Butler calls out Hoiberg / Update pg 33: KC releases negative report on Jimmy

[kingkirk]

The issue is the offense, period. Nobody predicted the offense would be this bad, and mostly everyone thought Hoiberg would easily turn this team into a top 5 offense (even though the supposed offensively inept Thibs had this exact team at a top 10 efficiency, even with all the injuries last year). This team is not made for pace and space. It's meant for a slow it down, grind you to death, iso and post offense system, because that's what Butler, Rose, and Gasol would thrive in. And if there's one thing Thibs did in his tenure here, it was that he ALWAYS put his players in positions to succeed, it was just up to them to execute. Thinking that pace and space is this brand new thing that would work with any roster is just a fools errand.

Fred Hoiberg has brought back up what Thibodeau was doing. He has done away with a lot of things that he wanted to do in favor of what the team did last season.

Solely blaming the offense on Fred Hoiberg is hard for me to cop when he has Derrick Rose running his offense. He's bad historically bad this season, but somehow that continues to be overlooked or least downplayed.

[rtblues]

Fred Hoiberg has a pacemaker in his heart. He's had multiple cardiac procedures. A long NBA career, a strong showing in the FO in Minny and a distinguished resume in NCAA.

I doubt he gives 2 flying **** on how Jimmy thinks he should coach the team. Especially, when that feedback is delivered via the media.

Jimmy - you made your money, you are playing well, just know that your hardship to success story doesn't mean other folks in the NBA don't have the same stories.

Fred's paid his dues already.

Are these supposed to be resume items? Don't understand what this has to do with anything here. If anything, those are concerns in a head coach...>See Steve Kerr, you remember him right, the guy who has missed this entire season...
Heart troubles, NCAA experience and FO experience don't translate to a successful NBA head coach, sorry...

[RSP83]

Fred Hoiberg has a pacemaker in his heart. He's had multiple cardiac procedures. A long NBA career, a strong showing in the FO in Minny and a distinguished resume in NCAA.

I doubt he gives 2 flying **** on how Jimmy thinks he should coach the team. Especially, when that feedback is delivered via the media.

Jimmy - you made your money, you are playing well, just know that your hardship to success story doesn't mean other folks in the NBA don't have the same stories.

Fred's paid his dues already.

Are these supposed to be resume items? Don't understand what this has to do with anything here. If anything, those are concerns in a head coach...>See Steve Kerr, you remember him right, the guy who has missed this entire season...
Heart troubles, NCAA experience and FO experience don't translate to a successful NBA head coach, sorry...

I think musiq meant to say that Jimmy's comment is the least Fred is worried about.

[Chicago Brawls]

I don't like what we've become.

[Jimako10]

The issue is the offense, period. Nobody predicted the offense would be this bad, and mostly everyone thought Hoiberg would easily turn this team into a top 5 offense (even though the supposed offensively inept Thibs had this exact team at a top 10 efficiency, even with all the injuries last year). This team is not made for pace and space. It's meant for a slow it down, grind you to death, iso and post offense system, because that's what Butler, Rose, and Gasol would thrive in. And if there's one thing Thibs did in his tenure here, it was that he ALWAYS put his players in positions to succeed, it was just up to them to execute. Thinking that pace and space is this brand new thing that would work with any roster is just a fools errand.

Fred Hoiberg has brought back up what Thibodeau was doing. He has done away with a lot of things that he wanted to do in favor of what the team did last season.

Solely blaming the offense on Fred Hoiberg is hard for me to cop when he has Derrick Rose running his offense. He's bad historically bad this season, but somehow that continues to be overlooked or least downplayed.

Hoiberg may eventually turn out to be a good head coach with more NBA experience, I'm not solely placing blame on him. Most of the blame should be directed at the FO that put an inexperienced coach in charge of a veteran team that was supposed to be contending for a title, while making zero changes to help him with the transition and new system that he was bringing. I honestly could not believe that this FO was dumb enough to expose themselves to pure, objective criticism by bringing back the exact same roster, trying to prove that the past failures laid at the hands of Thibs.

[RSP83]

Jimmy should and could have keep this internally. What the hell is he thinking? The media can't do anything to fix his problem. He should be careful with his openess to the media, teammates may start keeping some distance from him.

