OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins

CaPiTanAK · Post #741 » by **CaPiTanAK** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 12:32 am

If you watch his college stats, there were plenty of instances in which he would get the defense line to commit on a free penalty, and get a free play. On those free plays, he definitely always goes for the home run plays. The only guy in the NFL that does this on a consistent basis is no longer than Aaron Rodger. He def does use his athleticism and legs to buy time for home run plays. But, there were plenty of instances in which he is smart enough to throw the football away.

I have never seen Trubisky does this in college or in the pros. I have said this before, but we might have gotten a top elite QB prospect in which the doubters were pissing on his resume by labeling typical racist black garbage like athletic black QB without a brain, as evident by slow progression aka low football IQ. They never put that label on Trubisky and that dude was dumb. For once, we are getting an elite QB prospect off the systemic racism in the NFL.

dice · Post #742 » by **dice** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:01 am

fleet wrote:
dice wrote:
fleet wrote:Nagy said Fields is devouring the formations and stuff watching Dalton. His memory is good. Best things about a good QB is the mind, accuracy and arm. Fields has all 3. The rest is coachable, and Fields is that too. BTW, Jordan Love had a bounceback day yesterday Ah well, Fields is better, but the Packers will have a better team around him with more assets to burn going forward. We’ll see how it all shakes out in a few years.

it truly is incredible how badly the packers have managed the aaron rodgers situation. jordan love is likely to be a bust. question is whether he can woo a team into giving him big bucks a la garoppolo. assuming that rodgers doesn't leave soon, that is

as for nagy, i wouldn't necessarily trust what he says. fields is his meal ticket. it has to work

They’ll give Love a lot of rope since he cost them Rogers. Not that they won’t be compensated. But the fans won’t be easily pawned off. The Nagy advice is well received. Just that Fields is a phenom IQ test type guy apparently, so it fit into his profile I guess.

i think rodgers will be back. could well be another situation like brady and garoppolo where the vet sabotages the long-term plan. except that there would probably be some element of spite involved in the case of rodgers

dice · Post #743 » by **dice** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:03 am

CaPiTanAK wrote:If you watch his college stats, there were plenty of instances in which he would get the defense line to commit on a free penalty, and get a free play. On those free plays, he definitely always goes for the home run plays. The only guy in the NFL that does this on a consistent basis is no longer than Aaron Rodger. He def does use his athleticism and legs to buy time for home run plays. But, there were plenty of instances in which he is smart enough to throw the football away.

I have never seen Trubisky does this in college or in the pros. I have said this before, but we might have gotten a top elite QB prospect in which the doubters were pissing on his resume by labeling typical racist black garbage like athletic black QB without a brain, as evident by slow progression aka low football IQ. They never put that label on Trubisky and that dude was dumb. For once, we are getting an elite QB prospect off the systemic racism in the NFL.

please stop with this junk. you've produced exactly zero evidence that there is a problem w/ systemic racism in the nfl. there are countless examples on both sides

Susan · Post #744 » by **Susan** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 3:06 am

dice wrote:
CaPiTanAK wrote:If you watch his college stats, there were plenty of instances in which he would get the defense line to commit on a free penalty, and get a free play. On those free plays, he definitely always goes for the home run plays. The only guy in the NFL that does this on a consistent basis is no longer than Aaron Rodger. He def does use his athleticism and legs to buy time for home run plays. But, there were plenty of instances in which he is smart enough to throw the football away.

I have never seen Trubisky does this in college or in the pros. I have said this before, but we might have gotten a top elite QB prospect in which the doubters were pissing on his resume by labeling typical racist black garbage like athletic black QB without a brain, as evident by slow progression aka low football IQ. They never put that label on Trubisky and that dude was dumb. For once, we are getting an elite QB prospect off the systemic racism in the NFL.

please stop with this junk. you've produced exactly zero evidence that there is a problem w/ systemic racism in the nfl. there are countless examples on both sides

Fields is very obviously smart if not brilliant (top 2% intelligence if not higher) and his intelligence/work ethic were called into question by Orlovsky. He's been praised by the coaching staff through the media for his intelligence and work ethic.

