What type of contract is Coby like to get, and what would you be happy with?

[League Circles]

Following up on my own post, how can anyone confidently know what they want to do with Coby as of today?

There is a pretty significant range of versions of White we could see next year based on past history. And based on most recent past history, the high end of that range is a really damn good - albeit flawed - shooting guard who, unlike Lavine, prefers to run and gun. Which I assume is the general offensive game plan with Giddey.

If someone loves him and wants to back up the truck this summer with an asset rich offer, or a significant move up in the draft, of course trade him. But he’s expiring. No one is going to do that.

It seems it almost has to be a wait and see approach.

Absolutely. He could easily still range from deserving an MLE deal all the way up to a max deal next summer based on how next season goes. I'm with you - definitely trade him for a GREAT offer, but IMO a great offer is extremely unlikely because that would mean a player or prospect who actually projects to be better than him, and we just kinda know that won't happen in today's NBA.

[Chi town]

Following up on my own post, how can anyone confidently know what they want to do with Coby as of today?

There is a pretty significant range of versions of White we could see next year based on past history. And based on most recent past history, the high end of that range is a really damn good - albeit flawed - shooting guard who, unlike Lavine, prefers to run and gun. Which I assume is the general offensive game plan with Giddey.

If someone loves him and wants to back up the truck this summer with an asset rich offer, or a significant move up in the draft, of course trade him. But he’s expiring. No one is going to do that.

It seems it almost has to be a wait and see approach.

Exactly where I am.

[kodo]

Immanual Quickley: $35M per year, 5 years
17 ppg 6.8 apg 42%/38%
57% TS

Tyler Herro (when he signed): $32.5M per year, 4 years
20 ppg 4.2 apg 44%/38%
56% TS

Coby White: ???
20 ppg 4.5 apg 45%/37%
60% TS

If he improves at all next season and with 10% max cap raises for years due to the new TV deal, he could be making a lot more than what people want. If the Bulls aren't going to sign him for Quickley/Herro money at $35M, probably $40M in 2 years cap, they need to trade him or he will walk in FA with the Bulls getting nothing. $25M just isn't what a 20 ppg combo guard makes with good 3P shooting. That's what Terry Rozier makes to come off the bench.

Even within the Bulls org we know they signed Patrick to $20M per year last year which is like $25M a year from now. Not even the biggest Pat believer on the Bulls thinks these two players the same value.

I guess a bad year from Coby makes everything easier, but then the future of the Bulls as a win-now team that isn't rebuilding is pretty dismal.

[CROBulls]

Lol don't even need to know what's coming back?

Nope. Coby is gonna ask money, we should do what Grizllies did. Reload our war chest of picks. If you cannot get picks (because you terrible GM), please dont give any in return. Any decent GM would in Coby's case if you cannot get picks, get cost controlled young player which doesnt get minutes because they trying to win or is stuck in bad situation.

What makes you think that any GM would trade multiple first round picks for Coby on an expiring contract?

We dont need multiple first round picks. We need just one decent one. (Which we can use to trade up in this draft if needed). And Coby can be S&T if needed for multiple ones. If anything I find it suprising that Orlando went to Grizzlies and offered those picks instead to Bulls for Coby. But it could be they actually think Bane is in long term cheaper than what Coby is gonna demand on a new deal. So this is another Bulls worry.

[League Circles]

Nope. Coby is gonna ask money, we should do what Grizllies did. Reload our war chest of picks. If you cannot get picks (because you terrible GM), please dont give any in return. Any decent GM would in Coby's case if you cannot get picks, get cost controlled young player which doesnt get minutes because they trying to win or is stuck in bad situation.

What makes you think that any GM would trade multiple first round picks for Coby on an expiring contract?

We dont need multiple first round picks. We need just one decent one. (Which we can use to trade up in this draft if needed). And Coby can be S&T if needed for multiple ones. If anything I find it suprising that Orlando went to Grizzlies and offered those picks instead to Bulls for Coby. But it could be they actually think Bane is in long term cheaper than what Coby is gonna demand on a new deal. So this is another Bulls worry.

I thought it didn't matter what we got back for him?

If we don't trade Coby this summer I think we probably won't trade him at all - he'll either walk next summer or be re-signed.

[dougthonus]

Following up on my own post, how can anyone confidently know what they want to do with Coby as of today?

In the end, I can say confidently that while we have no one even resembling a franchise player, that I don't want to pay a bunch of guys 2x MLE contracts that look like non-top 3 players on a championship team.

While it is not a lock that Coby is in that bucket, I think it is by far the most likely outcome, and I would e willing to trade him for picks today based on that. Like any forward thinking move, there is always some uncertainty involved.

