OT: The next President of the United States: ★★★ Donald Trump ★★★

[RedBulls23]

A man being a man is really what you guys are concerned with ?

It's sad that you think those statements represent acceptable male behavior or, worse, normal male behavior. It's neither.

Yup.

Also the "It's just locker room talk" is nonsense. I'm a man and have been in plenty of locker room talk. That never included wanting to commit sexual assault.

[coldfish]

I thought that the 2004 election between Kerry and Bush was just awful. On one side you had a pretty clueless, bull headed president. On the other side, you had a naive gold digger who wanted to put "president" on his resume. I told my friends that a sock puppet could beat Bush and yet the democrats nominated someone worse than a sock puppet.

This election laps that one by a mile.

First off, Hillary is incompetent. I'm not sure I know of one thing in her life that she has actually accomplished other than "being" something. Being first lady, then being senator then being secretary of state. If you look at her record in elected office, its not chock full of accomplishments. She isn't some visionary or great orator either. Behind that you have a whole series of scandals and questionable connections that seem to follow here everywhere. She almost gets beat in the primary by a no name socialist and basically has to use insider connections to win.

On a day where wikileaks sends out the start of a number of documents detailing just how much in bed she is with coroporatists (which would get her a blowout loss in a lot of elections), its not even major news because her competitor is WORSE.

Trump? Well, I think its pretty clear he really is delusionally narscissistic and has no value for any human being not named Donald Trump. He treats his wives and daughters like crap. Why the hell would he treat random people better? He isn't even a particularly good businessman. He inherited a fortune and then borrows massive amount of money against it. He isn't releasing his tax returns not because it shows how rich he is, but because it shows how rich he ISN'T.

He only got here because he made some casual observations that corporate bought politicians in both parties aren't allowed to discuss: Government policies are distributing economic gains unequally and said he would change the system. Even most democrats don't propose that. They just suggest some redistribution (that if you hire the right democratic lawyer to go through the thousands of pages of legislation, you can probably get around if you are rich).

I don't seriously believe that he would actually do anything he is saying once in office. I honestly have no clue what he would actually do. Set up a throne in the whitehouse and have a line of interns blow him 24/7? Just grab Angela Merkel's pussy?

Even the libertarian candidate seems to be a complete boob.

.......

Hillary is going to be president and that scares the crap out of me. The last time we got a Clinton in the white house working with a corporatist republican congress we got the WTO, Nafta, reversal of Glass Steagall, 3 strikes, etc.

Most times I think that how bad the state of politics is is actually overblown. This time, I'm actually afraid of regardless what direction we go, bad things are going to happen.

What do we have to do as a country to prevent this from happening again? There were competent republicans running (Kasich) and there are competent democrats out there. Why can't we nominate them?

[bentheredengthat]

This is a weird dichotomy. Because of the business I am in, and the places I like to socialize, I am around a lot of people who are trump supporter types.

They are nothing like this man. You come around our group and start spouting off about women like that you will get a rude awaking. We all have girlfriends, wives, daughters. That **** isn't going to fly.

But God help you if you actually ever touch one of them. lol you have no idea.

That being said, you come into our locker rooms dont' bring a mic because it 's pretty damn crude.

But there's a huge difference between talking like a predator and being a guy in a locker room.

[rtblues]

I fully expect Trump to keep digging the hole deeper. He can't help it. Narcissists are like that.
Also, if he decides to make Bill Clinton's past missteps a focus, that's not really going to work, given
the simple fact that Bill Clinton is not a candidate. It would be like Hillary discussing Melanie Trump.

The simple truth is that even with everything that is out there, including the latest leaked tape, and his already numerous past offensive comments, none of this will really make any of his supporters change sides, including the half-baked, sound-byte-condemnation Republicans who condemned the most recent leaked recorded statements, yet would not go as far as pulling their endorsement of him. However, there's probably some percentage of "undecided" voters who will be swayed by the latest news, particularly women.

A candidate may be able to win without, for example, the Black vote, or the Latino vote, however I don't think
a candidate can win without the "white women" vote, and there Trump is in trouble. In-fact, in his case, a combo-platter of trouble: virtually 0% of the black vote, ditto the Latino vote, add women, former Sanders supporters.

Finally the defections from within the Republican party, with a growing list of Republican senators, congressmen, and a host of former prominent Republicans denouncing the guy, and the media who is now beginning to punch back a bit more. The media whom he has consistently demeaned and blames for any negativity about him. All in all, it's not a good outlook for Trump at this stage.

Editors Note: Sean Hannity isn't "the media" referred to above. He's an ass-hat with a TV show, similar to the candidate he so staunchly stands by.

