2018 NBA Draft 2.0 - pick #7, #22 . - Merged

[The Box Office]

people are treating this like it's a straight-up choice between "high upside" and "high floor", which is pretty obviously silly on the face of it. it makes sense as shorthand for fans who are casually following the draft process, but the professional talent evaluators who are actually making the pick should be considering the likelihood of a spectrum of outcomes for each player.

like, it's not just

trey young = possibly great but possibly bad
mikal bridges = probably pretty good but definitely not great and definitely not bad

there's a decent chance trey young doesn't bust but doesn't hit his ceiling. there's a chance mikal bridges busts! a lot of things can happen! this feels like an overly simplistic thing to point out, but i think it's pretty facile to have people repeatedly say "we should pick the guy with the most upside!"

What? Please elaborate. Every player selected within the Top 10 has a bust factor. I know you're not high on Mikal Bridges because he doesn't look like a sexy pick compared Trey Young who put mega stats in college. There IS a good chance that Young can be a bust. You're acting like Trey Young will not bust at all compared to Mikal Bridges. Even Mikal can suck in the NBA.

I like Mikal Bridges because:
- super motor for defense = cannot be taught in the NBA.
- Defensive IQ
- He's 6-7 and 7-2 wing span meaning that he can guard positions 1-4. Not a liability.
- He's proven to make big defensive plays in the clutch. He's disruptive.
- Physical guy
- No current health problems

That doesn't say "bust" to me because Mikal's defensive abilities are consistent in every game.

However for Trey, the odds of reaching Steph Curry heights are super low. Trey Young does NOT play defense. He's already a huge liability. Even Steph Curry plays some defense. Here's a Trey Young quote: “I know I can play defense when I want to."


https://newsok.com/article/5579397/ou-basketball-trae-young-picks-his-spots-on-the-defensive-end

Holy crap. Trey Young should really be a 2nd round pick with that. Let the Knicks take him.

[Electric Slim]

From draft board:

Max Kellerman on First Take just said Suns should contemplate Wendell Carter (& JJJ) at the #1 spot. I mean i like Carter but that sounds kinda nuts.

lol

[dice]

I think it comes down to Carter vs Mikal. I'm hoping for Mikal or a Bamba drop.

that's the name of his band

[The Box Office]

From draft board:

Max Kellerman on First Take just said Suns should contemplate Wendell Carter (& JJJ) at the #1 spot. I mean i like Carter but that sounds kinda nuts.

lol

I'm not laughing. There's a good number of number one picks who are busts.
- Michael Olowokandi
- Anthony Bennett
- Joe Smith
- Kwame Brown
- Greg Oden
- LaRue Martin
- Art Heyman
- Kent Benson

Wendell Carter is definitely on my list for us at number 7 if he's available. Trey Young shouldn't be in the discussion. It's really Mikal Bridges vs. Wendell Carter.

[Ralphb07]

It's really hard to scout a draft and worry about which player is the best individual talent. Sure sometimes it's really easy to see it at the time (Shaq, LeBron, Duncan, etc) but in most cases, it really is hard to figure out the talent once you get outside that group. The way the game is going, five man lineups and flexibility to play multiple styles is a huge factor to playing winning basketball.

Once you get outside the true All-NBA level players, how guys improve the life of the other four guys on the floor matters far more than their individual talents or abilities. It matters that you cover as many basic things on a basketball team at once (so you need as a team to score, defend, push in transition, run varied sets, defend various styles, generate turnovers, etc) so finding guys who can do multiple things at a high level is far more likely to help you than finding a guy who can do a single thing great.

If I were to compare Bridges and say Porter, here is how I'd rank them solely offensive ability

On-Ball Creation: Advantage Porter
Off-ball movement: Bridges
Transition: Slight edge Porter
Spacing: Even
IQ: Bridges

If you think Porter is capable of being the lead guy on an offense then I won't really argue him over Bridges. I just believe that idea is really stretching the idea of what Porter's game is and how good he is, even pre-injury and just watching him play the few times he's been in games. He's an ok/good scorer but if you're thinking this is the future of the franchise, thats a bridge too far considering his size + athletic ability + passing/dribbling + overall feel for the game.

If you're saying that the team is likely still going to find a different guy to spearhead the offense and you're likely using Lauri as your pick man, now the question is not "who creates better" but who fits as a third option better. To me, this is where Bridges and players like him are vastly superior to players who may have better on-ball creation qualities. Third options, by their definition, aren't guys who eat up a ton of usage so their value to you and what they do is different than what your first option does. You can live with James Harden's defensive tendencies because of what he does offensively; you certainly wouldn't live with that kind of defense from Trevor Ariza or PJ Tucker. I value guys who do a lot of things well and maybe struggle to not be stars because those players are never not valuable to a team. To me, I think Bridges' dribbling ability is questioned too much and I think he's more than capable of attacking secondary wing defenders in this league.

