OT: COVID-19 thread #3

[Dresden]

The two-party system doesn’t need reform. The government needs more modern minds. McConnell, Trump and Biden (admittedly) would chopstick their way through emails if they ever spent a minute on a computer.

We badly need term limits in congress. It would help clear out this group of old bought toxic politicians that are unwilling to compromise.

I'm not sure that would change anything. Politicians vote the way they think their constituents want them to, for the most part.

[Dresden]

These type of things should be left to the states to decide. You don't have to live in that state. If your views are democratic then simply live in a democratic state. If your views are republican, live in a republican state. If they're open and moderate, live in a moderate state. Alot of these key issues that the federal government can't come to an agreement with should result in the states deciding the outcome. For example a state wants to defund police and/or ban guns, they can. More state power and control and less federal government meddling is the way to go on fixing many of the US key issues.

It's only costing them 10% of the price, to give a bunch more of their residents access to health care. And they refused because their legislature won't have anything to do with Obamacare. And now the people have voted to do it, over the objections of their legislature. If they had just done it in the first place, a lot more people would have access to health care these past 10 years. But I guess that's not something that's important to the GOP.

Old news for me. Finnish doctors notice that in March. That was also major newspapers. But it is really small group of people. probably other countries don`t pay too much attention what is going on in Finland I hope Finland is the country who found cure first because we are prepared tp give it everyone as ast as possible. They say we are pretty close to vaccine but Finland is way too small country to handle logistics alone. I don`t care who will be first but i hope it is someone who don`t just try to make business (like Trump but he is not only one).Half of the people don`t probably have money to buy it. So rich countries must pay vaccine and spread it eveywhere. Today we have in hospitals 23 corona patiens and zero critical cases. Meanwhile in Sweden things look ugly. Same goes Russia. Baltic countries, Danmark and Norway are doing great also. Things are pretty much normal here right now. Hopefully second wave don`t come before vaccine. I really miss watching NHL, NBA and Soccer with audience. Formula 1 starts sunday. Gladly i can play now soccer and basketball again. But i miss watching sports. Can`t wait. Only sad thing is that Bulls are out. Even how bad team is still mostly like to watch.

Congrats to Finland for doing it right. I wish we had that kind of leadership here.

[moorhosj]

Never in my life have I heard of more accusations of racism on a daily basis. And outright anti-white racism has never been more common place and accepted.

Did you miss your own hypocrisy? Literally the sentence after complaining about how everyone else is calling people racists, you call people racist. There is no anti-white or anti-whatever racism, there is just racism. Trying to create extra labels to divide people into teams, says a lot more about you than the people you think you're calling out.

The similarities between what's going on today and what George Orwell described in 1984 are nothing short of stunning.

1984 is about the state exhorting it's control over the population through thought control (like a media network that re-inforces the leaders actions). A maligned population demanding justice is much more like the protests the US historically supports around the world.

Arab Spring https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_Spring
Hong Kong protests https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019%E2%80%9320_Hong_Kong_protests

[Ccwatercraft]

Just going to say I believe that number is misleading. When the pandemic originally hit we were not testing nearly as many people as we are now. I remember when it was a milestone for the US to get to 100k a day. Now we are close to 500k a day. I strongly believe and so does the majority of the scientific community that our case counts were actually much higher in March, April, and May before testing got up to these levels. So yes, we are seeing another large spike according to the official numbers, but the true infection rate is still probably below where it was in those earlier months. Maybe I'm being naïve, but I look at that as a good thing. I always expected cases to go up in different regions/states at different times.

There is only one major thing I would like to see changed about our response to this pandemic. We need to make mask wearing a universal requirement in any public places. This needs to be made by the federal government. All the studies show if we do that our cases will drop significantly and could even allow us to eradicate the virus.

Yes, the positive aspect of it is is now we have people that now know to quarantine and re-test even if showing no symptoms. When this first started you have to have serious symptoms and in many cases early on the were even limiting tests to only those that were considered at risk due to the limited access to testing.

