2018 Draft Thread Lucky #7

[erlim]

When I see what Gobert's presence means to the Utah Jazz, it's hard for me to argue against the idea of bringing Bamba over. He is the closest thing to Rudy Gobert we will find in years to come. He could be a generational player. We are one of the worst defensive teams in the league, so I am really down with that.

Yeah his presence means sooo much that they are always like a bottom seed in the west. What a real difference maker. If that's the going rate for generational difference makers I'll pass.

Exactly. Players like Gobert will never win anything as the best player on a team. Probably not even second best player. Deandre Jordan certainly didn't take the Clippers any where despite having Paul and Griffin. Defense only guys are extremely overrated. They are complimentary players only. Whiteside in Miami is another example. Noah was another.

Players that don't score are not players that should be considered franchise talents.

Bamba and JJJ are massive bust risks. More so than Young.

One time we built a team where Tyson Chandler was one of the most important of the core players. That worked out well.

[Dresden]

I'd be happy with Robert Williams as our defensive center and we can get him with the Pels pick most likely.

[Mech Engineer]

Yeah his presence means sooo much that they are always like a bottom seed in the west. What a real difference maker. If that's the going rate for generational difference makers I'll pass.

Exactly. Players like Gobert will never win anything as the best player on a team. Probably not even second best player. Deandre Jordan certainly didn't take the Clippers any where despite having Paul and Griffin. Defense only guys are extremely overrated. They are complimentary players only. Whiteside in Miami is another example. Noah was another.

Players that don't score are not players that should be considered franchise talents.

Bamba and JJJ are massive bust risks. More so than Young.

One time we built a team where Tyson Chandler was one of the most important of the core players. That worked out well.

Your Center doesn't have to be the best 2-way player but if he is the best defensive player, then you are doing well. Trying to find 2-way franchise players is like finding needle in a haystack. And, you rarely have that kind of players who are big. Most of those 2-way stars are wings.

If the goal is to find a 2-way franchise player, then keep drafting a wing player every year.

[kodo]

Rim protectors like Bamba are valuable, the argument against drafting him is if rim protector / rim runner is the best use of what will be our best pick in many years.

Where would Houston be if they had used all their pick assets to trade for a rim protector, instead of Harden and just picking up Capela at the bottom of the 1st round.
Where would GS be if they used their best picks on a rim protector instead of Steph or Klay, and just picking up Draymond in the 2nd round.

Generally, success has come from teams using their best assets (either 1 high pick or multiple picks in trade) to get your #1 option scorer & offensive players, and using mediocre picks to get defenders. Deandre, 35th pick. Gobert, 27th pick. Capela, 25th pick. Whiteside, 33rd pick.

Have we had any example of success from a team in the modern basketball era that used their best pick on a pure rim defender / rim runner? Guys like Embiid & Porzingis do not qualify, since they can do everything a guard can do.

The closest I can think of is Andre Drummond, picked #9.

That being said we're drafting in a position where Jakob Poltl and Thon Maker were selected, so I guess our primary worry is getting someone that even be a starter in this league and not another Sene (#10 pick by the Sonics, agile rim defender with a 7' 9" wingspan).

[sh0ck]

Rim protectors like Bamba are valuable, the argument against drafting him is if rim protector / rim runner is the best use of what will be our best pick in many years.

Where would Houston be if they had used all their pick assets to trade for a rim protector, instead of Harden and just picking up Capela at the bottom of the 1st round.
Where would GS be if they used their best picks on a rim protector instead of Steph or Klay, and just picking up Draymond in the 2nd round.

Generally, success has come from teams using their best assets (either 1 high pick or multiple picks in trade) to get your #1 option scorer & offensive players, and using mediocre picks to get defenders. Deandre, 35th pick. Gobert, 27th pick. Capela, 25th pick. Whiteside, 33rd pick.

Have we had any example of success from a team in the modern basketball era that used their best pick on a pure rim defender / rim runner? Guys like Embiid & Porzingis do not qualify, since they can do everything a guard can do.

The closest I can think of is Andre Drummond, picked #9.

That being said we're drafting in a position where Jakob Poltl and Thon Maker were selected, so I guess our primary worry is getting someone that even be a starter in this league and not another Sene (#10 pick by the Sonics, agile rim defender with a 7' 9" wingspan).

Or
Bismack Biyambo - #7
Hasshem Thabeet - #2
Willie Cauley-Stein - #6
Nerles Noel - #6
Tristan Thompson - #4

The downside of taking a guy like that at the top of the draft is pretty scary.

[DanTown8587]

Before I can answer Bamba v Bagley, I'd have to see how well Bagley measures. Watching them I'm impressed by Bagley's motor but I think he might be a rich mans Bobby Portis at the NBA level more so than dynamic big who can score against other bigs.

