Pat Williams Discussion - Out 4-6 Mo (late Feb to late April)

Post #301 » by **DuckIII** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 12:17 pm

FriedRise wrote:

Read on Twitter

He should sit IMO.

If that’s all true rather than cover for the Patastrophe, he needs to sit. It’d be different if he were gutting it out and helping perform an important role.

sco · Post #302 » by **sco** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 12:25 pm

DuckIII wrote:
FriedRise wrote:

Read on Twitter

He should sit IMO.

If that’s all true rather than cover for the Patastrophe, he needs to sit. It’d be different if he were gutting it out and helping perform an important role.

First of all, it looked bad when the injury happened...I'm just happy it's just strained. I have a hard time trusting our medical staff, but I remind myself that it's a new staff. If playing is extending his injury, someone should sit him.

ikeziskash · Post #303 » by **ikeziskash** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 12:37 pm

DuckIII wrote:
FriedRise wrote:

Read on Twitter

He should sit IMO.

If that’s all true rather than cover for the Patastrophe, he needs to sit. It’d be different if he were gutting it out and helping perform an important role.

What a shameful puff piece and excuse making for poor play.

CaPiTanAK · Post #304 » by **CaPiTanAK** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 12:37 pm

A strain is actually a partial tear, so that might explains why his rebounding # sucks. Give the kid 10 days off and reassess from there.

Post #305 » by **DuckIII** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 12:41 pm

ikeziskash wrote:
DuckIII wrote:
FriedRise wrote:

Read on Twitter

He should sit IMO.

If that’s all true rather than cover for the Patastrophe, he needs to sit. It’d be different if he were gutting it out and helping perform an important role.

What a shameful puff piece and excuse making for poor play.

Could be. Could be that he’s injured.

Regardless, the motor issue dates back to last season and is real.

ikeziskash · Post #306 » by **ikeziskash** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 1:23 pm

Duck is right. You either have a motor or you don’t. He doesn’t. His is close to Eddy Curry level. No point trying to fix him, this team is looking to win now. Bench him and look to fix this issue w a trade this season.

Post #307 » by **DuckIII** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 1:31 pm

ikeziskash wrote:Duck is right. You either have a motor or you don’t. He doesn’t. His is close to Eddy Curry level. No point trying to fix him, this team is looking to win now. Bench him and look to fix this issue w a trade this season.

I don’t agree with any of that except me being right.

But I do think trading him is on the table this season if he can be packaged for a legitimate difference maker. Which would then put us in full win now mode if it could happen.

Post #308 » by **fleet** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 2:14 pm

If getting Grant is worth doing for Chicago, i.e. putting the Bulls regularly into the finals, hard to see Detroit doing it. And if it was worth it for Detroit, that means Pat is the real deal, and Pat will get us there anyway, cheaper.

Little_Bill · Post #309 » by **Little_Bill** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 6:10 pm

Can the Bulls afford to have Pat playing against the good teams? Will Pat's poor performance eventually hurt team morale?

Post #310 » by **HomoSapien** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 6:22 pm

DuckIII wrote:
FriedRise wrote:

Read on Twitter

He should sit IMO.

If that’s all true rather than cover for the Patastrophe, he needs to sit. It’d be different if he were gutting it out and helping perform an important role.

Very valiant of him, but way too early in the season to be playing through such a painful injury. Better for the team and for him if he sits and gets healthy.

Post #311 » by **coldfish** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 6:48 pm

fleet wrote:If getting Grant is worth doing for Chicago, i.e. putting the Bulls regularly into the finals, hard to see Detroit doing it. And if it was worth it for Detroit, that means Pat is the real deal, and Pat will get us there anyway, cheaper.

Grant is an unrestricted free agent in June of 2022. Unless Detroit thinks they are going to win a title in the next two seasons, they are better off cashing in for picks and young prospects then letting him walk for nothing.

Post #312 » by **HomoSapien** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 6:53 pm

coldfish wrote:
fleet wrote:If getting Grant is worth doing for Chicago, i.e. putting the Bulls regularly into the finals, hard to see Detroit doing it. And if it was worth it for Detroit, that means Pat is the real deal, and Pat will get us there anyway, cheaper.

Grant is an unrestricted free agent in June of 2022. Unless Detroit thinks they are going to win a title in the next two seasons, they are better off cashing in for picks and young prospects then letting him walk for nothing.

