Bears 11.0: Free Agency, College Pro days, Draft & beyond

[JohnnyKILLroy]

We gotta hit on every draft pick for the next 5 drafts

[JohnnyKILLroy]

With the kind of money Poles is throwing out he better draft replacement players on both lines.

[fleet]

We gotta hit on every draft pick for the next 5 drafts

With the kind of money Poles is throwing out he better draft replacement players on both lines.

It’s going to take some balancing. Just get it right, basically. Which should have been done better before. Hopefully he has learned, snd or with Ben’s guidance and vision there is progression.

[dougthonus]

We gotta hit on every draft pick for the next 5 drafts

With the kind of money Poles is throwing out he better draft replacement players on both lines.

It’s going to take some balancing. Just get it right, basically. Which should have been done better before. Hopefully he has learned, snd or with Ben’s guidance and vision there is progression.

I don't know if there is a thing to learn here. We just need to have done better. He invested in the oline with picks and FAs, but the guys he invested in just didn't pan out as well as you would have hoped. In the end, I think it's one of these things where either you believe the draft has so much variability that you just kind of get lucky or don't and in the past we didn't get lucky, or our scouting department is simply not up to par.

If it is the 2nd of those things, what Poles needs to do is invest in better people on his staff to do evaluations. I'm sure he does some of that himself, like any decision maker, but all decision makers massively rely on a huge group of staff to inform and make decisions, so if the information he's getting isn't good enough, it is about being bold enough to replace the staff.

[nomorezorro]

poles going all in on 2025. cap hits:

2025

10.5 jackson
8.0 dayo

2026

25.0 jackson
20.5 dayo

what a clown. why are these guys even on the team? a rotational EDGE replacing the same. and a guy coming off injury who can't pass protect - give that man an extension!

poor man's 2018 pop up season incoming?

i instinctually dislike the structure of the jackson contract, but i think this is more about pushing salary off to a season when you'll have $22+ million coming off the cap with the departure of edmunds/swift than it is about "going all in" this year. we haven't even begun to leverage our ability to restructure contracts to open up cap flexibility, and we can get out of the jackson/dayo contracts after 2026 so even if things go sour it's not like they're long-term albatrosses

you can criticize poles's ability to maximize the value of the cap space he's allocating, but when it comes to big-picture cap health we're still totally fine for now

[Jeffster81]

With the kind of money Poles is throwing out he better draft replacement players on both lines.

He had to do that anyways.

[panthermark]

I think there's a lot of reasons why Rome saw fewer targets, but it's hard to blame it Keenan Allen not being moved. For one thing, Allen seemed to have the best chemistry with Caleb. So why would you trade your rookie QB's favorite target when he's struggling so badly to begin with? another reason might be that the Bears O line was so poor last year and Rome might have been running more deep routes, which Caleb didn't have time for. Another reason might be that Rome just didn't get open as often- that was one knock on him coming out of college- his inability to get separation.

Also the Bears offense as a whole was one of the worst in the league, so ran fewer plays, and fewer pass plays.

Rome may have been unique in that he was drafted top 10 but was WR3 on his team. I don't know how many WR's in the past 10 years went into a situation like that. The thinking obviously was to give Caleb a lot of targets. Turned it that having targets wasn't the issue- it was having enough time to throw. Plus a crappy offense by Waldron.

In any case, I don't see how Rome "got shafted". If that applies to anyone, it was Kmet, and it was to his credit that he never complained about that one bit. Rome willl get his opportunities this year. Let's see what he makes of them.

I wanted him moved because the chemistry was irrelevant.

He was brought in Mooney left. It made perfect sense at the time of the trade, but we lucked into Odunze being at #9.
Early on, KA was hurt and even when he came back, the team was out of synch and not getting W's.
I don't care if KA was CW's favorite target if the team was still losing and CW was still struggling. In the end, him being here didn't really help. His favorite target produced 744 yards and had one of the lowest catch percentages on the team even though he was a possession WR.
Moore, Rome, and Kmet (and Swift and Rosch and Scott) are all younger, and have longer contracts. Those are the guys that needed the reps and chemistry for this upcoming season. If it would have been a situation like Fields/Moore where CW/KA was the best QB combo in the league, or the Bears would have been winning games, then I would not have wanted him traded at the deadline.

