Cowherd: Derrick Rose is closer to Tmac and AI then MJ+Magic

[Ajosu]

Whats wrong with being compared to T-mac and Iverson ? Minus the attitude problems Iverson is a future HOF and T-mac would had been a future HOF if he did not have the major injuries . In their prime they were top 5 players in the NBA

If he has any other point than to say that Rose is not close to being a Top 5 of all time player, than I say the comparison stinks. The way he grouped the names he threw out there doesn't make any sense. What makes Magic's style of play closer to MJ's than Tmac's or AI's?

Assuming one was actually trying to compare playing styles rather than just hate on someone irrationally, a better comparison would be: Derrick Rose is closer to Francis/Wade than Stockton/Magic.

Note: I used Wade and Magic because I dont think Cowherd, in what little good intentions he had here, wanted to make a positional comparison.

[Bully6789]

If you are a fan of the herd of cows good for you, but he is a media cluck who has found out how to maintain his name within the sports world by down grading players managers and other personnel. His statements are to get people riled and having them constantly speak of the trash he states. He and Rome are clowns who use their position to make their statements about athlete's personal, but yet if confronted by that athlete they both would fold up like water hitting cotton candy. They both are nothing without that sound sysytem or mike near their mouth. Herd of cows is just a talker noting more to say that Rose is more like AI and TMac and not MJ and Magic please what a cluck @ss statement their have been only one MJ and Magic and there is nobody not even his booty butt boy Bron like MJ or Magic. Funny thing about this when the draft was being contructed Wade was whining to Riley if the heat get the first pick he wanted him to take Rose. Take Bron and his cavs last season where do you think that cavs would have ended their season if Rose and Bron were teammates?

[kyrv]

If you are a fan of the herd of cows good for you, but he is a media cluck who has found out how to maintain his name within the sports world by down grading players managers and other personnel. His statements are to get people riled and having them constantly speak of the trash he states. He and Rome are clowns who use their position to make their statements about athlete's personal, but yet if confronted by that athlete they both would fold up like water hitting cotton candy. They both are nothing without that sound sysytem or mike near their mouth. Herd of cows is just a talker noting more to say that Rose is more like AI and TMac and not MJ and Magic please what a cluck @ss statement their have been only one MJ and Magic and there is nobody not even his booty butt boy Bron like MJ or Magic. Funny thing about this when the draft was being contructed Wade was whining to Riley if the heat get the first pick he wanted him to take Rose. Take Bron and his cavs last season where do you think that cavs would have ended their season if Rose and Bron were teammates?

I agree and I guess what I would say is, these guys are more likely to be entertaining than really give any good sports insight.

Personally I have a hard time mixing, like for B and B, the "well they are entertaining but often like the loudmouth drunk at the end of the bar - kind of stupid". I can handle it in small doses, that's it. There's also the phoniness and shock jock mentality that you kind of want to like them, but they just aren't real. Cool for those that this does not bother though!

[TRWJINC]

if this is true rose should be traded. this utter pathetic if true. he cost bulls fans a dynasty.


give me the wade lbj combo >>> rose anyday imagine this line up

PG - Mills
SG - Wade
SF - James
PF - Boozer/Bosh
C - Noah

that would be the championship written for 5 years

[m_willis01]

Cowherd is right.. the bulls fans on here are just homers and can't put their biases aside..

D Rose is closer to a steve francis/baron davis.. he definitely is no Kobe or Lebron because they are ALL DEFENSE.. and has NO defense therefore he CAN'T be the best PG in the league.

[Shill]

if this is true rose should be traded. this utter pathetic if true. he cost bulls fans a dynasty.


give me the wade lbj combo >>> rose anyday imagine this line up

PG - Mills
SG - Wade
SF - James
PF - Boozer/Bosh
C - Noah

that would be the championship written for 5 years

[TheAdmiral]

if this is true rose should be traded. this utter pathetic if true. he cost bulls fans a dynasty.


give me the wade lbj combo >>> rose anyday imagine this line up

PG - Mills
SG - Wade
SF - James
PF - Boozer/Bosh
C - Noah

that would be the championship written for 5 years

[Shill]

Cowherd is right.. the bulls fans on here are just homers and can't put their biases aside..

D Rose is closer to a steve francis/baron davis.. he definitely is no Kobe or Lebron because they are ALL DEFENSE.. and has NO defense therefore he CAN'T be the best PG in the league.

[SKIBA7]

haha colin cowherd. he's one of those gimmick guys like skip bayless. the whole point of them being on the air is to stir things up by being stupid.

i agree with him that rose is closer to t-mac and ai than mj/magic. i don't really see that as an insult either. i mean it's way too early to tell, but at this point that seems like a fair statement to make. ai and t-mac (in his short prime) were great players.

i do think rose has more desire to win than either of those guys though. (unless this was the argument he was making. i didnt read it because i don't waste my time reading garbage from guys like bayless/cowherd.

if he was talking terms of personality and character, then it was stupid. if he meant as an overall player, then it was fine.

