Bears 10.0: GM and coach watch before the draft

[patryk7754]

Something I would like to see us do is explore trading Edmunds. I never wanted to trade Roquan and hated replacing him with Edmounds. He has been a disappointment and I'd like us to do what I said should've been done after trading Smith. Role with Edwards and Sanburn and see if sanburn has the ability to be a full time starter. The trade would have to make sense though. So we get a pick and save 10+ on the cap. Teams I could see entertaining the idea of trading for Edmunds.....

Patriots
Raiders
Chargers
Bengals

Each of those teams have 50m plus in cap so they can afford Edmounds. I think the Patriots make the most sense. they have 125m in cap space and I'm sure Vrebel values LB play more than most. If we can land a 3rd for Edmonds, great, but I would probably take anything if it meant clearing a significant portion of his contract

[patryk7754]

interesting stat comparison I saw scrolling..

Caleb and Jordan Love's stats vs the NFL north

Caleb
1-5 record
1531 yards
8 TDs
0 TOs

Love:
1-5
1367
8TDs
6TOs


Obviously missing a lot of context but there are a lot of things to look at and be hopeful when it comes to Williams. Also wouldn't be shocked if 90% of those stats came in the 4th for Williams. Coaching will solve the majority of issues we had with him

[fleet]

To me, with the Bears very obviously being interested in Ben Johnson, I cannot understand the criticism of doing a bunch of interviews. There's nothing they can do re: Johnson right now, and it's unclear when they'll be able to try to hire him, given we don't know when the Lions will lose. Why the heck wouldn't you spend your time gathering as much intel as possible and having backup candidates sorted out?

I totally get the instinct to just presume everything the Bears do is stupid, because they have a track record that supports that. But it's better to not just reflexively think that and actually try to evaluate what they are doing.

It’s hard to evaluate exactly what they are doing without more information. At this point it looks quite a bit unfocused and directionless to the point where it’s actually becoming intentional based on what they expect to lose out on. But don’t have all the information, which we most likely will get soon in the second round. My main concern is they are planning for not landing the top tier candidates. There’s no reason they can’t actually beat out the competition for Ben Johnson unless they choose to have other priorities. I do expect that if they hired someone like Mike McCarthy, they have some idea that some of these guys are on his list for OC hires, and they are getting a jump on that. Which is fine in that aspect.

Count me in the camp of thinking this is Warren being more "adminstrative guy" than "football guy". IMO, the less you know, the more indecisive you will likely be. Now if the Bears wanted to up the count in order to give more minorities a chance to interview, I have no problem with that; however, it doesn't seem to be the case there. There is also the narrative that they are interviewing so many guys because they are having trouble finding a guy who Poles, McCaskey and Warren all like, which should yield the lowest-common-denominator coach (aka another 2 year coach).

I personally don't want Johnson. He might be fine, but I've seen enough from guys who haven't head coached before.

That’s the most disturbing narrative there is. And there’s been reporting in that respect regarding a mixed consensus on Ben Johnson. Whether or not we like BJ or not, this is bad. It means you have a weak GM, and as a result a dysfunctional process in football decisions. Even if he is eventually offered a job, that’s a reason to look for a stronger GM and front office option to align with

[panthermark]

The interview process feels bungled. I would love to give them the benefit of the doubt, but they have not earned it.

This FEELS like over-compensation for being called out on NOT interviewing Kevin O'Connell.
But if that is the case, they are still missing the point. The issue isn't the total number of candidates and they just didn't interview enough in 2022. The issue is WHY such a good candidate was not included in the interview process. What was the flaw in the selection criteria, and has THAT been addressed? Is it ownerships condition of nice guys that don't curse?

It FEELS like the Bears don't know what they are looking for, but don't want to be perceived as not doing due diligence.
Wide net = good
blind fishing expedition = bad

but as we don't really know one way or the other what's going on, why pass judgement on it?

We do know that they didn't interview Kevin O'Connell, and had basically pre-selected Flus.
We do know that they have sucked at hiring coaches for a long time.
We do know that they like to do things their own way, without much success.


