Free Noa.

[drosestruts]

I believe teams have to put out official statements every time a player moves between practicing and/or playing with a g-league team and then practicing and/or playing with the NBA team.

Noa is gonna keep the PR department busy.

Likely their was just more actual practice time with the G-league guys than whatever the NBA team was doing due to their schedule.

[Red Larrivee]

I get he's only 18, but I think it's being slightly overstated. He has some high level overseas professional experience under his belt.

18 is only a year younger than the one-and-dones who come out and contribute in the NBA right away.

Essengue probably will spend the majority of this and next season in the G League, but redshirting him for two years really takes away any value from having a young player on a cheap rookie contract. And he might only be a 9th or 10th man in years 3 and 4.

For an extremely raw guy who doesn't likely project to have star upside, is he really worth all these years and patience? For a guy who will most likely end up as a back end starter or solid bench player? Would it have been smarter to take a guy with similar, if slightly lesser, upside who is more NBA ready? Or explored trades that were established to have been discussed?

These years long projects only really make sense when they have star upside IMO. I feel like this would be a worthy wait for a late 1st or 2nd round pick, but not as much for a lottery pick.

I'm not giving up on him or anything, but I'm not seeing the long-term commitment vs the reward when it's all said and done.

The short answer is: Maybe?

Making the jump to the NBA from an international league in Germany is a lot different than doing it as a college or HS player. And it's not like Essengue put up crazy production in that league. We're not talking about a blue chip prospect here. He was a late riser.

In general, I would play him over Phillips or Terry. But, it's also possible (likely?) that Essengue hasn't met the baseline of readiness to be trusted in a game with even small minutes. Donovan slow rolling him in preseason was a big show of hand.

I get the anticipation, but there's no rush. We knew this was the likely timeline for him. He's ridiculously raw; let's just let it play out.

[GoBlue72391]

I get he's only 18, but I think it's being slightly overstated. He has some high level overseas professional experience under his belt.

18 is only a year younger than the one-and-dones who come out and contribute in the NBA right away.

Essengue probably will spend the majority of this and next season in the G League, but redshirting him for two years really takes away any value from having a young player on a cheap rookie contract. And he might only be a 9th or 10th man in years 3 and 4.

For an extremely raw guy who doesn't likely project to have star upside, is he really worth all these years and patience? For a guy who will most likely end up as a back end starter or solid bench player? Would it have been smarter to take a guy with similar, if slightly lesser, upside who is more NBA ready? Or explored trades that were established to have been discussed?

These years long projects only really make sense when they have star upside IMO. I feel like this would be a worthy wait for a late 1st or 2nd round pick, but not as much for a lottery pick.

I'm not giving up on him or anything, but I'm not seeing the long-term commitment vs the reward when it's all said and done.

The short answer is: Maybe?

Making the jump to the NBA from an international league in Germany is a lot different than doing it as a college or HS player. And it's not like Essengue put up crazy production in that league. We're not talking about a blue chip prospect here. He was a late riser.

In general, I would play him over Phillips or Terry. But, it's also possible (likely?) that Essengue hasn't met the baseline of readiness to be trusted in a game with even small minutes. Donovan slow rolling him in preseason was a big show of hand.

I get the anticipation, but there's no rush. We knew this was the likely timeline for him. He's ridiculously raw; let's just let it play out.

Different for sure, but coming from a pro league where you're playing against grown men versus HS where you're playing against boys makes that aspect of transitioning to the NBA a lot easier.

I know going to a different country and learning a new language for an 18 year old is a huge challenge, but I've never heard anyone argue going from HS, or even college, to the NBA is easier than going from a pro league to the NBA, which seems to be what you were implying.

He wasn't a star or big time producer, but regardless he was going against grown professional men who do this for a living, many of which were former D1 guys or guys who play for their country's national team and even the occasional former NBA player. That's a huge advantage, even if he is young and raw.

I just don't get the coddling. We threw these 18 years to the wolves right out of HS and the majority of them were no worse off for it, hell it probably helped them develop. He doesn't need to be ready to play the odd 8 minute stretch here, or 4 minutes there.

