Just Sad, "Chicago sees deadliest Memorial Day weekend in four years"

[jc23]

So the comment from the Minneapolis Mayor and Gov that 80% of the protesters arrested was made up? i also saw the president jumped on that false truth as well.

It really is difficult to take any new story as the truth, seems like you need to let it marinate for a week before you can make a honest decision on something. I wish people held the media more responsible for what they reported but so much of information also travels from social media sites, so i cant entirely blame them.

[Dresden]

Spoiler:

horses**t. obama bent over backwards to avoid being divisive. because it's not in his nature, because he knew that his legacy as the first black president was important, because he knew that his opposition was desperate to depict him as "angry black man" despite the reality that he is just the opposite, and because he didn't want to give people like you ammunition. that quote was said privately and is typically, as you have conveniently done, taken out of context. it was an expression of understanding for why in the world anybody would, for example, vote for a two bit con man for president. because their fear stems from economic anxiety in an economy that has shifted away from the kinds of jobs they used to be able to depend on. and right wing politicians take advantage of that fear

https://theweek.com/articles/610945/how-obama-diagnosed-trumpism-way-back-2008

the black community, probably rightfully, often did not think that obama advocated for their interests sufficiently. hell, when pressured to weigh in about a black harvard professor being arrested by a white officer for attempting to enter his own home, obama did about the whitest thing ever: he held a "beer summit" with the two men



yeah, THAT guy inflamed racial tensions. you know what inflamed racial tensions? the underbelly of the republican party coming out of the woodwork in response to the election of a black president. the result: birtherism and donald trump




cherry picking the rare instances when obama said anything that could even be CONSTRUED as divisive is hardly a counterpoint to what we're seeing with trump. there are probably websites devoted to tallying all the divisive crap he says, just as there are to the over 18,000 lies he has told as president

Obama depicted rural, white voters as an other. Obama never tried to understand and help white voters. Wasn't his constituency, didn't care. Said jobs weren't coming back. This directly led to Trump.

Obama inflamed race relations by speaking out prematurely in every controversial situation, always was trying to point a finger before the facts came out while legitimizing BLM and undermining law enforcement.

This shouldn't even be a debate, there's polls everywhere that show the country has become much more polarized racially since Obama became president.

He helped millions of those white voters health insurance, that they didn't have before. It's rubbish to say that wasn't his constituency. You can't get elected just on the minority vote. He got the country out of the worst economic meltdown since the 1920's, and that helped everybody. Just because the country became more polarized doesn't mean it was due to Obama. And a lot of that is due to so many white people being upset that we had a black president.

[gardenofsound]

Regarding Englewood, Garfield Park, Austin, etc.

Do some research on HOW those neighborhoods got to be the way they are now. The segregation in Chicago was no mistake. It was fully intentional and well coordinated, between the city, realtors, and banks/lenders.

It's disingenuous to blame the current state of those neighborhoods for the city's segregation. The implied effect is actually the cause, and vice versa.

https://www.npr.org/sections/codeswitch/2016/04/11/473414348/talking-housing-segregation-and-chicago-with-wbez-s-natalie-moore

[Bluewaterheaven]

What blows my mind about this case specifically is it is not a racial case. Two arresting officers are White, one Black, and one Asian. The one white guy was the only one to speak up, but it was done poorly and quickly silenced.

No this is a police issue. The militarization of police and their us vs them mentality has got to be destroyed. But some many people want to turn it into a racial issue that message is getting lost in the weeds.

Get rid of the thin blue line

[bullsnewdynasty]

highly simple-minded response. it's common knowledge that black people, for example, are imprisoned on drug charges at a substantially higher rate than white people. there is systematic inequality in policing, legislatively, and in sentencing

Don't dumb down the argument to petty drug possession and ignore shootings, assault, selling drugs, armed robbery, and worse.

because it's more dangerous. nobody wants to live in a more dangerous area. so why are those areas more dangerous? poverty. additionally, there have been historical efforts made on the part of the city to segregate communities on racial lines

It's more dangerous because the crime rate is astronomical.

There's plenty of poverty in the world, yet for some reason only the South and West sides of Chicago is violence blamed on poverty and not the people committing the crimes.

Actually, it's not just those areas. Violence and poverty go hand in hand in many areas in the US. Read some sociology on the connection between the two. Look at rates of violent crimes in areas like the poorer parts of the Deep South (including many predominantly white areas). It's nothing to do with the color of one's skin, and everything to do with economic inequality, and generations of discrimination.

Stop blaming violence on poverty and admit there's a serious culture problem in black communities in Chicago.