Yeah, that's where I'm at. Detroit is so far away from being meaningful, and Patrick Williams aligns much better with their timeline than Grant. If they think Pat's an interesting prospect at all, then the reasoning for doing the trade simplifies.

gardenofsound · Post #313 » by **gardenofsound** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 6:57 pm

HomoSapien wrote:
coldfish wrote:
fleet wrote:If getting Grant is worth doing for Chicago, i.e. putting the Bulls regularly into the finals, hard to see Detroit doing it. And if it was worth it for Detroit, that means Pat is the real deal, and Pat will get us there anyway, cheaper.

Grant is an unrestricted free agent in June of 2022. Unless Detroit thinks they are going to win a title in the next two seasons, they are better off cashing in for picks and young prospects then letting him walk for nothing.

Yeah, that's where I'm at. Detroit is so far away from being meaningful, and Patrick Williams aligns much better with their timeline than Grant. If they think Pat's an interesting prospect at all, then the reasoning for doing the trade simplifies.

Just to clarify, he's unrestricted in June of 2023, not 2022.

Andi Obst · Post #314 » by **Andi Obst** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 6:59 pm

Still all-in on Pat, nothing has changed for me. There’s no question he needs to be better, though. I really hope he shows some signs of life on offense during the upcoming brutal stretch of games so this board can stop panicking a little bit.

Dieselbound&Down · Post #315 » by **Dieselbound&Down** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 7:06 pm

ikeziskash wrote:Duck is right. You either have a motor or you don’t. He doesn’t. His is close to Eddy Curry level. No point trying to fix him, this team is looking to win now. Bench him and look to fix this issue w a trade this season.

They need to find the next Isiah Thomas, a GM willing to give up picks that became Noah and LaMarcus Aldridge for a low energy bust.

Arguably the luck of that trade and Rose's lottery ball extended Pax's GM career by a decade.

Post #316 » by **fleet** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 7:10 pm

coldfish wrote:
fleet wrote:If getting Grant is worth doing for Chicago, i.e. putting the Bulls regularly into the finals, hard to see Detroit doing it. And if it was worth it for Detroit, that means Pat is the real deal, and Pat will get us there anyway, cheaper.

Grant is an unrestricted free agent in June of 2022. Unless Detroit thinks they are going to win a title in the next two seasons, they are better off cashing in for picks and young prospects then letting him walk for nothing.

Doesn’t have to be with the Bulls. A number of deals on the table, all things more or less equal, a team usually trades out of the division. Especially when handing the division title to a close rival.

panthermark · Post #317 » by **panthermark** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 8:21 pm

Grant does not really fix the problem to me, especially given the potential cost. But we do need to address Pat at PF. I'd like to see a smaller trade happen.

Post #318 » by **kulaz3000** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 8:51 pm

fleet wrote:
coldfish wrote:
fleet wrote:If getting Grant is worth doing for Chicago, i.e. putting the Bulls regularly into the finals, hard to see Detroit doing it. And if it was worth it for Detroit, that means Pat is the real deal, and Pat will get us there anyway, cheaper.

Grant is an unrestricted free agent in June of 2022. Unless Detroit thinks they are going to win a title in the next two seasons, they are better off cashing in for picks and young prospects then letting him walk for nothing.

Doesn’t have to be with the Bulls. A number of deals on the table, all things more or less equal, a team usually trades out of the division. Especially when handing the division title to a close rival.

Exactly what I was going to post. Divisions not so much of a concern these days, but Detroit isn't going to trade away Grant to the Bulls who are in the same conference, to make them better. And if they do, it's going to to a one-sided deal to make it happen.

And if I were the Pistons, why would you trade him? They just drafted arguably the best player in the draft who doesn't even play the same position. Even if you don't see him as part of your long term future, you still want to put out a decent team, so unless they are getting lottery picks or a clearly better player, I don't see why they would trade him to the Bulls, to a conference rival no less.

Post #319 » by **fleet** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 9:02 pm

Pretty straightforward right? For Detroit to do that Pat must be pretty damn good. So if Pat is that good, the Bulls would be foolish to do the deal as well. Especially considering Pat will be making a lot less money and keeping him wouldn’t push the Bulls into the lux tax.

Chi town · Post #320 » by **Chi town** » Wed Oct 27, 2021 9:02 pm

Seems like a Pat trade would be for Grant, Barnes, or OG. I'd take OG every time.

I think PW will get healthy, play well as a starter and show more as the main PnR man with DDR and the 2nd unit. This could make him more likely to get traded though. I know AK loves him but I think he would still trade him for the right piece like OG.