OT Bears 2019/20 season and beyond

[Jcool0]

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[fleet]

So, Mitch wants all the TV's turned off at Halas Hall to shield the team from the criticism.

If true, if that is not a sign of weakness, then I dont know what is. No wonder the defense has lost heart.

[MeloRoseNoah]

So, Mitch wants all the TV's turned off at Halas Hall to shield the team from the criticism.

If true, if that is not a sign of weakness, then I dont know what is. No wonder the defense has lost heart.

I honestly think that he will start to play better. One of the red flags for me about him this year was the offseason distractions:

1) His new hot IG girlfriend
2) His return to twitter and social media
3) His attempt to build his brand by appearing at more social events over the summer

The dude has a lot of work that needed to be done. While all the reports seem to claim that he was working hard, I seriously doubt it considering the time and effort that he put into the following mentioned three things.

His career is on the line, and it might be too late. We will see.

[dice]

he was the third most effective QB in the entire league (10th in passing, 2nd in rushing). significantly more effective than either goff or rodgers, both of whom were voted in ahead of him as reserves. and certainly way better than the "competent" or even "above average" QB that some are saying is all we need to return to contention. we need WAY more than that

Yeah, I don't think anyone really believes that is an accurate measure of his true effectiveness though. His numbers were skewed up quite a bit due to the one 6 TD game against TB and other games against very weak defenses. He was 16th in passer rating and his QBR was buffed largely by running stats that didn't feel sustainable once teams schemed against them.

QBR adjusts for competition and accounts for situational performance, which is what makes it better than passer rating. and the sustainability question doesn't apply to what he actually accomplished. but of course the tampa game did skew things a bit

[dice]

Mitch was a pro-bowl alternate. Who knows how many QBs turned down the NFL before they got to him.

nobody turns down being a pro bowler. they accept the honor and claim injury

That doesnt change my arguement, and I didn't say they said no to being a pro bowler, that they turned down playing in the game. My point is that he was an alternate because other QBs didn't want to play.

you said you had no idea how many QBs turned it down. we know exactly how many did. three. two of whom were not as effective as mitch over the course of the season

By vast majority of stats he was a middle of the pack QB last season. Only stat he excelled in was QBR, but that stat is flawed. It takes his running game into account too.

running (and avoiding sacks, and converting 3rd/4th downs, etc.) is part of being a QB, which makes QBR far and away the most relevant all-around QB stat. you're referring strictly to passer stats

[dice]

So, Mitch wants all the TV's turned off at Halas Hall to shield the team from the criticism.

If true, if that is not a sign of weakness, then I dont know what is. No wonder the defense has lost heart.

if the defense is losing heart based on anything other than their own performance, they are showing signs of weakness as well

i don't think he was talking about literally turning off TVs, by the way

[dice]

I see a possible Bree out of Mariota by that guy is actually intelligent and reads defense. His only problem is his inaccuracies but he’s very accurate once he has protection and sets his feet.

As for Trubusty, he is just a dimwit. I hope that I am wrong and that Trubisky will go gangbuster from here. But all I’m seeing is a choker who will get worse the longer he’s starting for the Bears.

Right now, we just waiting for the ok from Pace to admit that his picked QB is a bust before he goes to the bench permanently.

he hasn't performed worse in clutch situations. if anything, just the opposite. he's not a choker. he's just not that good

[dice]

Trubisky was a pro bowler just like Deng was an all-star on 14 PER 50% TS when the Bulls were 1st in the East. And last year is really irrelevant anyway, another year in the league should have Mitch improving but instead he has regressed as teams have film on him and Nagy's offense. Mistakes that were chalked up to youth and inexperience have turned out to be Mitch simply not being very good.

first of all, the nba all-star game is at mid-season and oftentimes factors in performance from the previous season. secondly, the discussion was about what the bears have to do going forward to getting BACK to where they were when trubisky was performing well. which means that bringing in an average or even above average starting QB will not do that. particularly when the defense has regressed

[dougthonus]

QBR adjusts for competition and accounts for situational performance, which is what makes it better than passer rating. and the sustainability question doesn't apply to what he actually accomplished. but of course the tampa game did skew things a bit

QBR accounts for that as best as someone has figured out in a popular metric. I don't think many people whom watched the Bears play every week would have even remotely said Trubisky was anywhere close to as good a QB as his QBR. Not even close. Of course, that is just my opinion and is obviously subjective and falls prey to the same problems as any subjective opinion.

[RedBulls23]

nobody turns down being a pro bowler. they accept the honor and claim injury

That doesnt change my arguement, and I didn't say they said no to being a pro bowler, that they turned down playing in the game. My point is that he was an alternate because other QBs didn't want to play.

you said you had no idea how many QBs turned it down. we know exactly how many did. three. two of whom were not as effective as mitch over the course of the season

By vast majority of stats he was a middle of the pack QB last season. Only stat he excelled in was QBR, but that stat is flawed. It takes his running game into account too.

running (and avoiding sacks, and converting 3rd/4th downs, etc.) is part of being a QB, which makes QBR far and away the most relevant all-around QB stat. you're referring strictly to passer stats

Who were the 2 that were not as effective as Mitch?