KA probably won't even be here in 2025, which in the end makes trading for him, coupled with not moving him, a bust of a move and a waste of a 4th.


As for Odunze getting the shaft, that was really in the context of all the other rookie pass catchers drafted in the 1st round, but yes, Kmet got screwed as well. Lowest targets since his rookie season.

So you have a rookie QB who is struggling, and you want to take away from him the one guy he seems to have some confidence in? That's like pulling the lifejacket away from a guy who just fell overboard. And who knows if Poles didn't try to trade him but there were no takers? There was always hope that things would turn around, too, and that having 3 good WR's would help Caleb and the offense start to get going. I can't fault Poles for letting it play out, or for trading for Allen in the first place.

Yes, because that 32, soon to be 33 year old life jacket isn't part of the long term future, AND the team wasn't winning. You make it sound like it was some type of awesome connection being disrupted, but it wasn't. A possession WR with a 57.9 catch % is awful.

I would have a hard time believing Poles could not find a taker for KA considering the other WR's that were moved at the deadline and that he managed to find a taker for Herbert. My guess is that he didn't like the return (something like trading a 4th for him, but could only get back a 6th at the deadline), so he stood pat. Sunk cost fallacy at is finest.

CW was struggling because he can't throw deep, part of it is on CW, part of it is on the line.

Push your argument forward. If KA isn't here this coming season, are you suddenly OK with CW being "forced" to throw to Moore/Odunze/Kmet? Why? Why would it be OK now, but not during the 2nd half of a 5-12 season?

[Dresden]

poles going all in on 2025. cap hits:

2025

10.5 jackson
8.0 dayo

2026

25.0 jackson
20.5 dayo

what a clown. why are these guys even on the team? a rotational EDGE replacing the same. and a guy coming off injury who can't pass protect - give that man an extension!

poor man's 2018 pop up season incoming?

i instinctually dislike the structure of the jackson contract, but i think this is more about pushing salary off to a season when you'll have $22+ million coming off the cap with the departure of edmunds/swift than it is about "going all in" this year. we haven't even begun to leverage our ability to restructure contracts to open up cap flexibility, and we can get out of the jackson/dayo contracts after 2026 so even if things go sour it's not like they're long-term albatrosses

you can criticize poles's ability to maximize the value of the cap space he's allocating, but when it comes to big-picture cap health we're still totally fine for now

That's a good way to look at it.

[jnrjr79]

Fields on why he signed with the Jets over the Steelers:

“I think, No. 1, coach (Aaron) Glenn,” Fields told newyorkjets.com reporter Ethan Greenberg. “I’ve played against him early in my career. I know how passionate he is about the game, the way he coaches, the way his players play. So I think that was the biggest thing for me. And just the opportunity, the fans, of course, the city. When you win here, there’s no better place to win. Those reasons are ultimately why I ended up here.”

I thought Tomlin was generally considered a coach that players loved to play for so it is a bit surprising Justin seemed to prefer Aaron Glenn over Tomlin. Of course, Fields did get benched last year by Tomlin, so there's that.

Yeah, Tomlin may be a good guy to play for generally, but Justin probably feels like he got screwed over being benched after going 4-2. And the Steelers weren't promising him a starting role next season, AFAIK.

Relatedly, Najee Harris was recently vaguely critical of what it was like to play for the Steelers, so maybe it's not as fun for the players as it seems.

[Dresden]

I wanted him moved because the chemistry was irrelevant.

He was brought in Mooney left. It made perfect sense at the time of the trade, but we lucked into Odunze being at #9.
Early on, KA was hurt and even when he came back, the team was out of synch and not getting W's.
I don't care if KA was CW's favorite target if the team was still losing and CW was still struggling. In the end, him being here didn't really help. His favorite target produced 744 yards and had one of the lowest catch percentages on the team even though he was a possession WR.
Moore, Rome, and Kmet (and Swift and Rosch and Scott) are all younger, and have longer contracts. Those are the guys that needed the reps and chemistry for this upcoming season. If it would have been a situation like Fields/Moore where CW/KA was the best QB combo in the league, or the Bears would have been winning games, then I would not have wanted him traded at the deadline.