With hospitalization data still somewhat elusive its difficult at times to gauge the seriousness. I know locally were well under capacity at the hospitals but those figures tend to be a few days old and you really have to dig to figure out how many are there in the ICU because of covid-19 many are just there in the ICU for other reasons. A recent local news broadcast said we were at 70% capacity but I had to dig online to determine that the covid figures were only 17%. That should have been part of the news item.

Also perhaps being naive but for example way back when when they estimated a certain percentage of people in Los Angeles County to be positive extrapolating the numbers, now we have better data, but its not as scary was the numbers were when we primarily only tested severe cases like back when NY was dealing with a surge.

Still quite incomplete data but a significant improvement over april/may.

Incomplete data because DeSantis is cooking the books. Stay safe Florida...

lol, specific hospitalization data being difficult to find for each county has nothing to do with DeSantis, I'm pleased with his efforts and have followed his press briefings and actions closely. I'm dam glad he addressed the nursing home situation to protect the vulnerable, that was a mess in NY, and that's saying it nicely.

Not sure how many states if any where you can assume the numbers are 100% accurate right now.

[_txchilibowl_]

Yes, the positive aspect of it is is now we have people that now know to quarantine and re-test even if showing no symptoms. When this first started you have to have serious symptoms and in many cases early on the were even limiting tests to only those that were considered at risk due to the limited access to testing.

With hospitalization data still somewhat elusive its difficult at times to gauge the seriousness. I know locally were well under capacity at the hospitals but those figures tend to be a few days old and you really have to dig to figure out how many are there in the ICU because of covid-19 many are just there in the ICU for other reasons. A recent local news broadcast said we were at 70% capacity but I had to dig online to determine that the covid figures were only 17%. That should have been part of the news item.

Also perhaps being naive but for example way back when when they estimated a certain percentage of people in Los Angeles County to be positive extrapolating the numbers, now we have better data, but its not as scary was the numbers were when we primarily only tested severe cases like back when NY was dealing with a surge.

Still quite incomplete data but a significant improvement over april/may.

Incomplete data because DeSantis is cooking the books. Stay safe Florida...

lol, specific hospitalization data being difficult to find for each county has nothing to do with DeSantis, I'm pleased with his efforts and have followed his press briefings and actions closely. I'm dam glad he addressed the nursing home situation to protect the vulnerable, that was a mess in NY, and that's saying it nicely.

Not sure how many states if any where you can assume the numbers are 100% accurate right now.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but hasn't Florida changed their counting criteria and the information made available to the public multiple times? And coincidentally have those changes not reduced the apparent impact of the virus?

Edit: And my criticism is not due to the fact that the state doesn't have 100% accurate numbers it's that they haven't been transparent about the data they have.

[Dresden]

Didn't one of the key people involved in tracking data there quit recently (or was fired), because she wouldn't go along with orders from higher up to fudge the numbers? Now she runs her own website that tries to more accurately reveal the case numbers.

[Ccwatercraft]

Incomplete data because DeSantis is cooking the books. Stay safe Florida...

lol, specific hospitalization data being difficult to find for each county has nothing to do with DeSantis, I'm pleased with his efforts and have followed his press briefings and actions closely. I'm dam glad he addressed the nursing home situation to protect the vulnerable, that was a mess in NY, and that's saying it nicely.

Not sure how many states if any where you can assume the numbers are 100% accurate right now.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but hasn't Florida changed their counting criteria and the information made available to the public multiple times? And coincidentally have those changes not reduced the apparent impact of the virus?

Edit: And my criticism is not due to the fact that the state doesn't have 100% accurate numbers it's that they haven't been transparent about the data they have.

depends on the county, some county numbers increased, others decreased, there was a big media debacle over an apparent nut job on their website that was complaining about the numbers but the figures were minor and scattered. Personally I prefer worldmeters because it covers the world but also breaks it down to country/state/county as well.

I'm certainly expecting anyone to throw their mask in the trash because they think Sarasota county had 6 more or 6 less cases last week, I'm certainly not going to lose sleep over 2 deaths + or - for my area, we're looking at 40-50K cases a week lately, I couldn't care less if there are minor discrepancies. No different than not expecting anyone in IL to do so because of how they are labeling deaths, which was quite bizarre and hopefully had been addressed.