Mitch was average or slightly above average intelligence for an everyday person, but by QB standards well below average intelligence and it wasn't talked about until his 3rd year here.

IMO - other players pick up on this intelligence/confidence early on and is something that can't be faked. Some dudes just have it.

dice · Post #745 » by **dice** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 3:18 am

Susan wrote:
dice wrote:
CaPiTanAK wrote:If you watch his college stats, there were plenty of instances in which he would get the defense line to commit on a free penalty, and get a free play. On those free plays, he definitely always goes for the home run plays. The only guy in the NFL that does this on a consistent basis is no longer than Aaron Rodger. He def does use his athleticism and legs to buy time for home run plays. But, there were plenty of instances in which he is smart enough to throw the football away.

I have never seen Trubisky does this in college or in the pros. I have said this before, but we might have gotten a top elite QB prospect in which the doubters were pissing on his resume by labeling typical racist black garbage like athletic black QB without a brain, as evident by slow progression aka low football IQ. They never put that label on Trubisky and that dude was dumb. For once, we are getting an elite QB prospect off the systemic racism in the NFL.

please stop with this junk. you've produced exactly zero evidence that there is a problem w/ systemic racism in the nfl. there are countless examples on both sides

Fields is very obviously smart if not brilliant (top 2% intelligence if not higher) and his intelligence/work ethic were called into question by Orlovsky. He's been praised by the coaching staff through the media for his intelligence and work ethic.

Mitch was average or slightly above average intelligence for an everyday person, but by QB standards well below average intelligence and it wasn't talked about until his 3rd year here.

IMO - other players pick up on this intelligence/confidence early on and is something that can't be faked. Some dudes just have it.

1) dan orlovsky is not evidence of systemic racism in the nfl
2) plenty of highly selected QBs aren't that bright. both black and white
3) the average wonderlic score for the "everyday person" is 25. the average for QBs is 24. trubisky got a 25. pat mahomes got a 24 and deshaun watson got a 20

Chewie · Post #746 » by **Chewie** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 3:28 am

Guessing the Panthers are working on that time machine about now so they can go back to draft day and pick Fields like they should have.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/panthers/2021/06/09/sam-darnold-panthers-coronavirus-vaccine/7627642002/

New Carolina Panthers quarterback Sam Darnold fielded some questions following OTAs on Wednesday afternoon. Among them included an inquiry on his stance regarding the COVID-19 vaccine, in which replied with a dose of uncertainty about the treatment.

“I haven’t been vaccinated yet,” Darnold said. “Still gotta think about all those certain things that go into it. Again, it’s everyone’s choice, whether they wanna get vaccinated or not. So, that’s really all I got on it. I don’t wanna go too into detail.”

He was then asked if he’d done research on the vaccination and how that may ultimately factor into his decision.

“Yeah, I have been. For me, I’m just staying by myself right now. I don’t have a family or anything like that," Darnold said. "Again, there’s a ton of different things that go into it. I’m gonna evaluate that on my own and make the best decision that I feel is, again, the best for myself.”

The fourth-year quarterback, who just turned 24 on Saturday, infamously dealt with mononucleosis, another infectious illness, two seasons ago with the New York Jets. So, of course, his response didn’t go without some slick meme’ing courtesy of the fans on social media.

Susan · Post #747 » by **Susan** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 4:09 am

Chewie wrote:Guessing the Panthers are working on that time machine about now so they can go back to draft day and pick Fields like they should have.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/panthers/2021/06/09/sam-darnold-panthers-coronavirus-vaccine/7627642002/
New Carolina Panthers quarterback Sam Darnold fielded some questions following OTAs on Wednesday afternoon. Among them included an inquiry on his stance regarding the COVID-19 vaccine, in which replied with a dose of uncertainty about the treatment.

“I haven’t been vaccinated yet,” Darnold said. “Still gotta think about all those certain things that go into it. Again, it’s everyone’s choice, whether they wanna get vaccinated or not. So, that’s really all I got on it. I don’t wanna go too into detail.”

He was then asked if he’d done research on the vaccination and how that may ultimately factor into his decision.