[League Circles]

I thought that the 2004 election between Kerry and Bush was just awful. On one side you had a pretty clueless, bull headed president. On the other side, you had a naive gold digger who wanted to put "president" on his resume. I told my friends that a sock puppet could beat Bush and yet the democrats nominated someone worse than a sock puppet.

This election laps that one by a mile.

First off, Hillary is incompetent. I'm not sure I know of one thing in her life that she has actually accomplished other than "being" something. Being first lady, then being senator then being secretary of state. If you look at her record in elected office, its not chock full of accomplishments. She isn't some visionary or great orator either. Behind that you have a whole series of scandals and questionable connections that seem to follow here everywhere. She almost gets beat in the primary by a no name socialist and basically has to use insider connections to win.

On a day where wikileaks sends out the start of a number of documents detailing just how much in bed she is with coroporatists (which would get her a blowout loss in a lot of elections), its not even major news because her competitor is WORSE.

Trump? Well, I think its pretty clear he really is delusionally narscissistic and has no value for any human being not named Donald Trump. He treats his wives and daughters like crap. Why the hell would he treat random people better? He isn't even a particularly good businessman. He inherited a fortune and then borrows massive amount of money against it. He isn't releasing his tax returns not because it shows how rich he is, but because it shows how rich he ISN'T.

He only got here because he made some casual observations that corporate bought politicians in both parties aren't allowed to discuss: Government policies are distributing economic gains unequally and said he would change the system. Even most democrats don't propose that. They just suggest some redistribution (that if you hire the right democratic lawyer to go through the thousands of pages of legislation, you can probably get around if you are rich).

I don't seriously believe that he would actually do anything he is saying once in office. I honestly have no clue what he would actually do. Set up a throne in the whitehouse and have a line of interns blow him 24/7? Just grab Angela Merkel's pussy?

Even the libertarian candidate seems to be a complete boob.

.......

Hillary is going to be president and that scares the crap out of me. The last time we got a Clinton in the white house working with a corporatist republican congress we got the WTO, Nafta, reversal of Glass Steagall, 3 strikes, etc.

Most times I think that how bad the state of politics is is actually overblown. This time, I'm actually afraid of regardless what direction we go, bad things are going to happen.

What do we have to do as a country to prevent this from happening again? There were competent republicans running (Kasich) and there are competent democrats out there. Why can't we nominate them?

Great points throughout here.

I think Trump was nominated because of how many angry, stupid people there are. We probably can't fix that without evolutionary progress, so IDk maybe a hundred thousand years or something?

Hilarywas nominated almost solely because of democratic leadership failure and probably to some extent as compensation for favors handed out by her and Bill over decades. Simply put, among democrats (at least enough of the leadership), it was just "her turn." You're spot on when you say her main accomplishments are just "being" something. Any serious discussion of her being a nominee early in the process should have been met by comments from sane democratic leadership that amounted to "why on earth should we nominate someone who is so disliked by so many people and who has accomplished so little in so many opportunities?" It shouldn't have even been a discussion. I thought it was a joke when I first heard they were going to trot her out there. But what was an even bigger joke was her competition in the primaries. Look, I like Bernie and he's an honest man which would have been a great thing, but he is not a democrat and would not have gotten anything accomplished IMO. Frankly he's too old and doesn't seem very bright to me. The other democratic nominees were uninteresting nobodies that inspired nothing.

Man I miss former candidates that were at least somewhat inspiring like Kucinich, Bill Bradley, Mike Gravel, Ron Paul, etc.

[Axl Rose]

A man being a man is really what you guys are concerned with ?

It's sad that you think those statements represent acceptable male behavior or, worse, normal male behavior. It's neither.

Yup.

Also the "It's just locker room talk" is nonsense. I'm a man and have been in plenty of locker room talk. That never included wanting to commit sexual assault.

you probably have but didn't even realize it. luckily for you we don't have audio of your conversations that we can present highlighting the rapey undertones to everyone, proving you're a hypocrite.

[RedBulls23]

It's sad that you think those statements represent acceptable male behavior or, worse, normal male behavior. It's neither.

Yup.

Also the "It's just locker room talk" is nonsense. I'm a man and have been in plenty of locker room talk. That never included wanting to commit sexual assault.

you probably have but didn't even realize it. luckily for you we don't have audio of your conversations that we can present highlighting the rapey undertones to everyone, proving you're a hypocrite.

You need to watch yourself calling me a hypocrite or accusing me of saying anything supporting rape culture.

Infact you need to look your self in the mirror and ask yourself why you're defending such vile behavior.