If we're going to talk about societal issues then let's put it all on the table and not be afraid of talking about it.

[gardenofsound]

Don't dumb down the argument to petty drug possession and ignore shootings, assault, selling drugs, armed robbery, and worse.



It's more dangerous because the crime rate is astronomical.

There's plenty of poverty in the world, yet for some reason only the South and West sides of Chicago is violence blamed on poverty and not the people committing the crimes.

Actually, it's not just those areas. Violence and poverty go hand in hand in many areas in the US. Read some sociology on the connection between the two. Look at rates of violent crimes in areas like the poorer parts of the Deep South (including many predominantly white areas). It's nothing to do with the color of one's skin, and everything to do with economic inequality, and generations of discrimination.

Stop blaming violence on poverty and admit there's a serious culture problem in black communities in Chicago.

If we're going to talk about societal issues then let's put it all on the table and not be afraid of talking about it.

Regarding Englewood, Garfield Park, Austin, etc.

Do some research on HOW those neighborhoods got to be the way they are now. The segregation in Chicago was no mistake. It was fully intentional and well coordinated, between the city, realtors, and banks/lenders.

It's disingenuous to blame the current state of those neighborhoods for the city's segregation. The implied effect is actually the cause, and vice versa.

https://www.npr.org/sections/codeswitch/2016/04/11/473414348/talking-housing-segregation-and-chicago-with-wbez-s-natalie-moore

Sure, let's talk about it.

[bullsnewdynasty]

Regarding Englewood, Garfield Park, Austin, etc.

Do some research on HOW those neighborhoods got to be the way they are now. The segregation in Chicago was no mistake. It was fully intentional and well coordinated, between the city, realtors, and banks/lenders.

It's disingenuous to blame the current state of those neighborhoods for the city's segregation. The implied effect is actually the cause, and vice versa.

https://www.npr.org/sections/codeswitch/2016/04/11/473414348/talking-housing-segregation-and-chicago-with-wbez-s-natalie-moore

If they were safe, they wouldn't be segregated. Hence why neighborhoods become gentrified and others don't.

Why don't we have protests over Chicago violence? Far more lives get ruined.

[musiqsoulchild]

Don't dumb down the argument to petty drug possession and ignore shootings, assault, selling drugs, armed robbery, and worse.



It's more dangerous because the crime rate is astronomical.

There's plenty of poverty in the world, yet for some reason only the South and West sides of Chicago is violence blamed on poverty and not the people committing the crimes.

Actually, it's not just those areas. Violence and poverty go hand in hand in many areas in the US. Read some sociology on the connection between the two. Look at rates of violent crimes in areas like the poorer parts of the Deep South (including many predominantly white areas). It's nothing to do with the color of one's skin, and everything to do with economic inequality, and generations of discrimination.

Stop blaming violence on poverty and admit there's a serious culture problem in black communities in Chicago.

If we're going to talk about societal issues then let's put it all on the table and not be afraid of talking about it.

Ugh!

There is a serious problem with your assertion.

[musiqsoulchild]

Regarding Englewood, Garfield Park, Austin, etc.

Do some research on HOW those neighborhoods got to be the way they are now. The segregation in Chicago was no mistake. It was fully intentional and well coordinated, between the city, realtors, and banks/lenders.

It's disingenuous to blame the current state of those neighborhoods for the city's segregation. The implied effect is actually the cause, and vice versa.

https://www.npr.org/sections/codeswitch/2016/04/11/473414348/talking-housing-segregation-and-chicago-with-wbez-s-natalie-moore

If they were safe, they wouldn't be segregated. Hence why neighborhoods become gentrified and others don't.

Why don't we have protests over Chicago violence? Far more lives get ruined.

You're putting the tail before the head.

Daley Sr...and before him several leaders created clear lines of division along racial lines.

That's how urban planning was done. You dont have to take my word for it. Just educate yourself on this. Please.

[musiqsoulchild]

Mods...can we change the thread title to George Floyd Protests. Or maybe add that as well to the thread title.

[gardenofsound]

Actually, it's not just those areas. Violence and poverty go hand in hand in many areas in the US. Read some sociology on the connection between the two. Look at rates of violent crimes in areas like the poorer parts of the Deep South (including many predominantly white areas). It's nothing to do with the color of one's skin, and everything to do with economic inequality, and generations of discrimination.

Stop blaming violence on poverty and admit there's a serious culture problem in black communities in Chicago.

If we're going to talk about societal issues then let's put it all on the table and not be afraid of talking about it.