“Yeah, I have been. For me, I’m just staying by myself right now. I don’t have a family or anything like that," Darnold said. "Again, there’s a ton of different things that go into it. I’m gonna evaluate that on my own and make the best decision that I feel is, again, the best for myself.”

The fourth-year quarterback, who just turned 24 on Saturday, infamously dealt with mononucleosis, another infectious illness, two seasons ago with the New York Jets. So, of course, his response didn’t go without some slick meme’ing courtesy of the fans on social media.

How the hell you let Sam Darnold get in the way of you drafting Justin Fields will be beyond me forever. Sam Darnold.

Susan · Post #748 » by **Susan** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 4:14 am

dice wrote:
Susan wrote:
dice wrote:please stop with this junk. you've produced exactly zero evidence that there is a problem w/ systemic racism in the nfl. there are countless examples on both sides

Fields is very obviously smart if not brilliant (top 2% intelligence if not higher) and his intelligence/work ethic were called into question by Orlovsky. He's been praised by the coaching staff through the media for his intelligence and work ethic.

Mitch was average or slightly above average intelligence for an everyday person, but by QB standards well below average intelligence and it wasn't talked about until his 3rd year here.

IMO - other players pick up on this intelligence/confidence early on and is something that can't be faked. Some dudes just have it.

1) dan orlovsky is not evidence of systemic racism in the nfl
2) plenty of highly selected QBs aren't that bright. both black and white
3) the average wonderlic score for the "everyday person" is 25. the average for QBs is 24. trubisky got a 25. pat mahomes got a 24 and deshaun watson got a 20

Enough people believed it to let somebody of his talent level slip to 11.

Look back a page, "Oh I just thought he was a one read QB" is code for "I thought he was a dumb black guy".

What's Mahomes or Watson's worderlic have to do with anything in this thread? Fields didn't take the test.

Chewie · Post #749 » by **Chewie** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 4:53 am

Susan wrote:
dice wrote:
Susan wrote:
Fields is very obviously smart if not brilliant (top 2% intelligence if not higher) and his intelligence/work ethic were called into question by Orlovsky. He's been praised by the coaching staff through the media for his intelligence and work ethic.

Mitch was average or slightly above average intelligence for an everyday person, but by QB standards well below average intelligence and it wasn't talked about until his 3rd year here.

IMO - other players pick up on this intelligence/confidence early on and is something that can't be faked. Some dudes just have it.

1) dan orlovsky is not evidence of systemic racism in the nfl
2) plenty of highly selected QBs aren't that bright. both black and white
3) the average wonderlic score for the "everyday person" is 25. the average for QBs is 24. trubisky got a 25. pat mahomes got a 24 and deshaun watson got a 20

Enough people believed it to let somebody of his talent level slip to 11.

Look back a page, "Oh I just thought he was a one read QB" is code for "I thought he was a dumb black guy".

What's Mahomes or Watson's worderlic have to do with anything in this thread? Fields didn't take the test.

Whoa Whoa Whoa!!! Hold up.....that was MY comment and totally based on very limited actual clips I was watching that had him staring down receivers and actually making a single read! No code there and had ZERO ZERO ZERO to do with race.

Don't feel like doing the digging but I think it may have been Stephen A. Smith that was doing the out loud thinking about why Fields was the consensus #2 QB after the season and then this strange slip happened afterward in his ranking and making the connection to race? Could be wrong.

Edit: OK, maybe I will dig it up:

Watch on YouTube

Susan · Post #750 » by **Susan** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:00 am

Chewie wrote:
Susan wrote:
dice wrote:1) dan orlovsky is not evidence of systemic racism in the nfl
2) plenty of highly selected QBs aren't that bright. both black and white
3) the average wonderlic score for the "everyday person" is 25. the average for QBs is 24. trubisky got a 25. pat mahomes got a 24 and deshaun watson got a 20

Enough people believed it to let somebody of his talent level slip to 11.

Look back a page, "Oh I just thought he was a one read QB" is code for "I thought he was a dumb black guy".

