:
Hugi Mancura wrote:
HomoSapien wrote:
My comparison wasn't about style, I just meant he needs a team to say "hey, we think you're talented, and for at least a year we'll allow this to be your team." Obviously, no one is going to win with Lauri as their focal point, but he needs someone who is willing to go to those lengths to rehab his value/reputation. No one saw it happening with Grant, so maybe there's a team out there for Lauri.


I don't think he needs to be a focal point. Just to get to a team which is more about ball movement. Near what Bulls had earlier in this season. Lauri has been efficient scorer in post this year. More efficient than Thad or Vucevic, but basketball and especially NBA basketball is about opportunity. Do you get opportunity to do things in the court. This is not decided by the player himself. This is decided by coaching staff most of the time. Typical NBA team has maybe 2-3 players who are those people who get to do stuff where they are good at. Rest of them... don't. Unless they are really good at supporting role, but I would think majority of the 'role' players are star's who are just forced to be in supporting role.

If Bulls as a team would have wanted Lauri to improve his post game they would have put him to the post, but they never did this continually. They did these small one game spurts like last game where they did it 3 times, but to really teach someone to play in the post you need to do it 4-5 times in every game. Not 3 times in one game and then 20 games nothing. So Bulls organization never wanted Lauri to build a post game.

I never actually understood why people hate Lauri for not creating his own shots. That is not what bigs do anymore. Maybe in the 80's and 90's. This is first year of AD's career when he assisted basket's is under 70% (didn't really check this, but I think at least last 3-4 year with NOP his basket's were assisted). J.Collins creates about the same amount of his shots as Lauri. List can be continued forever. There are some bigs who create their own shots, but those are few. But it seems for a many people this is a negative thing for Lauri, but for other big's it's acceptable.

Lauri has done lot of things wrong, but he has also played in organization who have never wanted Lauri to be anything else than he is now. Fans maybe have wanted Lauri to be more, but fans don't pay Lauri's salary or decide how many minutes he gets. Lauri has now good/great PnR numbers, both on ball handler and as a big, great post numbers and do Bulls use Lauri in those plays? No. Lebron can choose what he does in court, majority of the NBA players don't and Lauri is one of them.

Lauri is the same situation as 90% of the NBA players. A player who his own organization doesn't really care about as long he does his job (which in Lauri case was to spread the floor for Dunn, Valentine and White). Organizations really cares about their star's and players who they believe will be star's.


The biggest mystery to me, post FebruLauri, was why the Bulls' coaching staffs insisted on moving him to the weak-side spacer role almost exclusively. I know why, but it was a crappy choice for the reasons I'll describe in the paragraphs below. He stopped being used as a P&P and P&R player, his touches dropped in half--after he had what looked like a breakout season no less. So, in typical fashion, they finally found something that worked very well... and then promptly threw it in the garbage bin... because? FebruLauri was as good an offensive player as Zach is right now. Let that sink in for a second.

As I've written countless times, you've got to pimp your players out. Just have to. If that means that Lauri is guaranteed 70 touches to score 22-23 ppg, you do it, especially on a young team. Zach deserved his touches. Coby definitely didn't deserve his. Neither did WCJ. Lauri was the ONLY other player where we knew what he can do with more touches... and Boylen never gave them to him (if you remember, Boylen's comment that if Lauri wanted more touches, he needed to make up the 40-touch difference by rebounding more). That's just dumba$$ery in not understanding what you've got on the roster. Our team was so young it lacked discipline--Blah, blah, whatever. If you can't execute what the coaches tell you to--ride the effin' pine.

This season, schematically, isn't that much different than last, with the major change being that Lauri does get 3-4 plays run for him every game and, to start the season, he was allowed to roam outside of weak-side corner jail. He responded well and had a really good stretch to open the season.

Now that teams have started sitting on the Bulls passing lanes, and especially on our shooters (it's not a coincidence that we're shooting much worse from 3 the last 15 or so games--people are letting Thad score more and staying home more often than before; better for cutters like PaW, worse for our shooters, in theory).

Anyhow, back to Lauri.

A FebruLauri-lite at 23 ppg and 60%+ TS (say last year) was either going to make the team vastly more attractive to potential FAs because the Bulls would have had 2 "stars" (if we wanted to keep Lauri), or he would have fetched a (semi)star in return in the trade market, if they didn't want to pay him. Either way, the Bulls would have been better off with Lauri getting 70+ touches / game instead of 40 like last year and this year.

Instead, this year we opened up by giving Coby 75 / game and Wendell and Thad darn near 60. Yeah, given that Zach deserved his 70, there's nothing left for anybody else. In retrospect the 20 ppg Lauri managed to pull off on 40 was some sort of mini-NBA-miracle.

That's one of the problem with young teams that don't have guys who've already been paid but also understand a bit better their place in the pecking order. Even if Lauri was FebruLauri-lite (which he was to open the year), why would Coby, Wendell or Denzel go out of their way to give up their touches and opportunities to him, unless the coach stressed it to them and if they don't, they won't see the floor? That's true for every other young player on the team.