MJ was actually the same way, but he gets on his coaches and teammates face behind closed doors. Does Jimmy think he's Jordan?

I think Fred won't be too bothered with it. Somehow, I think Jimmy is calling out Niko. Niko played with no sense of urgency, and I think Hoiberg is not holding him accountable.

[League Circles]

Honestly, I'm sick of his mouth and I'd start shopping him. Dude is stupid. It's just a low IQ move to start calling out your coach 20 games into his career.

[coldfish]

Random comments:
- Right now, the Bulls have played 15 home games (11-4) and 10 road games (4-6). That obviously changes going forward. They have a point differential of +1.0 (10th in conference) and are 0.5 games out of the 9th spot. The metrics right now point to Chicago MISSING THE PLAYOFFS! The status quo is not good and someone has to do something about it.
- I don't see where Butler is calling for Thibodeau. If anything, Thibodeau's biggest failing was not calling out individuals. Butler is being very consistent in not being happy with either of them.
- And yes, everyone here is right that the team played like this last year. Lots of people blamed the coach, including the front office, and the front office was completely wrong. I don't know who the trouble maker is. I suspect its Pau or Rose but with his play and euro history, it might be Mirotic too. Regardless, an insider needs to figure out who the poison is and either bench or trade them.

Kudos to Jimmy here for doing what Thibodeau should have done, Fred should be doing and what the front office should have understood!!!!

[coldfish]

Jimmy should and could have keep this internally. What the hell is he thinking? The media can't do anything to fix his problem. He should be careful with his openess to the media, teammates may start keeping some distance from him.

MJ was actually the same way, but he gets on his coaches and teammates face behind closed doors. Does Jimmy think he's Jordan?

I think Fred won't be too bothered with it. Somehow, I think Jimmy is calling out Niko. Niko played with no sense of urgency, and I think Hoiberg is not holding him accountable.

Has it crossed people's minds that it has been in doors for quite some time now, in house finger pointing, calling people out, etc. and its just not working so Butler is trying a different tactic?

[MC3]

Here come the "Has Hoiberg lost the team?" and the "The Bulls are a dumpster fire" articles.

But guess what this will not happen, but it will happen "Jimmy Butler is on trading block".

[FORMIDABULLS]

Fred's been rather honest to admitting his mistakes like that not calling timeout in the OT, so maybe he will learn to adjust his coaching style. 50% of Thibs and picking the right timing to stamp a point probably works too than being hard all the time. Ain't he supposed to be that A-star communicator that got Royce White to play hard? I'm inclined to believe Fred will be able to sort these things out eventually. That said, like a couple of other posters, I don't get Jimmy's tendency to stop the ball and go iso. Yeah, he carried the team with his hero ball at times but is that part of the game plan or taking out his frustrations maybe.

[riprose]

Never liked Fred. And I am thankful that Jimmy said it.

[DarthDiggler69]

Hoiberg isn't going to survive very long here.

Or any coach, if Thib's, a strict X's and O's coach and Hoiberg, a laidback ex-player coach, cant motivate them then not many coaches can unless they have a few titles under their belts, and not many of those coaches around. So the Butler just needs to STFU about this stuff to the media

[DarthDiggler69]

Never liked Fred. And I am thankful that Jimmy said it.

Hoiberg had my respect when he played here, he was the only player that gave a $hit and played his butt off every game when things were bleak. Im fine if Jimmy felt that way but he is an idiot for saying it to the media, he thinks hes bigger than he actually is and is a bad leader

[smileyforall220]

Butler needs to shut his mouth. He's been getting destroyed on defense, and is the worst offender on stopping the ball on offense for the team. Every time he gets the ball, he usually looks to shoot, or hold the ball for a couple seconds and ISO up a shot. Derrick will pass to him, but Butler rarely ever passes to derrick, and many times just goes into JimME mode

[Crafty_Veteran]

Honestly, I'm sick of his mouth and I'd start shopping him. Dude is stupid. It's just a low IQ move to start calling out your coach 20 games into his career.

Agree. At first I thought Butler was being a good vocal leader with all the talking in post games, but criticizing your coach publicly is a huge no no for almost every player in every sport. Lebron and Kobe could do that in their prime. Did not expect Butler to create drama like this. Maybe Butler sees this as a Lebron/Blatt situation from last year. But Jimmy is no Lebron.

