Chicago Sky/WNBA thread 2024

[Betta Bulleavit]

Should We Start a "Go Fund Me" Account for Angel?
https://www.breitbart.com/sports/2024/10/18/angel-reese-says-her-wnba-salary-dont-pay-my-bills/

It’s not like this is new information. WNBA players have been saying this for years and it’s the primary reason why so many of them have to play overseas for supplemental income. 74k a year (before taxes in an income tax state) isn’t very much at all. This isn’t just a Reese thing. It’s all wnba players. Some just talks about it more than others.

[Almost Retired]

Should We Start a "Go Fund Me" Account for Angel?
https://www.breitbart.com/sports/2024/10/18/angel-reese-says-her-wnba-salary-dont-pay-my-bills/

It’s not like this is new information. WNBA players have been saying this for years and it’s the primary reason why so many of them have to play overseas for supplemental income. 74k a year (before taxes in an income tax state) isn’t very much at all. This isn’t just a Reese thing. It’s all wnba players. Some just talks about it more than others.

My well of sympathy went dry when I read she pays $8,000 a month rent. I know Chicago is expensive but how big a place does she need?

[CROBulls]

People like Reese doesnt deserve any sympathy. She spends 8000 dollars per month for rent. Absolute lunacy. She knows what her salary is. If you cannot afford the place, get something more modest.

Inflation sucks, and prices are raising, but this is her problem. You need to get by with what you have. Dont live lifestyle you cannot afford to have. I would do it too, I think everybody would if they could, but they are not financially irresponsible and not mature enough to act like kid and complain how her salary cannot afford her luxury lifestyle she wants.

[DuckIII]

I’m sure her endorsements will provide her with a very comfortable buffer to pay her rent. She’s just making a statement about salaries.

But salaries should not be high in a league that has never made a profit. Perhaps it did this year and things will change. I hope so. But the WNBA has been a subsidized money pit since day one. The complaints about salaries are nonsense. This is not US Women’s Soccer.

[Ice Man]

I live in NYC. $8,000 a month gets a nice place, but admittedly not grand. But in Chicago? Damn. That's a palace.

On another note, the WNBA Finals was a dynamite affair, fittingly ended in overtime of the deciding game. The Liberty crowd was LOUD last night. I was not there in person, but it seemed to me louder than any Bulls game I have attended -- and I have been to 4 Bulls playoff games.

The league looks to be in very good shape.

[dougthonus]

Should We Start a "Go Fund Me" Account for Angel?
https://www.breitbart.com/sports/2024/10/18/angel-reese-says-her-wnba-salary-dont-pay-my-bills/

It’s not like this is new information. WNBA players have been saying this for years and it’s the primary reason why so many of them have to play overseas for supplemental income. 74k a year (before taxes in an income tax state) isn’t very much at all. This isn’t just a Reese thing. It’s all wnba players. Some just talks about it more than others.

My well of sympathy went dry when I read she pays $8,000 a month rent. I know Chicago is expensive but how big a place does she need?

She wasn't asking for sympathy. She said she makes a ton of money from endorsements and not from the WNBA which is a factual statement. The larger point is that for many WNBA players who don't get help from endorsements, the WNBA is kind of at the fringe "living wage" point.

[Betta Bulleavit]

Should We Start a "Go Fund Me" Account for Angel?
https://www.breitbart.com/sports/2024/10/18/angel-reese-says-her-wnba-salary-dont-pay-my-bills/

It’s not like this is new information. WNBA players have been saying this for years and it’s the primary reason why so many of them have to play overseas for supplemental income. 74k a year (before taxes in an income tax state) isn’t very much at all. This isn’t just a Reese thing. It’s all wnba players. Some just talks about it more than others.

My well of sympathy went dry when I read she pays $8,000 a month rent. I know Chicago is expensive but how big a place does she need?