And if he tops out as say a 9-12 PPG and 6-9 RPG guy with good defense, then what was even the point in dedicating years to him? That seems like his most likely ceiling. Obviously he can become more, but it's not likely.

The pick is just making less and less sense to me.

[WindyCityBorn]

I get he's only 18, but I think it's being slightly overstated. He has some high level overseas professional experience under his belt.

18 is only a year younger than the one-and-dones who come out and contribute in the NBA right away.

Essengue probably will spend the majority of this and next season in the G League, but redshirting him for two years really takes away any value from having a young player on a cheap rookie contract. And he might only be a 9th or 10th man in years 3 and 4.

For an extremely raw guy who doesn't likely project to have star upside, is he really worth all these years and patience? For a guy who will most likely end up as a back end starter or solid bench player? Would it have been smarter to take a guy with similar, if slightly lesser, upside who is more NBA ready? Or explored trades that were established to have been discussed?

These years long projects only really make sense when they have star upside IMO. I feel like this would be a worthy wait for a late 1st or 2nd round pick, but not as much for a lottery pick.

I'm not giving up on him or anything, but I'm not seeing the long-term commitment vs the reward when it's all said and done.

The short answer is: Maybe?

Making the jump to the NBA from an international league in Germany is a lot different than doing it as a college or HS player. And it's not like Essengue put up crazy production in that league. We're not talking about a blue chip prospect here. He was a late riser.

In general, I would play him over Phillips or Terry. But, it's also possible (likely?) that Essengue hasn't met the baseline of readiness to be trusted in a game with even small minutes. Donovan slow rolling him in preseason was a big show of hand.

I get the anticipation, but there's no rush. We knew this was the likely timeline for him. He's ridiculously raw; let's just let it play out.

Different for sure, but coming from a pro league where you're playing against grown men versus HS where you're playing against boys makes that aspect of transitioning to the NBA a lot easier.

I know going to a different country and learning a new language for an 18 year old is a huge challenge, but I've never heard anyone argue going from HS, or even college, to the NBA is easier than going from a pro league to the NBA, which seems to be what you were implying.

He wasn't a star or big time producer, but regardless he was going against grown professional men who do this for a living, many of which were former D1 guys or guys who play for their country's national team and even the occasional former NBA player. That's a huge advantage, even if he is young and raw.

I just don't get the coddling. We threw these 18 years to the wolves right out of HS and the majority of them were no worse off for it, hell it probably helped them develop. He doesn't need to be ready to play the odd 8 minute stretch here, or 4 minutes there.

And if he tops out as say a 9-12 PPG and 6-9 RPG guy with good defense, then what was even the point in dedicating years to him? That seems like his most likely ceiling. Obviously he can become more, but it's not likely.

The pick is just making less and less sense to me.

We are trying to win now. No one gets entitlement minutes. Noa was pick to develop for 3 years down the road. Not to be a big rookie contributor.

[GoBlue72391]

The short answer is: Maybe?

Making the jump to the NBA from an international league in Germany is a lot different than doing it as a college or HS player. And it's not like Essengue put up crazy production in that league. We're not talking about a blue chip prospect here. He was a late riser.

In general, I would play him over Phillips or Terry. But, it's also possible (likely?) that Essengue hasn't met the baseline of readiness to be trusted in a game with even small minutes. Donovan slow rolling him in preseason was a big show of hand.

I get the anticipation, but there's no rush. We knew this was the likely timeline for him. He's ridiculously raw; let's just let it play out.

Different for sure, but coming from a pro league where you're playing against grown men versus HS where you're playing against boys makes that aspect of transitioning to the NBA a lot easier.

I know going to a different country and learning a new language for an 18 year old is a huge challenge, but I've never heard anyone argue going from HS, or even college, to the NBA is easier than going from a pro league to the NBA, which seems to be what you were implying.

He wasn't a star or big time producer, but regardless he was going against grown professional men who do this for a living, many of which were former D1 guys or guys who play for their country's national team and even the occasional former NBA player. That's a huge advantage, even if he is young and raw.

I just don't get the coddling. We threw these 18 years to the wolves right out of HS and the majority of them were no worse off for it, hell it probably helped them develop. He doesn't need to be ready to play the odd 8 minute stretch here, or 4 minutes there.