QBR had guys like Trubisky and Jamis Winston as top 8 QBs last year. Agree to disagree. The stat is flawed as hell.

And it was proven that Mitch by far dominated against weak teams, and was really bad against good teams. Article I posted in the past thread did a thorough comparison against other QBs in the league in same situations and Mitch came up worse against good teams. I'll see if I can find it. His games against bad teams inflated his stats.

[dice]

QBR adjusts for competition and accounts for situational performance, which is what makes it better than passer rating. and the sustainability question doesn't apply to what he actually accomplished. but of course the tampa game did skew things a bit

QBR accounts for that as best as someone has figured out in a popular metric. I don't think many people whom watched the Bears play every week would have even remotely said Trubisky was anywhere close to as good a QB as his QBR. Not even close. Of course, that is just my opinion and is obviously subjective and falls prey to the same problems as any subjective opinion.

no, i think that's accurate. the biggest key to his high QBR was his uncanny ability to scramble for first downs in key situations. which was never going to be sustainable

[RedBulls23]

That doesnt change my arguement, and I didn't say they said no to being a pro bowler, that they turned down playing in the game. My point is that he was an alternate because other QBs didn't want to play.

you said you had no idea how many QBs turned it down. we know exactly how many did. three. two of whom were not as effective as mitch over the course of the season

By vast majority of stats he was a middle of the pack QB last season. Only stat he excelled in was QBR, but that stat is flawed. It takes his running game into account too.

running (and avoiding sacks, and converting 3rd/4th downs, etc.) is part of being a QB, which makes QBR far and away the most relevant all-around QB stat. you're referring strictly to passer stats

Who were the 2 that were not as effective as Mitch?

QBR had guys like Trubisky and Jamis Winston as top 8 QBs last year. Agree to disagree. The stat is flawed as hell.

And it was proven that Mitch by far dominated against weak teams, and was really bad against good teams. Article I posted in the past thread did a thorough comparison against other QBs in the league in same situations and Mitch came up worse against good teams. I'll see if I can find it. His games against bad teams inflated his stats.

https://www.chicagoaudible.com/numbers-never-lie-trubisky-average/

Found the article

[dice]

That doesnt change my arguement, and I didn't say they said no to being a pro bowler, that they turned down playing in the game. My point is that he was an alternate because other QBs didn't want to play.

you said you had no idea how many QBs turned it down. we know exactly how many did. three. two of whom were not as effective as mitch over the course of the season

By vast majority of stats he was a middle of the pack QB last season. Only stat he excelled in was QBR, but that stat is flawed. It takes his running game into account too.

running (and avoiding sacks, and converting 3rd/4th downs, etc.) is part of being a QB, which makes QBR far and away the most relevant all-around QB stat. you're referring strictly to passer stats

Who were the 2 that were not as effective as Mitch?

QBR had guys like Trubisky and Jamis Winston as top 5 QBs last year. Agree to disagree. The stat is flawed as hell.

goff and rodgers were not as effective as mitch last season. and again, the stat is less flawed BY FAR than any other regularly cited stat, none of which evaluate on a play-by-play, granular level. for example, the more traditional QB rating counts a 10 yard completion on 3rd and 15 as better than a 5 yard completion on 3rd and 5. which, of course, it is not. QBR grades on how much a particular play contributes to the end goal of scoring points

[chitownsalesmen]

Dear Santa......





I think you send Virginia to Riveras house and she BEGS him.
Ron I don't have too many years left. We need to capatialize on that Mack trade.

I'm cool with Philip Rivers too.

Kinda strikes me as the next Jay Cutler if we do that.

Jay Cutler would be a GOD SEND compared to what the bears are getting from trubisky.

[chitownsalesmen]

So, Mitch wants all the TV's turned off at Halas Hall to shield the team from the criticism.

If true, if that is not a sign of weakness, then I dont know what is. No wonder the defense has lost heart.

I honestly think that he will start to play better. One of the red flags for me about him this year was the offseason distractions:

1) His new hot IG girlfriend
2) His return to twitter and social media
3) His attempt to build his brand by appearing at more social events over the summer

The dude has a lot of work that needed to be done. While all the reports seem to claim that he was working hard, I seriously doubt it considering the time and effort that he put into the following mentioned three things.

His career is on the line, and it might be too late. We will see.

I don't buy any of this.

Aren't most of these guys dating attractive women? Also aren't the vast majority of them on social media? And any major player (QB/Multiple pro bowler level guys, etc) trying to build a brand around themselves?

The only problem is at his core of being a football player he just isn't very good.

