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MGB8 wrote:Pat will have to play like he played as a rookie but a little better until the trade deadline… and then, if that happens (and only if that happens), someone will offer cap space or an expiring for him. And AKME, having mentally decided to move on from Pat, will jump at that opportunity.
sco wrote:Here's where I see it differently. IMO, the defensive adjustments necessary to cover up for the worst defensive C in the league hurt our team, not to mention, make our other guys look like worse defenders which lowers their trade value. Add to that the fact that Vuc is only really effective if he is fed the ball constantly as he's not able to generate his own offense...just another guy who can't add value on the court without the ball in his hands. More importantly, I'm looking for Matas to step into a 3rd option role (ideally 2nd, but prob not yet), and that cannot happen with Vuc here.
dougthonus wrote:MGB8 wrote:Pat will have to play like he played as a rookie but a little better until the trade deadline… and then, if that happens (and only if that happens), someone will offer cap space or an expiring for him. And AKME, having mentally decided to move on from Pat, will jump at that opportunity.
An interesting question would be if Pat plays better, will we still want to move on from him? I really wonder that one.
MGB8 wrote:dougthonus wrote:MGB8 wrote:Pat will have to play like he played as a rookie but a little better until the trade deadline… and then, if that happens (and only if that happens), someone will offer cap space or an expiring for him. And AKME, having mentally decided to move on from Pat, will jump at that opportunity.
An interesting question would be if Pat plays better, will we still want to move on from him? I really wonder that one.
My thought with this, and it’s relevant to your Vuc post, below, is that (1) AK seems to have an outsized influence on floors of guys’ minutes, and (2) AK seems to make things more personal, for lack of a better term, with these guys than otherwise would be warranted. He seems to have 3 categories: (1) his guy (DDR, Pat until last year, Buz, Vuc until last year), (2) “done with you” (LaVine post extension, Pat now), and (3) “meh” (Vuc now, everyone else).
I think he is pretty transparent about this, too, and was with Lauri, etc.
In that way, I have this sense (via what’s flowing from various reports) that he is “done with” Pat. Once he is done, as soon as the player triggers a not-too-harmful return, the player is gone. I’m not sure that he was done with Lonzo so much as meh about him and wants to take the flier on Okoro. I don’t get the sense that he is done with Vic - I think he would like to move him but still sees him as a contributor and respected veteran - so Vuc won’t get benched or even bought out. He’ll be traded for the right deal, but it will still have to bring some 2nd rounders and no net salary gain (or be part of a larger trade w/ other players).
I could be wrong, but that is my sense of how the Bulls are currently operating.
Chi town wrote:3pm EST FA Begins…
Will be a crazy day.
Hope AK doesn’t overpay for Tre. Need that contract to be tradable.
dougthonus wrote:MGB8 wrote:Pat will have to play like he played as a rookie but a little better until the trade deadline… and then, if that happens (and only if that happens), someone will offer cap space or an expiring for him. And AKME, having mentally decided to move on from Pat, will jump at that opportunity.
An interesting question would be if Pat plays better, will we still want to move on from him? I really wonder that one.
Evil_Headband wrote:Chi town wrote:3pm EST FA Begins…
Will be a crazy day.
Hope AK doesn’t overpay for Tre. Need that contract to be tradable.
Starts at 6 EST
Evil_Headband wrote:I’m a little concerned that the signings of Giddey and Jones haven’t happened yet. Returning players don’t have to wait until 5:00 CST today. I hope these don’t drag out.
dougthonus wrote:sco wrote:Here's where I see it differently. IMO, the defensive adjustments necessary to cover up for the worst defensive C in the league hurt our team, not to mention, make our other guys look like worse defenders which lowers their trade value. Add to that the fact that Vuc is only really effective if he is fed the ball constantly as he's not able to generate his own offense...just another guy who can't add value on the court without the ball in his hands. More importantly, I'm looking for Matas to step into a 3rd option role (ideally 2nd, but prob not yet), and that cannot happen with Vuc here.
I will say a few caveats to this, you have a lot of options with Vuc because he is an expiring:
You could:
1: Play him in the minimum role that makes him effective (ie, 15 minutes off the bench if you want)
2: You could bench him and just use him for salary filler later
3: You could simply buy him out
So I think a slight tweak is that it isn't imperative to trade Vuc, but it is imperative to start thinking of him as your starting caliber center that has to play 28-32 minutes a night, and view him as a piece that is irrelevant to your future and maximize whatever you do with him regardless of his feelings.
Like trading him for a different expiring does nothing for you that the above 3 options wouldn't, and I highly question that anyone would give you something valuable for him, so really the outcomes of trade, waive, minimize, bench are all about the same.
I think what you are eluding to is that we probably won't choose any of those top three options on I laid out, and that trading him is the only way we accomplish what you're saying, and that wouldn't surprise me, but that's a choice not a thing that has to happen.
ShouldaPaidBG wrote:Evil_Headband wrote:I’m a little concerned that the signings of Giddey and Jones haven’t happened yet. Returning players don’t have to wait until 5:00 CST today. I hope these don’t drag out.
I like it - let other contracts set the market.
ThreeYearPlan wrote:Bulls fans defend HomoSapien more than Rose.
Evil_Headband wrote:Chi town wrote:3pm EST FA Begins…
Will be a crazy day.
Hope AK doesn’t overpay for Tre. Need that contract to be tradable.
Starts at 6 EST
YourCousinVinny wrote:If Vuc is traded for Simmons and Coby for Kuminga ,we should be all over Dayron Sharpe in free agency.
Infinity2152 wrote:Bulls need to stop playing these small moves and ante up for a real good player. I don't think not playing with a star is going to help Giddey or Matas. Neither should be leading a team as the best player at this point, and winning builds winning. We're one of the few teams you can point to and say, "There are no stars there."
Use Vucevic/Collins/Huerter/Ayo in conjunction with Coby and get a guy with a higher ceiling than Coby. Period.
Make that big push for Devin Booker, Jaylen Brown, Zion, Jimmy Butler (Yes, Jimmy Butler!), Gobert in that order. I'd give up one of Giddey or Matas if that's what it took to get Booker.
Infinity2152 wrote:Bulls need to stop playing these small moves and ante up for a real good player. I don't think not playing with a star is going to help Giddey or Matas. Neither should be leading a team as the best player at this point, and winning builds winning. We're one of the few teams you can point to and say, "There are no stars there."
Use Vucevic/Collins/Huerter/Ayo in conjunction with Coby and get a guy with a higher ceiling than Coby. Period.
Make that big push for Devin Booker, Jaylen Brown, Zion, Jimmy Butler (Yes, Jimmy Butler!), Gobert in that order. I'd give up one of Giddey or Matas if that's what it took to get Booker.