Bucks Fan: Question about Thabo/Thomas availability

[EastSideBucksFan]

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yea, i just wanted to change the tone of what was going on. now lets add simmons for bigben

I would do that in a heartbeat as well

Even with Ben Wallace struggling

We could try him at PF or bring him off the bench

Either way, he'd add more to our team than Bobby Simmons can at this time.

[Sonny_D1]

No offense, but you know absolutely nothing about Andrew Bogut.

No offense, but you know absolutely nothing about Joakim Noah.

I have been watching a fair number of Bulls game and have a good feel for Noah's game. Not trying to diss him but his offensive skills are disgusting.

So it's fair for you to come to such conclusion after 1/2 season in the pros, yet after 2 1/2 NBA seasons for Bogut I know absolutely nothing about him?

Explain to me the logic in that?

BTW, come back in 3 years, make that 5 years, when Noah is averaging the minutes Bogut is. Oh, and here are their per 36 numbers:

Bogut: 14.1ppg/9.6reb/2.4ast/.8stl/1.8blk/2.2to

Noah: 12.5ppg/10.0reb/2.4ast/2.1stl/1.7blk/1.9to

Like I said, come back in 3-5 years.....

[Leslie Forman]

I don't think the Bucks should trade any one of Bogut/Villanueva/Yi. That's a good big man trio to keep around. Bogut and Yi should both be above average starters eventually (Bogut already is), and Villanueva makes a great sixth man. What they need to do is dump Redd and Simmons, and I'm not really a big fan of Mo Williams, either.

[REDDzone]

Wow this thread has shocked me in regards to Tyrus Thomas value for the Bulls.

Why doesn't he get any minutes if he has all this potential?

I thought he would after Skiles got fired.

[Bull Shak]

A straight up Thomas for Bogut trade would be great. I'd personally be willing to give up Thabo in that trade as well, not sure about Pax though.

[DuckIII]

I don't think the Bucks should trade any one of Bogut/Villanueva/Yi. That's a good big man trio to keep around. Bogut and Yi should both be above average starters eventually (Bogut already is), and Villanueva makes a great sixth man. What they need to do is dump Redd and Simmons, and I'm not really a big fan of Mo Williams, either.

+1. I'd love it if they didn't agree with you though.

[Rerisen]

Poor Bucks fans. See this is what happens when you make this board bad offers. We make up our own deals.

Now just wait till Sam Smith reads this thread, by tomorrow it will be national news that Bogut is on the block. Then your organization will have to go into damage control.

[REDDzone]

Bogut averaging 20/10 in January, I just don't see the Bucks trading him for a player who can't even get off the bench for a team just as bad as them.

[REDDzone]

Now just wait till Sam Smith reads this thread, by tomorrow it will be national news that Bogut is on the block. Then your organization will have to go into damage control.

That would really suck.

[DuckIII]

Wow this thread has shocked me in regards to Tyrus Thomas value for the Bulls.

Why doesn't he get any minutes if he has all this potential?

Because we don't really have a good explanation for you.

[REDDzone]

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(picture)

Because we don't really have a good explanation for you.

I'm not sure if that's a knock on your coach for not playing your potential laden young'n, or if its a knock on your posters for loving a guy so much who can't get PT?

[EastSideBucksFan]

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So it's fair for you to come to such conclusion after 1/2 season in the pros, yet after 2 1/2 NBA seasons for Bogut I know absolutely nothing about him?

Explain to me the logic in that?

BTW, come back in 3 years, make that 5 years, when Noah is averaging the minutes Bogut is. Oh, and here are their per 36 numbers:

Bogut: 14.1ppg/9.6reb/2.4ast/.8stl/1.8blk/2.2to

Noah: 12.5ppg/10.0reb/2.4ast/2.1stl/1.7blk/1.9to

Like I said, come back in 3-5 years.....

I have problems with your "logic" b/c Noah and Bogut are not comparable.

Noah's game hasn't changed since he's been in college. He's not going to all of a sudden discover he has a jumpshot...or post moves. He never showed any in college, it's unlikely he'll show any in the NBA.

On the other hand Bogut showed us a slew of offensive moves in college, some of which are reappearing now that he's getting the offensive opportunities.

Just b/c you extrapolate their "Per Minute" numbers, which in my opinion, is a worthless stat b/c it doesn't always hold true that more minutes = more production.

Bogut and Noah are centers. Thats all they have in common.