I specifically typed "FEELS"...twice.
That isn't passing judgement, that is stating my opinion on how it feels.

They could be nailing the process behind closed doors, but their history says otherwise.

[Dresden]

It’s hard to evaluate exactly what they are doing without more information. At this point it looks quite a bit unfocused and directionless to the point where it’s actually becoming intentional based on what they expect to lose out on. But don’t have all the information, which we most likely will get soon in the second round. My main concern is they are planning for not landing the top tier candidates. There’s no reason they can’t actually beat out the competition for Ben Johnson unless they choose to have other priorities. I do expect that if they hired someone like Mike McCarthy, they have some idea that some of these guys are on his list for OC hires, and they are getting a jump on that. Which is fine in that aspect.

Count me in the camp of thinking this is Warren being more "adminstrative guy" than "football guy". IMO, the less you know, the more indecisive you will likely be. Now if the Bears wanted to up the count in order to give more minorities a chance to interview, I have no problem with that; however, it doesn't seem to be the case there. There is also the narrative that they are interviewing so many guys because they are having trouble finding a guy who Poles, McCaskey and Warren all like, which should yield the lowest-common-denominator coach (aka another 2 year coach).

I personally don't want Johnson. He might be fine, but I've seen enough from guys who haven't head coached before.

That’s the most disturbing narrative there is. And there’s been reporting in that respect regarding a mixed consensus on Ben Johnson. Whether or not we like BJ or not, this is bad. It means you have a weak GM, and as a result a dysfunctional process in football decisions. Even if he is eventually offered a job, that’s a reason to look for a stronger GM and front office option to align with

"Narrative" is just a euphemism for "rumor" in this case.

[panthermark]

I think a good part of that perception is due in large part to the number of candidates that they are interviewing/requesting interviews with.

For me personally, I’m not a huge fan of this approach because it’s almost a certainty that at least half of the people that you are interviewing aren’t serious candidates. So why waste that time. With that said, I’ve been acquainted with people that like interviewing broader groups even when they know who they really want. Not so much to find a better candidate. But to confirm (or fortify) their belief in the candidate that they know they really want.

Also, with regards to the number of candidates, it looks to be as follows:

Bears - 15
Jets - 17
Jags - 10
Saints -10
Raiders - 7
Patriots -6 (they’re obviously done now)
Cowboys - TBD

Yes, the Bears number is relatively high. But they aren’t the only team in the double digit zone.

The Bears are higher than 15 when you include requested interviews.
https://bearswire.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/bears/2025/01/14/bears-head-coach-tracker-who-interviewed-scheduled/77691874007/
I think they are at 19 if Thomas is included.

I was actually working off of the information that I found here.

https://sports.yahoo.com/nfl-coaching-requests-hires-full-list-of-teams-and-names-being-pursued-173222847.html

The article says 15, but it is actually 16 if you count the names on the list.

Just off the top of my head Kliff Kingsbury and Marcus Freeman are missing off that list, but maybe those are not considered serious candidates?

[Dresden]

The interview process feels bungled. I would love to give them the benefit of the doubt, but they have not earned it.

This FEELS like over-compensation for being called out on NOT interviewing Kevin O'Connell.
But if that is the case, they are still missing the point. The issue isn't the total number of candidates and they just didn't interview enough in 2022. The issue is WHY such a good candidate was not included in the interview process. What was the flaw in the selection criteria, and has THAT been addressed? Is it ownerships condition of nice guys that don't curse?

It FEELS like the Bears don't know what they are looking for, but don't want to be perceived as not doing due diligence.
Wide net = good
blind fishing expedition = bad

but as we don't really know one way or the other what's going on, why pass judgement on it?

We do know that they didn't interview Kevin O'Connell, and had basically pre-selected Flus.
We do know that they have sucked at hiring coaches for a long time.
We do know that they like to do things their own way, without much success.


I specifically typed "FEELS"...twice.
That isn't passing judgement, that is stating my opinion on how it feels.

They could be nailing the process behind closed doors, but their history says otherwise.

