Knicks/Nets Looking At Lavine

[Jvaughn]

Maybe I'm in the minority, and I know he was just a rookie, but RJ Barrett is a horrid player. 14ppg on 47% TS% 10PER and not in the top 100 for guards for DRPM.

[The Evidence]

New Yorkers + Our Guards

[othawhitemeat]

Hypothetically, Dinwiddie, Levert, Kuruks for Lavine works. But doubt Nets do that, and don't see how it would help us all that much (although I love Levert).

An odd thing to me when looking at it was that Lavine is the same age as Levert (who I thought was younger).

Knicks/Nets have multiple assets for Lavine. For the Nets, I am ok with Din/Levert since the Bulls give up 1 starter for 2 and Levert is like 70% of Lavine with potential.

For Knicks, it would have to be this yrs pick plus DSJ, Knox.

Personally, the issue with LaVert is health. While Zach is a more explosive scorer, I like LaVert's game more. He is a much better defender too. He is just not the shooter/scorer that Zach is. I've grown to like Zach more this year and overall, seems to be a low ego borderline all star type player. However, if LaVert/Dinwiddie is offered to pair with Coby, that is a heck of a 3 guard lineup at all times. 3 guards that are quick, can dish, and can get hot in a hurry.

[MrSparkle]

Well, if NYK wants to pay FRP, RJ and filler (Taj), while taking a few redundancies (Felicio, Kornet), I'm all ears.

The Zach/Jimmy comparison is ludicrous. From his 4th year on, Jimmy was carrying broken rosters to .500+ records. Whereas I personally had no issue with paying a prime Jimmy the "super max" (which yes, was a lot of money, but you had a top-15 two-way wing who could carry a junk team to the 8-seed), frankly, Zach is going to shop for the max salary in 2022, and that's all there is to it. IMO he has 3 strikes (defense, shot selection, ACL) which would make it very unreasonable paying him $35m a year or so.

I don't like this draft at all, but two top-10 picks (good chance top-4) are a lot to work with in any draft. If you want to talk about the worst NBA draft (2000), that's still an opening for a Mike Miller, Jamal Crawford, Darius Miles, Kenyon Martin, Turkoglu, etc.

RJ Barrett obviously had a bad season, but I can think of zero reasons to disqualify his future.

Good size.
Good competitor and mature (apparently).
NYK are a bad organization to play for.
He just turned 20.

Of course this probably isn't something I'd take if the NYK pick is #8 or so. Not sure who it is, but 1 of the guys in the top-6 should have all-star potential.

So anyway, if we're talking about two rookie salaries to replace Zach's looming $$$ extension... Well.... I'm into it.

[Mr. Tibbs]

I know people are gonna say “sell high” like butler

This is a guy with #1 option tools who’s gotten better every year

You don’t give those guys up unless they absolutely force your hand

I’m hoping this organization learned that the hard way last time and doesn’t do it again

LaVine isn't close to being the player Butler is or was when we traded him. Completely different situation.

I'm going to disagree.

LaVine is a much better offensive talent/scorer than Butler will ever be and he's only getting better. Butler has him defensively and Butler has slipped up on that end ever since he focused more on his offense.

I don't know that I'd call someone averaging 25.5 points on 20 shots a game a much better scorer than someone averaging 20.2 points on 13.4 shots a game.

[Poohdini1]

I'm a fan of LaVert but I fail to see the point of that trade for the Bulls? We'd have the best player in that deal (Lavine), doing that basically puts us where the Nets were, but without Kyrie or KD (or Russell last year).

No thanks.

[Andi Obst]

I know people are gonna say “sell high” like butler

This is a guy with #1 option tools who’s gotten better every year

You don’t give those guys up unless they absolutely force your hand

I’m hoping this organization learned that the hard way last time and doesn’t do it again

LaVine isn't close to being the player Butler is or was when we traded him. Completely different situation.

I'm going to disagree.

LaVine is a much better offensive talent/scorer than Butler will ever be and he's only getting better. Butler has him defensively and Butler has slipped up on that end ever since he focused more on his offense.

Butler was and is a much better player on both ends. It's not close.

[WindyCityBorn]

He has two years left. Why would he want a trade? Also neither of those teams have anything they would trade that I would want.

Also Zach loves being a Bull I highly doubt he wants out after we just made huge organizational changes. Another season of clownshoes Boylen will have EVERY player wanting out though. It's imperative they can his ass.

[MrSparkle]

I'm a fan of LaVert but I fail to see the point of that trade for the Bulls? We'd have the best player in that deal (Lavine), doing that basically puts us where the Nets were, but without Kyrie or KD (or Russell last year).

No thanks.

Yeah, no way I play the game with BRK.

NYK have a good prospect in RJ and a top-8 (at worst) FRP to work with, plus I think bringing Taj home would be good for the locker-room (and he's expiring, so the salary is fine).

[drosereturn]

Well, if NYK wants to pay FRP, RJ and filler (Taj), while taking a few redundancies (Felicio, Kornet), I'm all ears.

The Knicks have new mgt. They arent going to deal RJ, let along both. And Lavine doesnt even have close to that kind of value.

