PG: Can't stop, won't stop

[The Evidence]

Oh make no mistake, the Bulls are much more watchable lately, I've watched more in the last 2 weeks than all the time prior.

That still doesn't mean the wins are good for this team's long term future or shouldn't be complained about.

Because the long term goal is not to 'enjoy' the wins of a ~25 win team or something, but to eventually build a real contender. For that you need elite talents. Easiest place to get them is the draft, and for that you need top picks.

I know people want to say well hey the kids are developing, but sorry none of them look like elite talents so far.

Lauri hasn't even been playing for half of them, the wins have more to do with Niko, Portis, Nwaba.

Dunn is contributing, but certainly not at some phenom level.

Our Expected Win Loss is 5-21, so we're slightly outpacing by only 1 win right now.

Thats good for second worst odds, and Atlanta is under-pacing their Expected Win Loss of 8-19.

I'd expect some correction to occur there.

I'm perfectly fine with a Hinkie style hard tank and going 0-82. I was ready to tank ages ago.

But people should get ready for worse and MORE unwatchable basketball once guys like Mirotic and RoLo get traded, and I don't want to hear any complaining from the superfans that only watch "winning basketball".

[Derk77]

Mirotic highlights vs Jazz!

Watch on YouTube

[Red Larrivee]

In the 2008 draft, the 2 teams with the best lottery odds were just about demolished. Those teams were the Miami Heat and the Seattle Supersonics. I imagine Rose would have had even more success on those teams than he would have on the Bulls.

Miami still had a prime Dwyane Wade. They were closer to a David Robinson/San Antonio type of situation. Either way, having a superstar on a rookie contract playing with nobody can be just as bad.

The Bulls plan is fine. They're building up assets and still in the running for one of the top picks. That was always the best outcome of this season. It's still likely to continue.

[madvillian]

i do think it's hilarious that people are genuinely falling into the trap of going "yeah!! let's keep everyone on our team who's playing pretty good at this precise moment in time!!"

everyone's always into the idea of selling high until they stumble across someone you can actually sell high on

in this season I got zero problem with it. Commit to the damn thing. You can still keep Dunn and Lauri etc. If someone offers real assets for Niko (aka mid 1st rounder or similar) you make the damn deal and think long term.

I like Niko always been a fan of his ability to score, especially now that he looks to have gotten in real, high level shape and can play hard for his 30+ minutes. But if the deal is there trade him and I'm sure you can sell him on going to a playoff team.

[Ralphb07]

I hate to see this board once Zach returns. He may be too good for us lol

I really hope he looks amazing. Cause It's hard for me to root for this team playing 0.500 basketball .

Long term I like this group better than the past so I'm cool with it. Dunn, Lavine and Lauri with a top 8 pick than last years team. I do think Zach is going to look awesome too. He was on the verge of being really good and I do know Thibs liked him better than Wiggins before the injury occurred.

[TheSuzerain]

It's just hilarious to me that the board was absolutely shook about being a treadmill team with Butler. And now those same people have unbridled enthusiasm for a budding treadmill core. Do you guys realize how much talent is in the NBA right now?

If we are actually going to build a contender, that means that 75% of this roster will have to be turned over.

[ArizonaBullsFan]

Read on Twitter

My boy and I had it on the Jazz feed at the time, so I don't if the Bulls feed had it as clear, but we saw it right away, live, the last 2 "F him"s, and he just looked at me and we laughed so hard, it was so blatant.

Then they showed the replay, and I saw like 3 or 4 "F him"s it looked like.

Never mind, just watched the clip here, there were AT LEAST 2 more "F him"s, it started right after teammates approached him after the make.

[Rerisen]

Man I wish Dunn the 5th pick in last years draft wasn't looking good each game and like the hype coming out. We need him to suck

Dunn is fine. But if Rolo, Niko or Portis don't get shopped/moved soon, they aren't doing this right.

Unless that is, Jerry wants to start "competing" ASAP. Which case...

[Red Larrivee]

The odds of getting a superstar fall off massively after #2 if not even #1.

People can cite outliers where you get one at 5 or 7 or whatever, but they are terrible odds.

If this were a traditional draft with one headliner, then sure. But, there could potentially be anywhere from 3-4 players in the running for #1 overall. The odds are thrown out of the window in that scenario.

[MC3]

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/7jow17/the_chicago_bulls_have_the_longest_win_streak_in/

[the ultimates]

Maybe they want Hinrich over Wade again.

Yay, lets do the whole 'scrapper' team again for 5 years. Not much point to have blown it up for that.

If GarPax have any gray matter, they will get Niko outta here soon.

Wade was drafted before Hinrich.

That's the whole point, if we had a better pick we could have taken Wade straight away.

Meaning, its silly to defend these wins as if they are good.

I'd rather have Wade - and be the worst team in the league when I get him - than have 3 or 4 Hinrichs that start helping you win too soon.

Let's not forget Wade was not projected as a sure fire franchise player and was a little of a surprise when Riley selected him. I get people want the most ping pong balls but that doesn't guarantee you'll get a franchise player.

[TheSuzerain]

In the 2008 draft, the 2 teams with the best lottery odds were just about demolished. Those teams were the Miami Heat and the Seattle Supersonics. I imagine Rose would have had even more success on those teams than he would have on the Bulls.