A single very smart player like Chris Paul or Mike Conley could have made a TON of difference on our team the last 2 years, and they both could have been had. Just somebody to keep feeding the hot hand and bring some structure to the team where it has been "lord-of-the-flies" after Zach gets his touches for 2 years running now.

Anyways, that shipped looked to have sailed. Sucks they blew it, IMO. Lauri could have been much better, or could have been sold for a king's ransom.

You make some good points here!

I think that the decision to prioritize White over Lauri happened when Lauri didn't accept AK's offer. White showed some great offense late last season, so IMO they decided to give White the chance to step up. He didn't. IMO, Lauri further hurt his case for being an offensive key player when he reminded everyone that he his durable when he went down for a long stretch. Statistics get put aside when guys repeatedly miss extended time.

I think the plan was to get Ball, but that fell through and may never materialize. I also think the FO wants PWill to become our 3rd option scorer going forward, and I think Lauri, with the starters changes that dynamic, so putting Lauri with the bench guys seems to make the most sense. He gets more touches and gives PWill more offensive responsibility with starting unit.
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1750 » by Louri » Tue Apr 6, 2021 6:24 pm

Atm benching seems like a best thing that has happened to Lauri in a while. I mean, now he has to get motivation to get better in certain aspects in his game that he lack.. ofc only IF he wants to be better player in this league. Not just shooter. I think he would be already really good player in Euroleague like Mirotic is. But I think Lauri still has some flame to get better in NBA and improve his game next off-season.

Now that Lavine and Vucevic are working on their bro game, there would not be much touches in the starting line-up anyway. Bulls has been force feeding Vuce and Thad and that will be main goal in next games also.
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1751 » by CobyWhite0 » Wed Apr 7, 2021 5:15 pm

Bulls' record when Lauri starts: 8-17
Bulls' record when Lauri comes off the bench: 2-2
Bulls' record when Lauri doesn't play at all: 11-9
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1752 » by madvillian » Wed Apr 7, 2021 5:24 pm

He seems a little more animated. I think he's a pretty nice backup big man. Maybe that's just his level. Same with White. Useful backup. I like the OTO actions they run for him. If he could run off screens more often he'd be a helluva lot better. As he is now he's sorta only a catch and shoot guy with any sort of relability.
dumbell78 wrote:Random comment....Mikal Bridges stroke is dripping right now in summer league. Carry on.


I'll go ahead and make a sig bet that Mikal is better by RPM this year than Zach.
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1753 » by CobyWhite0 » Wed Apr 7, 2021 6:39 pm

madvillian wrote:He seems a little more animated. I think he's a pretty nice backup big man. Maybe that's just his level. Same with White. Useful backup. I like the OTO actions they run for him. If he could run off screens more often he'd be a helluva lot better. As he is now he's sorta only a catch and shoot guy with any sort of relability.


Small sample size, but he's been very efficient in his 4 games off the bench - .556 FG, .545 3's, .702 TS%
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1754 » by WindyCityBorn » Wed Apr 7, 2021 7:45 pm

Lauri played well last night. Hopefully that kick isn’t something that will set him back again.
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1755 » by Wingy » Wed Apr 7, 2021 10:20 pm

WindyCityBorn wrote:Lauri played well last night. Hopefully that kick isn’t something that will set him back again.


Shots went in, so that's of course great, but I thought his activity was excellent vs. other recent games. Cutting, and moving w/o the ball, energized. If we had that guy consistently, he's probably already resigned.
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1756 » by DuckIII » Thu Apr 8, 2021 12:59 am

Wingy wrote:
WindyCityBorn wrote:Lauri played well last night. Hopefully that kick isn’t something that will set him back again.


Shots went in, so that's of course great, but I thought his activity was excellent vs. other recent games. Cutting, and moving w/o the ball, energized. If we had that guy consistently, he's probably already resigned.


Spot on. The version of Lauri that played last night? We’ve seen him before. Off and on for years. That’s what makes him so damn frustrating. Because that version is clearly a plus value player. It’s hard to understand why he so rarely comes out that way. I don’t get it.
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1757 » by PaKii94 » Thu Apr 8, 2021 1:03 am

DuckIII wrote:
Wingy wrote:
WindyCityBorn wrote:Lauri played well last night. Hopefully that kick isn’t something that will set him back again.


Shots went in, so that's of course great, but I thought his activity was excellent vs. other recent games. Cutting, and moving w/o the ball, energized. If we had that guy consistently, he's probably already resigned.


Spot on. The version of Lauri that played last night? We’ve seen him before. Off and on for years. That’s what makes him so damn frustrating. Because that version is clearly a plus value player. It’s hard to understand why he so rarely comes out that way. I don’t get it.


He really doesn't have the alpha mentality/confidence. You almost have to force him to be aggressive. Last night was theis being out, that outburst with the suns came when zach was out.

The other thing is it has to continue throughout the game otherwise Lauri's content on standing on the perimeter hoisting up 3s a good roleplayer/teammate.