Regarding Englewood, Garfield Park, Austin, etc.

Do some research on HOW those neighborhoods got to be the way they are now. The segregation in Chicago was no mistake. It was fully intentional and well coordinated, between the city, realtors, and banks/lenders.

It's disingenuous to blame the current state of those neighborhoods for the city's segregation. The implied effect is actually the cause, and vice versa.

https://www.npr.org/sections/codeswitch/2016/04/11/473414348/talking-housing-segregation-and-chicago-with-wbez-s-natalie-moore

Sure, let's talk about it.

Culture problem in the black communities?

How about culture problems in the white communities? Let's start with the source of the demand for the drugs that are seemingly the cause of the "black community"?

Let's talk about the lack of any real above-board job and economic opportunities in black neighborhoods.

Let's talk about economic decay. Let's talk about the redlining and white flight that spurred such economic decay.

Let's talk about property values STILL being negatively impacted by the presence of black folks in a neighborhood.

Let's talk about how much harder it is for black folks to get a home loan or be accepted for a lease in traditionally non-black areas that makes it that much harder for them to get out of their neighborhood/situation.

Let's talk about the lack of access quality healthcare in black communities, and the cost of healthcare.

Let's talk about the proportion of white kids to black kids in the prominent magnet schools of Chicago in comparison to the overall population spread. Then let's also talk about how hard it is for those kids to get to and from said magnet schools if they actually get in. Let's then dig even further into the lack of strong elementary schools and after school programs in those neighborhoods.

I want to talk about the root causes of the cultural issues you are referencing in the black community, and I want us to acknowledge that there are a LOT of factors that are not within their control.

Street gangs used to provide above board after school care and education to kids. Seriously, they did.

[musiqsoulchild]

Stop blaming violence on poverty and admit there's a serious culture problem in black communities in Chicago.

If we're going to talk about societal issues then let's put it all on the table and not be afraid of talking about it.

Regarding Englewood, Garfield Park, Austin, etc.

Do some research on HOW those neighborhoods got to be the way they are now. The segregation in Chicago was no mistake. It was fully intentional and well coordinated, between the city, realtors, and banks/lenders.

It's disingenuous to blame the current state of those neighborhoods for the city's segregation. The implied effect is actually the cause, and vice versa.

https://www.npr.org/sections/codeswitch/2016/04/11/473414348/talking-housing-segregation-and-chicago-with-wbez-s-natalie-moore

Sure, let's talk about it.

Culture problem in the black communities?

How about culture problems in the white communities? Let's start with the source of the demand for the drugs that are seemingly the cause of the "black community"?

Let's talk about the lack of any real above-board job and economic opportunities in black neighborhoods.

Let's talk about economic decay. Let's talk about the redlining and white flight that spurred such economic decay.

Let's talk about property values STILL being negatively impacted by the presence of black folks in a neighborhood.

Let's talk about how much harder it is for black folks to get a home loan or be accepted for a lease in traditionally non-black areas that makes it that much harder for them to get out of their neighborhood/situation.

Let's talk about the lack of access quality healthcare in black communities, and the cost of healthcare.

Let's talk about the proportion of white kids to black kids in the prominent magnet schools of Chicago in comparison to the overall population spread. Then let's also talk about how hard it is for those kids to get to and from said magnet schools if they actually get in. Let's then dig even further into the lack of strong elementary schools and after school programs in those neighborhoods.

I want to talk about the root causes of the cultural issues you are referencing in the black community, and I want us to acknowledge that there are a LOT of factors that are not within their control.

Street gangs used to provide above board after school care and education to kids. Seriously, they did.

Straight spittin facts!

You saved me a bunch of typing.

I find the idea of "problems with black culture" inherently abhorrent.

[Ben Wilson25]

A neighborhood is only as good as the people that are in it. If the people are good the neighborhoods good. If the people are bad the neighborhoods bad. A big reason why there's never any progress made is because those neighborhood leaders won't admit there's a problem there , and instead deflects blame to the cops, teachers, politicians, etc. In order to solve a problem, you have to face the fact that there is one.

You have no idea what you’re talking about. The vast majority of people in Englewood, Austin etc are honest, decent hard-working people just like any other neighborhood. Let’s say there are 1000 people in a 3 block radius. 990 of them are those good people and 10 (1%) are hardcore gangbangers, usually carrying a gun and with zero fear of the police. A couple of those gangbangers decide to set up shop on your stoop. You step outside and ask them to leave and they tell you where you can shove it. You call the cops. The cops show up and they scatter. Guess what, they know where you live and what you look like. You have to walk out of the house every day to go to the store or work. Now you’re terrified to go anywhere. What do you do?