KA probably won't even be here in 2025, which in the end makes trading for him, coupled with not moving him, a bust of a move and a waste of a 4th.


As for Odunze getting the shaft, that was really in the context of all the other rookie pass catchers drafted in the 1st round, but yes, Kmet got screwed as well. Lowest targets since his rookie season.

So you have a rookie QB who is struggling, and you want to take away from him the one guy he seems to have some confidence in? That's like pulling the lifejacket away from a guy who just fell overboard. And who knows if Poles didn't try to trade him but there were no takers? There was always hope that things would turn around, too, and that having 3 good WR's would help Caleb and the offense start to get going. I can't fault Poles for letting it play out, or for trading for Allen in the first place.

Yes, because that 32, soon to be 33 year old life jacket isn't part of the long term future, AND the team wasn't winning. You make it sound like it was some type of awesome connection being disrupted, but it wasn't. A possession WR with a 57.9 catch % is awful.

I would have a hard time believing Poles could not find a taker for KA considering the other WR's that were moved at the deadline and that he managed to find a taker for Herbert. My guess is that he didn't like the return (something like trading a 4th for him, but could only get back a 6th at the deadline), so he stood pat. Sunk cost fallacy at is finest.

CW was struggling because he can't throw deep, part of it is on CW, part of it is on the line.

Push your argument forward. If KA isn't here this coming season, are you suddenly OK with CW being "forced" to throw to Moore/Odunze/Kmet? Why? Why would it be OK now, but not during the 2nd half of a 5-12 season?

At the time, I don't think they knew Allen wouldn't be part of the future. I think it's quite possible they thought they would like to re-sign him if the price was right. And I suppose they still might- he doesn't seem to be getting any offers elsewhere, unless I missed something. In any case, I don't know why you'd want to make it any more difficult than it already was for your young QB. Without Allen, defenses would be able to concentrate more on DJ, Rome and Kmet, etc. And you'd have to promote someone else to Allen's position, someone who maybe doesn't know the plays and the routes as well, which would make it harder for everyone.

[sco]

So you have a rookie QB who is struggling, and you want to take away from him the one guy he seems to have some confidence in? That's like pulling the lifejacket away from a guy who just fell overboard. And who knows if Poles didn't try to trade him but there were no takers? There was always hope that things would turn around, too, and that having 3 good WR's would help Caleb and the offense start to get going. I can't fault Poles for letting it play out, or for trading for Allen in the first place.

Yes, because that 32, soon to be 33 year old life jacket isn't part of the long term future, AND the team wasn't winning. You make it sound like it was some type of awesome connection being disrupted, but it wasn't. A possession WR with a 57.9 catch % is awful.

I would have a hard time believing Poles could not find a taker for KA considering the other WR's that were moved at the deadline and that he managed to find a taker for Herbert. My guess is that he didn't like the return (something like trading a 4th for him, but could only get back a 6th at the deadline), so he stood pat. Sunk cost fallacy at is finest.

CW was struggling because he can't throw deep, part of it is on CW, part of it is on the line.

Push your argument forward. If KA isn't here this coming season, are you suddenly OK with CW being "forced" to throw to Moore/Odunze/Kmet? Why? Why would it be OK now, but not during the 2nd half of a 5-12 season?

At the time, I don't think they knew Allen wouldn't be part of the future. I think it's quite possible they thought they would like to re-sign him if the price was right. And I suppose they still might- he doesn't seem to be getting any offers elsewhere, unless I missed something. In any case, I don't know why you'd want to make it any more difficult than it already was for your young QB. Without Allen, defenses would be able to concentrate more on DJ, Rome and Kmet, etc. And you'd have to promote someone else to Allen's position, someone who maybe doesn't know the plays and the routes as well, which would make it harder for everyone.

How many capable receiving options does he need? Add Zaccheaus to that mix. CW has no excuses. I'm really worried that CW doesn't ever get over his yips, but the team has done about as much as a team can do to help him.

