Rumors: Bobcats, Bulls, Kings three-team discussions

[screwdriver]

What is the rush to bring Mirotic over in 2014, particularly if Boozer is playing well? We could just bring him over in 2015, after Boozer is off the books.

[BuffaloBull]

Count me in as someone intrigued by these discussions.

I really don't care about 2014 cap space because once we signed Taj to an extension we lost the ability to sign guys like Lebron, Melo etc. The max for all those guys as 10 year vets will be 20m+. I'd rather just keep Deng than chase after aging guys like Wade or Kobe.

Thompson would be a very good big to have off the bench and would be a serious upgrade compared to Nazr. He's young, active, and has offensive skill. We'd be able to bring a solid mix of energy, rebounding and offense from our bigs for 48 mins every game.

To anyone arguing we should have just kept Omer...I'm pretty sure the whole reason we let him go is because we need to get under the apron in summer 2014 to offer Mirotic the full MLE. Omer at $15m would have made that next to impossible. Thompson would be a solid alternative backup at a more flexible cost.

Jimmer/Taylor...I'm indifferent about. Jimmer has shown some flashes but doubt his defense would fly under Thibs. I liked Taylor around the draft and seems he’s been a solid rookie so far, but I’m not sure he’s any better/worse than Jimmy.

Getting Portland’s pick makes the value worth it. It will likely only be a mid-1st either this year or next, but that’s only a few spots lower than what I ultimately expect the Bobcats pick to be…plus we get it much sooner.

All that said, I’d still much rather pry Tyreke Evans out of Sacramento than any of these players/picks. We could use him as a super 6th man and have some serious firepower.

Yeah Tyreke would be nice, but I doubt he gets moved until after the sale... unless they really don't like him and know they don't want to resign him at all. I worry a bit about Tyreke on this current squad (he's not going to hit many threes for you) but his ability to attack would be nice.

That Portland pick would be late lotto at best, but I still think you could find a wing you like there, or you could package your own pick plus that one and trade up a few spots to get a guy you really like. I think McLemore's out of our range at this point, but a guy like Goodwin, maybe, you can get.

We have to be realistic about the kind of package you'll get back if you give up the Charlotte pick. It's a lottery ticket, and one with good odds as these things go, but if you cash it in now, you aren't going to get something close to the best case return. But the benefit is, especially if you do something like this where you do end up settling for a late lotto pick, that you start the clock on your guy now, and hope he can be a piece that helps in the near to mid future. Versus everything going right and getting that lotto guy in 2016.

I think a lot depends on how high you value this current squad. I personally like Noah, Gibson, Deng, and Mirotic's promise a whole lot. And a deal like this, where you get a young vet in Thompson and some kind of pick back to develop. Draft the right guy and I think you're right there, ready to compete when Rose is back to full strength.

[jax98]

Shabazz Muhammad is overatted to me and we dont need anymore bigs. We need an offensive SG/SF if we are going to draft up in this draft.

Fair enough he's overrated to you. But he really shouldn't be. The guy has a great feel for the game. He'd be perfect here. Which is why we won't get him, since he'll go number 1 or 2, pending tourney play.

McLemore's stock is rising, I agree. But it's still not past Cody Zeller's or Nerlens Noel's.

Goodwin is a long-term project, but definitely someone who can end up an All-Star one day. His physical tools and all-around ability carries a lot of potential.

[VolumePoster]

It's not a bad depth package if we're getting an additional first round pick. It obviously wont be the Bobcats pick, as that would completely go against the sole purpose of this trade.

Not necessarily. Supposedly, Charlotte's scouts told them to trade out of the draft this year.

Charlotte's scouts say trade out? Trade in!

[mr.ankle]

I just don't trust Rumor Press anymore . You rarely hear these rumors in the papers or online besides realgm

[PistolP]

The beauty of 2014 cap space is that it allows us to work with FAs to bluff their former teams into trading them to us instead of us signing them, with Taj, Boozer, Butler, Teague, Bobcats pick, etc being used to not eat as much of our cap space as signing them outright would take. I've shown in depth before in other threads how careful negotiations could basically have us adding a top player or two AND keep Deng (with bird rights) by using cap space to force S&Ts instead of outright signings. It's a crucial thing to note IMO.

I know...I think we've had this discussion a couple times ...I really just think there are a ton of IFs in that scenario (i.e., talented wing FA wants to come here, we have enough cap space for that FA, other team willing to take back salary filler in S&T, Deng willing to wait around while all this happens, the Boozer/Mirotic summer swap still fits into all this, etc.).

Possible...sure, but not likely that all adds up so not worthwhile enough IMO to pass on other opportunities now. I'd rather just keep building a solid, contending team that's over the cap...so long as we aren't acquiring any bad contracts.