I think Mikal Bridges will be a better pro, if not isolation scorer, than Michael Porter Jr. I have him four on my board (I have Doncic, Ayton, JJJ ahead of him; Bamba and Young directly after) so that's my order of the top six of this draft. Obviously if they go top six and the Bulls are seven you probably roll the dice on Bagley.

The obvious goal is to win, the question is how does the player(s) you draft do that.

I would take MPJ if there but I’m with you with how high you rate Mikal. He’s my 5th ranked guy in this draft.

[Ralphb07]

Wendell Carter is being grossly underrated and undervalued on this board. I would take MPJ over him if there and give a slight edge to Mikal but I keep on going back and forth on that. Come June 22nd he could be ahead of both guys too. I really don’t get the hate with him

[johnnyvann840]

Wendell Carter is being grossly underrated and undervalued on this board. I would take MPJ over him if there and give a slight edge to Mikal but I keep on going back and forth on that. Come June 22nd he could be ahead of both guys too. I really don’t get the hate with him

I agree he's being very underrated. I wouldn't take MPJ over him though.

[League Circles]

I think Carter will be gone by 7 and if he is assuming Porter is the guy whose place he has taken according to the OP I pretty much want to trade the pic or just give it back to the NBA.

[thewraith]

people are treating this like it's a straight-up choice between "high upside" and "high floor", which is pretty obviously silly on the face of it. it makes sense as shorthand for fans who are casually following the draft process, but the professional talent evaluators who are actually making the pick should be considering the likelihood of a spectrum of outcomes for each player.

like, it's not just

trey young = possibly great but possibly bad
mikal bridges = probably pretty good but definitely not great and definitely not bad

there's a decent chance trey young doesn't bust but doesn't hit his ceiling. there's a chance mikal bridges busts! a lot of things can happen! this feels like an overly simplistic thing to point out, but i think it's pretty facile to have people repeatedly say "we should pick the guy with the most upside!"

What? Please elaborate. Every player selected within the Top 10 has a bust factor. I know you're not high on Mikal Bridges because he doesn't look like a sexy pick compared Trey Young who put mega stats in college. There IS a good chance that Young can be a bust. You're acting like Trey Young will not bust at all compared to Mikal Bridges. Even Mikal can suck in the NBA.

I like Mikal Bridges because:
- super motor for defense = cannot be taught in the NBA.
- Defensive IQ
- He's 6-7 and 7-2 wing span meaning that he can guard positions 1-4. Not a liability.
- He's proven to make big defensive plays in the clutch. He's disruptive.
- Physical guy
- No current health problems

That doesn't say "bust" to me because Mikal's defensive abilities are consistent in every game.

However for Trey, the odds of reaching Steph Curry heights are super low. Trey Young does NOT play defense. He's already a huge liability. Even Steph Curry plays some defense. Here's a Trey Young quote: “I know I can play defense when I want to."


https://newsok.com/article/5579397/ou-basketball-trae-young-picks-his-spots-on-the-defensive-end

Holy crap. Trey Young should really be a 2nd round pick with that. Let the Knicks take him.

Beat it with this bootleg logic of yours. Its no reason Young shouldn't be considered with all the other prospects in this range. Not like we have some HOF pg or something. I wish the you and all the other people talking crazy about Young would look at the Steph pre draft comparisons instead of 2018 Steph to see how much they were similar in things people said about them negatively coming out of college.

[The Box Office]

people are treating this like it's a straight-up choice between "high upside" and "high floor", which is pretty obviously silly on the face of it. it makes sense as shorthand for fans who are casually following the draft process, but the professional talent evaluators who are actually making the pick should be considering the likelihood of a spectrum of outcomes for each player.

like, it's not just

trey young = possibly great but possibly bad
mikal bridges = probably pretty good but definitely not great and definitely not bad

there's a decent chance trey young doesn't bust but doesn't hit his ceiling. there's a chance mikal bridges busts! a lot of things can happen! this feels like an overly simplistic thing to point out, but i think it's pretty facile to have people repeatedly say "we should pick the guy with the most upside!"

What? Please elaborate. Every player selected within the Top 10 has a bust factor. I know you're not high on Mikal Bridges because he doesn't look like a sexy pick compared Trey Young who put mega stats in college. There IS a good chance that Young can be a bust. You're acting like Trey Young will not bust at all compared to Mikal Bridges. Even Mikal can suck in the NBA.

I like Mikal Bridges because:
- super motor for defense = cannot be taught in the NBA.
- Defensive IQ
- He's 6-7 and 7-2 wing span meaning that he can guard positions 1-4. Not a liability.
- He's proven to make big defensive plays in the clutch. He's disruptive.
- Physical guy
- No current health problems

That doesn't say "bust" to me because Mikal's defensive abilities are consistent in every game.