[Almost Retired]

After losing Jaylon Jones to Arizona we're going to have to draft a cornerback no later than the 3rd round. Which is why trading down would be the best option for the #10 pick. Unless it's Jeanty or Warren it's doubtful that our #10 pick would even start. We could use at least one extra Day 2 pick. We can draft for depth at DT, the O-Line, CB, S, WR3, and EDGE. Two CBs that we could probably get late 2nd/early 3rd round are Maxwell Hairston of KY who is a little small but really burned the 40 at 4.28 at the combine. Darien Porter from Iowas State also looks promising. He's bigger and has run the 40 in 4.30. We have to have some roster protection in case of injury. We've also lost some Special Teams players. I'd let Hightower pick our 6th and 7th rounders with the plan to utilize them on Special Teams.

[fleet]

poles going all in on 2025. cap hits:

2025

10.5 jackson
8.0 dayo

2026

25.0 jackson
20.5 dayo

what a clown. why are these guys even on the team? a rotational EDGE replacing the same. and a guy coming off injury who can't pass protect - give that man an extension!

poor man's 2018 pop up season incoming?

i instinctually dislike the structure of the jackson contract, but i think this is more about pushing salary off to a season when you'll have $22+ million coming off the cap with the departure of edmunds/swift than it is about "going all in" this year. we haven't even begun to leverage our ability to restructure contracts to open up cap flexibility, and we can get out of the jackson/dayo contracts after 2026 so even if things go sour it's not like they're long-term albatrosses

you can criticize poles's ability to maximize the value of the cap space he's allocating, but when it comes to big-picture cap health we're still totally fine for now

the funny thing that happens is that when you acquire top talent, you end up paying for it and you’re capped. And vice versa. Not to mention the Bears haven’t paid a quarterback in years. There’s not a ton of $$ management magic going on. It’s very straightforward.

[nomorezorro]

ok? i'm just saying that we're not really close to being in the same situation we were after 2018, because the contracts on the books now can't feasibly come back to haunt us 2-3 years down the line

[panthermark]

So you have a rookie QB who is struggling, and you want to take away from him the one guy he seems to have some confidence in? That's like pulling the lifejacket away from a guy who just fell overboard. And who knows if Poles didn't try to trade him but there were no takers? There was always hope that things would turn around, too, and that having 3 good WR's would help Caleb and the offense start to get going. I can't fault Poles for letting it play out, or for trading for Allen in the first place.

Yes, because that 32, soon to be 33 year old life jacket isn't part of the long term future, AND the team wasn't winning. You make it sound like it was some type of awesome connection being disrupted, but it wasn't. A possession WR with a 57.9 catch % is awful.

I would have a hard time believing Poles could not find a taker for KA considering the other WR's that were moved at the deadline and that he managed to find a taker for Herbert. My guess is that he didn't like the return (something like trading a 4th for him, but could only get back a 6th at the deadline), so he stood pat. Sunk cost fallacy at is finest.

CW was struggling because he can't throw deep, part of it is on CW, part of it is on the line.

Push your argument forward. If KA isn't here this coming season, are you suddenly OK with CW being "forced" to throw to Moore/Odunze/Kmet? Why? Why would it be OK now, but not during the 2nd half of a 5-12 season?

At the time, I don't think they knew Allen wouldn't be part of the future. I think it's quite possible they thought they would like to re-sign him if the price was right. And I suppose they still might- he doesn't seem to be getting any offers elsewhere, unless I missed something. In any case, I don't know why you'd want to make it any more difficult than it already was for your young QB. Without Allen, defenses would be able to concentrate more on DJ, Rome and Kmet, etc. And you'd have to promote someone else to Allen's position, someone who maybe doesn't know the plays and the routes as well, which would make it harder for everyone.

At the time they traded for KA, they would not have known what the future holds, even if they knew KA wasn't on the same time-line as CW.

But the moment they drafted Odunze, they SHOULD have known. That was obvious. Whether KA re-signs or not, the connections need to be with Odunze, Moore, and Kmet.

It it isn't like he didn't have anyone to throw to. DJ (who would have been 27 all last season) had 96 catches for 1364 yards and 8TD's the previous season. Throw in Kmet and a top 10 draft pick...and I would say that a lack of options was not the problem. Using your own logic, KA should have a magical season because of all the attention everyone was drawing, but that didn't happen. CW could only throw screens to Moore, and ignore Kmet for games at a time. That needs to be addressed.

[biggestbullsfan]

Read on Twitter

Sad way to go out smh

[fleet]

Wow. I didn’t realize that anyone was still held accountable for anything.