I don’t know that anyone can be sympathetic for Reese specifically. 9/10, she is paying her bills due to other resources that she has off the court. I think the point was that her salary as a WNBA player wouldn’t be sufficient to pay her current bills, which would likely be true even if she wasn’t paying 8000 in rent. But for every Reese/Clark, there are dozens of other players that can barely afford their bills unless they play overseas.

[madvillian]

A really poorly played and officiated game with the commish showing up to the ceremony in a NYC skyline print outfit. I've been harsh on the league and will continue to be harsh. That was a really poor basketball game with poor officiating and even worse optics after the game, with the commish obviously rooting for NY, and the Lynx coach just going off, as she should.

[sco]

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/wnba-players-opt-out-of-current-cba-after-historic-season-were-out-193058683.html

Those women have Caitlin to thank 100% for every extra penny they get. It's like the MJ effect on the NBA.

[Ice Man]

A really poorly played and officiated game

The offenses were terrible, in large part because (to address the second half of that quote) the referees decided that basketball defenders are permitted to use shoulder charges. I watched a basketball game and a soccer match broke out.

But I do stand by my earlier comment that it was riveting entertainment, in a mosh pit sort of way. It had a bunch of lead changes, last-moment plays, overtime, all the things you want for a Game 7. OK Game 5, but the league will go to 7 for the Finals next year.

[madvillian]

A really poorly played and officiated game

The offenses were terrible, in large part because (to address the second half of that quote) the referees decided that basketball defenders are permitted to use shoulder charges. I watched a basketball game and a soccer match broke out.

But I do stand by my earlier comment that it was riveting entertainment, in a mosh pit sort of way. It had a bunch of lead changes, last-moment plays, overtime, all the things you want for a Game 7. OK Game 5, but the league will go to 7 for the Finals next year.

I swear I'm not trying to rag on the women too hard but I've never seen so many non basketball movements outside low level park games. Hip checks, shoulder bumps, following through on rakes, like a lot of that would be "do it again a fight is breaking out" type fouls in pickup games. As you said, blame the refs. League needs to completely re-evaluate its reffing and emphasize "freedom of movement" like NBA did.

You can have objectively bad play with compelling competition, but it's better to eventually have both.

[_txchilibowl_]

A really poorly played and officiated game

The offenses were terrible, in large part because (to address the second half of that quote) the referees decided that basketball defenders are permitted to use shoulder charges. I watched a basketball game and a soccer match broke out.

But I do stand by my earlier comment that it was riveting entertainment, in a mosh pit sort of way. It had a bunch of lead changes, last-moment plays, overtime, all the things you want for a Game 7. OK Game 5, but the league will go to 7 for the Finals next year.

I swear I'm not trying to rag on the women too hard but I've never seen so many non basketball movements outside low level park games. Hip checks, shoulder bumps, following through on rakes, like a lot of that would be "do it again a fight is breaking out" type fouls in pickup games. As you said, blame the refs. League needs to completely re-evaluate its reffing and emphasize "freedom of movement" like NBA did.

You can have objectively bad play with compelling competition, but it's better to eventually have both.

Don't worry. I'm sure women's basketball will be reduced to a three-point shooting contest just as men's basketball has in due time.

[Ice Man]

Don't worry. I'm sure women's basketball will be reduced to a three-point shooting contest just as men's basketball has in due time.

I like the physical aspect of the WNBA, in general, but the laxity of the refereeing* in Game 5 was a couple of steps too far.

* That is, until 5 seconds left in regulation, when suddenly a dribbler falling down on her own became a defensive foul. Shoulder charges all game were fine, but then the rule became that a defender couldn't breathe near an attacker.

[jc23]

my opinion of the physicality issue in the wnba has changed about 45%. Early in the season i saw some very sloppy basketball. At first i thought to myself this is what i feared the league still was. Having such a short training camp and turnaround is partly to blame. Also the fact that women are not strong enough to finish and score through physical play in a way that men are. As the season progressed so did team chemistry which resulted in a higher caliber of play. I was very impressed at times. You still got some women missing wide open layups; not the star players tho, there is a big gap between star and role player in the wnba.