[Crafty_Veteran]

Jimmy should and could have keep this internally. What the hell is he thinking? The media can't do anything to fix his problem. He should be careful with his openess to the media, teammates may start keeping some distance from him.

MJ was actually the same way, but he gets on his coaches and teammates face behind closed doors. Does Jimmy think he's Jordan?

I think Fred won't be too bothered with it. Somehow, I think Jimmy is calling out Niko. Niko played with no sense of urgency, and I think Hoiberg is not holding him accountable.

Has it crossed people's minds that it has been in doors for quite some time now, in house finger pointing, calling people out, etc. and its just not working so Butler is trying a different tactic?

Yes.

[DarthDiggler69]

I dont see how Jimmy is calling for Thibs either, Thibs drove these guys "Too hard" , so Butler is saying Fred needs to be between Thibs and Fred.

[coldfish]

The issue is the offense, period. Nobody predicted the offense would be this bad, and mostly everyone thought Hoiberg would easily turn this team into a top 5 offense (even though the supposed offensively inept Thibs had this exact team at a top 10 efficiency, even with all the injuries last year). This team is not made for pace and space. It's meant for a slow it down, grind you to death, iso and post offense system, because that's what Butler, Rose, and Gasol would thrive in. And if there's one thing Thibs did in his tenure here, it was that he ALWAYS put his players in positions to succeed, it was just up to them to execute. Thinking that pace and space is this brand new thing that would work with any roster is just a fools errand.

Fred Hoiberg has brought back up what Thibodeau was doing. He has done away with a lot of things that he wanted to do in favor of what the team did last season.

Solely blaming the offense on Fred Hoiberg is hard for me to cop when he has Derrick Rose running his offense. He's bad historically bad this season, but somehow that continues to be overlooked or least downplayed.

Hoiberg may eventually turn out to be a good head coach with more NBA experience, I'm not solely placing blame on him. Most of the blame should be directed at the FO that put an inexperienced coach in charge of a veteran team that was supposed to be contending for a title, while making zero changes to help him with the transition and new system that he was bringing. I honestly could not believe that this FO was dumb enough to expose themselves to pure, objective criticism by bringing back the exact same roster, trying to prove that the past failures laid at the hands of Thibs.

Plus a million.

This mess is completely on the front office. They undermined the coach last year, brought in Swanson to create a country club atmosphere, then fired the coach and brought in a soft puppet as his replacement. If you go back through some of these players' histories (particularly Pau and Mirotic) there are some troubling signs for their coachability too.

This is nothing like the Skiles Bulls teams or the 2010 Thibs team where everyone was a hard working high character guy. The front office assembled a questionable group and then coddled them. The old Paxson never would have done that.

IMO, the front office should be fired for being so blinded by ego that they can't even follow their own traditions. I doubt that is going to happen though so the most I can hope for is a few retributive trades to clean up the locker room.

Oh, and fire the stooge assistant coaches (Myers and Brown) and get Fred some real help while they are at it. It kills me to see that they fired Adams over personality issues as he seemingly is a huge part of GS as no talent yes men like Myers and Brown get hired on in Chicago.

[RSP83]

Jimmy should and could have keep this internally. What the hell is he thinking? The media can't do anything to fix his problem. He should be careful with his openess to the media, teammates may start keeping some distance from him.

MJ was actually the same way, but he gets on his coaches and teammates face behind closed doors. Does Jimmy think he's Jordan?

I think Fred won't be too bothered with it. Somehow, I think Jimmy is calling out Niko. Niko played with no sense of urgency, and I think Hoiberg is not holding him accountable.

Has it crossed people's minds that it has been in doors for quite some time now, in house finger pointing, calling people out, etc. and its just not working so Butler is trying a different tactic?

Different coach have different style. If Jimmy don't like how Hoiberg handle things he should challenge him internally. So you're assuming Jimmy have challenged Hoiberg multiple times internally, and Hoiberg have been dismissing Jimmy's concern. So now Jimmy goes to the media because Hoiberg have been ignoring him? Or failing to act upon Jimmy's input/concern.

I have a hard time believing this scenario.