Image ImageImage Image

Josh Giddey - Conundrum Killer

Moderators: HomoSapien, Ice Man, Michael Jackson, dougthonus, Tommy Udo 6 , kulaz3000, fleet, DASMACKDOWN, GimmeDat, RedBulls23, AshyLarrysDiaper, coldfish, Payt10

User avatar
dougthonus
Senior Mod - Bulls
Senior Mod - Bulls
Posts: 58,998
And1: 19,083
Joined: Dec 22, 2004
Contact:
 

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#781 » by dougthonus » Tue Feb 25, 2025 1:26 am

Infinity2152 wrote:He's shooting far better this season. Over 53 games so far. He shot 26% from 3 his rookie year. He's shooting 36% this year. I know there are all kind of chaotic reasons to show that the three pointer's he's actually making in NBA games really don't count, but I'm going to count them. That's a 10% jump in 4 years. That's probably extremely rare. If he settles at 34 like last year or 35%, that' still huge improvement from where he started.


As noted, his 3 point percentage doesn't do credit to how bad a shooter he is, because his release is so slow, he can't shoot anything advanced, and defenses have disrespected him so much that they frequently do not even look at him at the three point line.

His defense is pretty clearly improving. When you start at 9 rebounds and 8 assists per 36, pretty hard to improve there. Already pretty elite.


His absolute ceiling on defense is likely "bad" instead of "bottom of the league bad" due to physical limitations unless he just massively reworks his body to become way more athletic.

Who is a $30 mill player, in your opinion? Some guys to reference would be good. I showed two guys from the same draft class putting up similar numbers getting $30 and $44, so clearly not Barnes or Jalen Johnson, who's always hurt. Please pick from guys 25 and younger, adjusting for more than 3 years age difference would be tedious. Also, please exclude guys like Wemby and Banchero, obvious max guys.

I'm curious what other people thing a $30 mill young player looks like among actually available players, and not made up prototypes.


It's a good question, probably the answer is that there is no one worth 30M because the max was ~35M and everyone who probably should get 30 gets pushed up to the max even if they don't deserve it then become bad max contract guys.

Like I said, what's the most expensive guy in the league that signed their deal as:
1: A bad shooter
2: Doesn't draw fouls
3: A bad defender

Title contending team ditched him for a 30 year old frequently hurt bench player that fits in with the style of the modern NBA, and they are much happier for it.
PJSteven22
Starter
Posts: 2,197
And1: 918
Joined: Feb 04, 2022

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#782 » by PJSteven22 » Tue Feb 25, 2025 1:27 am

Jcool0 wrote:
Jcool0 wrote:
PJSteven22 wrote:Firsts are more important to a rebuild than a meh young player that you have to pay in a year. It’s a dumb trade from a financial standpoint and a basketball standpoint.


That meh player currently has 6 points, 2 assists and 8 rebounds in 10 minutes.


17 points, 10 rebounds, 5 assists and 3 blocks.

Rookie > Guy you have to pay next year. You wouldn’t have responded if he was playing bad. Still doesn’t make the trade look any better.
User avatar
Jcool0
RealGM
Posts: 15,421
And1: 9,353
Joined: Jul 12, 2014
Location: Illinois
         

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#783 » by Jcool0 » Tue Feb 25, 2025 1:29 am

PJSteven22 wrote:
Jcool0 wrote:
Jcool0 wrote:
That meh player currently has 6 points, 2 assists and 8 rebounds in 10 minutes.


17 points, 10 rebounds, 5 assists and 3 blocks.

Rookie > Guy you have to pay next year. You wouldn’t have responded if he was playing bad. Still doesn’t make the trade look any better.


Pretty sure it makes the trade look better.
PJSteven22
Starter
Posts: 2,197
And1: 918
Joined: Feb 04, 2022

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#784 » by PJSteven22 » Tue Feb 25, 2025 1:32 am

cocktailswith_2short wrote:Giddey conundrum solved. He's pretty good we're going to pay him .

AKME special. Let the market decide his worth
PJSteven22
Starter
Posts: 2,197
And1: 918
Joined: Feb 04, 2022

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#785 » by PJSteven22 » Tue Feb 25, 2025 1:33 am

Jcool0 wrote:
PJSteven22 wrote:
Jcool0 wrote:
17 points, 10 rebounds, 5 assists and 3 blocks.