In closing, the mens game needs more physicality which seems to be taking place and the womens game needs to allow for more freedom of movement. Nothing drastic, just start with some tweaks. I mean the mens game is not a finished product yet, so to those old heads acting like the womens game is above change is just silly to me.

[ScrantonBulls]

Should We Start a "Go Fund Me" Account for Angel?
https://www.breitbart.com/sports/2024/10/18/angel-reese-says-her-wnba-salary-dont-pay-my-bills/

It’s not like this is new information. WNBA players have been saying this for years and it’s the primary reason why so many of them have to play overseas for supplemental income. 74k a year (before taxes in an income tax state) isn’t very much at all. This isn’t just a Reese thing. It’s all wnba players. Some just talks about it more than others.

My well of sympathy went dry when I read she pays $8,000 a month rent. I know Chicago is expensive but how big a place does she need?

Lmao, she rents an apartment on the upper levels of the new NEMA high-rise. My good friend rented the exact same apartment (I know it was 8k and on the upper levels). It was an absurdly nice 3 bed, 2 bath. Totally unnecessary for her to rent that.

[Andi Obst]

It’s not like this is new information. WNBA players have been saying this for years and it’s the primary reason why so many of them have to play overseas for supplemental income. 74k a year (before taxes in an income tax state) isn’t very much at all. This isn’t just a Reese thing. It’s all wnba players. Some just talks about it more than others.

My well of sympathy went dry when I read she pays $8,000 a month rent. I know Chicago is expensive but how big a place does she need?

Lmao, she rents an apartment on the upper levels of the new NEMA high-rise. My good friend rented the exact same apartment (I know it was 8k and on the upper levels). It was an absurdly nice 3 bed, 2 bath. Totally unnecessary for her to rent that.

You guys realize that she can easily afford to live there, right?

The only thing she said that the WNBA money doesn't pay her bills. That's only a tiny part of her income, though.

Edit: I just realized I clicked on a Breitbart "article". Ew. But that explains a lot.

[WookieOnRitalin]

Number one insulator to poverty is marriage.

The living beyond my means and complaining about it is bound to fall on deaf ears to otherwise people you NEED to be fans of YOUR sport that has YET to turn a profit. The league is on track to lose $50 million this season.

https://www.cbsnews.com/minnesota/news/despite-recent-success-with-caitlin-clark-wnba-expected-to-lose-50-million

The league is just a loser and has been a loser. The new TV deal should help provide more money, but the league has an upward fight to profitability. The WNBA is a charity league. I do not even know what level of profitability the league can expect.

Women, in general, are not interested in the WNBA. Women could easily support the league, but they don't. They could spend the $87/ticket and go support the players, but they don't. They would rather spend their dollars elsewhere. I think this idea is relatively well known and then men get yelled at for not supporting the league and we are the problem.

The league has not resolved the majority of the problems that impact its profitability which is the game itself. The WNBA game does not carry the same level of entertainment value. The game needs to change. Imagine women playing baseball with the same rules and park sizes as the men.

Would people watch it or would it be difficult to watch? Yeah, but women are great at getting on base. Hey! There is a female pitcher who can throw 70 mph (GWR)! The league would be slow. Homeruns would be non existent. But we might have a several .400 hitters. Then the argument we get to hear is...

"The WMLB has more women who hit over .400 than in the men's league. We should be paid just as well as our male counterparts."

There is a fundamental reason women do not play baseball or a variation of it (softball) with the same rules and field size as men. The majority of sports vary rules to promote engagement and entertainment in their female variations.

This is still the problem with the WNBA. Until it decides to get out of the dark ages and improve the entertainment value of the game.

I have yet to find a compelling argument from anyone that contrasts that claim especially as it marches towards long term profitability and growth for the league.