Let’s say you’re a mother and decide to start a group called Mothers Against Senseless Killings (MASK) to do exactly what racists say your neighborhood won’t do and protest the violence and put your life on the line to stand on corners trying to patrol your own neighborhood. That’s exactly what Chantelle Grant and Andrea Stoudemire were doing when they were gunned down last summer https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/US/total-cowardice-chicago-mothers-killed-drive-shooting-taking/story%3fid=64653175. What do you do?

Don’t sit in your safe neighborhood and throw stones at the good people of these neighborhoods who are held hostage by a small group of domestic terrorists because you have zero idea of what their reality is really like.

[Dresden]

Don't dumb down the argument to petty drug possession and ignore shootings, assault, selling drugs, armed robbery, and worse.



It's more dangerous because the crime rate is astronomical.

There's plenty of poverty in the world, yet for some reason only the South and West sides of Chicago is violence blamed on poverty and not the people committing the crimes.

Actually, it's not just those areas. Violence and poverty go hand in hand in many areas in the US. Read some sociology on the connection between the two. Look at rates of violent crimes in areas like the poorer parts of the Deep South (including many predominantly white areas). It's nothing to do with the color of one's skin, and everything to do with economic inequality, and generations of discrimination.

Stop blaming violence on poverty and admit there's a serious culture problem in black communities in Chicago.

If we're going to talk about societal issues then let's put it all on the table and not be afraid of talking about it.

There is a serious cultural problem in black communities. Its the culture that gets created when you have generation after generation living in substandard housing, with poor access to quality education, poor access to health care, and poor economic prospects. It spawns violence, hopelessness, and making money through illegal means like drug trafficking. And it's got nothing to do with being black, other than the discrimination that exists and have made it harder for black communities to improve themselves than white communities.

You sound like you want to pin the blame on these places, as if they could just pull themselves up by their own bootstraps like everyone else. But anyone who grows up in that kind of environment is going to have a very tough time improving their lives. You can look at places like Appalachia (mainly white) that have similar problems with violence, lack of education, lack of job opportunities, rampant drug use and trafficking. That's just reality, and there is no one simple solution to it. It is a multi faceted problem that requires a broad range of programs and policies to correct, not half hearted measures.

[dice]

Spoiler:

horses**t. obama bent over backwards to avoid being divisive. because it's not in his nature, because he knew that his legacy as the first black president was important, because he knew that his opposition was desperate to depict him as "angry black man" despite the reality that he is just the opposite, and because he didn't want to give people like you ammunition. that quote was said privately and is typically, as you have conveniently done, taken out of context. it was an expression of understanding for why in the world anybody would, for example, vote for a two bit con man for president. because their fear stems from economic anxiety in an economy that has shifted away from the kinds of jobs they used to be able to depend on. and right wing politicians take advantage of that fear

https://theweek.com/articles/610945/how-obama-diagnosed-trumpism-way-back-2008

the black community, probably rightfully, often did not think that obama advocated for their interests sufficiently. hell, when pressured to weigh in about a black harvard professor being arrested by a white officer for attempting to enter his own home, obama did about the whitest thing ever: he held a "beer summit" with the two men



yeah, THAT guy inflamed racial tensions. you know what inflamed racial tensions? the underbelly of the republican party coming out of the woodwork in response to the election of a black president. the result: birtherism and donald trump




cherry picking the rare instances when obama said anything that could even be CONSTRUED as divisive is hardly a counterpoint to what we're seeing with trump. there are probably websites devoted to tallying all the divisive crap he says, just as there are to the over 18,000 lies he has told as president

Obama depicted rural, white voters as an other. Obama never tried to understand and help white voters. Wasn't his constituency, didn't care. Said jobs weren't coming back.

lies. you JUST quoted him out of context from a speech where he expressed understanding for the plight of rural, white voters. i explained this to you, you ignored it

This directly led to Trump.

birtherism has nothing to do with anything you just said

Obama inflamed race relations by speaking out prematurely in every controversial situation, always was trying to point a finger before the facts came out while legitimizing BLM and undermining law enforcement.

false. outright lie

first of all, nobody needs to legitimize a completely legitimate organization. secondly, obama has CONSISTENTLY, both as president and even THIS WEEK, advocated against violence in these protests. he has CONSISTENTLY been a calming voice, unlike the current resident of the white house. this is plain as day to an sane observer

i gave you the beer summit example. you made s**t up

This shouldn't even be a debate, there's polls everywhere that show the country has become much more polarized racially since Obama became president.