[CROBulls]

What makes you think that any GM would trade multiple first round picks for Coby on an expiring contract?

We dont need multiple first round picks. We need just one decent one. (Which we can use to trade up in this draft if needed). And Coby can be S&T if needed for multiple ones. If anything I find it suprising that Orlando went to Grizzlies and offered those picks instead to Bulls for Coby. But it could be they actually think Bane is in long term cheaper than what Coby is gonna demand on a new deal. So this is another Bulls worry.

I thought it didn't matter what we got back for him?

If we don't trade Coby this summer I think we probably won't trade him at all - he'll either walk next summer or be re-signed.

Yes. You still need to get something back in return. Coby's value based on latest trade is multiple firsts. Market set his value. So yes, one instead of 4 is "doesnt really matter what we get".

[League Circles]

Following up on my own post, how can anyone confidently know what they want to do with Coby as of today?

In the end, I can say confidently that while we have no one even resembling a franchise player, that I don't want to pay a bunch of guys 2x MLE contracts that look like non-top 3 players on a championship team.

While it is not a lock that Coby is in that bucket, I think it is by far the most likely outcome, and I would e willing to trade him for picks today based on that. Like any forward thinking move, there is always some uncertainty involved.

Is your concern more tying up cap space or inflating our performance and thus hurting the value of our own draft pick(s)?

I agree Coby probably doesn't project as a top 3 title team guy, but we could probably pay 5 guys 2x MLE money and still have a decent amount under the tax to field a bench. Coby may not look like a top 3 type guy, but 5 guys of his caliber, if they all fit together in terms of complementary skills, could probably be a good top 8 team IMO if we can get him. I kinda think the "big 3" concept may no longer apply very well to team building. There is too much parity between players.

[Red Larrivee]

Yes. You still need to get something back in return. Coby's value based on latest trade is multiple firsts. Market set his value. So yes, one instead of 4 is "doesnt really matter what we get".

That's not how it works man.

[dougthonus]

Is your concern more tying up cap space or inflating our performance and thus hurting the value of our own draft pick(s)?

I agree Coby probably doesn't project as a top 3 title team guy, but we could probably pay 5 guys 2x MLE money and still have a decent amount under the tax to field a bench. Coby may not look like a top 3 type guy, but 5 guys of his caliber, if they all fit together in terms of complementary skills, could probably be a good top 8 team IMO if we can get him. I kinda think the "big 3" concept may no longer apply very well to team building. There is too much parity between players.

The MLE is over 9% of the cap, so if you have 5 2x MLE guys then you really have very minimal flexibility left as you're basically at the salary cap. I don't have a cap sheet in front of me, but I would guess one 30% max + 5 2x MLE guys + vet min salaries puts you in the tax. If you look around the league. I think you'd find it's generally very rare that the 5th highest paid guy on the team is making 2x the MLE (probably less than 3 teams, maybe even 0 teams).

It's a combination of things though:
1: You have less financial flexibility to trade for guys or sign guys
2: You are more likely to land in the low middle of the NBA (where we are now) which I find to be a non-desirable place to be
3: These contracts aren't always poor, but I think more times than not they tend to be really poor for future trade value

I'm not saying it's a hard no, that this is destined to fail, there may be pathways where it makes sense, but generally, I don't like acquiring then committing a lot of money to guys that project to be your 4-8th roster spot guys. I'd rather move those guys on for future assets to teams that can leverage them right away and instead try to build a future surplus of assets.

That strategy isn't without its own risks, but it is my preferred strategy.

[jnrjr79]

I assume the Bulls are going to commit long-term to Giddey. Given that, I’d be looking to move Coby, as I don’t like his defensive fit next to Giddey. That’s not Coby’s fault, but the thing with Giddey is you have to be pretty deliberate about what type of players you have around him.

[CROBulls]

Yes. You still need to get something back in return. Coby's value based on latest trade is multiple firsts. Market set his value. So yes, one instead of 4 is "doesnt really matter what we get".

That's not how it works man.

You do realize that "value" is artifical and made up thing, right? And picks and assets? And money too? When you go to shopping if government says eggs are worth 10 dollars and you want eggs, you gonna pay that. Regardless if I or you think value of that should be. So yes, market sets value and that's how it works.

[WindyCityBorn]

IMO it should be $20-25M. His season-long metrics all kinda suck.

We can’t extend him the offseason for even $20 million. We either trade him or let him become unrestricted.

[WindyCityBorn]

No reason to extend him. Trade him and as long we dont gave up a pick we good.

Lol don't even need to know what's coming back?