[drosereturn]

Hypothetically, Dinwiddie, Levert, Kuruks for Lavine works. But doubt Nets do that, and don't see how it would help us all that much (although I love Levert).

An odd thing to me when looking at it was that Lavine is the same age as Levert (who I thought was younger).

Knicks/Nets have multiple assets for Lavine. For the Nets, I am ok with Din/Levert since the Bulls give up 1 starter for 2 and Levert is like 70% of Lavine with potential.

For Knicks, it would have to be this yrs pick plus DSJ, Knox.

Personally, the issue with LaVert is health. While Zach is a more explosive scorer, I like LaVert's game more. He is a much better defender too. He is just not the shooter/scorer that Zach is. I've grown to like Zach more this year and overall, seems to be a low ego borderline all star type player. However, if LaVert/Dinwiddie is offered to pair with Coby, that is a heck of a 3 guard lineup at all times. 3 guards that are quick, can dish, and can get hot in a hurry.

Idc if Levert has health issues. He is making cheap money so we can dump him if he doesnt perform but the real prize is Din who is the best player on day 1 and an actual floor general unlike Lavine, White. Before Lauri and Carter goes wasted, the Bulls need someone whether its old man Paul or all star level distributor.

The biggest thing im looking for is replace Lavine for cheaper replacements who has decent potential and not pay lavine the max/supermax. We had this discussion with a much better player in Butler and I feel the time is right. The rebuild is far from over and getting rid of Lavine allows the Bulls to buy time for at least 2 yrs. Just look at the cost controlled Levert. Beautiful.

[HomoSapien]

Read on Twitter

[DASMACKDOWN]

There is no way I would trade Zach with 2 years left. That's me personally.

The trade scenario just lacks the proper components.

Firstly, our payroll is in great standings. We have no horrible contracts in terms of big money. If Felicio was your worst contract, we are doing amazing.

Secondly Zach is FAR outperforming his current contract. That makes it really really hard to make a trade that makes you better off.

So I think Zach is going to be here for the long haul.

[FriedRise]

LeVert hasn't been able to stay healthy since he's been in the league, so I'd be wary about centering a trade around him (assuming Dinwiddie is the throw-in here). He's also very average/below average offensively, which is something we need a lot of help at.

RJ Barrett is the more intriguing piece (mostly due to age), but the Knicks will have to throw in something more like their 1st round pick (in a bad class) + ??

I don't see how any of these guys will help us win more games though. At best, it'll put us closer back to tanking and Chicago clearly in a sell mode. If we trade LaVine, we might as well start over (which I can't say I'm against since we haven't really done much since we shipped Butler out of Chicago years ago).

[pipfan]

Let's say we move up to the top 2, and the FO likes Edwards. Then, it makes more sense-rebuild around Lauri, Carter, White, Gafford, Hutch (maybe), Edwards.
Then, I would do Lavine to NY for the #6 and Knox. I doubt NY gives up more. Would love to get the Dallas pick next year, but Lavine doesn't have that kind of value

Let's say we take Okoro at #6 and roll with this team (trading Porter and Young)
White/Sato/Archie
Edwards/Sato/Mokoro
Okoro/Hutch/Knox
Lauri/Knox/Hutch
Carter/Gafford/Kornet

Now, that team would be bottom 6 next year with a ton of young talent, and what looks like a great lottery for franchise-type talent, with a clear cap.

[Jvaughn]

Well, if NYK wants to pay FRP, RJ and filler (Taj), while taking a few redundancies (Felicio, Kornet), I'm all ears.

The Knicks have new mgt. They arent going to deal RJ, let along both. And Lavine doesnt even have close to that kind of value.

Lavine doesn't have RJ and FRP in a weak draft value? WTH?? Zach is being criminally underrated again.

[ChettheJet]

So many awful trade suggestions get posted about Lavine it makes you think fans of other teams really want him, but don't have much to offer that doesn't take their own team down a peg. Neither the Knicks or Nets have a big basket to offer

The question to me is Zach is the Bulls best player, so when they add up the return where does who they get fall in the order.
Once Zach is gone I don't think you can call Markkanen their player based on his performance last year. Porter hasn't played 50 games in a Bulls uniform and is going. Carter isn't there. Coby is going into his second year and finally starting so I guess it's him. So do they get a player who challenges Coby as the best player or slots in behind him and ahead or behind Lauri?

Because if they trade Lavine they've got to be able to look at what they get and say, here's how we improved the Bulls. Lavert, Dinwiddie, Randle aren't that impressive and a single pick higher than what the Bulls have this year is a start but I think another the following year is essential. The best thing for them to get back is a starting passing PG and at least one lottery pick. They could look good this year and go FA shopping, plus the 2021 draft gives them three young guys in two years

[TheSuzerain]

Frank Ntilikina and multiple 1sts.

RJ and Knox are **** assets. They won't give up Mitch Robinson.

[rtblues]

So it looks like Reinsdorf is choosing Boylen over Lavine...

[Red8911]

If the Bulls want to turn things around and make the playoffs then they should keep Lavine. The only way they should consider trading him is if a team offers a deal for a player or players that could make the bulls better, meaning not for picks or cash. It would have to be a basketball move.The players they should trade first are Carter and Porter, not Lavine.