Reggie Rose rips Bulls' inactivity

[nitetrain8603]

Would have traded Noah for Harden, then kept Asik.

So we can be Houston 2.0?

We'd be so much better than Houston at 100% and you know that unless you rank Rose as a lesser player than Jeremy Lin.

Rose
Harden
Deng
Boozer
Asik

I'll take my chances with that team over the current one.

[GetBuLLish]

That is just wild overreaction, seems to me as backlash vs Rose's brother's comments, to demean him.

Yup. Funny how quick fans are ready to demean the best player on the team.

[Rerisen]

That is just wild overreaction, seems to me as backlash vs Rose's brother's comments, to demean him.

Yup. Funny how quick fans are ready to demean the best player on the team.

It's been a long tradition going back years, usually at expense of protecting even worse players, or worse yet, management.

[babblin-on]

I'm not sure that I'm correctly interpreting you first post & I want to be fair in my response. The underlined portion is why I quoted you & why I showed the players that are surrounding the (possible) two superstars that you mentioned. I now see that Lebron & KD are the players that you were talking about in your first post.

From the list that you provided & your second post, it seems that we are on the same page. Correct me if I'm wrong, but we are both saying that D-Rose needs a legit #2 alongside of him, like all of those mentioned title-winning superstars had. If he doesn't get one, he won't win a title in Chicago.

It's also the same thing that Reggie Rose is saying.

Nope, you're not on the same page; coldfish has insisted time and again that if Rose needs a true #2 then he isn't a true superstar, because real superstars, like Lebron, don't need a true #2 to to win a title.

They don't?

How many championships did LeBron win in Cleveland?

Hey man, I'm not the one who's been pushing that idea, don't ask me. He's been one of the very best the board has had to offer over the years, but he's been pushing this idea since the offseason.

[DuckIII]

I'm probably misremembering, but I don't remember your taking a hardline stance on the SAT matter at the time. I thought you were even okay with it because it highlighted the hypocrisy and fecklessness of the NCAA as an institution.

Again, I'm probably misremembring. It may have been someone else.

Good memory, just incomplete. I've repeatedly cited it as a potential red flag regarding Rose's character and chastised fans for defending him for that particular act. However, and this is the part you recall, I also used the incident to rip both the hypocrisy of the NCAA (I'm loving this Miami 'Canes story) and the absurdity of the NBA's collusion with the NCAA which forces kids like Rose into making those types of decisions.

Rose should have never had to make that decision. That's one criticism. The fact that he did make it (or probably more accurately and more relevent to today's events, let Reggie make that choice for him) is another criticism.

The Bulls fan base for a variety of different reasons, has been overly protective and dedicated to the image of Rose's sales package. Me too many, many times. But at times we need to check ourselves and ask hard questions. Today is one of those times. He's not made of teflon, or at least shouldn't be. What we've seen over the last few years in the NBA with D-Will, Howard, LeBron, and Melo should tell us that we are wading through a sea of red flags right now.

[GetBuLLish]

It's been a long tradition going back years, usually at expense of protecting even worse players, or worse yet, management.

The affinity to management has always baffled me. Tonight it has reached all-time highs (or lows, depending on your perspective).

[Rerisen]

Why Rose SAT was never a big issue... the alternative was Beasley.

Wait, didn't some of you want him anyway?

[TheFix]

No one comes out of this episode looking good.

[Shill]

Hey man, I'm not the one who's been pushing that idea, don't ask me. He's been one of the very best the board has had to offer over the years, but he's been pushing this idea since the offseason.

Gotcha.

I thought you agreed.

[waffle]

then what would YOU have done if YOU were the FO?

[kingkirk]

It's been a long tradition going back years, usually at expense of protecting even worse players, or worse yet, management.

The affinity to management has always baffled me. Tonight it has reached all-time highs (or lows, depending on your perspective).

Can we stop speaking in generalisations, and assuming those that have blasted Reggie Rose, have indeed now turned against Derrick in an instant?

This is false.

Whilst a select few have said some outlandish things, the hyperboles are not helping, and nor are they fact.

[DuckIII]

That is just wild overreaction, seems to me as backlash vs Rose's brother's comments, to demean him.

Yup. Funny how quick fans are ready to demean the best player on the team.

Funny how him being the best player on the team is considered relevent to whether or not his threat to not play is defensible.

