What Happens From Here

[wolffy]

On Stacey Kings podcast they mentioned the Bulls have the 5th most losses in the NBA since Jimmy Butler left.

All those losses should have equaled some good draft talent but highlights just how terrible AK has been. Getting rid of him should probably be whats next.

AK's draft record is a mixed bag. Its not awful like its made out to be. He has important hits and important misses.

The issue is less their draft acumen - which I'm not suggesting is affirmatively good - and more that those wins are spread out over a very long period of time illustrating that the organization has been unwilling to do what it takes to get better, which frequently involves getting much worse first. We would not do that. We stayed in hell. So we have a huge number of losses while never properly positioning ourselves to use draft-based assets (read: involves more than just tanking) to rebuild properly.

That is the outrageous folly of the AK era. The draft record, while frustratingly uneven, is a collateral concern.

That's really my point, the results they've achieved with wins and draft assets are both simultaneously poor. And im not even saying the picks they made were particularly bad (tho thats also not great), I'm saying the lack of draft capital. Its just ridiculous

If you lose this much you should be stacking picks and they should be high usually.

[Evil_Headband]

To me AK is looking to "spend" his expirings and at least 1, probably 2 picks to bring in one of the flawed "name" players at the deadline to show he's doing something. At this point, if he just pisses away 1 draft pick I'll be happy.

The worse the Bulls are at the deadline, the less likely he'll do this, in my opinion. If we look at where the Bulls were a few weeks ago, I would have agreed that this was a strong possibility.

Now? I recall AK mentioning in the offseason that they would be more methodical on the build this time. I think the most likely scenario is he doesn't rush it if the team continues to be bad. Maybe he'd spend on a young player that fits the timeline. I'd be shocked if there were a trade for someone like AD, Zion, Trae Young, etc.

But, really, who knows. I mentioned previously that I don't think AK has even decided what he wants to do yet.

[kodo]

I have no interest in Kuminga. Maybe I'd change my mind if Patrick Williams was part of the deal, but why would GS do that?

They wouldn't. They wanted Josh Giddey for Kuminga.

[MikeDC]

From here I see us slowly getting healthy and eventually playing better once again.

I think we make some largely inconsequential trade, one I like is a trade with the Clippers - 3 players for 3 players, all expirings.

Bulls in: Brook Lopez, John Collins, and Bogdan Bogdanovic

Clippers in: Vuc, Kevin Huerter, and Jevon Carter

Gives us much needed size (I'd start Collins at the 4), and paves the way for us to move on from Vuc.


Mostly I see us arguing about what this team is and isn't then having a lot of debates in the offseason and who we should re-sign vs use in a sign and trade.

We are not a top-heavy team with a star dragging a team to wins, we start one of the worst defensive lineups in the entire NBA. But when at full strength we are deep, which will win you regular season games.

It's really not that confusing to me.

I've tried to figure out something that would work like that, mostly because I think Collins is a low risk move, but I don't see why the Clippers would trade him. They're bad, but we don't seem to have what they need I think

If nothing else, it's a big decrease to their tax bill. Could decrease it even further by swapping our Carter for Terry or Phillips - which gives them a young guy to look at, and a lowered tax bill.

We have expirings and we have room below the tax. For someone like John Collins, I feel like it's all we really need.

Wow, I hadn't realized they were almost $7M into the tax. Yeah, that would save them $20M, which is a lot given their awful team.

[kodo]

Agree with #1, and KC has said the Bulls are targeting the Pacers as a model (ironic since the Pacers are the 2nd worst team in the EC) and KC gets his info straight from the org.

Who they would try and get as their "Siakam" piece that actually propelled Indiana to a winning team is going to be interesting. The pre-Siakam Pacers were a 35 W team (with Haliburton), which is very similar to where Chicago is headed.

I just fear that guy is Sabonis, because he fits the AK mold of player he wants and unlike other stars he's actually available like all Kings players. Vuc's expiring would save SAC $116M and he slides into what Sabonis did very easily for the rest of the season and helps their tank. Throw in the 2x 1st round picks we'll throw to Sacramento including this year's historic draft and I'm sure they'll agree.

[WindyCityBorn]

Yeah they should fire AK, ME, BD and even Benny The Bulls and hire the geniuses that none of the other 29 teams have hired who will turn things around and satisfy a bunch of 12 years olds married to their phones who have no clue about the NBA.

Right now, you wait to see if there's a chance you can put a healthy full roster out there to really see what you've got. Next man up sounds like great basketballspeak but it's BS. If the next guy up was as good at the first, you'd get him on the floor more. Backups come off the bench because they're not as good as the starters. Live with it. From day 1 Billy has said, we don't have much margin for error with this team, we have to show up every night to win games. Well when anywhere from 1-3 starters are out they aren't close to having enough to win most games even against the bottom tanking teams.