[chitownsalesmen]

So I just want to add that as much as Trubisky is looking like a problem on the field, Naggy is looking like just as big of a problem on the sideline. He knows who mitch is, and what he can and cannot do and he refuses to call the type of plays/offense that would at least be compatible with Mitch. Bears also had a nice RB in Howard on a rookie deal for another year, and it was common knowledge they were going to dump him last offseason. Now Howard isn't a make or break player, but I always pause when a coach has a certain "flavor" for a position and a talented player at that position is traded because hes a bad scheme fit, see Mike Marts with Greg Olsen.

[bullsnewdynasty]

Trubisky was a pro bowler just like Deng was an all-star on 14 PER 50% TS when the Bulls were 1st in the East. And last year is really irrelevant anyway, another year in the league should have Mitch improving but instead he has regressed as teams have film on him and Nagy's offense. Mistakes that were chalked up to youth and inexperience have turned out to be Mitch simply not being very good.

first of all, the nba all-star game is at mid-season and oftentimes factors in performance from the previous season. secondly, the discussion was about what the bears have to do going forward to getting BACK to where they were when trubisky was performing well. which means that bringing in an average or even above average starting QB will not do that. particularly when the defense has regressed

The only difference is that someone told Mitch to stop running the ball. As a passer he's the same.

I don't think the defense has gotten worse, when you are constantly losing the time of possession battle it is very hard for the defense to maintain the same energy level.

[bullsnewdynasty]

So I just want to add that as much as Trubisky is looking like a problem on the field, Naggy is looking like just as big of a problem on the sideline. He knows who mitch is, and what he can and cannot do and he refuses to call the type of plays/offense that would at least be compatible with Mitch. Bears also had a nice RB in Howard on a rookie deal for another year, and it was common knowledge they were going to dump him last offseason. Now Howard isn't a make or break player, but I always pause when a coach has a certain "flavor" for a position and a talented player at that position is traded because hes a bad scheme fit, see Mike Marts with Greg Olsen.

There's only so much the coach can do with one of the least accurate QB's in the NFL. If Mitch can't make throws, the play calls don't even matter.

[chitownsalesmen]

So I just want to add that as much as Trubisky is looking like a problem on the field, Naggy is looking like just as big of a problem on the sideline. He knows who mitch is, and what he can and cannot do and he refuses to call the type of plays/offense that would at least be compatible with Mitch. Bears also had a nice RB in Howard on a rookie deal for another year, and it was common knowledge they were going to dump him last offseason. Now Howard isn't a make or break player, but I always pause when a coach has a certain "flavor" for a position and a talented player at that position is traded because hes a bad scheme fit, see Mike Marts with Greg Olsen.

There's only so much the coach can do with one of the least accurate QB's in the NFL. If Mitch can't make throws, the play calls don't even matter.

Well again, I'm certainly not a member of the trubisky fan club, but I do think giving Mitch the ability to get out of the pocket more, try to make a play with his leg, sprinkle in more play action, some more designed QB keepers, etc. The kid is a decent athlete for the qb position. I know you don't want to turn your QB into a glorified tail back, but stop calling plays with tons of passing progressions, with a lot of pre snap reads, etc.

And its not like Naggy can't do anything that I'm talking about, they put trubisky in a lot more favorable positions last season.

[dice]

Trubisky was a pro bowler just like Deng was an all-star on 14 PER 50% TS when the Bulls were 1st in the East. And last year is really irrelevant anyway, another year in the league should have Mitch improving but instead he has regressed as teams have film on him and Nagy's offense. Mistakes that were chalked up to youth and inexperience have turned out to be Mitch simply not being very good.

first of all, the nba all-star game is at mid-season and oftentimes factors in performance from the previous season. secondly, the discussion was about what the bears have to do going forward to getting BACK to where they were when trubisky was performing well. which means that bringing in an average or even above average starting QB will not do that. particularly when the defense has regressed

The only difference is that someone told Mitch to stop running the ball. As a passer he's the same.

again, even if that's true, it's irrelevant to the conversation, which is NOT about how good trubisky is now or how good he will be going forward. it's about how good he was LAST year and what kind of QB we need to bring in that will get the team back to contention like last year's team. and it would have to be someone who could at least produce on a similar level to what trubisky did overall last year. which is a tall order

I don't think the defense has gotten worse, when you are constantly losing the time of possession battle it is very hard for the defense to maintain the same energy level.

the bears defense has been on the field an average of 31:26 this season. gimme a break

and it's the DEFENSE that has been mostly responsible for that minor differential. last year opponent average drive was 2:30. this year it's 2:54. the offense is averaging 2:41 per drive (middle of the pack). 2:57 last year, which was excellent

the biggest problem is that last year the bears were intercepting 4.43% of opponent passes. this year it's 1.68%. which goes to show that much of the defensive improvement last year had nothing to do with khalil mack. it had to do with an opportunistic secondary