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Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real

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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#361 » by Susan » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:29 pm

Stratmaster wrote:
Susan wrote:
fleet wrote:Why Nagy didn’t max protect in this game is amazing.

Can’t run his “system” that way I reckon.


Spread it out over and over against a top flight DLine with a rookie QB and a questionable Oline.

9 sacks, that's not on Fields. This stubbornness is going to be Nagy's undoing. He put Fields and the offensive line in a terrible position to succeed today.
9 sacks not all on fields, definitely. But it is somewhat on him. How many times do you think Dalton would have been sacked? I would guess probably three or four. The ball would have been gone much earlier. Like I said, there is plenty of blame to go around.

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Doesn't matter, when you have a complete breakdown like that, you gotta adjust and stop running 5 wide out there. They put Peters on an island over and over again and he clearly couldn't manage it. Terrible lack of adjustments by the coaching staff.
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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#362 » by Stratmaster » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:33 pm

fleet wrote:
Stratmaster wrote:
fleet wrote:Not sure how much any rookie is supposed to be good at in the first place, and especially getting thrown into that fire after running the scout team.
Which is why he wasn't starting game 1. The scout team stuff is just...well... I agree to disagree

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If Alex Smith was the alternative I would agree about game 1. But its Dalton. The Bears arent gonna score this year with anyone, may as well give the rookie his chance to work out the growth process ASAP. That is good for Wilson and Lawrence, it is good for Fields. That being said, if he is not in danger of death.
I will agree to disagree again. There is nothing positive for Fields growth having him take the snaps he did today.

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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#363 » by Stratmaster » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:35 pm

Susan wrote:
Stratmaster wrote:
Susan wrote:
Spread it out over and over against a top flight DLine with a rookie QB and a questionable Oline.

9 sacks, that's not on Fields. This stubbornness is going to be Nagy's undoing. He put Fields and the offensive line in a terrible position to succeed today.
9 sacks not all on fields, definitely. But it is somewhat on him. How many times do you think Dalton would have been sacked? I would guess probably three or four. The ball would have been gone much earlier. Like I said, there is plenty of blame to go around.

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Doesn't matter, when you have a complete breakdown like that, you gotta adjust and stop running 5 wide out there. They put Peters on an island over and over again and he clearly couldn't manage it. Terrible lack of adjustments by the coaching staff.
I agree except Fields contributed to the issues. It's OK. He is a rook. The coach takes the majority of the blame here

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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#364 » by chicagoballer » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:36 pm

The bears are 172W-183L under ted phillips since 1999. Trestman, Dick Jauron, Nagy, John fox were all hires under him. Jerry Angelo, Phil emery, pace were all hired under him.

The only respectable hire was Lovie smith to me.
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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#365 » by fleet » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:38 pm

Stratmaster wrote:
fleet wrote:
Stratmaster wrote:Which is why he wasn't starting game 1. The scout team stuff is just...well... I agree to disagree

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If Alex Smith was the alternative I would agree about game 1. But its Dalton. The Bears arent gonna score this year with anyone, may as well give the rookie his chance to work out the growth process ASAP. That is good for Wilson and Lawrence, it is good for Fields. That being said, if he is not in danger of death.
I will agree to disagree again. There is nothing positive for Fields growth having him take the snaps he did today.

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This game? Probably not. Not like this. But Justin will come up with something as a result, because that is who he is. Next week, we try again. Go Justin. Go away Nagy.
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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#366 » by Stratmaster » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:40 pm

fleet wrote:
Stratmaster wrote:
fleet wrote:If Alex Smith was the alternative I would agree about game 1. But its Dalton. The Bears arent gonna score this year with anyone, may as well give the rookie his chance to work out the growth process ASAP. That is good for Wilson and Lawrence, it is good for Fields. That being said, if he is not in danger of death.
I will agree to disagree again. There is nothing positive for Fields growth having him take the snaps he did today.

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This game? Probably not. Not like this. But Justin will come up with something as a result, because that is who he is. Next week, we try again. Go Justin. Go away Nagy.
You might not believe this, but I love Fields' upside and am stoked they have him.

He just isn't ready yet.

It is the NFL. All the defensive players are faster and smarter.

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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#367 » by fleet » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:45 pm

Stratmaster wrote:
fleet wrote:
Stratmaster wrote:I will agree to disagree again. There is nothing positive for Fields growth having him take the snaps he did today.