[SKIBA7]

Cowherd is right.. the bulls fans on here are just homers and can't put their biases aside..

D Rose is closer to a steve francis/baron davis.. he definitely is no Kobe or Lebron because they are ALL DEFENSE.. and has NO defense therefore he CAN'T be the best PG in the league.

haha lebron plays defense now? when did that start?

[m_willis01]

Cowherd is right.. the bulls fans on here are just homers and can't put their biases aside..

D Rose is closer to a steve francis/baron davis.. he definitely is no Kobe or Lebron because they are ALL DEFENSE.. and has NO defense therefore he CAN'T be the best PG in the league.

haha lebron plays defense now? when did that start?

lmao obviously you don't know basketball..

As much as i hate Lebron... you have to be downright foolish to not acknowledge that he is..

2-time All Defensive First Team + a runner up to Dwight Howard for Defensive Player of the Year..and is considered one of the league's better perimeter defenders.

[Shill]

Cowherd is right.. the bulls fans on here are just homers and can't put their biases aside..

D Rose is closer to a steve francis/baron davis.. he definitely is no Kobe or Lebron because they are ALL DEFENSE.. and has NO defense therefore he CAN'T be the best PG in the league.

haha lebron plays defense now? when did that start?

lmao obviously you don't know basketball..

As much as i hate Lebron... you have to be downright foolish to not acknowledge that he is..

2-time All Defensive First Team + a runner up to Dwight Howard for Defensive Player of the Year..and is considered one of the league's better perimeter defenders.

And if you think Rose is comparable to Franchise or B. Diddy, YOU don't know basketball.

[m_willis01]

haha really man?? Rose and Franchise(in his Houston years) are both explosive combo guards who couldn't shoot the 3pt.. and the numbers are pretty darn identical.. #imjustsaying..



Steve Francis
Year Team GP GS MPG FG% 3P% FT% RPG APG SPG BPG PPG
1999–2000 77 77 36.1 .445 .345 .786 5.3 6.6 1.5 .4 18.0
2000–2001 80 79 39.9 .451 .396 .817 6.9 6.5 1.8 .4 19.9
2001–2002 57 56 41.1 .417 .324 .773 7.0 6.4 1.2 .4 21.6
2002–2003 81 81 41.0 .435 .354 .800 6.2 6.2 1.7 .5 21.0


D. Rose
Year Team GP GS MPG FG% 3P% FT% RPG APG SPG BPG PPG
2008–2009 81 80 37.0 .475 .222 .788 3.9 6.3 .8 .2 16.8
2009–2010 78 78 36.8 .489 .267 .766 3.8 6.0 .7 .4 20.8

[RedBulls23]

Cowherd is right.. the bulls fans on here are just homers and can't put their biases aside..

D Rose is closer to a steve francis/baron davis.. he definitely is no Kobe or Lebron because they are ALL DEFENSE.. and has NO defense therefore he CAN'T be the best PG in the league.

haha lebron plays defense now? when did that start?

lmao obviously you don't know basketball..

As much as i hate Lebron... you have to be downright foolish to not acknowledge that he is..

2-time All Defensive First Team + a runner up to Dwight Howard for Defensive Player of the Year..and is considered one of the league's better perimeter defenders.

Lebron James is a very good help side defender, but his on the ball defense is very average and at times it's below that. The reason he makes the all-defensive teams is because of his rep as the best player in the game. If you actually watch him play you see he tends to have bad foot work and gets beat by his man plenty of times. He is just a freak of nature so he is able to come back on that. When Luol Deng crosses you over, it proves that he is just average on his man d. And he didn't even start getting better on the defensive end till like 2 years ago.

To say or imply that rose who has only played two seasons and shown improvement on d won't get much better is sort sighted and in general just flat out hating!

[Shill]

Rose and Franchise(in his prime) are both explosive combo guards who couldn't shoot the 3pt.. and the numbers are pretty darn identical.. #imjustsaying..



Steve Francis
Year Team GP GS MPG FG% 3P% FT% RPG APG SPG BPG PPG
1999–2000 77 77 36.1 .445 .345 .786 5.3 6.6 1.5 .4 18.0
2000–2001 80 79 39.9 .451 .396 .817 6.9 6.5 1.8 .4 19.9
2001–02 Houston 57 56 41.1 .417 .324 .773 7.0 6.4 1.2 .4 21.6
2002–03 Houston 81 81 41.0 .435 .354 .800 6.2 6.2 1.7 .5 21.0


D. Rose
Year Team GP GS MPG FG% 3P% FT% RPG APG SPG BPG PPG
2008–2009 81 80 37.0 .475 .222 .788 3.9 6.3 .8 .2 16.8
2009–2010 78 78 36.8 .489 .267 .766 3.8 6.0 .7 .4 20.8

First of all, Rose isn't a combo guard. He's a point guard. It just so happens he's a very talented scorer. He'd rather be a distributor, but he's by far the best scorer on his team. BTW he's currently averaging 9.8 apg.