And if he tops out as say a 9-12 PPG and 6-9 RPG guy with good defense, then what was even the point in dedicating years to him? That seems like his most likely ceiling. Obviously he can become more, but it's not likely.

The pick is just making less and less sense to me.

We are trying to win now. No one gets entitlement minutes. Noa was pick to develop for 3 years down the road. Not to be a big rookie contributor.

I know, I'm questioning if he tops out as a decent role player 3-5 years from now then what was the point?

[WindyCityBorn]

Different for sure, but coming from a pro league where you're playing against grown men versus HS where you're playing against boys makes that aspect of transitioning to the NBA a lot easier.

I know going to a different country and learning a new language for an 18 year old is a huge challenge, but I've never heard anyone argue going from HS, or even college, to the NBA is easier than going from a pro league to the NBA, which seems to be what you were implying.

He wasn't a star or big time producer, but regardless he was going against grown professional men who do this for a living, many of which were former D1 guys or guys who play for their country's national team and even the occasional former NBA player. That's a huge advantage, even if he is young and raw.

I just don't get the coddling. We threw these 18 years to the wolves right out of HS and the majority of them were no worse off for it, hell it probably helped them develop. He doesn't need to be ready to play the odd 8 minute stretch here, or 4 minutes there.

And if he tops out as say a 9-12 PPG and 6-9 RPG guy with good defense, then what was even the point in dedicating years to him? That seems like his most likely ceiling. Obviously he can become more, but it's not likely.

The pick is just making less and less sense to me.

We are trying to win now. No one gets entitlement minutes. Noa was pick to develop for 3 years down the road. Not to be a big rookie contributor.

I know, I'm questioning if he tops out as a decent role player 3-5 years from now then what was the point?

But that could be the case for any late lotto pick. It’s not like we took him top 5.

[fleet]

He’s only gonna get as many minutes as his defense can carry for awhile.

[GoBlue72391]

We are trying to win now. No one gets entitlement minutes. Noa was pick to develop for 3 years down the road. Not to be a big rookie contributor.

I know, I'm questioning if he tops out as a decent role player 3-5 years from now then what was the point?

But that could be the case for any late lotto pick. It’s not like we took him top 5.

True that most late lotto picks might only end up as solid role players, but they usually don't take 3+ years to become that. They're generally ready to play day 1.

[WindyCityBorn]

We are trying to win now. No one gets entitlement minutes. Noa was pick to develop for 3 years down the road. Not to be a big rookie contributor.

I know, I'm questioning if he tops out as a decent role player 3-5 years from now then what was the point?

But that could be the case for any late lotto pick. It’s not like we took him top 5.

Sometimes you get lucky and get a Buzelis. Sometimes you get a Dalen Terry. After seeing how Donovan handled bringing Buzelis along last season who was one year older I’ll trust him on when Noa is ready to contribute. I’m sure he’ll have to play at some point later this season even if only because of injuries. I’ll say mostly DNPs this season, rotation player as a sophomore and starter by year 3. That’s the ideal realistic scenario.

[Red Larrivee]

Different for sure, but coming from a pro league where you're playing against grown men versus HS where you're playing against boys makes that aspect of transitioning to the NBA a lot easier.

I know going to a different country and learning a new language for an 18 year old is a huge challenge, but I've never heard anyone argue going from HS, or even college, to the NBA is easier than going from a pro league to the NBA, which seems to be what you were implying.

He wasn't a star or big time producer, but regardless he was going against grown professional men who do this for a living, many of which were former D1 guys or guys who play for their country's national team and even the occasional former NBA player. That's a huge advantage, even if he is young and raw.

I just don't get the coddling. We threw these 18 years to the wolves right out of HS and the majority of them were no worse off for it, hell it probably helped them develop. He doesn't need to be ready to play the odd 8 minute stretch here, or 4 minutes there.

And if he tops out as say a 9-12 PPG and 6-9 RPG guy with good defense, then what was even the point in dedicating years to him? That seems like his most likely ceiling. Obviously he can become more, but it's not likely.

The pick is just making less and less sense to me.