[League Circles]

The way most teams attack a big center these days is to go small, forcing a guy like Bamba to play out on the perimeter v. a stretch 4 playing the 5.

How many teams can do this well enough for it to matter?

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

Yeah, and this is just where the defensive coach needs to get creative. Bamba should stay near the basket and the lane on D at all times.

[Minalt]

Shoot, I think Bamba is an amazing addition to this team. I would be happy with him even in the top 5. He is the type of player that is literally going to change the entire game for the opposing team. Driving to the basket will not be easy against someone like that. And the goal of the offensive game today is 3 point shooting and layups. Bamba can make a difference there! And not every team in the league has a stretch 5, that's a lot of players on the outside. Even the warriors still play inside-out basketball for the most part.

If his offense is entirely setup by other players on the team, then so be it. Nothing wrong with having a guy out there who isn't focused on getting his. In fact, it can open up the game for everyone else.

Plus he is a well spoken guy and that is always a bonus.

[dawhizz]

I hope people are preparing for the scenario where we somehow manage to tank ourselves into the sixth worst record, only to have the team with the eighth worst record get a top 3 pick.

[NDave79]

Gobert - 27th pick
Jordan - 35th pick
Capela - 25th pick
Whiteside - 33rd pick
Green - 35th pick

Bismack Biyambo - #7
Hasshem Thabeet - #2
Willie Cauley-Stein - #6
Nerles Noel - #6
Tristan Thompson - #4

This is interesting and worth noting. However, it seems like more of a case of bad scouting or a testament of what a crap shoot the draft has become.

That first group probably all go top 5 (didn't actually research that, just assuming) if those drafts were re drafted, meaning an athletic, defensive-minded big who pans out is probably worth a top 10 pick.

However, it does make a case to try and find that type of player with a lower pick.

[Mech Engineer]

Shoot, I think Bamba is an amazing addition to this team. I would be happy with him even in the top 5. He is the type of player that is literally going to change the entire game for the opposing team. Driving to the basket will not be easy against someone like that. And the goal of the offensive game today is 3 point shooting and layups. Bamba can make a difference there! And not every team in the league has a stretch 5, that's a lot of players on the outside. Even the warriors still play inside-out basketball for the most part.

If his offense is entirely setup by other players on the team, then so be it. Nothing wrong with having a guy out there who isn't focused on getting his. In fact, it can open up the game for everyone else.

Plus he is a well spoken guy and that is always a bonus.

IMO, a Stretch 5 probably will come with a negative defensive game. It is tough to develop instincts on both sides of the ball. Look at KAT. He is great on the offensive end and has good instincts what to do. But, he is the complete opposite on the defensive end. It is like he gets a different brain when he goes on the other side.

You want your Center to do his job at the rim. If the Bulls can get a healthier version of Noah with a jump-shot, they will do great.

[Minalt]

I hope people are preparing for the scenario where we somehow manage to tank ourselves into the sixth worst record, only to have the team with the eighth worst record get a top 3 pick.

Haha yup. But one should never get mad about that happening. The point is to give ourselves the best chances, then we let everything happen as it happens. It's a lottery after all! A lot of it is still luck.

[TheSuzerain]

Shoot, I think Bamba is an amazing addition to this team. I would be happy with him even in the top 5. He is the type of player that is literally going to change the entire game for the opposing team. Driving to the basket will not be easy against someone like that. And the goal of the offensive game today is 3 point shooting and layups. Bamba can make a difference there! And not every team in the league has a stretch 5, that's a lot of players on the outside. Even the warriors still play inside-out basketball for the most part.

If his offense is entirely setup by other players on the team, then so be it. Nothing wrong with having a guy out there who isn't focused on getting his. In fact, it can open up the game for everyone else.

Plus he is a well spoken guy and that is always a bonus.

IMO, a Stretch 5 probably will come with a negative defensive game. It is tough to develop instincts on both sides of the ball. Look at KAT. He is great on the offensive end and has good instincts what to do. But, he is the complete opposite on the defensive end. It is like he gets a different brain when he goes on the other side.

You want your Center to do his job at the rim. If the Bulls can get a healthier version of Noah with a jump-shot, they will do great.

Bamba isn't a healthier version of Noah with a jump-shot.

Such a player would be a better prospect than Ayton.

[bigworld2017]

I'd be happy with Robert Williams as our defensive center and we can get him with the Pels pick most likely.

You might be right. Williams III has an NBA ready body right now. He has a more consistent motor than Bamba. It is all going to depend on where we end up picking and who is still available when we do. Maybe GarPax gets lucky and we win the Lottery again. Or maybe they work out a deal for us to move up using both picks or our pick and a player. There are two many unknowns at this point. I also would like to see how Mitchell Robinson looks at the Combine. Supposedly he's been working toward the draft for a year. If he's been going to a performance center and also working with good coaching he might be in the mix. His measurables are not that far off from Bamba's. I do wish that the Pelicans would have lost quite a few more games. Anthony Davis has probably cost us 8 slots with their pick. That is unfortunate.