Second, similar stats to Stevie Franchise does not make him Stevie Franchise. You can't look at the stats in a vacuum like that. They have COMPLETELY DIFFERENT temperaments. Franchise was always a "me" player. Look no further than him pouting on draft night, and dogging his way out of town. Rose has often been unselfish to a fault.

BTW the stats you posted aren't even indicators that Franchise couldn't shoot the three.

[m_willis01]

Second, similar stats to Stevie Franchise does not make him Stevie Franchise. You can't look at the stats in a vacuum like that. They have COMPLETELY DIFFERENT temperaments. Franchise was always a "me" player. Look no further than him pouting on draft night, and dogging his way out of town. Rose has often been unselfish to a fault.

I'm sorry I forgot to take into account the temperaments when comparing a player's SKILLS. D Rose's temperament is that of jason kidd and jeff hornacek...so he must have similar games to those sure fire hall-of famers... gimme a break dude

Rose's GAME and PHYSICAL TALENTS are extremely similar to that of Francis ..but you are right..their personalities are different..

BTW Rose has turned into a NO-Defense, shoot-first ball hog ..evident by him taking a lot of bad shots so far and is 2nd in the league in FG attempts.. necessity or not..So even though his temperament is that of a quite, humble dude..the "ME" label on Rose can be debated.. I'm pretty sure Thibs wants Rose to take 29 shots per game right..(sarcasm)

& I was just pointing to stats to further support my point..not make it.

[-Illmatic-]

Second, similar stats to Stevie Franchise does not make him Stevie Franchise. You can't look at the stats in a vacuum like that. They have COMPLETELY DIFFERENT temperaments. Franchise was always a "me" player. Look no further than him pouting on draft night, and dogging his way out of town. Rose has often been unselfish to a fault.

I'm sorry I forgot to take into account the temperaments when comparing a player's SKILLS. D Rose's temperament is that of jason kidd and jeff hornacek...so he must have similar games to those sure fire hall-of famers... gimme a break dude

Rose's GAME and PHYSICAL TALENTS are extremely similar to that of Francis ..but you are right..their personalities are different..

BTW Rose has turned into a NO-Defense, shoot-first ball hog ..evident by him taking a lot of bad shots so far and is 2nd in the league in FG attempts.. necessity or not..So even though his temperament is that of a quite, humble dude..the "ME" label on Rose can be debated.. I'm pretty sure Thibs wants Rose to take 29 shots per game right..(sarcasm)

& I was just pointing to stats to further support my point..not make it.

trolls...

[bennjuiced34]

Don't feed the troll. He, like other shock jocks, want you to talk about what they say because it's publicity for them. They could probably care less whether you agree or not, the mere fact you are responding and getting emotional about it is what he wants because he gets attention and that is what ESPN wants...attention and ratings.

Anyone who has watched Rose and has half a brain can see the idiocy of this statement.

[Shill]

Second, similar stats to Stevie Franchise does not make him Stevie Franchise. You can't look at the stats in a vacuum like that. They have COMPLETELY DIFFERENT temperaments. Franchise was always a "me" player. Look no further than him pouting on draft night, and dogging his way out of town. Rose has often been unselfish to a fault.

I'm sorry I forgot to take into account the temperaments when comparing a player's SKILLS. D Rose's temperament is that of jason kidd and jeff hornacek...so he must have similar games to those sure fire hall-of famers... gimme a break dude

Rose's GAME and PHYSICAL TALENTS are extremely similar to that of Francis ..but you are right..their personalities are different..

BTW Rose has turned into a NO-Defense, shoot-first ball hog ..evident by him taking a lot of bad shots so far and is 2nd in the league in FG attempts.. necessity or not..So even though his temperament is that of a quite, humble dude..the "ME" label on Rose can be debated.. I'm pretty sure Thibs wants Rose to take 29 shots per game right..(sarcasm)

& I was just pointing to stats to further support my point..not make it.

9.8 assists per game = "shoot-first ball hog"?

[Neusch23]

I have not read the whole thread, and I am sure I am going to be the 20th person to say this, but the same was said of Jordan early in his career.

Rose is very fun to watch right now. We will see what happens with his career, and where he takes it. I want to see him take it to the next level, and he is making all the right transitions right now. My hope is that by the end of the year he is averaging over 1.3 steals a game, with 7 assists, and 22 a game for us, while leading us to 50+ wins. I feel that was the step he has to take, while continuing to improve his defense, and 3 point shooting.

I don't believe he has a low IQ like Tyrus Thomas that is made up for with freak athletic ability. But I don't think he is the sharpest tool in the shed either. He is some where in the middle. If the NBA had a wonderlic test, I would bet he would score around a 20 max, but not much lower. Maybe I am way off, though.

All I can say is that I can't wait to get Boozer here, and enjoy the ride.