It's not like Germany's BBL is Euroleague or even Liga ACB. It's a mid-tier league. How many players in that league would crack an NBA rotation? The NCAA has better competition.

Noa looked bad in summer league and preseason. Physically, he just didn't even look ready. Typically, coaches will give rookies more rope in preseason, especially to keep rotation players healthy. Noa only played 13mpg; that says a lot. That's no knock against him. It was expected. He is arguably the rawest first round player in this class. He was a late riser because of physical tools and upside. Not because of any level of NBA readiness.

I completely understand the coddling. We've seen raw international players make that jump, not look ready and get minutes they shouldn't have got. The Bulls have a deep rotation, are more competitive than expected and don't need his contributions right now.

So, why not bring him along slowly? It seems like they actually have a plan and are executing it.

[sco]

Different for sure, but coming from a pro league where you're playing against grown men versus HS where you're playing against boys makes that aspect of transitioning to the NBA a lot easier.

I know going to a different country and learning a new language for an 18 year old is a huge challenge, but I've never heard anyone argue going from HS, or even college, to the NBA is easier than going from a pro league to the NBA, which seems to be what you were implying.

He wasn't a star or big time producer, but regardless he was going against grown professional men who do this for a living, many of which were former D1 guys or guys who play for their country's national team and even the occasional former NBA player. That's a huge advantage, even if he is young and raw.

I just don't get the coddling. We threw these 18 years to the wolves right out of HS and the majority of them were no worse off for it, hell it probably helped them develop. He doesn't need to be ready to play the odd 8 minute stretch here, or 4 minutes there.

And if he tops out as say a 9-12 PPG and 6-9 RPG guy with good defense, then what was even the point in dedicating years to him? That seems like his most likely ceiling. Obviously he can become more, but it's not likely.

The pick is just making less and less sense to me.

We are trying to win now. No one gets entitlement minutes. Noa was pick to develop for 3 years down the road. Not to be a big rookie contributor.

I know, I'm questioning if he tops out as a decent role player 3-5 years from now then what was the point?

If this was last year, he'd definitely be getting 10-12 minutes a night. I think that Pat's (surprisingly) good play has been the primary roadblock to minutes for him. Maybe the only reason to be happy about Noa's lack of mins is that Pat's playing well. Also, Phillips is pretty good and ahead of him too. At least it's guys who are here for a couple seasons.

[rosenthall]

I get he's only 18, but I think it's being slightly overstated. He has some high level overseas professional experience under his belt.

18 is only a year younger than the one-and-dones who come out and contribute in the NBA right away.

Essengue probably will spend the majority of this and next season in the G League, but redshirting him for two years really takes away any value from having a young player on a cheap rookie contract. And he might only be a 9th or 10th man in years 3 and 4.

For an extremely raw guy who doesn't likely project to have star upside, is he really worth all these years and patience? For a guy who will most likely end up as a back end starter or solid bench player? Would it have been smarter to take a guy with similar, if slightly lesser, upside who is more NBA ready? Or explored trades that were established to have been discussed?

These years long projects only really make sense when they have star upside IMO. I feel like this would be a worthy wait for a late 1st or 2nd round pick, but not as much for a lottery pick.

I'm not giving up on him or anything, but I'm not seeing the long-term commitment vs the reward when it's all said and done.

You're basically articulating why he was an end-of-lotto draft pick and not taken higher. He's someone you start to get decent minutes out of in his 3rd and 4th years, with the first two basically being sacrificed for developmental purposes.

That said, I think if he's not in the rotation next year it's a red-flag and I would be worried about his future. I'm fine with him red-shirting this year since our team seems to be competitive and he has a lot of learning he can do off of an NBA court. And I want him to be healthy for the upcoming offseason. But it's unusual to be a zero in year two and still have tantalizing upside as an NBA player.

If he still can't beat out Julian Phillips next year I'll start to assume that he just sucks.

Also, in terms of upside, he has superstar role-player potential. Sort of like a healthy Jonathan Isaac, who would've had a great career if he hadn't gotten injured.