[BullsFTW]

If the Bobcats offered us their unprotected 2013 pick along with a reliable back-up PF/C for their pick back and a SG that will be gone next year. I'd do it. The Bobcats pick this year is looking like a Top 5 pick, and the future CHA pick is no guarantee. I don't understand why people are against that package. I'd even do the trade without Jimmer. Once Rose comes back, Hinrich can fill in as the back-up SG and Bellineli moves in the starting line-up. Teague should get more minutes than Nate as well. Thompson will provide depth in the front-court and I believe he's a decent pick-up.

People, you cannot pass-up the opportunity to draft a future SG in McLemore or Muhammad without giving up your current core players.

[VolumePoster]

Shabazz Muhammad is overatted to me and we dont need anymore bigs. We need an offensive SG/SF if we are going to draft up in this draft.

Fair enough he's overrated to you. But he really shouldn't be. The guy has a great feel for the game. He'd be perfect here. Which is why we won't get him, since he'll go number 1 or 2, pending tourney play.

McLemore's stock is rising, I agree. But it's still not past Cody Zeller's or Nerlens Noel's.

Goodwin is a long-term project, but definitely someone who can end up an All-Star one day. His physical tools and all-around ability carries a lot of potential.

Shabazz Mo is being massively underrated. He's a great shooter, shot maker, and competitor. 6'6 with a 6'10 wingspan. People are sleeping big time.

Next to Derrick he would be outstanding.

[BullsFTW]

Shabazz Muhammad is overatted to me and we dont need anymore bigs. We need an offensive SG/SF if we are going to draft up in this draft.

Fair enough he's overrated to you. But he really shouldn't be. The guy has a great feel for the game. He'd be perfect here. Which is why we won't get him, since he'll go number 1 or 2, pending tourney play.

McLemore's stock is rising, I agree. But it's still not past Cody Zeller's or Nerlens Noel's.

Goodwin is a long-term project, but definitely someone who can end up an All-Star one day. His physical tools and all-around ability carries a lot of potential.

With that being said. McLemore would fit in perfectly next to Rose.

[Tenchi Ryu]

Ain't really feeling this. Now if Tyreke's name was thrown up in here....I don't see how losing one of our scoring options for a ok big makes us better. No, I'm not part of the Marco will save us train blind hope and homerism train.

[BuffaloBull]

The problem is that to me, RIP is more important now as our 2nd best wing after Deng than Thompson would be. Further, I don't think we can get nearly as good of a wing for the 5 mil TPE as RIP is. Nobody is going to give us a good contract for the TPE. It's going to have to be a player who is worth like 2-3 mil but being paid 5 mil. That's why I slate that 5 mil player as our 4th big, and yes I realize he won't be nearly as good as Thompson, though he should be better than Nazr

The problem is RIP is NOT going to be back next year so I don't understand this... Why wouldn't you want the Bulls to trade Hamilton now and get a player for the long term, allowing us to keep the TPE for something else. We need a 4th big and a good one. Especially one with size and Thompson is that. Our system calls for four bigs....

Also Taylor is not a throw in and is a Thibs guy. He can play the two and the three spot and can shoot the three ball. He is at 36% taking two a game. Him and Butler at the back up wings spots going forward is nice.

Who we add with the pick this summer is another plus, especially since we have ours as well.

Yeah I'm thinking that Rip won't be back next year no matter what regardless. You just can't build around a high usage piece, as he is, who can't stay on the floor. He does a lot of good on this current squad when he can play, but I think you can give those minutes to other guys who are more in the plans moving forward.

And along those lines, I'm not too worried about whether we can bring Marco back or not. If he does come back on the MMLE, that's great. If not, we'll find the next Marco next offseason. When Noah, Boozer, Deng, and Rose are all rolling, we don't need huge amounts of scoring or usage at the 2 to be successful. We just need a guard better than Bogans.

It's sorta like how the Spurs always find shooters for their system. We should be able to find somebody and plug them in, based on Thib's vision for the team and the foundational personell.

[DuckIII]

If the pick iz Charlotte's actual pick then I would be all over this. Doubt it is though.

[DanTown8587]

Only Bulls fans want to one in one breath say they're a title contender and then in the next breath talk about the fourth big and the backup 2/3 or third string PG as if it's helpful at all to winning a title.

I'm against the trade since it doesn't make the Bulls any better and likely gives them the stupid idea the team would be better off amnestying Boozer. Also, while I think you move the Bobcat pick for value, what's here of value? People say McLemore, Goodwin and others but that seems unlikely. Draftexpress has those guys in the top 10 and the only pick you'd get from Portland is 13 or 14.

Nothing that has been talked about is really worth giving up the Charlotte pick (McLemore and Goodwin are but you're not getting them at 13 or beyond).

Basically, this trade is a whole lot of depth, which is the last thing the Bulls need to do with a trade. People are overly concerned with a 4th big. I don't like that, the league is going small so having an ability to give spot minutes to Deng at the 4 is just as important. Als

[Ralphb07]

Yeah I'm thinking that Rip won't be back next year no matter what regardless. You just can't build around a high usage piece, as he is, who can't stay on the floor. He does a lot of good on this current squad when he can play, but I think you can give those minutes to other guys who are more in the plans moving forward.