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This game? Probably not. Not like this. But Justin will come up with something as a result, because that is who he is. Next week, we try again. Go Justin. Go away Nagy.
You might not believe this, but I love Fields' upside and am stoked they have him.

He just isn't ready yet.

It is the NFL. All the defensive players are faster and smarter.

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Ready is a word screaming for definition. He’s as ready to learn as anyone else in his class. Provided reasonable bodily safety. If you’re predicting 9 sacks every Sunday, you got a case. If you’re aiming for dubs, you will inherently be disappointed no matter who is under center. We got nothing to lose and everything to gain with Justin.
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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#368 » by Dominator83 » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:46 pm

chicagoballer wrote:The bears are 172W-183L under ted phillips since 1999. Trestman, Dick Jauron, Nagy, John fox were all hires under him. Jerry Angelo, Phil emery, pace were all hired under him.

The only respectable hire was Lovie smith to me.

And Lovie wasn't even their 1st choice. They tried to get Nick Saben (Who was a bust in the NFL) . Lovie was the rebound hire.
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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#369 » by Bulls69 » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:46 pm

Stratmaster wrote:
fleet wrote:I think we have witnessed the worst performance by an O Line in modern history
I think the offensive line is indeed horrible. But I also think your comment is coming up with excuses for fields

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The fans who wants to rush Fields now see why it's not wise this kid have a lot to learn I'm still worried more about Nagy than Fields.
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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#370 » by IliketheBullsNBearstoo » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:51 pm

Bulls69 wrote:
Stratmaster wrote:
fleet wrote:I think we have witnessed the worst performance by an O Line in modern history
I think the offensive line is indeed horrible. But I also think your comment is coming up with excuses for fields

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The fans who wants to rush Fields now see why it's not wise this kid have a lot to learn I'm still worried more about Nagy than Fields.


Im not rushing him. Take your time and learn in these games Justin. We should be in a rush to find someone better to bring him along though.
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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#371 » by dougthonus » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:55 pm

GetBuLLish wrote:First of all, the decision on when to start Fields affects more than just Fields, it affects the whole team. If it is true that Dalton is noticeably better than FIelds right now, then starting Fields sends a message to the rest of the team that this season is basically meaningless for them. Now maybe in the grand scheme of things, it's still the right decision (especially considering the Bears aren't going to win anyway even with Dalton starting). But it's a factor the coach has to consider when he stands in front of his team every day and tries convincing them to fight for wins. Beyond that, again, if Dalton is the better player now, that likely means the other offensive players are going to play worse, which for soon-to-be free agents might mean they will make less money. Defensive players will likely play worse too since they'll be spending more time on the field, which increases their risk of injury, which could seriously impact their next contracts.


I generally agree with this. I noted in a different post that if the Bears had Jimmy G or some other middle of the road QB, then I'd be more prone to side with this type of thinking.

However, to me because Dalton is so poor and has so little upside anyway, I'm content to take these risks to improve Fields faster.

Second, even if you just focus on Fields, the premise that he will automatically be better if he starts right away is just not true. You attempt to liken the situation to any other type of endeavor, but even that falls short. Let's take for example a lawyer coming right out of law school. Would it necessarily benefit him if his employer had him single handedly try a massive lawsuit in front of a jury, despite him clearly being ill-prepared and destined for embarrassing failure? No. Sure it might benefit him in the long run. But the experience could also scar him psychologically (especially if the trial loss is publicized and tarnishes his reputation). It might also teach him bad habits that he never shakes. It might even make him feel entitled to always having big cases since he was undeservedly gifted one right out of the gate and therefore causes him to put in less effort.


Fields has played to massive stadiums against elite competition already. He's played QB for many years of his life already. This is a new higher level, but this isn't a lawyer going to the trial of the century as his first case. It's not hte first time he's touched a football, so these types of analogies aren't warranted.

Why do we not worry about a 1st round linebacker being scarred for life if he blows a tackle while starting for his team? Why is he so mentally strong automatically but our QBs are mentally weak? No where else on the field do people think failure will scar a player for life except QB.

All these potential considerations apply to Gase's decision to start Fields. In addition, football carries the unique potential of injury. If Fields is truly not ready to play at a professional level, that likely means he isn't able to accurately and efficiently read defenses, in which case he would be more susceptible to getting hit, which would increase his risk of injury. This risk is further compounded if the coach knows his offensive line isn't good.