Most really good teams have at least one defensive swiss-army knife who enable lineups that are very hard to play against. Rodman, Draymond, Chet, Caruso, etc. His upside is the defensive chess piece that you can use in almost any scenario, that makes it easy to make the most of your most talented offensive players and maximize lineup potential. It's why OG Anunoby reportedly had some of the highest trade interest in the league when he was with the Raptors and hadn't signed his max contract yet. The comp I like best for him right now is Pacers era Derrick McKey, who was a big minute player when they regularly won 50+ games / year. He was 6'11 and defended 2-5 and was the glue that enabled them to maximize the offensive talents of Rik Smits and Reggie Miller, who were both weak defenders.

He's that type of guy. Not a counting stat maximizer, but a "winning" rotation player on the best teams.

[GoBlue72391]

He’s only gonna get as many minutes as his defense can carry for awhile.

Well, people are saying he has off-the-charts defensive IQ, yet he's still not playing.

[Michael Jackson]

I can't recall who said it during the game but the conversation on Noa going to Windy City was about getting him more on ball experience. On the Bulls he has no room for that but with Windy City he can. On the Bulls they can only get him off ball time. Really that makes sense if they want to up his game on ball skills. Give him more feature. That actually shows that they think he has more that he can show than what he would be able to in the NBA today. If he was viewed as just a defensive specialist yeah you would keep him on the Bulls and give him his spot minutes.

[pipfan]

NO's 0-7 start is REALLY making me hate this pick. I like Noa and see the upside, but MAN our FO really blew it. We could have had Newell sitting on our bench (he was my pick at #12) and a good shot at a top 3 2026 pick. Not taking that deal will haunt us, I feel

Imagine Giddey/Matas core with Peterson or AJ!?!

[Evil_Headband]

I can't recall who said it during the game but the conversation on Noa going to Windy City was about getting him more on ball experience. On the Bulls he has no room for that but with Windy City he can. On the Bulls they can only get him off ball time. Really that makes sense if they want to up his game on ball skills. Give him more feature. That actually shows that they think he has more that he can show than what he would be able to in the NBA today. If he was viewed as just a defensive specialist yeah you would keep him on the Bulls and give him his spot minutes.

He wasn't really featured in Germany either. I think it's the right move.

[MikeDC]

I can't recall who said it during the game but the conversation on Noa going to Windy City was about getting him more on ball experience. On the Bulls he has no room for that but with Windy City he can. On the Bulls they can only get him off ball time. Really that makes sense if they want to up his game on ball skills. Give him more feature. That actually shows that they think he has more that he can show than what he would be able to in the NBA today. If he was viewed as just a defensive specialist yeah you would keep him on the Bulls and give him his spot minutes.

Counterpoint: that seems to be the opposite of what they did with Matas (who seemed like a much more obvious guy to have the ball in his hands).

I think this just falls into the category of "we have to say something" when we send a player to the League.

Different for sure, but coming from a pro league where you're playing against grown men versus HS where you're playing against boys makes that aspect of transitioning to the NBA a lot easier.

I know going to a different country and learning a new language for an 18 year old is a huge challenge, but I've never heard anyone argue going from HS, or even college, to the NBA is easier than going from a pro league to the NBA, which seems to be what you were implying.

He wasn't a star or big time producer, but regardless he was going against grown professional men who do this for a living, many of which were former D1 guys or guys who play for their country's national team and even the occasional former NBA player. That's a huge advantage, even if he is young and raw.

It's not like Germany's BBL is Euroleague or even Liga ACB. It's a mid-tier league. How many players in that league would crack an NBA rotation? The NCAA has better competition.

I think this is incorrect. These guys are definitely better than NCAA competition. Which frankly sucks. But just on Noa's team (Ulm) there was Ben Saraf, who's only a few months older than Noa, but getting minutes for Brooklyn. So this team produced 2 '25 FRPs, 2 former second round picks (Isaiah Roby, Justinian Jessip), and 2 other guys who were (Nate Hinton, Alfonso Plummer) pretty good NCAA players.

Overall, I see that last year the BBL had 321 players. 66 weren't yet draft eligible. 10 were current or former draft picks. An additional 115 of them were American players who went undrafted but almost all of whom were good NCAA players.

He is arguably the rawest first round player in this class.