Miami still had a prime Dwyane Wade. They were closer to a David Robinson/San Antonio type of situation. Either way, having a superstar on a rookie contract playing with nobody can be just as bad.

The Bulls plan is fine. They're building up assets and still in the running for one of the top picks. That was always the best outcome of this season. It's still likely to continue.

It's not the best outcome. You're wrong.

The best outcome would be to have the worst record this year. And the worst record to look forward to in 2019. With a few extra draft picks sprinkled on top.

[Stratmaster]

I think they are playing Hoiball, although they are still playing too slow. The half court offense is honestly pretty to watch at times. There's a lot of movement and now they have some guys that can really shoot it and with Dunn a penetrator and Nwaba a cutter that helps get good looks.

Gotta trade Rolo, he's a key offensive gog, somehow. Dude sets some nice picks on and off ball and can finish off the roll.

And that weave people were cackling at has looked pristeen at times recently. Players executing really makes a difference for coaches, doesn't it?

[Proven_Winner]

i do think it's hilarious that people are genuinely falling into the trap of going "yeah!! let's keep everyone on our team who's playing pretty good at this precise moment in time!!"

everyone's always into the idea of selling high until they stumble across someone you can actually sell high on

I was just thinking this. It’s funny the things some of us complain about on this board we go against when it’s time to do just that. Makes me wonder if people finally see we aren’t as smart as the GM. That’s not to say Gar/Pax is smart but we do give them a lot of flak as if we wouldn’t have done the same in certain situations.

[sh0ck]

I was at the game tonight, super fun time.

But it was pretty empty, on a $5 Food Deal Wednesday on Star Wars night. The UC is really feeling the effects of the tank (especially at the prices I got tickets for).

It's actually kind of bad that fans aren't going out there to support the team during this time (especially since most people wanted this). Makes it more likely that ownership gets impatient and spends on an unworthy FA in order to spring up ticket sales.

For the actual game, Donovan Mitchell is the truth. That kid is the most impressive rookie I've seen in person since Derrick. The way he was able to make plays on both ends of the floor was special. Really looking forward to watching more Jazz games just to see him play.

[TheSuzerain]

The odds of getting a superstar fall off massively after #2 if not even #1.

People can cite outliers where you get one at 5 or 7 or whatever, but they are terrible odds.

If this were a traditional draft with one headliner, then sure. But, there could potentially be anywhere from 3-4 players in the running for #1 overall. The odds are thrown out of the window in that scenario.

Draft narratives are almost always bull. This year is no exception.

The odds are very much still in place.

[Rerisen]

But people should get ready for worse and MORE unwatchable basketball once guys like Mirotic and RoLo get traded, and I don't want to hear any complaining from the superfans that only watch "winning basketball".

That's what has to happen for best odds at success.

Will it suck, yes, but I'll just stop watching like I wasn't before they suddenly looked competitive.

I find great irony taking this side, since I never wanted to tank, and refuse to heavily engage a tanking team.

But even as a non-tanker I understand the obvious. Once you commit to it, you have to commit.

[Chi town]

Agreed. I think him and Lauri can play together too.

That is my whole premise. You start those two together.. they are both agile and can switch onto smaller players. Their rim protection is underrated. You have a 3rd big who is more of a true 5 who is not going to get shoved around by the M. Gasol's, Boguts and Howards and the few true C's left. I mean playing a 7 footer and a 6'10 guy at the 4/5 is not even really going small.

I do know the Bulls liked Lauri and Niko at the 4/5 in Fred's system. If I'm the Bulls I move RoLo and see if Niko is for real or is it a fluke. Because if it for real Lauri and Niko can cause so many problems.

That’s what I’ve been saying. Trade all your depth and set us up for the future. Keep the tank rolling.

[Ralphb07]

Man I wish Dunn the 5th pick in last years draft wasn't looking good each game and like the hype coming out. We need him to suck

Dunn is fine. But if Rolo, Niko or Portis don't get shopped/moved soon, they aren't doing this right.

Unless that is, Jerry wants to start "competing" ASAP. Which case...

If any get a reasonable offer they will be moved. Other than Zach, Dunn and Lauri all is available. But what they won't do is give up guys for nothing. They could finish with the 4th-5th worst record and still wind up with the top pick.

It's obvious they are holding Zach back. But right now this is all good because players they will want to move have value now. I also think even getting rid of RoLo, etc that Dunn, Lavine and Lauri as the season goes on will be good enough to win games

[Red Larrivee]

It's just hilarious to me that the board was absolutely shook about being a treadmill team with Butler. And now those same people have unbridled enthusiasm for a budding treadmill core. Do you guys realize how much talent is in the NBA right now?

If we are actually going to build a contender, that means that 75% of this roster will have to be turned over.

I won't speak for everyone, but some aren't advocating a run on the treadmill. They're simply saying that:

1. Improving young players is a good thing.
2. It's premature to say this team is costing itself a great draft pick.

It's a long season and every team typically ends up as good as they're supposed to be. If the Bulls are truthfully as good as this four game winning streak, then sure let's panic. But, that would also imply that a lot of unsustainable numbers (Mirotic) are actually sustainable.