PG: Philly evens series on lights out shooting

[bentheredengthat]

Collins coached this one well. He smelled blood in the water with the Bulls fielding two small, weak, bad-defending PGs who are vulnerable to being trapped while on offense. And he attacked Watson & Lucas with his bigger, more athletic, tougher guards. Collins gave the Bulls' PGs a beat down.

Thibs had no response, and that's on him. He needs another plan for Game #3 because Philly will do the same, and Watson and Lucas are what they are, you can't make them into something different.

This is what worries me about Thibs. He had a real dear in the headlights look about him in the second half last night. He's a systems coach. Fortunately he has an awesome system. But now he has no MVP to check the game when things go south, or when the opposing coach switches up on him. Anywho...

After seeing how hot Jo was, I wonder if we might need a little Jo on the high post wheel-type action to get the ball moving and the offense back on track. Might not be a bad idea as Booz's contributions on O are mostly jump shooting and passing - and we've got to get something on O out of our bigs to loosen things up on that end of the court.

[Mech Engineer]

Collins coached this one well. He smelled blood in the water with the Bulls fielding two small, weak, bad-defending PGs who are vulnerable to being trapped while on offense. And he attacked Watson & Lucas with his bigger, more athletic, tougher guards. Collins gave the Bulls' PGs a beat down.

Thibs had no response, and that's on him. He needs another plan for Game #3 because Philly will do the same, and Watson and Lucas are what they are, you can't make them into something different.

This is what worries me about Thibs. He had a real dear in the headlights look about him in the second half last night. He's a systems coach. Fortunately he has an awesome system. But now he has no MVP to check the game when things go south, or when the opposing coach switches up on him. Anywho...

After seeing how hot Jo was, I wonder if we might need a little Jo on the high post wheel-type action to get the ball moving and the offense back on track. Might not be a bad idea as Booz's contributions on O are mostly jump shooting and passing - and we've got to get something on O out of our bigs to loosen things up on that end of the court.

I think I might be completely wrong on this. But, Thibs seems to be a coach as you said who has a great system with a lot of attention to details and he runs it like a super project manager(like what Toyota did with their Kaizen system) which means it would work 90% of the time. When it doesn't work, he had Rose to do his hero stuff for a few minutes. This formula works great because the system cannot be handled by rival teams because of Rose being able to run it very well/improvise it as he is an elite athlete/player.

Now, his formula is going to struggle against good playoff teams because he doesn't have Rose. In all fairness to Thibs, most coaches(99%) will fail with what happened to the Bulls. Thibs has to do some magic now with what he has by tweaking his philosophy and also making sure the players can execute it. Can he do this on the fly? There was also a little bit of emotional letdown yesterday for Deng/Boozer in having to take over suddenly as leaders. Can Thibs prepare them to come out with the right leader mind-set and give them more options to succeed?

[bentheredengthat]

Wasn't Philly jambing our PG's and denying our wings?

Give it to Jo at the high post for some of this:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjsVtA7Zw5A[/youtube]

Give Booz a nice crisp pass that wide open - I guarantee you he shoots 65%. THAT is the way we need to use Booz.

Plus is they are tight on our wings, we'll get some back-cut action going off that too.

[bentheredengthat]

Collins coached this one well. He smelled blood in the water with the Bulls fielding two small, weak, bad-defending PGs who are vulnerable to being trapped while on offense. And he attacked Watson & Lucas with his bigger, more athletic, tougher guards. Collins gave the Bulls' PGs a beat down.

Thibs had no response, and that's on him. He needs another plan for Game #3 because Philly will do the same, and Watson and Lucas are what they are, you can't make them into something different.

This is what worries me about Thibs. He had a real dear in the headlights look about him in the second half last night. He's a systems coach. Fortunately he has an awesome system. But now he has no MVP to check the game when things go south, or when the opposing coach switches up on him. Anywho...

After seeing how hot Jo was, I wonder if we might need a little Jo on the high post wheel-type action to get the ball moving and the offense back on track. Might not be a bad idea as Booz's contributions on O are mostly jump shooting and passing - and we've got to get something on O out of our bigs to loosen things up on that end of the court.