Rookie > Guy you have to pay next year. You wouldn’t have responded if he was playing bad. Still doesn’t make the trade look any better.


Pretty sure it makes the trade look better.

No it doesn’t. Let’s me how he handles actual defense when he’s actually on the scouting report.
User avatar
Jcool0
RealGM
Posts: 15,421
And1: 9,353
Joined: Jul 12, 2014
Location: Illinois
         

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#786 » by Jcool0 » Tue Feb 25, 2025 1:36 am

PJSteven22 wrote:
Jcool0 wrote:
PJSteven22 wrote:Rookie > Guy you have to pay next year. You wouldn’t have responded if he was playing bad. Still doesn’t make the trade look any better.


Pretty sure it makes the trade look better.

No it doesn’t. Let’s me how he handles actual defense when he’s actually on the scouting report.


Read on Twitter
PJSteven22
Starter
Posts: 2,197
And1: 918
Joined: Feb 04, 2022

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#787 » by PJSteven22 » Tue Feb 25, 2025 1:40 am

Jcool0 wrote:
PJSteven22 wrote:
Jcool0 wrote:
Pretty sure it makes the trade look better.

No it doesn’t. Let’s me how he handles actual defense when he’s actually on the scouting report.


Read on Twitter

You need a larger sample size before you start being petty and gloating. He could easily revert back into the same he’s been previously. Very immature of you.
DrModesty
Rookie
Posts: 1,061
And1: 1,066
Joined: Jan 09, 2020

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#788 » by DrModesty » Tue Feb 25, 2025 1:49 am

This stretch post all star break is the first time in his career he has had the chance to play as the main guy (his natural role, regardless of if you think he'll end up any good at it). Encouraging early results so far.
cocktailswith_2short
Head Coach
Posts: 6,980
And1: 492
Joined: May 25, 2002
     

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#789 » by cocktailswith_2short » Tue Feb 25, 2025 1:58 am

PJSteven22 wrote:
Jcool0 wrote:
PJSteven22 wrote:No it doesn’t. Let’s me how he handles actual defense when he’s actually on the scouting report.


Read on Twitter

You need a larger sample size before you start being petty and gloating. He could easily revert back into the same he’s been previously. Very immature of you.
lolz just take the L man.
Hangtime84
RealGM
Posts: 21,076
And1: 4,767
Joined: Aug 18, 2006
Location: Rogers Park
     

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#790 » by Hangtime84 » Tue Feb 25, 2025 2:10 am

DrModesty wrote:This stretch post all star break is the first time in his career he has had the chance to play as the main guy (his natural role, regardless of if you think he'll end up any good at it). Encouraging early results so far.

That’s not a good thing. But I do think being the lead guy helps players develop and become more accountable.

My issues with him are shooting the 3 and finishing at the rim. IMO finishing the biggest flaw.
Jcool0 wrote:
aguifs wrote:Do we have a friggin plan?


If the Bulls do, you would be complaining to much to ever hear it.


NBA fan logic we need to trade one of two best players because (Player X) one needs to shine more.
PJSteven22
Starter
Posts: 2,197
And1: 918
Joined: Feb 04, 2022

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#791 » by PJSteven22 » Tue Feb 25, 2025 2:13 am

cocktailswith_2short wrote:
PJSteven22 wrote:
Jcool0 wrote:
Read on Twitter

You need a larger sample size before you start being petty and gloating. He could easily revert back into the same he’s been previously. Very immature of you.
lolz just take the L man.

3.5 years > 1 month.
User avatar
Jcool0
RealGM
Posts: 15,421
And1: 9,353
Joined: Jul 12, 2014
Location: Illinois
         

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#792 » by Jcool0 » Tue Feb 25, 2025 2:13 am

PJSteven22 wrote:
Jcool0 wrote:
PJSteven22 wrote:No it doesn’t. Let’s me how he handles actual defense when he’s actually on the scouting report.


Read on Twitter

You need a larger sample size before you start being petty and gloating. He could easily revert back into the same he’s been previously. Very immature of you.