[Mech Engineer]

Shoot, I think Bamba is an amazing addition to this team. I would be happy with him even in the top 5. He is the type of player that is literally going to change the entire game for the opposing team. Driving to the basket will not be easy against someone like that. And the goal of the offensive game today is 3 point shooting and layups. Bamba can make a difference there! And not every team in the league has a stretch 5, that's a lot of players on the outside. Even the warriors still play inside-out basketball for the most part.

If his offense is entirely setup by other players on the team, then so be it. Nothing wrong with having a guy out there who isn't focused on getting his. In fact, it can open up the game for everyone else.

Plus he is a well spoken guy and that is always a bonus.

IMO, a Stretch 5 probably will come with a negative defensive game. It is tough to develop instincts on both sides of the ball. Look at KAT. He is great on the offensive end and has good instincts what to do. But, he is the complete opposite on the defensive end. It is like he gets a different brain when he goes on the other side.

You want your Center to do his job at the rim. If the Bulls can get a healthier version of Noah with a jump-shot, they will do great.

Bamba isn't a healthier version of Noah with a jump-shot.

Such a player would be a better prospect than Ayton.

Well, let me put it this way. Is there a possibility that he can develop a jump shot? Noah never had a chance with his tornado to be consistent.

This is where GarPax have to earn their money by projecting that skill in a player. I am sure he can make a jumpshot in practice but can he make it in an NBA game?

Is he confident? A good learner? Can he shoot from different places in practice? Can he do it when he is tired? A lot more questions before making a decision.

[Darius Miles Davis]

Rim protectors like Bamba are valuable, the argument against drafting him is if rim protector / rim runner is the best use of what will be our best pick in many years.

Where would Houston be if they had used all their pick assets to trade for a rim protector, instead of Harden and just picking up Capela at the bottom of the 1st round.
Where would GS be if they used their best picks on a rim protector instead of Steph or Klay, and just picking up Draymond in the 2nd round.

Generally, success has come from teams using their best assets (either 1 high pick or multiple picks in trade) to get your #1 option scorer & offensive players, and using mediocre picks to get defenders. Deandre, 35th pick. Gobert, 27th pick. Capela, 25th pick. Whiteside, 33rd pick.

Have we had any example of success from a team in the modern basketball era that used their best pick on a pure rim defender / rim runner? Guys like Embiid & Porzingis do not qualify, since they can do everything a guard can do.

The closest I can think of is Andre Drummond, picked #9.

That being said we're drafting in a position where Jakob Poltl and Thon Maker were selected, so I guess our primary worry is getting someone that even be a starter in this league and not another Sene (#10 pick by the Sonics, agile rim defender with a 7' 9" wingspan).

Or
Bismack Biyambo - #7
Hasshem Thabeet - #2
Willie Cauley-Stein - #6
Nerles Noel - #6
Tristan Thompson - #4

The downside of taking a guy like that at the top of the draft is pretty scary.

If there is a Harden type available where the Bulls pick, the Bulls will take him. That would only be Doncic in this draft, and it's doubtful he falls to us unless we win a top 2 pick in the lottery. You could make an argument that Trae Young is an offensive creator we should draft above a big, and we might just do that given the option. After that, there are probably no creators on the level deserving to be a top 8-9 pick in this draft unless you really believe in Shai.

I think you're underrating Bamba's potential as a shooter, which makes him potentially a better prospect than any of those you listed. His 68% free throw percentage is far and away higher than any of the other players you mentioned when they were freshman in college (Biyambo excluded). And he's the only one of them that has any upside as a 3-point shooter.

I like Bamba for a 6-9 range pick for us if he's there. He seems like a great fit next to Lauri. He's also an extremely impressive young man. Hear one interview with him, and you'll want him to teach your college class. I get it, offensive creators rule the day in the NBA, but I think there are only two worthy of being taken in the top of the lottery. And Cole Zwicker for one believes Doncic and Young should both be gone by pick 4.

[Darius Miles Davis]

Rim protectors like Bamba are valuable, the argument against drafting him is if rim protector / rim runner is the best use of what will be our best pick in many years.

Where would Houston be if they had used all their pick assets to trade for a rim protector, instead of Harden and just picking up Capela at the bottom of the 1st round.
Where would GS be if they used their best picks on a rim protector instead of Steph or Klay, and just picking up Draymond in the 2nd round.

Generally, success has come from teams using their best assets (either 1 high pick or multiple picks in trade) to get your #1 option scorer & offensive players, and using mediocre picks to get defenders. Deandre, 35th pick. Gobert, 27th pick. Capela, 25th pick. Whiteside, 33rd pick.