I think I might be completely wrong on this. But, Thibs seems to be a coach as you said who has a great system with a lot of attention to details and he runs it like a super project manager(like what Toyota did with their Kaizen system) which means it would work 90% of the time. When it doesn't work, he had Rose to do his hero stuff for a few minutes. This formula works great because the system cannot be handled by rival teams because of Rose being able to run it very well/improvise it as he is an elite athlete/player.

Now, his formula is going to struggle against good playoff teams because he doesn't have Rose. In all fairness to Thibs, most coaches(99%) will fail with what happened to the Bulls. Thibs has to do some magic now with what he has by tweaking his philosophy and also making sure the players can execute it. Can he do this on the fly? There was also a little bit of emotional letdown yesterday for Deng/Boozer in having to take over suddenly as leaders. Can Thibs prepare them to come out with the right leader mind-set and give them more options to succeed?

My fear is that he cannot do it on the fly. But I do have faith that he can do it within a 7 game series.

[suckfish]

I think we need to run the offense through Boozer and Noah in the low/mid/high posts EARLY in the offense. I'm not saying they have to shoot or create anything every time, I just think the ball needs to come out of the point guards hands right away so we can get away from CJ and Lucas dribbling the ball until the shot clock is in hail mary time.

We just can't have the point guards dribbling the possession to death. Neither CJ or Lucas can handle the trap on the ball at all.

The point guards need to do their thing, but lets not start the offense that way.

[bentheredengthat]

^^^yep. I think we are being denied east/west ball movement, but high/ low can be just as effective. Then towards the end of the shot clock, after the defense has collapsed, we just might have kick outs available to take advantage of our PG's 3pt sharpshooting.

[Mech Engineer]

I think we need to run the offense through Boozer and Noah in the low/mid/high posts EARLY in the offense. I'm not saying they have to shoot or create anything every time, I just think the ball needs to come out of the point guards hands right away so we can get away from CJ and Lucas dribbling the ball until the shot clock is in hail mary time.

We just can't have the point guards dribbling the possession to death. Neither CJ or Lucas can handle the trap on the ball at all.

The point guards need to do their thing, but lets not start the offense that way.

We have to run the Orlando offense with Noah/Boozer who can make better passes than Howard and use Rip/Deng/Watson/JL3/Korver as our 3 pt/long 2 pt shooters. Even if the long 2 is an inefficient shot, it is better than getting nothing as the rebounds on the long 2 won't be so long that Noah/Boozer/Taj can get a chance on it compared to a 3pt miss.

That plus them going small effectively made Asik useless yesterday

[Bulls Revenge]

I don't often post on here, but I do come to this site daily and read some great posts...that being said, like many of you, I am really emotionally attached to our Bulls. We can blame all the players and coaches because like winning, losing like that is a group effort as well. In my opinion, the two players who should get the blunt of the blame is Boozer and Deng. Deng is an all-star and he didn't show up. Boozer was brought in to dominate the post and has yet to do it. They get my blame. As for CJ and JL3, look, they are who they are. They are backups behind our Superstar. Anyone expecting them to be a game changer are only kidding themselves. We know what we can get from those two and that's about it. Right now there is too much pressure on them to be Derrick Rose. Someone needs to go up to them and tell them manage the game and we'll take over... I guess what I'm trying to get at is others (Deng, Boozer) on our team need to be leaders and step up. Do I think that we can win a championship if they do? No, but at least show us some fight and pride...If we go out, go out swinging...

Like you, I am tired of the "let's do it for johnny" speeches...but I think this story reminds me alot of whats going on with our Bulls...As a high school football coach, this past season we were faced with a similar position. We were picked to be in the state championship. In the 4th quarter of our first district game, up 14-6 with 58 seconds to go, 4th and 2 we decided to go for it. Our QB ran for a 1st down, game over. Only after the play our QB did not get up. He ended up tearing his ACL on the play as one defender held on to his leg while another brought him down. Needless to say this was a huge blow to our state championship aspiration. Being that our offense runs a veer offense based on speed, our backup is not one of the fastest players either. We had to alter our offensive approach. We never asked our backup to do something we knew he couldn't do. We did ask him to manage the game and avoid turnovers. Others on our offense stepped up and picked up the slack...