[Rerisen]

It's been a long tradition going back years, usually at expense of protecting even worse players, or worse yet, management.

The affinity to management has always baffled me. Tonight it has reached all-time highs (or lows, depending on your perspective).

Indeed, management is NOT the Chicago Bulls, yet oddly get treated like they are. That if you are against moves they do or don't do, you are somehow anti-Bulls. Management comes and goes surely as players do.

In this case, Reggie may have spoken out of turn, or certainly in wrong context (Rose sitting out due to the lack of team improvement) but end of the day, Rose's goals, or motivations behind all this, should be 100% consistent with Bulls fans. The team winning as top priority.

It's not about money, because Rose makes the same either way. It is management who has conflicting goals, and must balance winning with profits, often blurring the line to which drives their actions.

Bulls management already decided this year 'is not worth it' by the moves they made. Financially driven decisions. I did not like it when they did it and I would not like it if Rose based a decision on 'not worth it' either, but sure seems the idea of him doing it is provoking much stronger personal disdain than when management already did it.

[LoveDaBoo]

Well, I do wish Derrick had crushed this. Reggie's comments do count, because he's Derrick's manager. The FO does want, and is trying, to get a second star. There's just not been any opportunity. That's all there is to it. The Bulls players and FO don't deserved to be trashed pulbicly this way.

I don't get why people keep saying this. The Bulls have had chances, but the thing is, the Bulls have been waiting for the perfect situation and the perfect star which will not come. Those players and situations are never available. You have to take risks and that's what's probably bothering Rose & Camp. Dwight was available, the Bulls did have the most available to offer, but didn't because they wanted an extension from Howard. They had a great chance at Melo, but overvalued their assets and didn't want to give up Deng. Now they're satisfied apparently with waiting for Love to come in 2014 and wasting another year or two of Derrick's career.

You simply don't know any of that is true. You're just talking out your ass.

[coldfish]

Before saying Rose needs to be a #2 himself, lets get him a real #2 first. It will be cheaper and easier. He's never had one and we were pretty competitive with Miami with Keith Bogans, possibly the worst starting SG in the league.

I believe there is a difference between regular season play and playoffs for sure, but the Bulls underlying metrics as a team, as measured by regular season performance, is not in any way consistent with suggesting the Bulls actually need a Durant or LeBron level player added to this team. That is just wild overreaction, seems to me as backlash vs Rose's brother's comments, to demean him.

No, its reality. Rose isn't one of the top two players of the game. Those are the guys that need #2 guys to win. Its not a wild overreaction. I have been saying that for quite some time. Look at the Love threads. Seriously, is saying that Rose isn't as good as Lebron or Durant is a wild attack? I'm just stating the obvious.

The guys who have been saying that it takes two stars to win and basing it on history are misrepresenting history. That's what I'm pointing out. People are at first strawmanning my points then they are using bull **** information to do it.

[Shill]

I'm probably misremembering, but I don't remember your taking a hardline stance on the SAT matter at the time. I thought you were even okay with it because it highlighted the hypocrisy and fecklessness of the NCAA as an institution.

Again, I'm probably misremembring. It may have been someone else.

Good memory, just incomplete. I've repeatedly cited it as a potential red flag regarding Rose's character and chastised fans for defending him for that particular act. However, and this is the part you recall, I also used the incident to rip both the hypocrisy of the NCAA (I'm loving this Miami 'Canes story) and the absurdity of the NBA's collusion with the NCAA which forces kids like Rose into making those types of decisions.

Rose should have never had to make that decision. That's one criticism. The fact that he did make it (or probably more accurately and more relevent to today's events, let Reggie make that choice for him) is another criticism.

The Bulls fan base for a variety of different reasons, has been overly protective and dedicated to the image of Rose's sales package. Me too many, many times. But at times we need to check ourselves and ask hard questions. Today is one of those times. He's not made of teflon, or at least shouldn't be. What we've seen over the last few years in the NBA with D-Will, Howard, LeBron, and Melo should tell us that we are wading through a sea of red flags right now.

Fair enough.

I just can't hold Derrick accountable for his older brother.

As far as brothers of celebrities go, he's rather benign.

I think the only way this story blows up is if Rose sits out the season despite being medically cleared.

[nitetrain8603]

then what would YOU have done if YOU were the FO?

I would've pushed both Noah and Deng for Howard, even without assurance that he would re-sign, because if he didn't, you have a lot of cap cleared. Once you do that, you could fill in the blanks as that's much easier to do once you have two superstars.