However for Trey, the odds of reaching Steph Curry heights are super low. Trey Young does NOT play defense. He's already a huge liability. Even Steph Curry plays some defense. Here's a Trey Young quote: “I know I can play defense when I want to."


https://newsok.com/article/5579397/ou-basketball-trae-young-picks-his-spots-on-the-defensive-end

Holy crap. Trey Young should really be a 2nd round pick with that. Let the Knicks take him.

Beat it with this bootleg logic of yours. Its no reason Young shouldn't be considered with all the other prospects in this range. Not like we have some HOF pg or something. I wish the you and all the other people talking crazy about Young would look at the Steph pre draft comparisons instead of 2018 Steph to see how much they were similar in things people said about them negatively coming out of college.

LOL. Trey Young said it himself. Can you read? Here's a Trey Young quote: “I know I can play defense when I want to."


He's a 2nd round guy.

[dumbell78]

Mikal






Young
Carter

Young scares the hell out of me but I get how some here would totally gamble and go for the pie in the sky scenario he is elite. Carter Im not even going to talk about, he needs to go sit next to Jahlil Okafor. He will have the same impact.

[Truebiscuit]

Was listening to Waddle and Silvy and their guest made a solid point... if MPJ is available at #7 you really should be concerned about his medicals. He said there really is no way MPJ should be there unless teams flagged him medically.

[kyrv]

I think Carter will be gone by 7 and if he is assuming Porter is the guy whose place he has taken according to the OP I pretty much want to trade the pic or just give it back to the NBA.

I think Carter will rise and Bagely will drop. Porter is a real wildcard. Not a huge fan though.

[kyrv]

What? Please elaborate. Every player selected within the Top 10 has a bust factor. I know you're not high on Mikal Bridges because he doesn't look like a sexy pick compared Trey Young who put mega stats in college. There IS a good chance that Young can be a bust. You're acting like Trey Young will not bust at all compared to Mikal Bridges. Even Mikal can suck in the NBA.

I like Mikal Bridges because:
- super motor for defense = cannot be taught in the NBA.
- Defensive IQ
- He's 6-7 and 7-2 wing span meaning that he can guard positions 1-4. Not a liability.
- He's proven to make big defensive plays in the clutch. He's disruptive.
- Physical guy
- No current health problems

That doesn't say "bust" to me because Mikal's defensive abilities are consistent in every game.

However for Trey, the odds of reaching Steph Curry heights are super low. Trey Young does NOT play defense. He's already a huge liability. Even Steph Curry plays some defense. Here's a Trey Young quote: “I know I can play defense when I want to."


https://newsok.com/article/5579397/ou-basketball-trae-young-picks-his-spots-on-the-defensive-end

Holy crap. Trey Young should really be a 2nd round pick with that. Let the Knicks take him.

Beat it with this bootleg logic of yours. Its no reason Young shouldn't be considered with all the other prospects in this range. Not like we have some HOF pg or something. I wish the you and all the other people talking crazy about Young would look at the Steph pre draft comparisons instead of 2018 Steph to see how much they were similar in things people said about them negatively coming out of college.

LOL. Trey Young said it himself. Can you read? Here's a Trey Young quote: “I know I can play defense when I want to."


He's a 2nd round guy.

Wow. That's straight out of the Carmelo Anthony "How to not get it" handbook.

Young seems a great candidate to drop before and/or on draft day.

[kyrv]

Was listening to Waddle and Silvy and their guest made a solid point... if MPJ is available at #7 you really should be concerned about his medicals. He said there really is no way MPJ should be there unless teams flagged him medically.

Not sure what you mean by 'you', I doubt six teams will have secret medical info that others don't have?

I also disagree that every scout and team will have Porter in the top six, and also some teams may factor in position.

[The Box Office]

Was listening to Waddle and Silvy and their guest made a solid point... if MPJ is available at #7 you really should be concerned about his medicals. He said there really is no way MPJ should be there unless teams flagged him medically.

Yup. That's why MPJ is not on my list. He had back surgery. Not many people recover from that especially competing in high level sports. It will linger for the rest of his career.

[SHO'NUFF]

Trae Young Summer League MVP.

[rtblues]

MPJ if he's still there, and pending medical data, workouts, and interviews of course
From the 3 listed I'd go Carter.
Upside,m skill set, defends.
Fouls a lot is one concern though
But he could be the guy with the most upside.
Young seems like he has the highest bust potential of the three in the poll

[IcemanGervin]

I hope we pass on Young and he is the next Curry/Nash. I'll be rooting hard for him.

[johnnyvann840]

we were at 101 pages quick so here you go....

continue here.