The joke in the NE until Tom Brady was always the two most popular athletes in Boston were the backup QB for the Patriots and the backup goalie for the Bruins. Every fan base thinks the guy they see the least of is the better player


I'm willing to get much closer to the deadline to see if the playoffs are in sight, if anybody in the top 8 goes down for the season then you might as well look at trading now but only if you think you can get more for players than you can over the summer, Going onto the summer with a lot of cap space for FAs or trades, Noa back healthy with a year of weights and watching film, their own pick is like having a pair of 1sts, the outside chance at the PORT pick, that's a good spot to be in.

At some point Brad Stevens was someone none of the other 29 teams had hired. Same thing with Greg Poppovich, Sam Presti, etc etc

So, what has AKME done that makes you think they're better than any of the "geniuses that none of the other 29 teams have hired."

The 1 winning season?

Is it the 1 play off win?

Please don't tell me you're still holding on to the start of the 21/22 season.

Their exemplary draft record in the 1st round of Pat Williams, Dalen Terry, Noa Essengue?

I'm 100% serious, what has AKME EVER done that could be seen as an unarguably positive move. The only one I can think of is signing AC but everything else has been at best "okay" and, more than likely, absolute dog ****.

Not a lot of good but the Ayo pick was solid and the Giddey trade was ok, especially if they can flip him for something else.

[drosestruts]

Agree with #1, and KC has said the Bulls are targeting the Pacers as a model (ironic since the Pacers are the 2nd worst team in the EC) and KC gets his info straight from the org.

Who they would try and get as their "Siakam" piece that actually propelled Indiana to a winning team is going to be interesting. The pre-Siakam Pacers were a 35 W team (with Haliburton), which is very similar to where Chicago is headed.

I just fear that guy is Sabonis, because he fits the AK mold of player he wants and unlike other stars he's actually available like all Kings players. Vuc's expiring would save SAC $116M and he slides into what Sabonis did very easily for the rest of the season and helps their tank. Throw in the 2x 1st round picks we'll throw to Sacramento including this year's historic draft and I'm sure they'll agree.

Sabonis would be such a funny move.

Don't get me wrong, he's no doubt better than Vuc, I looked at their last 3 years and we've got:

Sabonis: 19/14/7 per game on 58/39/72 shooting splits for a TS% of 64%

Vucevic: 18/10/3 per game on 50/35/81 shooting splits for a TS% of 57%

But many would melt out of frustration at our continued lack of paint protection

For me, when Sabonis comes up my initial reaction is "no thank you", followed very quickly by me going "well what would it cost?"

Cause there's certainly an answer to my second reaction that has me making the move.

[bledredwine]

Hey, look at the bright side.

Connor Bedard is having a hell of a season.

[sco]

Agree with #1, and KC has said the Bulls are targeting the Pacers as a model (ironic since the Pacers are the 2nd worst team in the EC) and KC gets his info straight from the org.

Who they would try and get as their "Siakam" piece that actually propelled Indiana to a winning team is going to be interesting. The pre-Siakam Pacers were a 35 W team (with Haliburton), which is very similar to where Chicago is headed.

I just fear that guy is Sabonis, because he fits the AK mold of player he wants and unlike other stars he's actually available like all Kings players. Vuc's expiring would save SAC $116M and he slides into what Sabonis did very easily for the rest of the season and helps their tank. Throw in the 2x 1st round picks we'll throw to Sacramento including this year's historic draft and I'm sure they'll agree.

Sabonis would be such a funny move.

Don't get me wrong, he's no doubt better than Vuc, I looked at their last 3 years and we've got:

Sabonis: 19/14/7 per game on 58/39/72 shooting splits for a TS% of 64%

Vucevic: 18/10/3 per game on 50/35/81 shooting splits for a TS% of 57%

But many would melt out of frustration at our continued lack of paint protection

For me, when Sabonis comes up my initial reaction is "no thank you", followed very quickly by me going "well what would it cost?"

Cause there's certainly an answer to my second reaction that has me making the move.

What deal is worth it to you? To me if it involves a pick, it better involve PWill. Sabonis and Vuc to me are analogous to great running quarterbacks who are bad passers. I see how it's easy to watch and say "wow look at that guy rack up the rushing yards", but I fail to see how it will bring the team closer to contending unless you go find a running back who is a great passer.

[burlydee]

Agree with #1, and KC has said the Bulls are targeting the Pacers as a model (ironic since the Pacers are the 2nd worst team in the EC) and KC gets his info straight from the org.