And along those lines, I'm not too worried about whether we can bring Marco back or not. If he does come back on the MMLE, that's great. If not, we'll find the next Marco next offseason. When Noah, Boozer, Deng, and Rose are all rolling, we don't need huge amounts of scoring or usage at the 2 to be successful. We just need a guard better than Bogans.

It's sorta like how the Spurs always find shooters for their system. We should be able to find somebody and plug them in, based on Thib's vision for the team and the foundational personnel.

I really like Noah, Boozer, Gibson, Thompson, Deng, Butler, Taylor, Rose and Teague (Kirk) is really nice next year. Use that TPE for a SG and we're set. I just love what both Thompson and Taylor can bring to this team.

This whole we need a all star SG is a bit crazy. We're going to win up front and with Rose and the key is getting Rose, Deng, Noah and Boozer on the floor together. The rest is putting the right pieces with that.

[BuffaloBull]

Jeff Taylor really wouldn't be so bad; I'd prefer him to Jimmer, I think. I don't know that Jimmer would ever find the floor much with Rose back with the way Thibs likes to play defense.

[dice]

If you're going to pay four bigs a lot of money, why on earth did you get rid of Asik?

asik would've added to team salary whereas we'd have a contract going out to get thompson. even so, many fans will ask the same question and wonder why we had to throw in a potentially very valuable pick

[League Circles]

The problem is RIP is NOT going to be back next year so I don't understand this... Why wouldn't you want the Bulls to trade Hamilton now and get a player for the long term, allowing us to keep the TPE for something else.

I believe RIP is more likely to be back than not. In order for him to not be back, we probably have to get lucky and sign a better player on a one year 3 mil MMLE deal IMO, which is unlikely. I don't want any no star players for the long term, because I want the leverage that max+ 2014 cap space can give us. The want RIP to stay so that we can use the TPE on another player, not on a sure-downgrade at the SG spot.

We need a 4th big and a good one. Especially one with size and Thompson is that. Our system calls for four bigs....

"Need" is relative. We need a solid SG much more than a 4th big IMO. Why can't Taj just play more? Size? Boozer usually guards the Cs anyway whether he's with Noah or Taj.

Also Taylor is not a throw in and is a Thibs guy. He can play the two and the three spot and can shoot the three ball. He is at 36% taking two a game. Him and Butler at the back up wings spots going forward is nice.

I've never heard of Taylor, and don't spend much time thinking about scrubs on bottom dwelling teams, so I'm ignorant on his value. I will say, though, that backup wings are IMO a dime a dozen on a contending team in Chicago. There will always be guys the caliber of Marco, Nate, Brewer, etc that will play in a great city for a great team with a PT need for dirt cheap. I'm interested in adding a serious core player. I have no interest in lining up long term backups.

Who we add with the pick this summer is another plus, especially since we have ours as well.

The problem is this is supposed to be a bad draft, and if it's a high pick, the salary for the pick will cut into 2014 cap space significantly, for a player who, like most draft picks, including most of ours like James Johnson, Marquis Teague and Jimmy Butler, is just not that good of a player and not someone you should be satisfied with going forward as a rotation player. To me, ALL players who are not what I'd call plus rotation players on title teams are not worth trading assets for. So while I don't want to lose RIP for nothing, it's not because I think he's great, it's because we already have him, he knows our system, he doesn't go beyond 2014, and we're unlikely to be able to add a better player as a FA this summer. Guys like Butler, Marco, and Nate are not bad players at all, but I would never give up a real asset (the bobcats pick) for someone of that caliber. I think the Bulls can add guys of that caliber for vet min deals, small exception deals, and with our own late draft picks for the next 10 years. Seriously, serviceable wing players are a dime a dozen. We've literally acquired 8 of them in the Thibs era without giving up anything of value:

Korver
Brewer
Bogans
RIP
Marco
Butler
Kirk
Cook

[Tenchi Ryu]

Only Bulls fans want to one in one breath say they're a title contender and then in the next breath talk about the fourth big and the backup 2/3 or third string PG as if it's helpful at all to winning a title.

I swear, just ready to throw away the entire season in one swoop...Probably would ship Boozer if they could too...

[PistolP]

Yeah Tyreke would be nice, but I doubt he gets moved until after the sale... unless they really don't like him and know they don't want to resign him at all. I worry a bit about Tyreke on this current squad (he's not going to hit many threes for you) but his ability to attack would be nice.

I'd agree with that. Seems odd though that they'd be interested in Henderson, who is also going to be an RFA, unless they are looking at moving one of Evans or Thornton.

[Darius Miles Davis]

Yeah, none of that is worth a potential #1 pick in a couple years.

This