Please explain to me how Noah is comparable to Bogut. I'd really like to hear it.


Oh, and why is it going to take Noah 3-5 years to get the minutes that Bogut is getting right now?

[RyGuy24]

Because Andres Nocioni, Joe Smith, Joakim Noah, Ben Wallace, and Aaron Gray all need minutes too (according the Bulls at least).

[Sonny_D1]

Oh, and why is it going to take Noah 3-5 years to get the minutes that Bogut is getting right now?

It's an inside joke that only a Bulls fan would understand.

Now back to the rest of your post.

I believe you've gotten completely off track with where this discussion began. The debate isn't/wasn't who the better player is, Bogut or Noah. The debate was whether or not it's worth trading TT and Sefolosha for Bogut.

The unknown here is TT. If he turns out to be what I think he can be, the value of Noah and TT will be exponentially better than the value of Noah and Bogut.

Don't misunderstand me when I say Noah will be like Bogut. I'm not referring to their "style" of play, I'm referring more or less to their overall production on the court. Again, while Bogut does have some offensive game, I don't think he'll ever be the kind of low post player that's going to carry a team. In other words, he'll never be an offensive powerhouse or a superstar type player. Besides, I believe Noah will be an OVERALL better player than Bogut. But again, this isn't a discussion of Noah versus Bogut.

So the extra added benefit in offensive game he may have over Noah right now, certainly isn't enough, imho, to give up TT for.

Sorry, but it just isn't.

Edit: And that's not to say that I would trade Bogut for TT if I were the Bucks, because I wouldn't. TT is an unknown. It doesn't make sense for the Bucks, and imo, it doesn't make sense for the Bulls either.

[EastSideBucksFan]

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It's an inside joke that only a Bulls fan would understand.

Now back to the rest of your post.

I believe you've gotten completely off track with where this discussion began. The debate isn't/wasn't who the better player is, Bogut or Noah. The debate was whether or not it's worth trading TT and Sefolosha for Bogut.

The unknown here is TT. If he turns out to be what I think he can be, the value of Noah and TT will be exponentially better than the value of Noah and Bogut.

Don't misunderstand me when I say Noah will be like Bogut. I'm not referring to their "style" of play, I'm referring more or less to their overall production on the court. Again, while Bogut does have some offensive game, I don't think he'll ever be the kind of low post player that's going to carry a team. In other words, he'll never be an offensive powerhouse or a superstar type player. Besides, I believe Noah will be an OVERALL better player than Bogut. But again, this isn't a discussion of Noah versus Bogut.

So the extra added benefit in offensive game he may have over Noah right now, certainly isn't enough, imho, to give up TT for.

Sorry, but it just isn't.

Fair enough


Bucks fans just hate Noah so you know.

Cuz he dissed us hardcore before the draft.

But IMHO, I don't think he'll ever do more than Dan Gadzuric


thx fellas, adios

[Sonny_D1]

Bucks fans just hate Noah so you know.

Cuz he dissed us hardcore before the draft.

You shoudn't hold a grudge, because as I recall, so did Yi (at least his camp did)

[Magilla_Gorilla]

Bogut averaging 20/10 in January, I just don't see the Bucks trading him for a player who can't even get off the bench for a team just as bad as them.

When did 18 & 10 become 20 & 10? He's having a great start to the month, no need to artificially inflate his stats.

[Dieselbound&Down]

I would absolutely trade Bogut for Noah. And I like what Noah has shown. I think Bogut would be a good fit in Chicago, def better than Milwaukee at least until the last month.

Eastside is right that Bogut will always have a better back to the basket and overall offensive game than Noah. He is also as good or better as a passer. I would love to see him in a Bulls jersey someday soon. I hope he becomes even more disgruntled and the Bucks continue to lose - nothing personal Bucks fans - because I think that would help a trade to the Bulls happen.

[Neusch23]

Tyrus isn't going to play much for Chicago until he gets a defined role, and understands said role.

He is a lost player right now, where anything of value that he brings to the team is lost by his inability to grasp and understand how we are trying to play the game.

It is sad.

[VinTheBarber]

Tyrus isn't going to play much for Chicago until he gets a defined role, and understands said role.

He is a lost player right now, where anything of value that he brings to the team is lost by his inability to grasp and understand how we are trying to play the game.

It is sad.

sometimes i,wonder if the bulls coaches know how we are trying to run the game..so how can tyrus?