Let the media have fun with that crap, I'm not going to lose sleep, he's doing a good job considering everything and the clown he beat out was in rehab last I checked so I'm glad to have him.

Every single state is learning as they go with this.

[_txchilibowl_]

Didn't one of the key people involved in tracking data there quit recently (or was fired), because she wouldn't go along with orders from higher up to fudge the numbers? Now she runs her own website that tries to more accurately reveal the case numbers.

Exactly.

Honestly I don't see how anyone can say they are pleased with Ron DeSantis and Florida's "efforts". That state is shaping up to be ground zero for stupid coronavirus response. It's akin to saying I've been happy with GarPax's team building efforts. What a joke.

[_txchilibowl_]

Florida topping 10k new cases yesterday, btw. If that doesn't move the needle then you're just burying your head in the sand...

[Ccwatercraft]

Didn't one of the key people involved in tracking data there quit recently (or was fired), because she wouldn't go along with orders from higher up to fudge the numbers? Now she runs her own website that tries to more accurately reveal the case numbers.

Exactly.

Honestly I don't see how anyone can say they are pleased with Ron DeSantis and Florida's "efforts". That state is shaping up to be ground zero for stupid coronavirus response. It's akin to saying I've been happy with GarPax's team building efforts. What a joke.

Florida topping 10k new cases yesterday, btw. If that doesn't move the needle then you're just burying your head in the sand...

A direct result of massively stepping up testing across the state, within just a couple weeks of the testing surge we saw an increase in numbers as soon as results started pouring in. I now have access to 3 different testing sights now, no symptoms no appointments needed & local labs (Quest) are jamming them through by the thousands.

It wouldn't surprise me to learn that the case counts would have been pretty high 30-60 days ago but there was very limited testing capability pretty much everywhere, not just FL so it was just a hypothetical. The good news now is that now you can get a test even without symptoms, if positive you can quarantine, vs just tossing on a mask and wandering around the store, this is all helpful and positive info for everyone involved. I have bloodwork scheduled in a couple weeks (they are booked nearly full 3 weeks out) and the Dr said they can add the antibody test for me as well, I suspect that I had it a long time ago but I think a lot of people have said that and were wrong.

Largely this is a big city issue so for my area, and most smaller sized area's, it is very quiet, I'm sure as hell not making road trips to Miami for any reason.

[moorhosj]

A direct result of massively stepping up testing across the state, within just a couple weeks of the testing surge we saw an increase in numbers as soon as results started pouring in. I now have access to 3 different testing sights now, no symptoms no appointments needed & local labs (Quest) are jamming them through by the thousands.

It wouldn't surprise me to learn that the case counts would have been pretty high 30-60 days ago but there was very limited testing capability pretty much everywhere, not just FL so it was just a hypothetical. The good news now is that now you can get a test even without symptoms, if positive you can quarantine, vs just tossing on a mask and wandering around the store, this is all helpful and positive info for everyone involved. I have bloodwork scheduled in a couple weeks (they are booked nearly full 3 weeks out) and the Dr said they can add the antibody test for me as well, I suspect that I had it a long time ago but I think a lot of people have said that and were wrong.

Largely this is a big city issue so for my area, and most smaller sized area's, it is very quiet, I'm sure as hell not making road trips to Miami for any reason.

7-day rolling positivity rate in Florida was 3.8% on June 1. Yesterday, it was 16%. It’s not just because of more testing, as a far higher percentage (4x) of those being tested are positive so positives would be increasing even with identical testing numbers.

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/testing/individual-states/florida

[Ccwatercraft]

A direct result of massively stepping up testing across the state, within just a couple weeks of the testing surge we saw an increase in numbers as soon as results started pouring in. I now have access to 3 different testing sights now, no symptoms no appointments needed & local labs (Quest) are jamming them through by the thousands.