I'm not gonna sit here and tell you we won it all, because we didn't. Our backup helped us win games we were supposed to win...was it pretty? Heck no...But when we played in the Quarterfinal playoff game, his inexperience came through. We lost 13-7. We had the ball inside our opponents 5 yard line 3 times and our backup fumbled once and threw two int's on 4th and goal. We needed our starter to lead us in the big games because our backup couldn't handle the pressure. Everyone else stepped up but we could only go so far with what we had at QB; but at least I knew that our other players had our QB's back and went out swinging. We return most of our players this year and our QB is 100%. It helped us because now we have a chip on our shoulder for the upcoming season...

I can see similarities in these two situations. We can only go so far CJ and JL3. Thibs needs to realize this and adjust the offense based on their abilities. As much as I hate Indiana's coach Vogel, I admire him because he tells Indiana they are the best team and they buy into it and play like it, even when us fans know they aren't...we know its gonna be a battle because they have that attitude...and as for the players all I can ask is that our money players step up and lead by example. All I can ask is for them to fight and show some pride. Give that hard foul, dive for balls, crash the boards. If Philly beats us by 1 or 2 then hats off to them because I know we gave it our all. Last night we didn't see that. It seemed like us fans care more about our team than the actual players...Playing without heart in the playoffs bothers me. I just hope we have leaders on our team, who are reading just how bad they are without Rose, and do something about it. And shying away from the challenge is not an option! Don't tell me wasted season. This is the damn playoffs where anything can happen! Play all out and you can look at yourself in the mirror with dignity...BUT, if you are going to tank it, let us know so we won't waste our time watching the games anymore.

[HINrichPolice]

HINrichPolice, this is you right (on the left with the Van Lier jersey)? Big props to you brother, for showing up and representing.

Thanks kulaz. You know I had to be there for what promised to be one of the more emotional games of the year.

Not going to lie, my facepaint irritated my eyes a bit when I saw Derrick Rose present the game ball.

Too bad the game itself almost made my facepaint irritate my eyes as well.

Hopefully this was just an aberration and that we'll be able to take better shots, defend in transition, and control the boards like we typically do.


Btw, where did you find the pic?
EDIT: nevermind, I see it espn

[blinkofaneye]

Congrats on guiding your team to the state quarterfinals despite losing your QB and for altering your offensive approach. I agree with your insights. Let's hope Thibs can make some changes in our offense to fit the point guards we now have. We need to get the ball inside more and set up Boozer, Noah and Deng. the I'm hoping to see a little more Mike James. He seems to have the ability to run the offense better, doesn't pound his dribble as much at the top running the shot clock out, then passing for a desperation shot.
Deng had a miserable game. Boozer was limited and didn't give the Bulls what we needed. We need both to win Friday.

[the italian]

I didn't see much discussion of Noah throughout the first few pages of the thread. I missed much of the second half of the game, but in the first, Noah was a beast. He really stepped up with Rose being out. He had a fire in him and was very aggressive. We just need to have better shot selections and get back on defense quickly. It turned into NBA Jam for Philly in the second

[Ice Man]

I missed much of the second half of the game, but in the first, Noah was a beast. He really stepped up with Rose being out. He had a fire in him and was very aggressive.

Yeah he was great in the first half. Played a whole game's worth of excellence. He's been terrific down the stretch and so far in the playoffs.

The second half, let's not go there. No points, no rebounds, no blocks, no fouls, no existence in the first 8 minutes of the 3rd. During which time Philly went from 8 down to 7 ahead. Then Asik came in, Philly rallied some more, game over.

[Spimothy Leary]

HINrichPolice, this is you right (on the left with the Van Lier jersey)? Big props to you brother, for showing up and representing.

Thanks kulaz. You know I had to be there for what promised to be one of the more emotional games of the year.

Not going to lie, my facepaint irritated my eyes a bit when I saw Derrick Rose present the game ball.

Too bad the game itself almost made my facepaint irritate my eyes as well.

Hopefully this was just an aberration and that we'll be able to take better shots, defend in transition, and control the boards like we typically do.


Btw, where did you find the pic?
EDIT: nevermind, I see it espn

if I may ask,,, isn't that jersey on backwards ?