Have we had any example of success from a team in the modern basketball era that used their best pick on a pure rim defender / rim runner? Guys like Embiid & Porzingis do not qualify, since they can do everything a guard can do.

The closest I can think of is Andre Drummond, picked #9.

That being said we're drafting in a position where Jakob Poltl and Thon Maker were selected, so I guess our primary worry is getting someone that even be a starter in this league and not another Sene (#10 pick by the Sonics, agile rim defender with a 7' 9" wingspan).

Or
Bismack Biyambo - #7
Hasshem Thabeet - #2
Willie Cauley-Stein - #6
Nerles Noel - #6
Tristan Thompson - #4

The downside of taking a guy like that at the top of the draft is pretty scary.

If there is a Harden type available where the Bulls pick, the Bulls will take him. That would only be Doncic in this draft, and it's doubtful we have the opportunity unless we win a top 2 pick in the lottery. You could make an argument that Trae Young is an offensive creator we should draft above a big, and we might just do that given the option. After that, there are probably no creators on the level deserving to be a top 8-9 pick in this draft unless you really believe in Shai.

I think you're underrating Bamba's potential as a shooter, which makes him potentially a better prospect than any of those you listed. His 68% free throw percentage is far and away higher than any of the other players you mentioned when they were freshman in college (Biyambo excluded). And he's the only one of them that has any upside as a 3-point shooter.

I like Bamba for a 6-9 range pick for us if he's there. He seems like a great fit next to Lauri. He's also an extremely impressive young man. Hear one interview with him, and you'll want him to teach your college class. I get it, offensive creators rule the day in the NBA, but I think there are only two worthy of being taken in the top of the lottery. And Cole Zwicker for one believes Doncic and Young should both be gone by pick 4.

[TheSuzerain]

IMO, a Stretch 5 probably will come with a negative defensive game. It is tough to develop instincts on both sides of the ball. Look at KAT. He is great on the offensive end and has good instincts what to do. But, he is the complete opposite on the defensive end. It is like he gets a different brain when he goes on the other side.

You want your Center to do his job at the rim. If the Bulls can get a healthier version of Noah with a jump-shot, they will do great.

Bamba isn't a healthier version of Noah with a jump-shot.

Such a player would be a better prospect than Ayton.

Well, let me put it this way. Is there a possibility that he can develop a jump shot? Noah never had a chance with his tornado to be consistent.

This is where GarPax have to earn their money by projecting that skill in a player. I am sure he can make a jumpshot in practice but can he make it in an NBA game?

Is he confident? A good learner? Can he shoot from different places in practice? Can he do it when he is tired? A lot more questions before making a decision.

It seems like a stretch to me. He shoots 68% from the line and shot 27.5% from the college 3.

If a wing or guard had those numbers, would we project them to add a 3 ball? No.

On top of that, his arms are so long, that I feel like it becomes almost difficult mechanically for him to shoot it all that well.

And on top of that, Bamba was a useless passer this year. And therefore can't be compared to Noah.

[Repeat 3-peat]

I'd be happy with Robert Williams as our defensive center and we can get him with the Pels pick most likely.

Agreed.

Mikal Bridges and Robert Williams would be a great draft.

Dunn, LaVine, Bridges, Lauri, Williams. A very balanced line up.

[Mech Engineer]

Bamba isn't a healthier version of Noah with a jump-shot.

Such a player would be a better prospect than Ayton.

Well, let me put it this way. Is there a possibility that he can develop a jump shot? Noah never had a chance with his tornado to be consistent.

This is where GarPax have to earn their money by projecting that skill in a player. I am sure he can make a jumpshot in practice but can he make it in an NBA game?

Is he confident? A good learner? Can he shoot from different places in practice? Can he do it when he is tired? A lot more questions before making a decision.

It seems like a stretch to me. He shoots 68% from the line and shot 27.5% from the college 3.

If a wing or guard had those numbers, would we project them to add a 3 ball? No.

On top of that, his arms are so long, that I feel like it becomes almost difficult mechanically for him to shoot it all that well.

And on top of that, Bamba was a useless passer this year. And therefore can't be compared to Noah.

I am not sure how good Noah was in his 1st year of college with his passing skills. And, it is not like Noah was a wizard. He could handle the ball well for a Center, but would be static and look around to pass it to the cutting guy. It wasn't like he was dribbling all over the place with one eye on where to pass. And, that skill is not a necessary skill for a Center. It is good to have it. And, Bamba or most NBA players are smart enough to pass to an open guy.

And, a jump-shot for a Center means having the ability to draw a defender. Noah could never do that. We have to let Bamba develop his game a little more with a professional coaching system before coming to conclusions. And, he has 3 or 4 more years to learn that.