[Almost Retired]

you already brought in an agenda-based source that grossly misconstrued the context of the quote due it to its own political agenda, either purposefully or accidentally, don't double down by pushing more political agenda out of context -doug

[nomorezorro]

The league is on track to lose $50 million this season.

https://www.cbsnews.com/minnesota/news/despite-recent-success-with-caitlin-clark-wnba-expected-to-lose-50-million

The league is just a loser and has been a loser. The new TV deal should help provide more money, but the league has an upward fight to profitability. The WNBA is a charity league. I do not even know what level of profitability the league can expect.

their new media deals are supposed to bring in an extra $200m annually over the previous deal, so it doesn't seem like a particularly upwards fight to cover $50 million in losses?

[dougthonus]

Number one insulator to poverty is marriage.

The living beyond my means and complaining about it is bound to fall on deaf ears to otherwise people you NEED to be fans of YOUR sport that has YET to turn a profit. The league is on track to lose $50 million this season.

https://www.cbsnews.com/minnesota/news/despite-recent-success-with-caitlin-clark-wnba-expected-to-lose-50-million

The league is just a loser and has been a loser. The new TV deal should help provide more money, but the league has an upward fight to profitability. The WNBA is a charity league. I do not even know what level of profitability the league can expect.

This was true in the past, but now the larger problem is the NBA is assigning an arbitrary value that would appear WAY below market value for the media rights for the WNBA which they negotiated in with the NBA rights. The WNBA rights are allocated a price over the next 10 years of 1/44th of the NBA rights which is considerably less than the number of eyeballs they received this year.

Part of this is simply a timing issue, perhaps if this year happened earlier they would have split out the rights earlier.

Women, in general, are not interested in the WNBA. Women could easily support the league, but they don't. They could spend the $87/ticket and go support the players, but they don't. They would rather spend their dollars elsewhere. I think this idea is relatively well known and then men get yelled at for not supporting the league and we are the problem.

The league has not resolved the majority of the problems that impact its profitability which is the game itself. The WNBA game does not carry the same level of entertainment value. The game needs to change. Imagine women playing baseball with the same rules and park sizes as the men.

Would people watch it or would it be difficult to watch? Yeah, but women are great at getting on base. Hey! There is a female pitcher who can throw 70 mph (GWR)! The league would be slow. Homeruns would be non existent. But we might have a several .400 hitters. Then the argument we get to hear is...

"The WMLB has more women who hit over .400 than in the men's league. We should be paid just as well as our male counterparts."

There is a fundamental reason women do not play baseball or a variation of it (softball) with the same rules and field size as men. The majority of sports vary rules to promote engagement and entertainment in their female variations.

This is still the problem with the WNBA. Until it decides to get out of the dark ages and improve the entertainment value of the game.

I have yet to find a compelling argument from anyone that contrasts that claim especially as it marches towards long term profitability and growth for the league.

The WNBA finals game 5 drew 3.3M viewers, their average national game drew 1.3M viewers per year. They aren't being compensated with a TV deal reflecting that, again, likely due to timing more than ill intent. However, your points are extraordinarily dated, irrelevant and ignorant of the current challenges with the league and why they exist.

But to counteract your specific points, NCAA basketball is a much lower caliber tier than the G-League, and yet it is worth a ton more money. It's probably a lower talent level than 20 other leagues in the world that all make less money than it does. Talent level isn't necessarily what sells. Money is related to how much marketing you can do and how much people care. The WNBA has a lot of people care this year. Their ratings were about 1/3rd of the NBA in the regular season and 1/4 of the NBA in the playoffs. If you factor out for total games played, then you get to 1/18th in the regular season and 1/20th for post season. Their media rights are going to be correlated at 1/44th of the NBA in the new deal which based on present ratings of both leagues is underselling their rights by more than half, which means based on eyeballs, their fair market value should be ~600M per year instead of 250M per year going forward.

Which means, if they were getting equitable distribution of their media rights, instead of losing 50M per year, the league would be up 550M or an average profit of 55M per team.

The problem isn't the talent level (because talent level isn't necessarily the biggest driver) or the interest right now (which is extremely robust). The problem is they don't control their own media rights and aren't getting an equitable deal.