Is Kevin O'Connel that great? They just got creamed by the Rams. And Brian Flores defense just gave us 400 yards+ for the second game in a row. Viking fans are complaining about how poorly their O line played (they gave up 9 sacks v. LAR), and how bad the play calling was, and how their QB held onto the ball too long. Very familiar complaints.

[Dresden]

Something I would like to see us do is explore trading Edmunds. I never wanted to trade Roquan and hated replacing him with Edmounds. He has been a disappointment and I'd like us to do what I said should've been done after trading Smith. Role with Edwards and Sanburn and see if sanburn has the ability to be a full time starter. The trade would have to make sense though. So we get a pick and save 10+ on the cap. Teams I could see entertaining the idea of trading for Edmunds.....

Patriots
Raiders
Chargers
Bengals

Each of those teams have 50m plus in cap so they can afford Edmounds. I think the Patriots make the most sense. they have 125m in cap space and I'm sure Vrebel values LB play more than most. If we can land a 3rd for Edmonds, great, but I would probably take anything if it meant clearing a significant portion of his contract

That would be a good move it you could do it. I never understood why they spent that much on a LB, when they need linemen so badly.

[biggestbullsfan]

Read on Twitter

[panthermark]

How the hell does Thomas Brown not get an in person interview?

Well, I guess Vrabel didn't get one and he was available starting December 31st. Carrol didn't get one and we was available any time.

But Rivera and McCarthy will get them?

https://beargoggleson.com/bears-recent-head-coach-interview-failure-thomas-brown-slap-in-the-face-01jhk1zq6hr5

I was reading this article and had almost the same thoughts word for word as what was written.

This is just one more hilarious example of incompetence. It is yet one more piece of evidence that the Bears do not know how to run things properly and why the organization has been behind the 8-ball for years now.

There's a reason other organizations, fans and media laugh at the Bears. In fact, there are several reasons. This is just one more added to the list.

They can't even go through a standard interview process in correct fashion.

[panthermark]

but as we don't really know one way or the other what's going on, why pass judgement on it?

We do know that they didn't interview Kevin O'Connell, and had basically pre-selected Flus.
We do know that they have sucked at hiring coaches for a long time.
We do know that they like to do things their own way, without much success.


I specifically typed "FEELS"...twice.
That isn't passing judgement, that is stating my opinion on how it feels.

They could be nailing the process behind closed doors, but their history says otherwise.

Is Kevin O'Connel that great? They just got creamed by the Rams. And Brian Flores defense just gave us 400 yards+ for the second game in a row. Viking fans are complaining about how poorly their O line played (they gave up 9 sacks v. LAR), and how bad the play calling was, and how their QB held onto the ball too long. Very familiar complaints.

LOL...dude, that sounds like cope.
Look at the Vikes record since he has been there. Sam "the bust" Donald is going to the Pro-Bowl.

But fine, let us say he isn't that great.
Tell be about the guy we hired instead.

[nomorezorro]

doing all of the first-round interviews remotely is a good thing; put everyone on the same playing field. i assumed the rivera interview was in person just because it was an Obvious Favor Interview so whatever. the mccarthy interview being in person is concerning because he is presumably a legitimate candidate, but we'll see how things play out.

the vast majority of pre-emptive fretting about the process is pointless when so much of what's going on is opaque. i think interviewing this many people is silly, but if they maintain a clarity of focus on their top targets throughout it, then who cares. no point in getting worked up until you have actual results to react to

[patryk7754]

Something more fanatical I'm "selling" myself on is signing Tee Higgins. Obviously, we should first fix our OL but doing that wouldn't prevent us from signing Higgins. Nor would signing Higgins prevent us from addressing other things on top of the OL. Would we need to sacrifice one or two things? Probably. But sometimes sacrificing a "need" is worth it for the right "Luxury". I think the Bengals drafting Chase of Sewell is a good example of this.

Higgins absolutely dominated in limited play this season and if it weren't for chase, he could have very well been All Pro. I also think he's going to sign a very team friendly deal. It sounds like he'll be getting about 25m a year. I think Aiyuk signed for 30 and Aiyuk is not close to being as good as Higgins.