Nope. Coby is gonna ask money, we should do what Grizllies did. Reload our war chest of picks. If you cannot get picks (because you terrible GM), please dont give any in return. Any decent GM would in Coby's case if you cannot get picks, get cost controlled young player which doesnt get minutes because they trying to win or is stuck in bad situation.

Coby is one year rental. A team should have to be absolutely sure he would re-up with them.

[WindyCityBorn]

Yes. You still need to get something back in return. Coby's value based on latest trade is multiple firsts. Market set his value. So yes, one instead of 4 is "doesnt really matter what we get".

That's not how it works man.

You do realize that "value" is artifical and made up thing, right? And picks and assets? And money too? When you go to shopping if government says eggs are worth 10 dollars and you want eggs, you gonna pay that. Regardless if I or you think value of that should be. So yes, market sets value and that's how it works.

So we don’t trade him if no good offers. If that Grizzlies guard got four unprotected 1sts then Coby is worth at least two unprotected 1sts.

It’s no different than how NFL position values are set by the most recent deals.

[MrSparkle]

IMO it should be $20-25M. His season-long metrics all kinda suck.

We can’t extend him the offseason for even $20 million. We either trade him or let him become unrestricted.

Well, they have tons of cap-space in 2026. Besides Lonzo’s team option, the only guaranteed salaries are Pat (puke), Jalen (eh), Matas, Phillips and this year’s #12. Presumably Giddey. That’ll still add up to about $80M at most. Bulls will have room for 2 max contracts, or 3 big contracts if Coby is one of them.

Not exactly thrilled with the 2026 class, but until they sign an extension, you do have JJJ, Durant (assuming he opts out and doesn’t resign), Trae, FVV, Ayton, Simons, Wiggins, Porzingis, Mikal, Gafford, A. Gordon... The list will greatly shrink, but you’ll also likely have only 3-5 teams with major cap space, and of those, it’s questionable whether they’ll have a good recruitment angle (Jazz, Wizards, etc.). I expect a lot of movement (however inconsequential), incl. this draft and off-season. The 2nd apron is unsustainable for the damaged Celtics, Suns, Nuggets (on the brink), so teams will have to budge.

Anyway, I think Bulls will realistically want to keep Coby, amongst the options, and hope atleast 1 bigger impact FA is still available for the pitch.

IMO prime Coby’s worth $20M, but I can see AK paying closer to $30M unless he really sh*ts the bed next season. Sure didn’t stop Pat from getting paid, though. I also wouldn’t mind a different direction altogether, but what’s new.

This stuff is all kinda irrelevent. Right now, the most important things are #1 Drafting an extraordinary talent at 12 (or whatever means). #2 Developing Matas into a star. #3 Developing Giddey into a star.

Today, the above 3 things have a remote chance of happening. I think Coby projects well below a star, barre an insane late career jump in efficiency and intangibles.

[Red Larrivee]

Yes. You still need to get something back in return. Coby's value based on latest trade is multiple firsts. Market set his value. So yes, one instead of 4 is "doesnt really matter what we get".

That's not how it works man.

You do realize that "value" is artifical and made up thing, right? And picks and assets? And money too? When you go to shopping if government says eggs are worth 10 dollars and you want eggs, you gonna pay that. Regardless if I or you think value of that should be. So yes, market sets value and that's how it works.

Contracts matter. Coby is an expiring deal and he's almost guaranteed to hit FA next summer. No team is tying up their pick compensation by giving up multiple firsts for him. Hell, they may not even give up a single first for him.

That Bane deal has zero reflection on what Coby's value actually is.

[WindyCityBorn]

IMO it should be $20-25M. His season-long metrics all kinda suck.

We can’t extend him the offseason for even $20 million. We either trade him or let him become unrestricted.

Well, they have tons of cap-space in 2026. Besides Lonzo’s team option, the only guaranteed salaries are Pat (puke), Jalen (eh), Matas, Phillips and this year’s #12. Presumably Giddey. That’ll still add up to about $80M at most. Bulls will have room for 2 max contracts, or 3 big contracts if Coby is one of them.

Not exactly thrilled with the 2026 class, but until they sign an extension, you do have JJJ, Durant (assuming he opts out and doesn’t resign), Trae, FVV, Ayton, Simons, Wiggins, Porzingis, Mikal, Gafford, A. Gordon... The list will greatly shrink, but you’ll also likely have only 3-5 teams with major cap space, and of those, it’s questionable whether they’ll have a good recruitment angle (Jazz, Wizards, etc.). I expect a lot of movement (however inconsequential), incl. this draft and off-season. The 2nd apron is unsustainable for the damaged Celtics, Suns, Nuggets (on the brink), so teams will have to budge.

Anyway, I think Bulls will realistically want to keep Coby, amongst the options, and hope atleast 1 bigger impact FA is still available for the pitch.