I think it'll eventually start clicking with him as he matures. He's still young and big men take time to develop. Also he FINALLY has a bigman mentor in vuc who's anywhere near his skillset. Hopefully Lauri's sponging up all the knowledge he can get from him.
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1758 » by DuckIII » Thu Apr 8, 2021 1:26 am

PaKii94 wrote:
DuckIII wrote:
Wingy wrote:
Shots went in, so that's of course great, but I thought his activity was excellent vs. other recent games. Cutting, and moving w/o the ball, energized. If we had that guy consistently, he's probably already resigned.


Spot on. The version of Lauri that played last night? We’ve seen him before. Off and on for years. That’s what makes him so damn frustrating. Because that version is clearly a plus value player. It’s hard to understand why he so rarely comes out that way. I don’t get it.


He really doesn't have the alpha mentality/confidence. You almost have to force him to be aggressive. Last night was theis being out, that outburst with the suns came when zach was out.

The other thing is it has to continue throughout the game otherwise Lauri's content on standing on the perimeter hoisting up 3s a good roleplayer/teammate.

I think it'll eventually start clicking with him as he matures. He's still young and big men take time to develop. Also he FINALLY has a bigman mentor in vuc who's anywhere near his skillset. Hopefully Lauri's sponging up all the knowledge he can get from him.


That’s definitely the hope. The problem is he’s shown the ability - and mentality - to play that way since he was a rookie. It’s been 4 years. It’s just hard to understand how a guy who has seen his own self consistently be effective that way, does it so infrequently.

4 years is a long time to not improve on that. Patrick Lee
Williams suffers from the same thing, but he’s a 19 year old rookie. If he’s still this way when he’s 23, that will be a big problem.
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1759 » by PaKii94 » Thu Apr 8, 2021 1:45 am

DuckIII wrote:
PaKii94 wrote:
DuckIII wrote:
Spot on. The version of Lauri that played last night? We’ve seen him before. Off and on for years. That’s what makes him so damn frustrating. Because that version is clearly a plus value player. It’s hard to understand why he so rarely comes out that way. I don’t get it.


He really doesn't have the alpha mentality/confidence. You almost have to force him to be aggressive. Last night was theis being out, that outburst with the suns came when zach was out.

The other thing is it has to continue throughout the game otherwise Lauri's content on standing on the perimeter hoisting up 3s a good roleplayer/teammate.

I think it'll eventually start clicking with him as he matures. He's still young and big men take time to develop. Also he FINALLY has a bigman mentor in vuc who's anywhere near his skillset. Hopefully Lauri's sponging up all the knowledge he can get from him.


That’s definitely the hope. The problem is he’s shown the ability - and mentality - to play that way since he was a rookie. It’s been 4 years. It’s just hard to understand how a guy who has seen his own self consistently be effective that way, does it so infrequently.

4 years is a long time to not improve on that. Patrick Lee
Williams suffers from the same thing, but he’s a 19 year old rookie. If he’s still this way when he’s 23, that will be a big problem.


I've mentioned it earlier in this thread but he legitimately hasn't gotten focused 1st/2nd option touches since the FebruLauri period. I do think he's improved in somethings

-finishing at the rim, he's been elite near the rim this year but limited attempts
-improving his loose handles, remember the TOs last year whenever he handled the ball?
- quickening his shot, but it's been treading down since injuries
-improved defense, it's still not above average but his defensive impact numbers have improved.

But it all comes down to dedicated looks. BD said last games presser than zach is someone who can get his own, vuc needs to be given the ball for his points. Lauri is the same way, but he hasn't been given that privilege. They ran more Lavine/vuc pnr last game that they probably have done all season with Lavine/lauri.

Now lauri is again partially to blame for that because like I said, he doesn't have the alpha in him yet to demand the ball and take over a #2 role. He's content being "one of the guys" after zach which isn't good for him or the team.

Then there is the injury excuses. For the past 3 years, this one included. Lauri's been out/injured earlier in the season for like a month. Each season they learn to play without him as a focal point so when he comes back he's an afterthought (happened again this year). Which again is partially on him because he doesn't/hasn't stepped up to the mantle and demanded those looks (something like val's confidence)

Lauri's still got years of basketball left unless he keeps getting bit by the injury bug. I think he'll eventually figure it out once he matures and becomes a "vet". It took zach until now to be a winning player and he's still learning. Vuc took years to develop on a bad magic team to become a multiple time all star later in his career. I'm confident lauri will eventually figure it out.

I would hope it's on/for the bulls but I don't see him being resigned here unless he balls out for the rest of the year and puts up some good playoff performances.
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Re: Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread 

Post#1760 » by PaKii94 » Thu Apr 8, 2021 1:49 am

I do like the lauri at SF look. I've always advocated for that over lauri at C. It looks less viable now that Lauri's added some lbs and become more ground bound but I still think that could be a matchup problem.

The key thing is again finding the mismatch and forcing the issue. Lauri does try to call for the ball but half the time his teammates look him off and he's content with retreating to the corner. This doesn't do him or the team any good because it makes life easier for the opposing team to guard him with a small (kyrie a few games ago).

Instead they should be reposting and forcing the issue continually until the opposing team adjusts. This is something I think lauri can learn from Vuc. Vuc excels in that regard

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