I mean, today's game basically proved all these potentials could come to fruition. What exactly did Fields learning getting sacked 8 times? What exactly did he learn completing 6 passes for 68 yards and rushing for 12? Maybe this will help him. But maybe it won't. And even if it were to help him, would it have been worth it if Fields got seriously injured?

It's just not nearly as simple as you make it seem. Today proved that.


I think the opposite, I think Fields will come out of today learning a ton about what he has to do to succeed at the next level. His need to learn to feel a defense, make quick decisions, get the ball out fast etc... Those are all things he's not going to see in practice the same way he will in a game. A lot of his sacks today were absolutely on him. I don't think he learns to avoid those without feeling it in game action.

He also missed plays out there, and he's not going to have that on film. He's going to get to go out and see what he should ahve seen in the game, something he wouldn't have been able to do otherwise. I don't know if they're running game film all practice and then reviewing it in teh same way they do for real games, but my guess is probably not, and that this gives him another avenue to improve.

Could he get hurt? Sure he could. He could get hurt next year too. He could get hurt at any time. That's the risk of playing this sport. To get better, he's going to have to play. If he plays, he takes on risk.

I think a lot happened today that will allow him to improve. I think he was awful in all the ways I expected him to be and hope it's a strong learning experience for him.
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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#372 » by GinWeary » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:58 pm

As much as I want Pace and Nagy gone, nothing will change as long as ownership remains static. As long as the wrinkled up McCaskey's have a say, I see little changing in the Bears culture. The problems stem from the top. I'll take brand new ownership over a brand new stadium any day...just get the McCaskey's out of here!
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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#373 » by Susan » Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:01 pm

Stratmaster wrote:
fleet wrote:
Stratmaster wrote:I will agree to disagree again. There is nothing positive for Fields growth having him take the snaps he did today.

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This game? Probably not. Not like this. But Justin will come up with something as a result, because that is who he is. Next week, we try again. Go Justin. Go away Nagy.
You might not believe this, but I love Fields' upside and am stoked they have him.

He just isn't ready yet.

It is the NFL. All the defensive players are faster and smarter.

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This team is going nowhere this season. No need to waste time playing Dalton for a team that's ceiling is 9 wins.

We've got one really tough one against Tampa in a few weeks, but beyond that there's no OMFG games left on the schedule. Next week is a new week and Detroit coming to town.
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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#374 » by fleet » Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:01 pm

What would hurt Fields more than anything right now, is to not give him a chance next week against the Lions, and go out of the season with a beatdown of epic proportions.
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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#375 » by fleet » Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:02 pm

GinWeary wrote:As much as I want Pace and Nagy gone, nothing will change as long as ownership remains static. As long as the wrinkled up McCaskey's have a say, I see little changing in the Bears culture. The problems stem from the top. I'll take brand new ownership over a brand new stadium any day...just get the McCaskey's out of here!

Gof bless you for saying that
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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#376 » by chicagoballer » Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:04 pm

GinWeary wrote:As much as I want Pace and Nagy gone, nothing will change as long as ownership remains static. As long as the wrinkled up McCaskey's have a say, I see little changing in the Bears culture. The problems stem from the top. I'll take brand new ownership over a brand new stadium any day...just get the McCaskey's out of here!


McCaskeys won’t sell as it’s such a profitable business. There are three current execs. McCaskey, Pace, Phillips. Two can be fired. The replacements for them should not be hired by mcCaskeys. Instead, reach out to other team owners/NFL OGs to help hire a new executive panel who is knowledgeable in football and respected.
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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#377 » by Susan » Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:19 pm

Read on Twitter


Jimmy Graham retweeted this. They've lost faith in Nagy as a playcaller.
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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#378 » by fleet » Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:20 pm

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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#379 » by fleet » Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:21 pm

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Re: Bears talk 2.0; Fields era begins for real for real 

Post#380 » by Bulls69 » Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:27 pm

IliketheBullsNBearstoo wrote:
Bulls69 wrote:
Stratmaster wrote:I think the offensive line is indeed horrible. But I also think your comment is coming up with excuses for fields

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The fans who wants to rush Fields now see why it's not wise this kid have a lot to learn I'm still worried more about Nagy than Fields.


Im not rushing him. Take your time and learn in these games Justin. We should be in a rush to find someone better to bring him along though.


When you have a high school coach calling the plays and a o line that is worst than last year one this is why it not a smart move. You would think Nagy would had run the ball down the Browns throat you a stud RB but the moron on the headset can't figure it out.
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