It wouldn't surprise me to learn that the case counts would have been pretty high 30-60 days ago but there was very limited testing capability pretty much everywhere, not just FL so it was just a hypothetical. The good news now is that now you can get a test even without symptoms, if positive you can quarantine, vs just tossing on a mask and wandering around the store, this is all helpful and positive info for everyone involved. I have bloodwork scheduled in a couple weeks (they are booked nearly full 3 weeks out) and the Dr said they can add the antibody test for me as well, I suspect that I had it a long time ago but I think a lot of people have said that and were wrong.

Largely this is a big city issue so for my area, and most smaller sized area's, it is very quiet, I'm sure as hell not making road trips to Miami for any reason.

7-day rolling positivity rate in Florida was 3.8% on June 1. Yesterday, it was 16%. It’s not just because of more testing, as a far higher percentage (4x) of those being tested are positive so positives would be increasing even with identical testing numbers.

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/testing/individual-states/florida

That's great, every positive test can quarantine, get them out of the stores.

I certainly dont want Cuomo down here killing off people by the hundreds. I'm good with DeSantis.

[Dresden]

Didn't one of the key people involved in tracking data there quit recently (or was fired), because she wouldn't go along with orders from higher up to fudge the numbers? Now she runs her own website that tries to more accurately reveal the case numbers.

Exactly.

Honestly I don't see how anyone can say they are pleased with Ron DeSantis and Florida's "efforts". That state is shaping up to be ground zero for stupid coronavirus response. It's akin to saying I've been happy with GarPax's team building efforts. What a joke.

Florida topping 10k new cases yesterday, btw. If that doesn't move the needle then you're just burying your head in the sand...

A direct result of massively stepping up testing across the state, within just a couple weeks of the testing surge we saw an increase in numbers as soon as results started pouring in. I now have access to 3 different testing sights now, no symptoms no appointments needed & local labs (Quest) are jamming them through by the thousands.

It wouldn't surprise me to learn that the case counts would have been pretty high 30-60 days ago but there was very limited testing capability pretty much everywhere, not just FL so it was just a hypothetical. The good news now is that now you can get a test even without symptoms, if positive you can quarantine, vs just tossing on a mask and wandering around the store, this is all helpful and positive info for everyone involved. I have bloodwork scheduled in a couple weeks (they are booked nearly full 3 weeks out) and the Dr said they can add the antibody test for me as well, I suspect that I had it a long time ago but I think a lot of people have said that and were wrong.

Largely this is a big city issue so for my area, and most smaller sized area's, it is very quiet, I'm sure as hell not making road trips to Miami for any reason.

I wish they were offering antibody testing out here. I just had some blood work done last week, and no mention of that. Also very good that testing is so widely available. Everyone should get a test, although apparently they will only show positive results at certain points in the infection. Too early or too late, and you could get a false negative. Still better than nothing.

[Ccwatercraft]

Exactly.

Honestly I don't see how anyone can say they are pleased with Ron DeSantis and Florida's "efforts". That state is shaping up to be ground zero for stupid coronavirus response. It's akin to saying I've been happy with GarPax's team building efforts. What a joke.

Florida topping 10k new cases yesterday, btw. If that doesn't move the needle then you're just burying your head in the sand...

A direct result of massively stepping up testing across the state, within just a couple weeks of the testing surge we saw an increase in numbers as soon as results started pouring in. I now have access to 3 different testing sights now, no symptoms no appointments needed & local labs (Quest) are jamming them through by the thousands.

It wouldn't surprise me to learn that the case counts would have been pretty high 30-60 days ago but there was very limited testing capability pretty much everywhere, not just FL so it was just a hypothetical. The good news now is that now you can get a test even without symptoms, if positive you can quarantine, vs just tossing on a mask and wandering around the store, this is all helpful and positive info for everyone involved. I have bloodwork scheduled in a couple weeks (they are booked nearly full 3 weeks out) and the Dr said they can add the antibody test for me as well, I suspect that I had it a long time ago but I think a lot of people have said that and were wrong.

Largely this is a big city issue so for my area, and most smaller sized area's, it is very quiet, I'm sure as hell not making road trips to Miami for any reason.

I wish they were offering antibody testing out here. I just had some blood work done last week, and no mention of that. Also very good that testing is so widely available. Everyone should get a test, although apparently they will only show positive results at certain points in the infection. Too early or too late, and you could get a false negative. Still better than nothing.

yes, and there is still confusion and/or inconsistencies over how duplicate tests are counted, etc.