He didn’t actually dox anyone. He was fired for threatening to do something. Fired for being a dick. Which is your prerogative as a radio station for sure. He must not have had good enough ratings. They’ve been shuffling the lineup with him lately. I never like his know everything showboaty attitude about knowing everything.

[jnrjr79]

Wow. I didn’t realize that anyone was still held accountable for anything.

He didn’t actually dox anyone. He was fired for threatening to do something. Fired for being a dick. Which is your prerogative as a radio station for sure. He must not have had good enough ratings. They’ve been shuffling the lineup with him lately. I never like his know everything showboaty attitude about knowing everything.

Actually, Bernstein had the highest ratings of any Chicago sports talk show:

The “Spiegel & Holmes” afternoon show rated first in its time slot (2-6 p.m.) in the Chicago market among men aged 25-54 with a 5.9 share. The “Bernstein & Harris” midday show, with twice-weekly appearances by Leila Rahimi, ranked second in its spot (10 a.m.-2 p.m.) with a 7.4 share, the highest of the station’s shows. It trailed WLS-FM, which had a 9.5 share.

https://chicago.suntimes.com/sports-media/2024/12/24/the-scores-new-shows-earn-high-marks-in-fall-ratings-book

[Dresden]

Yes, because that 32, soon to be 33 year old life jacket isn't part of the long term future, AND the team wasn't winning. You make it sound like it was some type of awesome connection being disrupted, but it wasn't. A possession WR with a 57.9 catch % is awful.

I would have a hard time believing Poles could not find a taker for KA considering the other WR's that were moved at the deadline and that he managed to find a taker for Herbert. My guess is that he didn't like the return (something like trading a 4th for him, but could only get back a 6th at the deadline), so he stood pat. Sunk cost fallacy at is finest.

CW was struggling because he can't throw deep, part of it is on CW, part of it is on the line.

Push your argument forward. If KA isn't here this coming season, are you suddenly OK with CW being "forced" to throw to Moore/Odunze/Kmet? Why? Why would it be OK now, but not during the 2nd half of a 5-12 season?

At the time, I don't think they knew Allen wouldn't be part of the future. I think it's quite possible they thought they would like to re-sign him if the price was right. And I suppose they still might- he doesn't seem to be getting any offers elsewhere, unless I missed something. In any case, I don't know why you'd want to make it any more difficult than it already was for your young QB. Without Allen, defenses would be able to concentrate more on DJ, Rome and Kmet, etc. And you'd have to promote someone else to Allen's position, someone who maybe doesn't know the plays and the routes as well, which would make it harder for everyone.

At the time they traded for KA, they would not have known what the future holds, even if they knew KA wasn't on the same time-line as CW.

But the moment they drafted Odunze, they SHOULD have known. That was obvious. Whether KA re-signs or not, the connections need to be with Odunze, Moore, and Kmet.

It it isn't like he didn't have anyone to throw to. DJ (who would have been 27 all last season) had 96 catches for 1364 yards and 8TD's the previous season. Throw in Kmet and a top 10 draft pick...and I would say that a lack of options was not the problem. Using your own logic, KA should have a magical season because of all the attention everyone was drawing, but that didn't happen. CW could only throw screens to Moore, and ignore Kmet for games at a time. That needs to be addressed.

Well I think that was the logic of Poles/Flus/Waldron in taking Odunze, even with DJ and KA. Having 3 credible WR's, plus Kmet, plus Swift, SHOULD have lead to a prolific offense. But they miscalculated badly on how poor the O line would be, and that Waldron would not be able to make any adjustments.

I think you're wrong to write off KA just because he was older and on a one year deal. He was brought in to be a veteran presence that knew how to get open- just because they drafted Odunze should not have suddenly made KA irrelevant.

[fleet]

ok? i'm just saying that we're not really close to being in the same situation we were after 2018, because the contracts on the books now can't feasibly come back to haunt us 2-3 years down the line

I’m agreeing that running non core type players up to the point where Caleb’s next contract starts to comes online is correct. I’m just not agreeing with the oft expressed idea that Poles has done some kind of masterful job with the cap during his tenure. The Bears cap figures has reflected a relative lack of premium talent acquired during his tenure to this point.