With 83m in cap (93 if we cut everrett and walker) we can more than afford a 4/100-120m deal for him.

2/3 FA offensive linemen
Moore/Higgins/Odunze/Kmet
Swift

Assuming Williams develops enough to be at least an average QB next season (and we should assume that), that would be a near unstoppable offense. Espescially if we hit on the right coach. I think it would be worth sacrificing a middle of the pack DE or DT in free agency.

[Betta Bulleavit]

The Bears are higher than 15 when you include requested interviews.
https://bearswire.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/bears/2025/01/14/bears-head-coach-tracker-who-interviewed-scheduled/77691874007/
I think they are at 19 if Thomas is included.

I was actually working off of the information that I found here.

https://sports.yahoo.com/nfl-coaching-requests-hires-full-list-of-teams-and-names-being-pursued-173222847.html

The article says 15, but it is actually 16 if you count the names on the list.

Just off the top of my head Kliff Kingsbury and Marcus Freeman are missing off that list, but maybe those are not considered serious candidates?

Perhaps. Either way, whether it’s 15, 17 or 20, it’s A LOT of candidates and it probably wouldn’t be my approach.

To that point, if you’re hiring for one of the highest profile jobs on the market (for the best or worst of reasons) and most of the guys that you like can’t commit to offers for an indefinite period of time, you may just opt to conduct interviews just to acquire intel and not have it look like your just sitting on your butt. You remember how some folks were reacting to Poles not having any interviews scheduled once the GB game ended, don’t you?

[patryk7754]

Something I would like to see us do is explore trading Edmunds. I never wanted to trade Roquan and hated replacing him with Edmounds. He has been a disappointment and I'd like us to do what I said should've been done after trading Smith. Role with Edwards and Sanburn and see if sanburn has the ability to be a full time starter. The trade would have to make sense though. So we get a pick and save 10+ on the cap. Teams I could see entertaining the idea of trading for Edmunds.....

Patriots
Raiders
Chargers
Bengals

Each of those teams have 50m plus in cap so they can afford Edmounds. I think the Patriots make the most sense. they have 125m in cap space and I'm sure Vrebel values LB play more than most. If we can land a 3rd for Edmonds, great, but I would probably take anything if it meant clearing a significant portion of his contract

That would be a good move it you could do it. I never understood why they spent that much on a LB, when they need linemen so badly.

I never understood why Poles refused to sign a top 2 ILB and then pay an outsider nearly the same amount.

Kind of a side note but I think a major reason we are in the position we are in now is because of the full tank Poles embraced. We cultivated a losing culture. Avoiding that was one of my main reasonings for keeping Mack and Smith and why I didn't think fully resetting the cap was worth getting rid of them. I think we could have found a happy middle ground

[Jcool0]

I think a good part of that perception is due in large part to the number of candidates that they are interviewing/requesting interviews with.

For me personally, I’m not a huge fan of this approach because it’s almost a certainty that at least half of the people that you are interviewing aren’t serious candidates. So why waste that time. With that said, I’ve been acquainted with people that like interviewing broader groups even when they know who they really want. Not so much to find a better candidate. But to confirm (or fortify) their belief in the candidate that they know they really want.

Also, with regards to the number of candidates, it looks to be as follows:

Bears - 15
Jets - 17
Jags - 10
Saints -10
Raiders - 7
Patriots -6 (they’re obviously done now)
Cowboys - TBD

Yes, the Bears number is relatively high. But they aren’t the only team in the double digit zone.

The Bears are higher than 15 when you include requested interviews.
https://bearswire.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/bears/2025/01/14/bears-head-coach-tracker-who-interviewed-scheduled/77691874007/
I think they are at 19 if Thomas is included.

I was actually working off of the information that I found here.

https://sports.yahoo.com/nfl-coaching-requests-hires-full-list-of-teams-and-names-being-pursued-173222847.html

This one is continually updated

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1eqfOO0kTSKvczL9Z2F4tt3uY8jZSQ9ah9KTQdQYUMu0/edit?gid=0#gid=0

[patryk7754]

If we cut Everett and Wallker and enter free agency with 93m in cap, we could sign....