[chifan1798]

now all of a sudden everybody is a saint that has never said anything derogatory or even been in the presence of somebody saying something derogatory....GIVE ME A BREAK.

Im not even a Trump supporter, but im tired of the fake outrage. its a prop for people to jump on their high horse and act holier than thou. acting disgusted makes folks look and feel more cultured, intelligent, and a real upstanding pillar of society.

It's not about saying that he needs to be a saint. The true issue is that he has routinely lied throughout this campaign, denying that he has derogatory thoughts or comments about women. Beef with Megahn Kelly, Rosie Odonnell, former Miss USA, Cruz's wife, etc isn't enough for people to see that what he is feeding the public is bull. The real issue is more than what he actually said, but more about lying about it constantly. Then, when you look at the actual comments, it shows that he thinks that his celebrity and money put him above the law, and that he won't have to suffer consequences that your average Joe would have to if they were to try the same thing. His defenders are so wrapped up in how long ago it was, and that men make crude comments frequently, however ignore the fact that he tries to sell people on how he isn't that type of guy, and that he respects women, when it's clear that he doesn't. He just wants to get votes. Same thing with the comments that he says, that it's unfair for rich people to get off on not paying anything to the government......but when he gets caught with taxes that show that he probably hasn't paid federal taxes in 18 years, then he turns it around to him being a genius. He doesn't think it's unfair, because if he did, he would have self disclosed.

He has lied, just like people accuse Hilary of doing, it's just different instances. Main difference is that Trump has no political career, so his supporters want to think that his lies are not as important.....what they're missing is the narcissism, and his refusal to admit to wrongdoing, his lack of regard for many different populations (latinos, immigrants, blacks, women in general, overweight women, etc), and him barely listening to his own people in his campaign.....and that's just the tip of the iceburg. I say again, if he doesn't listen those who surround him, what makes people think that he's going to listen to the people in the general public?

In regards to this being a big deal, basically, this whole thing is just a good excuse for the major republicans to jump ship, because that's really what they've been wanting to do all along, but they've never had a good enough reason to destroy their own political careers and go against the party's official nominee. Something should be said if some of the most powerful and highly educated people in this country just can't even truly muster up support for a particular person, and are literally going to vote Democratic, or have a write in candidate.

[chifan1798]

One of the reasons that these comments are relevant now is that they reflect the privilege that Trump believes power grants him. He said he could do whatever he wanted to with women because he was a star. But what about the power of the presidency? Would he see himself as having any boundaries to honor whatsoever if he was president?

Exactly. That's what is getting lost in all of this. People want to brush it off as normal male banter, but ignore the fact that he thinks his power allows him to do whatever he wants. I would hate to see how that power goes to his head as the president.

[Axl Rose]

Yup.

Also the "It's just locker room talk" is nonsense. I'm a man and have been in plenty of locker room talk. That never included wanting to commit sexual assault.

you probably have but didn't even realize it. luckily for you we don't have audio of your conversations that we can present highlighting the rapey undertones to everyone, proving you're a hypocrite.

You need to watch yourself calling me a hypocrite or accusing me of saying anything supporting rape culture.

Infact you need to look your self in the mirror and ask yourself why you're defending such vile behavior.

sorry if my post came off wrong. i realize how it may have come off in a vindictive tone, which is ironically hilarious considering thats kinda the point im driving at.

the way i see it is Trump didn't realize how what he was saying could be taken. to me its more him saying "yeah im Donald Trump, ultimate playboy, women drop their panties around me" rather than admitting he likes to molest women (who does that?)

my point to you was that you may have been in a convo where if you actually thought about the words you or someone else spoke, you'd be like "man thats kinda fu*ked up"

[CoreyVillains]

you probably have but didn't even realize it. luckily for you we don't have audio of your conversations that we can present highlighting the rapey undertones to everyone, proving you're a hypocrite.

You need to watch yourself calling me a hypocrite or accusing me of saying anything supporting rape culture.

Infact you need to look your self in the mirror and ask yourself why you're defending such vile behavior.

sorry if my post came off wrong. i realize how it may have come off in a vindictive tone, which is ironically hilarious considering thats kinda the point im driving at.

the way i see it is Trump didn't realize how what he was saying could be taken. to me its more him saying "yeah im Donald Trump, ultimate playboy, women drop their panties around me" rather than admitting he likes to molest women (who does that?)

my point to you was that you may have been in a convo where if you actually thought about the words you or someone else spoke, you'd be like "man thats kinda fu*ked up"

He could have said the things you are claiming that he meant. He didnt though, he bragged about sexually assaulting someone. Sometimes you have to realize you're wrong about someone and take that L.