[spaceheat]

I am hoping to see a bigger role for Rip come game 3. He has prepared his body for this playoff push and we should be increasing his minutes. Is there some reason he is not getting the extra minutes?

[StaceyKing]

After this game i have fear. At halftime i was so confident. JL3 just showed, that he can do it. And everybody was playing good. But what i saw after that showed, that this year its gonna be tough. Suddenly we were playing unconcentrated, let our opponent play and didnt hit any shots.

Now we will play on the road, which is een more harder. I dont want to be panic, or overreacting, but i think, we can be happy to get in the 2nd round. Which ist bull, because WE HAVE THE BEST RECORD IN THE LEAGUE! OUR GUYS NEED TO HAVE THAT IN MIND AND JUST PLAY GOOD BASKETBALL!

[GetBuLLish]

Wasn't Philly jambing our PG's and denying our wings?

Give it to Jo at the high post for some of this:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjsVtA7Zw5A[/youtube]

Give Booz a nice crisp pass that wide open - I guarantee you he shoots 65%. THAT is the way we need to use Booz.

Yes, that is how to use Boozer. Unfortunately, because that is the primary way to use Boozer, he can't be used that much. Good defenses won't give up wide open jumpers to Boozer too often. And you can't expect Noah to consistently break the ankles of his defenders.

On a related note, people clamoring for Boozer to "step up" (not you, bentheredengthat) don't seem to understand that Boozer can't create for himself. Boozer "stepping up" is predicated upon another player(s) "stepping up" and creating open looks for Boozer. Unfortunately, Rose was the best player at doing this.

So the natural and next problem becomes: if we can't get Boozer open jumpers (his primary way of scoring), then he becomes a net negative on the team due to his defense. Thibs is in a tough situation here.

[pduh01]

On a related note, people clamoring for Boozer to "step up" (not you, bentheredengthat) don't seem to understand that Boozer can't create for himself. Boozer "stepping up" is predicated upon another player(s) "stepping up" and creating open looks for Boozer. Unfortunately, Rose was the best player at doing this.

This is why I feel that Thibs needs to play Mike James instead of JL3 for game three, now with Rose out, Mike James is the next guy that can give Boozer, and can run the offense better than both JL3 and CJ Watson.

I say this in this thread play Mike James as your primary back up point guard, only bring JL3 as a emergency instant offense sparks.

Let Mike James run the offense...Free Mike James...

[imagge]

On a related note, people clamoring for Boozer to "step up" (not you, bentheredengthat) don't seem to understand that Boozer can't create for himself. Boozer "stepping up" is predicated upon another player(s) "stepping up" and creating open looks for Boozer. Unfortunately, Rose was the best player at doing this.

This is why I feel that Thibs needs to play Mike James instead of JL3 for game three, now with Rose out, Mike James is the next guy that can give Boozer, and can run the offense better than both JL3 and CJ Watson.

I say this in this thread play Mike James as your primary back up point guard, only bring JL3 as a emergency instant offense sparks.

Let Mike James run the offense...Free Mike James...

I feel pretty confident that the FO did not think he would be an 18 foot jump shooter only. In these times he is big enough to post and seal Brand on the block. Get on the block and at least try to get to the FT line is all I ask. The excuse of clogging the lane is no more because Drose is not playing....250 pound PF now belongs on the block and Thibs should direct him there. If he chooses to float anywhere outside of 10 feet sit his ass down.

[suckfish]

I'm down with giving Mike James a shot. I think he controls the offense better than both CJ and Lucas, while staying aggressive himself.

Still, Lucas has to get minutes. He has proved time and time again he can get buckets, in flurries. Sure he can suck it up with over dribbling and missing passes on time, but he has to get some minutes.

[livbulls1]

Everyone played like straight up ass, except for Noah. I give him a lot of props. He's the only one who showed up to play.

I'm not mad about what happened. Just sad at 1) losing Rose, and 2) getting blown out right after.

I thought we would've come out with a lot more effort; ready to fight. I just hope Game 3 is much better. If we lose again, I don't really have high hopes for the rest of the series or season tbh.

I already miss Rose terribly.