Every test is a step in the right direction, more info is always good.

[_txchilibowl_]

A direct result of massively stepping up testing across the state, within just a couple weeks of the testing surge we saw an increase in numbers as soon as results started pouring in. I now have access to 3 different testing sights now, no symptoms no appointments needed & local labs (Quest) are jamming them through by the thousands.

It wouldn't surprise me to learn that the case counts would have been pretty high 30-60 days ago but there was very limited testing capability pretty much everywhere, not just FL so it was just a hypothetical. The good news now is that now you can get a test even without symptoms, if positive you can quarantine, vs just tossing on a mask and wandering around the store, this is all helpful and positive info for everyone involved. I have bloodwork scheduled in a couple weeks (they are booked nearly full 3 weeks out) and the Dr said they can add the antibody test for me as well, I suspect that I had it a long time ago but I think a lot of people have said that and were wrong.

Largely this is a big city issue so for my area, and most smaller sized area's, it is very quiet, I'm sure as hell not making road trips to Miami for any reason.

7-day rolling positivity rate in Florida was 3.8% on June 1. Yesterday, it was 16%. It’s not just because of more testing, as a far higher percentage (4x) of those being tested are positive so positives would be increasing even with identical testing numbers.

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/testing/individual-states/florida

That's great, every positive test can quarantine, get them out of the stores.

I certainly dont want Cuomo down here killing off people by the hundreds. I'm good with DeSantis.

But isn't that kind of the point? Every positive test can quarantine but how many people are walking around unaware that they are positive? Apparently quite a few.

Floridians need to take some personal accountability for the recent spike but it damn sure didn't help having leadership that was hell-bent on opening the state as soon as possible and downplaying the seriousness of the situation. It wasn't but just a few weeks ago that DeSantis was calling out the media for fear-mongering while claiming victory over the virus. He's been in lockstep with Trump the entire time and it's pretty clear at this point that Trump has no idea what he's doing.

I have hope that the state and it's residents will start to recognize what they're up against. I distinctly remember having a conversation with you about this very thing not a couple of weeks ago and I'm happy to hear that you've begun wearing masks when needed. It's a small but necessary step and the health and economy of the entire state would greatly benefit from more people adopting your change of mind.

Stay safe and GO BULLS

[Ccwatercraft]

7-day rolling positivity rate in Florida was 3.8% on June 1. Yesterday, it was 16%. It’s not just because of more testing, as a far higher percentage (4x) of those being tested are positive so positives would be increasing even with identical testing numbers.

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/testing/individual-states/florida

That's great, every positive test can quarantine, get them out of the stores.

I certainly dont want Cuomo down here killing off people by the hundreds. I'm good with DeSantis.

But isn't that kind of the point? Every positive test can quarantine but how many people are walking around unaware that they are positive? Apparently quite a few.

Floridians need to take some personal accountability for the recent spike but it damn sure didn't help having leadership that was hell-bent on opening the state as soon as possible and downplaying the seriousness of the situation. It wasn't but just a few weeks ago that DeSantis was calling out the media for fear-mongering while claiming victory over the virus. He's been in lockstep with Trump the entire time and it's pretty clear at this point that Trump has no idea what he's doing.

I have hope that the state and it's residents will start to recognize what they're up against. I distinctly remember having a conversation with you about this very thing not a couple of weeks ago and I'm happy to hear that you've begun wearing masks when needed. It's a small but necessary step and the health and economy of the entire state would greatly benefit from more people adopting your change of mind.

Stay safe and GO BULLS

I dont look at through a blue lens.

Perhaps that's why I can be objective.

[moorhosj]

That's great, every positive test can quarantine, get them out of the stores.

I certainly dont want Cuomo down here killing off people by the hundreds. I'm good with DeSantis.

Any time someone questions DeSantis, you reflexively bring up Cuomo. There are 48 other Governors, a truly "objective" person would look at some of those states, not just focus on New York.