[babythug23]

This presidential debate is more entertaining than wwe lol

[The Force.]

If Trump wants to counter Hillary's allegations that he's sexist why does he never bring up her ties to Saudi Arabia? Seems like a no-brainer.

[meekrab]

If Trump wants to counter Hillary's allegations that he's sexist why does he never bring up her ties to Saudi Arabia? Seems like a no-brainer.

What ties, and what would that do to help him?

[The Force.]

https://theintercept.com/2016/08/25/why-did-the-saudi-regime-and-other-gulf-tyrannies-donate-millions-to-the-clinton-foundation/

http://fortune.com/2016/03/17/this-is-how-oppressed-women-are-in-saudi-arabia/

[Ben]

In this thread's poll, I said that Trump had won the 2nd debate. I don't mean that he won in MY eyes, as I think that he's a lying scumbag who will say just about anything. I mean that IMO he got in more jabs and punches that hurt Hillary than she got in at him. I thought that she seemed "thrown" in the first half, and he seemed relatively calm (for him). If "undecided" voters were expecting to see a rabid pit bull or rabid womanizer on display, they may have been placated. I find that a sad commentary on our electorate, but it is what it is.

[Jo Jo English]

I think Trump "won" in the sense that he placed a tourniquet on his campaign after the disastrous last 48 hours. Trump did a pretty good job staying on the attack and Hillary never really had any knockout moments.

That said... when Trump mentioned that he was going to do whatever he could to investigate/jail Clinton if he wins... well, yikes. That may end up being the story of the night right there. We'll see how that plays.

[meekrab]

I think Trump "won" in the sense that he placed a tourniquet on his campaign after the disastrous last 48 hours. Trump did a pretty good job staying on the attack and Hillary never really had any knockout moments.

That said... when Trump mentioned that he was going to do whatever he could to investigate/jail Clinton if he wins... well, yikes. That may end up being the story of the night right there. We'll see how that plays.

He constantly interrupted Hillary, he whined incessantly that the moderators weren't treating him nice, he has no coherent policy goals, he straight up lied frequently. There's no world in which an adult human with critical thinking skills can think he 'won'.

His only rational argument is that Hillary has a colorful past; but Republicans have been slamming her with **** for 30 years and none of it has stuck... either she's made of Teflon or its not as bad as they claim.

[RedBulls23]

I think Trump "won" in the sense that he placed a tourniquet on his campaign after the disastrous last 48 hours. Trump did a pretty good job staying on the attack and Hillary never really had any knockout moments.

That said... when Trump mentioned that he was going to do whatever he could to investigate/jail Clinton if he wins... well, yikes. That may end up being the story of the night right there. We'll see how that plays.

He constantly interrupted Hillary, he whined incessantly that the moderators weren't treating him nice, he has no coherent policy goals, he straight up lied frequently. There's no world in which an adult human with critical thinking skills can think he 'won'.

His only rational argument is that Hillary has a colorful past; but Republicans have been slamming her with **** for 30 years and none of it has stuck... either she's made of Teflon or its not as bad as they claim.

I think what Jo Jo is saying is that the bar is set so **** low for him that people actually might come away with the conclusion that he won.

But to Jo Jo's point, saying stuff like that is just unprecedented. He continuously has said some of the most worrisome things like asking Russia to hack Hillary, insinuating that someone should or could assassinate her, and now a threat about trying to send his competition to jail if he wins.

Say what you will about Hillary and she certainly has her warts, but Trumps entire campaign is a **** show. He has no clue how to debate and no control over the ridiculous things that come out of his mouth.

[Jo Jo English]

I think what Jo Jo is saying is that the bar is set so **** low for him that people actually might come away with the conclusion that he won.

But to Jo Jo's point, saying stuff like that is just unrepresented. He continuously has said some of the most worrisome things like asking Russia to hack Hillary, insinuating that someone should or could assassinate her, and now a threat about trying to send his competition to jail if he wins.

Say what you will about Hillary and she certainly has her warts, but Trumps entire campaign is a **** show. He has no clue how to debate and no control over the ridiculous things that come out of his mouth.

Bingo.

I'm certainly no Trump supporter but based on the expectations that each candidate's base brought into this debate I would imagine that while neither side is disappointed, Trump's people are likely a little more energized. This has been the weekend from hell for a lot of them so anything that gives them hope, even if it is fleeting, is going to be celebrated.

Obviously much of what Trump says is utter nonsense, but sadly for a lot of people that is a secondary concern. His voters are probably thrilled he didn't have an epic crash and burn moment, they will be very vocal about that, and the media won't be able to ignore it. It's all about the expectations and how low they were for Donald coming into this thing.