16.2 ppg on 50/45/83 with 7.4 rebounds and 5.8 assists + 2.2 stocks over the last 14 games.
User avatar
Jcool0
RealGM
Posts: 15,421
And1: 9,353
Joined: Jul 12, 2014
Location: Illinois
         

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#793 » by Jcool0 » Tue Feb 25, 2025 2:27 am

Read on Twitter
PJSteven22
Starter
Posts: 2,197
And1: 918
Joined: Feb 04, 2022

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#794 » by PJSteven22 » Tue Feb 25, 2025 2:30 am

Jcool0 wrote:
PJSteven22 wrote:
Jcool0 wrote:
Read on Twitter

You need a larger sample size before you start being petty and gloating. He could easily revert back into the same he’s been previously. Very immature of you.


16.2 ppg on 50/45/83 with 7.4 rebounds and 5.8 assists + 2.2 stocks over the last 14 games.

3.5 seasons > 14 games
WindyCityBorn
RealGM
Posts: 22,255
And1: 11,917
Joined: Jun 26, 2014
     

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#795 » by WindyCityBorn » Tue Feb 25, 2025 2:42 am

DrModesty wrote:This stretch post all star break is the first time in his career he has had the chance to play as the main guy (his natural role, regardless of if you think he'll end up any good at it). Encouraging early results so far.


It’s not the first time. He averaged 16/8/8 he is second season in the NBA. He produces in this role. It’s not a fluke. He needs to figure out to be productive off ball too though.
WindyCityBorn
RealGM
Posts: 22,255
And1: 11,917
Joined: Jun 26, 2014
     

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#796 » by WindyCityBorn » Tue Feb 25, 2025 2:45 am

PJSteven22 wrote:
Jcool0 wrote:
PJSteven22 wrote:You need a larger sample size before you start being petty and gloating. He could easily revert back into the same he’s been previously. Very immature of you.


16.2 ppg on 50/45/83 with 7.4 rebounds and 5.8 assists + 2.2 stocks over the last 14 games.

3.5 seasons > 14 games


16/8/8 in his second season. It’s not shocking he is doing it again now(except better) now that he’s back in that role.
PJSteven22
Starter
Posts: 2,197
And1: 918
Joined: Feb 04, 2022

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#797 » by PJSteven22 » Tue Feb 25, 2025 2:46 am

WindyCityBorn wrote:
DrModesty wrote:This stretch post all star break is the first time in his career he has had the chance to play as the main guy (his natural role, regardless of if you think he'll end up any good at it). Encouraging early results so far.


It’s not the first time. He averaged 16/8/8 he is second season in the NBA. He produces in this role. It’s not a fluke. He needs to figure out to be productive off ball too though.

He shot 7 points below league average TS% that year.
WindyCityBorn
RealGM
Posts: 22,255
And1: 11,917
Joined: Jun 26, 2014
     

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#798 » by WindyCityBorn » Tue Feb 25, 2025 2:50 am

PJSteven22 wrote:
WindyCityBorn wrote:
DrModesty wrote:This stretch post all star break is the first time in his career he has had the chance to play as the main guy (his natural role, regardless of if you think he'll end up any good at it). Encouraging early results so far.


It’s not the first time. He averaged 16/8/8 he is second season in the NBA. He produces in this role. It’s not a fluke. He needs to figure out to be productive off ball too though.

He shot 7 points below league average TS% that year.


He was good enough to win 40 games in that role since winning games is apparently an argument when convenient. And now he’s clearly better.
PJSteven22
Starter
Posts: 2,197
And1: 918
Joined: Feb 04, 2022

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#799 » by PJSteven22 » Tue Feb 25, 2025 2:53 am

WindyCityBorn wrote:
PJSteven22 wrote:
WindyCityBorn wrote:
It’s not the first time. He averaged 16/8/8 he is second season in the NBA. He produces in this role. It’s not a fluke. He needs to figure out to be productive off ball too though.

He shot 7 points below league average TS% that year.


He was good enough to win 40 games in that role since winning games is apparently an argument when convenient. And now he’s clearly better.

Except Shai was the best player on that team. His on off numbers weren’t good either that year.
darbstar
Junior
Posts: 358
And1: 66
Joined: Jun 17, 2001

Re: Josh Giddey Conundrum 

Post#800 » by darbstar » Tue Feb 25, 2025 2:57 am

At what point does Giddey stop getting bagged for not being a good 3 point shooter?

He is now shooting 37% from 3 for the season which is better than

Tatum, MArkenana, maxey, trae young, jackson jnr, doncic, harden, lamelo, monk, franz wagner and many more

Return to Chicago Bulls