IMO prime Coby’s worth $20M, but I can see AK paying closer to $30M unless he really sh*ts the bed next season. Sure didn’t stop Pat from getting paid, though. I also wouldn’t mind a different direction altogether, but what’s new.

This stuff is all kinda irrelevent. Right now, the most important things are #1 Drafting an extraordinary talent at 12 (or whatever means). #2 Developing Matas into a star. #3 Developing Giddey into a star.

Today, the above 3 things have a remote chance of happening. I think Coby projects well below a star, barre an insane late career jump in efficiency and intangibles.

I think Coby is a good 3rd option. That puts him in the $25 $30 million range. If he plays all next season like he did post all-star break he might be looking at $35 million.

I don’t think we can afford to let him walk for nothing. I’d rather trade him now than do that.

[dice]

That's not how it works man.

You do realize that "value" is artifical and made up thing, right? And picks and assets? And money too? When you go to shopping if government says eggs are worth 10 dollars and you want eggs, you gonna pay that. Regardless if I or you think value of that should be. So yes, market sets value and that's how it works.

Contracts matter. Coby is an expiring deal and he's almost guaranteed to hit FA next summer. No team is tying up their pick compensation by giving up multiple firsts for him. Hell, they may not even give up a single first for him.

That Bane deal has zero reflection on what Coby's value actually is.

yes - bane's deal is locked in for next 4 years. w/o knowing coby's next contract it is apples and oranges

[kulaz3000]

IMO it should be $20-25M. His season-long metrics all kinda suck.

We can’t extend him the offseason for even $20 million. We either trade him or let him become unrestricted.

Well, they have tons of cap-space in 2026. Besides Lonzo’s team option, the only guaranteed salaries are Pat (puke), Jalen (eh), Matas, Phillips and this year’s #12. Presumably Giddey. That’ll still add up to about $80M at most. Bulls will have room for 2 max contracts, or 3 big contracts if Coby is one of them.

Not exactly thrilled with the 2026 class, but until they sign an extension, you do have JJJ, Durant (assuming he opts out and doesn’t resign), Trae, FVV, Ayton, Simons, Wiggins, Porzingis, Mikal, Gafford, A. Gordon... The list will greatly shrink, but you’ll also likely have only 3-5 teams with major cap space, and of those, it’s questionable whether they’ll have a good recruitment angle (Jazz, Wizards, etc.). I expect a lot of movement (however inconsequential), incl. this draft and off-season. The 2nd apron is unsustainable for the damaged Celtics, Suns, Nuggets (on the brink), so teams will have to budge.

Anyway, I think Bulls will realistically want to keep Coby, amongst the options, and hope atleast 1 bigger impact FA is still available for the pitch.

IMO prime Coby’s worth $20M, but I can see AK paying closer to $30M unless he really sh*ts the bed next season. Sure didn’t stop Pat from getting paid, though. I also wouldn’t mind a different direction altogether, but what’s new.

This stuff is all kinda irrelevent. Right now, the most important things are #1 Drafting an extraordinary talent at 12 (or whatever means). #2 Developing Matas into a star. #3 Developing Giddey into a star.

Today, the above 3 things have a remote chance of happening. I think Coby projects well below a star, barre an insane late career jump in efficiency and intangibles.

He may never become an All-Star, unless he is a second or third wheel on a really good team playing alongside a legitimate superstar, but to say that he projects well below a star seems a bit of a stretch. Speaking of stretches, he had played at a star level for a handful of months, even securing a player of the month award last season. Even if he remains inconsistent, and has similar seasons to last seasons, he is a fringe All-Star quality player for the rest of his career, and those players don't grow on trees.

Again, I'm with you, he isn't a star player, but his biggest attribute that prevents really good players from reaching All-Star status is consistency throughout the season and not having long stretches of poor performances, that's many players in the league. With Coby he also needs to be consistent on both ends. As soon as he began to improve on the defensive end, he began to regress there as he became more focused on leading the team is scoring and playing that role.

It's a damn shame that we have such a mess of a roster, because if we had an established star player, he is the type of player you'd be glad to sign at 30 million per season and ride with him as your second or third best player, but with how far off we are in terms of the team building and coming close to acquiring a star, I'm not sure if it's wise to tie him up to a long term contract on a big number, and waste his prime here with the Bulls.

He is a really good player, and he'd look a lot better with higher quality players around him provided he has a defined role. He would have fitted perfectly with the Magic, a defense first team that desperately needed a scorer/shooter like Coby - it's just a shame that he only had one year left on his contract, because as others have mentioned, it just diminishes a players value, unless a team is desperate to acquire him, and are convinced that the year they have him will put them in the best position to resign him.