Illinois has tested 131k per 1 million in population, Florida is at 94k tests per 1 million in population (about 30% lower). It's OK to admit that Florida should have been testing more throughout May and June.

[dice]

Didn't one of the key people involved in tracking data there quit recently (or was fired), because she wouldn't go along with orders from higher up to fudge the numbers? Now she runs her own website that tries to more accurately reveal the case numbers.

Exactly.

Honestly I don't see how anyone can say they are pleased with Ron DeSantis and Florida's "efforts". That state is shaping up to be ground zero for stupid coronavirus response. It's akin to saying I've been happy with GarPax's team building efforts. What a joke.

Florida topping 10k new cases yesterday, btw. If that doesn't move the needle then you're just burying your head in the sand...

A direct result of massively stepping up testing across the state...

nnnnnnnope. positive test RATE in florida has increased from 2.3% in the latter half of may to a whopping 16% now. increased testing generally brings DOWN the positive rate. the initial surge in testing was while the rate was still going down. the big spike in positive rates started in mid june...a full month after the testing surge

over the past week, in declining order of positive rates:

AZ 1 in 505 residents tested daily...24.0% positive rate

FL 1 in 480...16.0%
NV 1 in 680...14.9%
TX 1 in 695...14.4%
MS 1 in 650...13.9%
GA 1 in 665...13.3%
AL 1 in 620...12.5%
TN 1 in 480...8.1%
LA 1 in 315 ...7.4%
NC 1 in 485...6.8%
CA 1 in 420 ...6.4%
OH 1 in 735...5.5%
OK 1 in 575...5.4%
WI 1 in 605...5.3%
OR 1 in 1060...5.1%
CO 1 in 1100...5.0%
IN in 815...4.9%
WA 1 in 760...4.9%
PA 1 in 1050...4.7%
VA 1 in 730...4.5%
MN 1 in 450...3.4%
IL 1 in 430...2.7%
MI 1 in 595...2.2%
DC 1 in 310...1.5%
NJ 1 in 435...1.4%
CT 1 in 330 ...0.9%

the variation in positive rates is much greater than that of testing rates. there is absolutely no reason other than poor management/politics/lack of personal responsibility (all connected) that florida and texas should have more than double the positive rates of california. california didn't get hit hard early like the northeast did

and testing is STILL a problem. including in florida. meaning that cases are STILL being under-counted:

https://www.wtsp.com/article/news/health/coronavirus/florida-testing-sites-could-run-start-to-run-out-of-supplies-soon-as-coronavirus-case-numbers-rise/67-8499fa1d-e029-497e-afec-8413c372730c

if arizona doesn't get things under control quickly they will surpass new york for per capita cases. which would be astonishing on multiple levels. outside chance that florida, s carolina and louisiana could get there too

[Ccwatercraft]

That's great, every positive test can quarantine, get them out of the stores.

I certainly dont want Cuomo down here killing off people by the hundreds. I'm good with DeSantis.

Any time someone questions DeSantis, you reflexively bring up Cuomo. There are 48 other Governors, a truly "objective" person would look at some of those states, not just focus on New York.

Illinois has tested 131k per 1 million in population, Florida is at 94k tests per 1 million in population (about 30% lower). It's OK to admit that Florida should have been testing more throughout May and June.

Illinois death counts are?

And Other states...sure. how about new Jersey, how are their death counts?

California, Massachusetts, michigan, Connecticut, Pennsylvania.

I can bring those up as well if it makes you happy.

Its inevitable that this will move through virtually every state and have its way.

We all likely get a turn on the leaderboard.

[moorhosj]

Illinois death counts are?

And Other states...sure. how about new Jersey, how are their death counts?

California, Massachusetts, michigan, Connecticut, Pennsylvania.

I can bring those up as well if it makes you happy.

Its inevitable that this will move through virtually every state and have its way.

We all likely get a turn on the leaderboard.

This actually reinforces my point. If everyone gets a time at the top, the main thing you can control is testing so you have a chance to shorten that time at the top. Currently, Florida has 140k active cases and rapidly rising and Illinois has 26k with a slow drop.

Like you said, Illinois had its surge, the response was masks and more testing. Again, tests.