What's Mahomes or Watson's worderlic have to do with anything in this thread? Fields didn't take the test.

Whoa Whoa Whoa!!! Hold up.....that was MY comment and totally based on very limited actual clips I was watching that had him staring down receivers and actually making a single read! No code there and had ZERO ZERO ZERO to do with race.

Don't feel like doing the digging but I think it may have been Stephen A. Smith that was doing the out loud thinking about why Fields was the consensus #2 QB after the season and then this strange slip happened afterward in his ranking and making the connection to race? Could be wrong.

Find me those clips. I want to see it.

I wonder what everybody here thought of Bill Polian speaking out against Lamar Jackson and saying he should move to WR rather than play QB. No hints of racism there?

Chewie · Post #751 » by **Chewie** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:10 am

Susan wrote:Find me those clips. I want to see it.

Lol. This was literally a quick take from me scanning random clips of draftable QBs well before the draft. Certainly not anything I saved for your consumption. I must not have been alone in this thinking as I see multiple vids disputing it (below) and, again, I reiterate after doing a much deeper dive since he was drafted I can see he's clearly not what I thought in my limited pre-draft viewings.

Watch on YouTube

Susan · Post #752 » by **Susan** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:23 am

Chewie wrote:
Susan wrote:Find me those clips. I want to see it.

Lol. This was literally a quick take from me scanning random clips of draftable QBs well before the draft. Certainly not anything I saved for your consumption. I must not have been alone in this thinking as I see multiple vids disputing it (below) and, again, I reiterate after doing a much deeper dive since he was drafted I can see he's clearly not what I thought in my limited pre-draft viewings.

Watch on YouTube

I don't think you're a bad person or a liar - I just think there's been a the notion that black QBs rely only on athleticism and less on smarts for so long that it's a subconscious bias in a lot of people's minds.

The NFL is literally getting sued because they had a racial bias in their concussion lawsuit.

In its use of race-norming, the league compares a given player's cognitive test scores with the supposed norm for his demographic group. Under the methodology, black players are assumed to possess a lower level of cognitive function than the average white player.

But attorneys say the standard means that in order to qualify for compensation, the average black player must demonstrate a greater level of cognitive decline than a white counterpart.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-57336282

Chewie · Post #753 » by **Chewie** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:47 am

Susan wrote:
Chewie wrote:
Susan wrote:Find me those clips. I want to see it.

Lol. This was literally a quick take from me scanning random clips of draftable QBs well before the draft. Certainly not anything I saved for your consumption. I must not have been alone in this thinking as I see multiple vids disputing it (below) and, again, I reiterate after doing a much deeper dive since he was drafted I can see he's clearly not what I thought in my limited pre-draft viewings.

Watch on YouTube

I don't think you're a bad person or a liar - I just think there's been a the notion that black QBs rely only on athleticism and less on smarts for so long that it's a subconscious bias in a lot of people's minds.

The NFL is literally getting sued because they had a racial bias in their concussion lawsuit.

In its use of race-norming, the league compares a given player's cognitive test scores with the supposed norm for his demographic group. Under the methodology, black players are assumed to possess a lower level of cognitive function than the average white player.

But attorneys say the standard means that in order to qualify for compensation, the average black player must demonstrate a greater level of cognitive decline than a white counterpart.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-57336282

Yes, I am aware of that race-norming case that makes assumptions that blacks start off with lower cognitive function - awful. But I will say you don't know me and did come out firing that I made a blind assumption based on race w/Fields and I'm just not that guy.

I can agree with your point that people in general have a bias about black QBs. Moving on....

CaPiTanAK · Post #754 » by **CaPiTanAK** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 10:57 am

Chewie wrote:Yes, I am aware of that race-norming case that makes assumptions that blacks start off with lower cognitive function - awful. But I will say you don't know me and did come out firing that I made a blind assumption based on race w/Fields and I'm just not that guy.

I can agree with your point that people in general have a bias about black QBs. Moving on....

You're a good guy.

And I'm glad that the Bears kept Pace on board for this QB selection. He has learned from his mistakes of selecting Trubisky over two superior black QB prospects. If we had a new GM, we might have selected Mac Jones instead lol. That would be the equivalent of selecting Marshmallow Shea McCellin over Chandler Jones.