yes. i explained why, you ignored it. because racism no longer exists because a black president was elected, right? sheer ignorance, which you have proudly displayed throughout this thread. more reminders of the obama presidency:


















tip of the iceberg. countless republican officials and ordinary citizens nationwide were fired for posting crap like this

obama and his family were constantly attacked in the most vile ways. he remained cool as a cucumber. meanwhile, donald trump has daily tantrums

[musiqsoulchild]

A neighborhood is only as good as the people that are in it. If the people are good the neighborhoods good. If the people are bad the neighborhoods bad. A big reason why there's never any progress made is because those neighborhood leaders won't admit there's a problem there , and instead deflects blame to the cops, teachers, politicians, etc. In order to solve a problem, you have to face the fact that there is one.

You have no idea what you’re talking about. The vast majority of people in Englewood, Austin etc are honest, decent hard-working people just like any other neighborhood. Let’s say there are 1000 people in a 3 block radius. 990 of them are those good people and 10 (1%) are hardcore gangbangers, usually carrying a gun and with zero fear of the police. A couple of those gangbangers decide to set up shop on your stoop. You step outside and ask them to leave and they tell you where you can shove it. You call the cops. The cops show up and they scatter. Guess what, they know where you live and what you look like. You have to walk out of the house every day to go to the store or work. Now you’re terrified to go anywhere. What do you do?

Let’s say you’re a mother and decide to start a group called Mothers Against Senseless Killings (MASK) to do exactly what racists say your neighborhood won’t do and protest the violence and put your life on the line to stand on corners trying to patrol your own neighborhood. That’s exactly what Chantelle Grant and Andrea Stoudemire were doing when they were gunned down last summer https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/US/total-cowardice-chicago-mothers-killed-drive-shooting-taking/story%3fid=64653175. What do you do?

Don’t sit in your safe neighborhood and throw stones at the good people of these neighborhoods who are held hostage by a small group of domestic terrorists because you have zero idea of what their reality is really like.

Brilliant.

This was my experience as well on the South Side. And that's as an Indian student.

[Dresden]

LA is taking action:

Garcetti spoke of “reinvesting in black communities and communities of color.”

The mayor proceeded to announce $250 million in cuts to the proposed budget and to reallocate those dollars to communities of color, “so we can invest in jobs, in education and healing.” L.A. Police Commission President Eileen Decker then announced that $100 million-$150 million of those cuts would come from the police department budget.

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/los-angeles-mayor-eric-garcetti-013740738.html

[GetBuLLish]

Also, not all deaths are the same. If a suspect is shot by police because he's shot at them, that's a lot different than a suspect who gets killed because a cop is kneeling on his neck for 9 minutes.

There's no racial disparity between unarmed whites and unarmed blacks in terms of being killed by police. To the extent there is a disparity, it's against unarmed whites actually.

If it was all a lie, it wouldn't attract so many people to it.

This comment signifies a very basic misunderstanding of human history and human beings in general.

[dice]

Regarding Englewood, Garfield Park, Austin, etc.

Do some research on HOW those neighborhoods got to be the way they are now. The segregation in Chicago was no mistake. It was fully intentional and well coordinated, between the city, realtors, and banks/lenders.

It's disingenuous to blame the current state of those neighborhoods for the city's segregation. The implied effect is actually the cause, and vice versa.

https://www.npr.org/sections/codeswitch/2016/04/11/473414348/talking-housing-segregation-and-chicago-with-wbez-s-natalie-moore

If they were safe, they wouldn't be segregated. Hence why neighborhoods become gentrified and others don't.

Why don't we have protests over Chicago violence? Far more lives get ruined.

You're putting the tail before the head.

Daley Sr...and before him several leaders created clear lines of division along racial lines.

That's how urban planning was done. You dont have to take my word for it. Just educate yourself on this. Please.

he's had ample opportunity to educate himself. some people just don't want to be educated

[Dresden]

Also, not all deaths are the same. If a suspect is shot by police because he's shot at them, that's a lot different than a suspect who gets killed because a cop is kneeling on his neck for 9 minutes.

There's no racial disparity between unarmed whites and unarmed blacks in terms of being killed by police. To the extent there is a disparity, it's against unarmed whites actually.

If it was all a lie, it wouldn't attract so many people to it.

This comment signifies a very basic misunderstanding of human history and human beings in general.

I think the lack of basic understanding is on your part, not being able to comprehend what people are upset about, and believing that they are all being mislead by the media.