Who they would try and get as their "Siakam" piece that actually propelled Indiana to a winning team is going to be interesting. The pre-Siakam Pacers were a 35 W team (with Haliburton), which is very similar to where Chicago is headed.

I just fear that guy is Sabonis, because he fits the AK mold of player he wants and unlike other stars he's actually available like all Kings players. Vuc's expiring would save SAC $116M and he slides into what Sabonis did very easily for the rest of the season and helps their tank. Throw in the 2x 1st round picks we'll throw to Sacramento including this year's historic draft and I'm sure they'll agree.

Sabonis would be such a funny move.

Don't get me wrong, he's no doubt better than Vuc, I looked at their last 3 years and we've got:

Sabonis: 19/14/7 per game on 58/39/72 shooting splits for a TS% of 64%

Vucevic: 18/10/3 per game on 50/35/81 shooting splits for a TS% of 57%

But many would melt out of frustration at our continued lack of paint protection

For me, when Sabonis comes up my initial reaction is "no thank you", followed very quickly by me going "well what would it cost?"

Cause there's certainly an answer to my second reaction that has me making the move.

If the Bulls trade for Sabonis, the next move might as well be jumping into the sea.

[jordanwilliams6]

Agree with #1, and KC has said the Bulls are targeting the Pacers as a model (ironic since the Pacers are the 2nd worst team in the EC) and KC gets his info straight from the org.

Who they would try and get as their "Siakam" piece that actually propelled Indiana to a winning team is going to be interesting. The pre-Siakam Pacers were a 35 W team (with Haliburton), which is very similar to where Chicago is headed.

I just fear that guy is Sabonis, because he fits the AK mold of player he wants and unlike other stars he's actually available like all Kings players. Vuc's expiring would save SAC $116M and he slides into what Sabonis did very easily for the rest of the season and helps their tank. Throw in the 2x 1st round picks we'll throw to Sacramento including this year's historic draft and I'm sure they'll agree.

Sabonis would be such a funny move.

Don't get me wrong, he's no doubt better than Vuc, I looked at their last 3 years and we've got:

Sabonis: 19/14/7 per game on 58/39/72 shooting splits for a TS% of 64%

Vucevic: 18/10/3 per game on 50/35/81 shooting splits for a TS% of 57%

But many would melt out of frustration at our continued lack of paint protection

For me, when Sabonis comes up my initial reaction is "no thank you", followed very quickly by me going "well what would it cost?"

Cause there's certainly an answer to my second reaction that has me making the move.

If the Bulls trade for Sabonis, the next move might as well be jumping into the sea.

The fit could not be worse so it's exactly the sort of move I expect AKME to make.

The Bulls have been crying out for an athletic rim running C for years and AKME traded away one he inherited for nothing (Gafford). Sabonis a terrible fit with Giddey in the sense that on the defensive end we'd never even give ourselves a chance of winning long term.

[Indomitable]

Why even create this topic? You already know what the responses will be.

Why come into a topic if you know the results?

[step]

Depression and alcoholism? /raises whisky glass

[_txchilibowl_]

Why even create this topic? You already know what the responses will be.

Why come into a topic if you know the results?

I suppose that's fair. I guess just don't understand the value of another topic where the only responses will be a regurgitation of "FIRE AKME". If people are in to that then so be it.

[boozapalooza]

Why even create this topic? You already know what the responses will be.

Why come into a topic if you know the results?

I suppose that's fair. I guess just don't understand the value of another topic where the only responses will be a regurgitation of "FIRE AKME". If people are in to that then so be it.

I created it because I genuinely want to know what moves can be made to turn this around and/or what people think AKME will actually do next. They’re not gonna be fired this year. I think they will make a big move between now and the start of next year. Losing sucks but we do have a couple guys to build around with Giddey and Matas. Can’t dwell on the past, gotta look ahead.

[yifsuibfe1]

Following this franchise has become far too depressing. My interest has slowly decreased over the past few years. Even after the 5-0 start, I felt nothing.

I think I am finally going to fully cut ties this season.

[Indomitable]

Why even create this topic? You already know what the responses will be.

Why come into a topic if you know the results?

I suppose that's fair. I guess just don't understand the value of another topic where the only responses will be a regurgitation of "FIRE AKME". If people are in to that then so be it.

People express their frustration. Tell me what there is to believe in the franchise.

They are Sox like in their incompetence.

[Indomitable]

I created it because I genuinely want to know what moves can be made to turn this around and/or what people think AKME will actually do next. They’re not gonna be fired this year. I think they will make a big move between now and the start of next year. Losing sucks but we do have a couple guys to build around with Giddey and Matas. Can’t dwell on the past, gotta look ahead.

A comment to rebuilding and stop trying to avoid it.

Move Coby and valuable players for picks.