Rose
Hamilton
Butler
Boozer
Howard

[LoveDaBoo]

You keep calling everyone who disagrees with your opinions a joke.

When people use this opportunity to bring up Rose's SATs (like you have) or say that "This is Dwight territory if not worse (Dwight was always PC in public) and Rose would have done less damage by raping someone like Kobe did" (like ColdFish did), then I will call those opinions jokes.

Admittedly, I've never been comfortable with Rose stealing someone's scholarship. So I'll give you that. But it illustrates the degree to which his hero worship has always been out of bounds with Bulls fans. That act was indefensible. Yet it is defended in STRONG language to this day, like you calling it a joke to even mention it in the context of an event that raises questions about Rose's selfishness. Sorry, but its a pertinent point.
.

Nope, that's just wrong. It's the NCAA's fault. Rose didn't make the NCAA whore itself like it does. Blaming children for the insanely corrup NCAA simply isn't fair.

Edit: and the NBA. I shouldn't let them get away with their evil age limit. All they're doing is monetizing the NCAA's rank nonsense.

[BIGGIEsmalls 23]

I'm not sure that I'm correctly interpreting you first post & I want to be fair in my response. The underlined portion is why I quoted you & why I showed the players that are surrounding the (possible) two superstars that you mentioned. I now see that Lebron & KD are the players that you were talking about in your first post.

From the list that you provided & your second post, it seems that we are on the same page. Correct me if I'm wrong, but we are both saying that D-Rose needs a legit #2 alongside of him, like all of those mentioned title-winning superstars had. If he doesn't get one, he won't win a title in Chicago.

It's also the same thing that Reggie Rose is saying.

No, what I am saying is that Rose needs a legit #1 beside him if you want to win the superstar way. Rose is the Pippen to Jordan or Wade to Lebron or Kobe to Shaq. Outside of that, you need to have a ton of talent like Detroit or Boston and even then you are probably one and done.

I disagree with that because I think Rose is a #1. Is he Lebron or Durant?...No, but he's a franchise player that has won a MVP.

How are we not basically saying the same thing?...a #2 is some other team's #1. Kevin Love is the Wolves #1, but would be a #2 on other teams. Are you saying that a Rose/Love or Rose/Harden combo are not title contenders?

You pointed out that the championship has been won by superstars, but every single one of those superstars had a #2 with them. You said the the two superstars in the league presently are on the cusp of winning the title...that's true, but they both have a #2.

Myself & reggie Rose are also saying that he needs a #2.

So, yes, Rose needs more talent around him and behind the scenes its fine for Reggie to say that. To say it publicly AFTER the Bulls paid the luxury tax and when they can't do anything is idiotic. To then threaten to sit out, call out management and trash teammates publicly is beyond (Please Use More Appropriate Word).

I go back to one of the first posts in this thread by another poster. He/she raised the possibility of the Bulls passing on a deal today, which may have caused this public reaction from Reggie. It's completely a hypothetical scenario, but what if it indeed happened.

What if D-Rose convinced an unknown star to accept a trade to Chicago, but GarPax got cold feet & decided to hold on to Deng and/or Boozer instead of pulling the trigger. We don't know what happened to cause Rose's circle to go bonkers.

You are treating Reggie Rose like a poster. If he was, I wouldn't bash him. He is the professional representative of Derrick Rose giving quotes to the main stream press. Under that capacity, he is a FOOL.

Everyone has their opinion of how he handled it & I respect those views. I just look at it differently for various reasons...one being that he's not a bad person nor a fool.

[DuckIII]

It's been a long tradition going back years, usually at expense of protecting even worse players, or worse yet, management.

The affinity to management has always baffled me. Tonight it has reached all-time highs (or lows, depending on your perspective).

Indeed, management is NOT the Chicago Bulls, yet oddly get treated like they are. That if you are against moves they do or don't do, you are somehow anti-Bulls. Management comes and goes surely as players do.

You both need to take a good long read of King Cuban's post. I ripped the FO as harshly or maybe even more harshly than almost anyone for letting Asik walk and refusing to pay up. And yet, I can't help but feel I fall within this extraordinarily wide net you've cast over fans upset with Team Derrick's public statements today.

And I am most certainly not alone among posters here who can criticize both management and players alike for their choices.