Higgins: 4/120m
Trey Smith: 5/100
Josh Meyers: 4/48
Kevin Zeitler: 1/5
10m for resigning players

finish with about 16m in cap. And those numbers would all be on the high end so we could easily still have 20+ in cap

In the draft

RD1: LT
RD2: Sawyer and JTT
Rest of the draft: OL depth and DT

Top 5 offense with above average defense is a pretty good formula to win

[Bulls69]

interesting stat comparison I saw scrolling..

Caleb and Jordan Love's stats vs the NFL north

Caleb
1-5 record
1531 yards
8 TDs
0 TOs

Love:
1-5
1367
8TDs
6TOs


Obviously missing a lot of context but there are a lot of things to look at and be hopeful when it comes to Williams. Also wouldn't be shocked if 90% of those stats came in the 4th for Williams. Coaching will solve the majority of issues we had with him

I told my co worker who is a big Packers fan that I would take Williams over Love any day of the week and twice on Sunday.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[jnrjr79]

It’s hard to evaluate exactly what they are doing without more information. At this point it looks quite a bit unfocused and directionless to the point where it’s actually becoming intentional based on what they expect to lose out on. But don’t have all the information, which we most likely will get soon in the second round. My main concern is they are planning for not landing the top tier candidates. There’s no reason they can’t actually beat out the competition for Ben Johnson unless they choose to have other priorities. I do expect that if they hired someone like Mike McCarthy, they have some idea that some of these guys are on his list for OC hires, and they are getting a jump on that. Which is fine in that aspect.

Count me in the camp of thinking this is Warren being more "adminstrative guy" than "football guy". IMO, the less you know, the more indecisive you will likely be. Now if the Bears wanted to up the count in order to give more minorities a chance to interview, I have no problem with that; however, it doesn't seem to be the case there. There is also the narrative that they are interviewing so many guys because they are having trouble finding a guy who Poles, McCaskey and Warren all like, which should yield the lowest-common-denominator coach (aka another 2 year coach).

I personally don't want Johnson. He might be fine, but I've seen enough from guys who haven't head coached before.

That’s the most disturbing narrative there is. And there’s been reporting in that respect regarding a mixed consensus on Ben Johnson. Whether or not we like BJ or not, this is bad. It means you have a weak GM, and as a result a dysfunctional process in football decisions. Even if he is eventually offered a job, that’s a reason to look for a stronger GM and front office option to align with

The GM is only as strong as his bosses permit him to be, so that sort of a plan would rely on Warren/McCaskey being willing to be more deferential to a bigger/more experienced name - which they might be, I don't know.

[jnrjr79]

The interview process feels bungled. I would love to give them the benefit of the doubt, but they have not earned it.

This FEELS like over-compensation for being called out on NOT interviewing Kevin O'Connell.
But if that is the case, they are still missing the point. The issue isn't the total number of candidates and they just didn't interview enough in 2022. The issue is WHY such a good candidate was not included in the interview process. What was the flaw in the selection criteria, and has THAT been addressed? Is it ownerships condition of nice guys that don't curse?

It FEELS like the Bears don't know what they are looking for, but don't want to be perceived as not doing due diligence.
Wide net = good
blind fishing expedition = bad

but as we don't really know one way or the other what's going on, why pass judgement on it?

We do know that they didn't interview Kevin O'Connell, and had basically pre-selected Flus.
We do know that they have sucked at hiring coaches for a long time.
We do know that they like to do things their own way, without much success.


I specifically typed "FEELS"...twice.
That isn't passing judgement, that is stating my opinion on how it feels.

They could be nailing the process behind closed doors, but their history says otherwise.

This is Poles's 2nd hire (with the first having been made off a pre-selected menu) and Warren's first. I don't really think "their history" has much to do with the current search, absent some indication McCaskey is directing things.

This is not to say I trust Warren and Poles to get it right - just that we're in mostly unknown territory here.