Carry on...

Post #755 » by **dougthonus** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 4:17 pm

Susan wrote:IMO - other players pick up on this intelligence/confidence early on and is something that can't be faked. Some dudes just have it.

I think intelligence and confidence are two very different trades and often don't coincide. That said, I agree both are things that can't be faked and people intuitively feel immediately upon meeting you.

Post #756 » by **dougthonus** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 4:26 pm

Susan wrote:Enough people believed it to let somebody of his talent level slip to 11.

Look back a page, "Oh I just thought he was a one read QB" is code for "I thought he was a dumb black guy".

What's Mahomes or Watson's worderlic have to do with anything in this thread? Fields didn't take the test.

Fields will have to prove he shouldn't have slipped to #11 on the field, and I hope he does. Until then, the fact that he slipped to #11 isn't really relevant to me. How far did Aaron Rodgers slip? How silly is it now to think that Dwayne Haskins was underrated on draft day due to systemic racism (a theory talked about pretty repeatedly on ESPN in his draft)?

I hope Fields pulls a Mahomes and punishes every team that passed on him and especially brutalizes all the teams that took QBs ahead of him and plays with a massive chip on his shoulder and destroys the league. After that happens, I think we can go back and ask why Fields slipped behind these huge bust QBs if that happens.

Post #757 » by **dougthonus** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 4:33 pm

CaPiTanAK wrote:And I'm glad that the Bears kept Pace on board for this QB selection. He has learned from his mistakes of selecting Trubisky over two superior black QB prospects. If we had a new GM, we might have selected Mac Jones instead lol. That would be the equivalent of selecting Marshmallow Shea McCellin over Chandler Jones.

Carry on...

His mistake wasn't drafting a white QB over a black QB, and trading up for a black QB doesn't resolve that mistake.

His mistake was taking a bad QB ahead of two great QBs. If Fields is a great QB then he will have traded up for a great QB and done a better job in the draft. If Fields is a bust, then he won't have done anything helpful. The skin color is irrelevant, the results are relevant, and anyone who drafts based on skin color instead of talent at any position will make worse decisions.

Post #758 » by **fleet** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 4:39 pm

It would need to be a ridiculous amount of racism to drop an astounding talent all the way to 11. The amount of successful black quarterbacks has vanquished that iidea. Especially in the last few years . Come on. It is way more likely to be real football reasons. To voice the angst along those lines….If he is as good as we want him to be, he should have been the number 2 pick if not number 1, and no player in this draft should have been taken in front of him. Given how valuable a great QB is, Fields slipping to 11 is cause for concern. You have to pray a lot of mistakes were made. And it’s happened before, obviously. Yet recency bias of Mahomes and Watson looming should have prompted somebody above 11 to roll the dice on this kind of talent, it would be difficult for a team to explain why they did not roll the dice. This situation screams that scouts didn’t like this kid much for whatever reasons to backup his highlight reel. Again, it is concerning.

Post #759 » by **fleet** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:52 pm

My second biggest question is…..what the hell is going on with this defense being a no show at OTAs? The attitude this team is pretty weak right now, and they have the 8-8 stink at this time. The players are not feeling this organization and team these days They desperately need Fields to grab the reigns

Hold That · Post #760 » by **Hold That** » Sat Jun 12, 2021 6:33 pm

fleet wrote:My second biggest question is…..what the hell is going on with this defense being a no show at OTAs? The attitude this team is pretty weak right now, and they have the 8-8 stink at this time. The players are not feeling this organization and team these days They desperately need Fields to grab the reigns

I think it’s overblown and only getting spotlight due to not having any off-season OTA or minicamps last year and the Justin Fields hype. In April the NFLPA already wrote the league that almost half of the league’s players might not attend OTAs. They were already complaining that training camp is more than enough time to prepare them for the season and OTAs are unnecessary especially since the pandemic isn’t completely over.

For example the Browns most notable offensive players didn’t show up to OTAs. As long as they are their for training camp that’s all that matters.