It's a bad argument though. He played more minutes against better competition. Better to just accept that he's just not done all that well so far. He was a risky pick

The Bulls have a deep rotation, are more competitive than expected and don't need his contributions right now.

It's not a matter of "need" it's a matter of whether he can contribute as much or nearly as much as anyone else. If he can't, well, that's why you don't play him.

If he could be contributing more than another guy, the Bulls would be stupid to not take his contributions and maximize winning.

NO's 0-7 start is REALLY making me hate this pick. I like Noa and see the upside, but MAN our FO really blew it. We could have had Newell sitting on our bench (he was my pick at #12) and a good shot at a top 3 2026 pick. Not taking that deal will haunt us, I feel

Imagine Giddey/Matas core with Peterson or AJ!?!

I don't hate it yet, but I'm liking it less. I feel like the Bulls probably got scooped by the Grizzlies trading ahead of them to make sure they got Coward, and then instead of being flexible and taking the Pelicans deal, they just stood pat and took Noa. I liked him, and obviously they liked him, but it's a big swing.

[CROBulls]

NO pick should have been ours. If only we didnt had stupid GM turning even more stupider offer in our benefit.

[dougthonus]

But that could be the case for any late lotto pick. It’s not like we took him top 5.

We did pass up Asa Newell and the pick with the highest lotto odds in the NBA to be #1 next year (presently slotted in the 1-5 range) in order to give Noa a gap year, so there's that.

Would rather have a similar project in Asa + a way better prospect next year that doesn't require a gap year and adds values on all four year of their rookie deal and in fact has legit superstar potential, but water under the bridge now. Just have to hope for the best with Noa.

[GoBlue72391]

Different for sure, but coming from a pro league where you're playing against grown men versus HS where you're playing against boys makes that aspect of transitioning to the NBA a lot easier.

I know going to a different country and learning a new language for an 18 year old is a huge challenge, but I've never heard anyone argue going from HS, or even college, to the NBA is easier than going from a pro league to the NBA, which seems to be what you were implying.

He wasn't a star or big time producer, but regardless he was going against grown professional men who do this for a living, many of which were former D1 guys or guys who play for their country's national team and even the occasional former NBA player. That's a huge advantage, even if he is young and raw.

I just don't get the coddling. We threw these 18 years to the wolves right out of HS and the majority of them were no worse off for it, hell it probably helped them develop. He doesn't need to be ready to play the odd 8 minute stretch here, or 4 minutes there.

And if he tops out as say a 9-12 PPG and 6-9 RPG guy with good defense, then what was even the point in dedicating years to him? That seems like his most likely ceiling. Obviously he can become more, but it's not likely.

The pick is just making less and less sense to me.

It's not like Germany's BBL is Euroleague or even Liga ACB. It's a mid-tier league. How many players in that league would crack an NBA rotation? The NCAA has better competition.

Noa looked bad in summer league and preseason. Physically, he just didn't even look ready. Typically, coaches will give rookies more rope in preseason, especially to keep rotation players healthy. Noa only played 13mpg; that says a lot. That's no knock against him. It was expected. He is arguably the rawest first round player in this class. He was a late riser because of physical tools and upside. Not because of any level of NBA readiness.

I completely understand the coddling. We've seen raw international players make that jump, not look ready and get minutes they shouldn't have got. The Bulls have a deep rotation, are more competitive than expected and don't need his contributions right now.

So, why not bring him along slowly? It seems like they actually have a plan and are executing it.

Agree to disagree.

I think coming from the top pro league in Germany and a top 10 pro league in the world is a notable step up from the NCAA. It's not like he was playing in the 3rd tier league of Uzbekistan or something.

The majority of NCAA D1 players aren't even good enough to play for the BBL or similar tier 1 domestic leagues. You could say that the NCAA is more top heavy with top NBA draft picks who become future NBA stars, but that's like 0.5% of the competition, and not every school even plays those guys.

On the whole, the BBL is much tougher than the NCAA. A ton of NCAA players are 6'6" Cs and 6'0" SGs for mid-majors. Those types of players make up the majority of the NCAA.

I don't really think it's much of an argument, but you're entitled to your opinion.