Lonzo Ball Thread (UPDATE: Bulls Offer Sato + 2nd Round picks)

[PrimzyBulls81]

Ball, Hart for Sato, White and pick

[Rupert]

We ain't getting Lonzo, apparently every team wants him now. Someone will offer something good that we can't match

[dougthonus]

Who are these max FA's we're going to sign in the next year or two? There is no one on the market. And Lonzo at 20 is still very tradable imho.

What if it isn't 20m? What if someone offers him 28m?

What if it takes your 1st rounder next year and not 2nds to get him? (The Pelicans fans were throwing up in their mouths over our reported offer and laughed at the idea of taking it).

If it was Sato and 2nds, I would trade for Lonzo and just see what happens in FA. I doubt, to be honest, that this gets it done for the Pelicans though. However, Porter for Lonzo + Bledsoe, that could be something there because the money to the team might be worth something.

I also don't think Lauri will be around. So I think you can build a team around Lavine and Lonzo and try to figure out the rest. It seems we're keen on getting better and not rebuilding. Personally, I'd sell off everyone and gain assets to rebuild. Lonzo is the kind of young 2 way player that you get that can make a winning impact and improve.

Generally, you think more of Lonzo than I do, but I don't hate the idea of getting him.

The risks are generally:
1: He's starter caliber but not star caliber.
2: He's going to be paid a ton of money.
3: You probably have to give up something that has real value to get him.

When you add those three things up, it's pretty high risk that you aren't in a better position afterwards than you were before.

[BeKuK]

The risks are generally:
1: He's starter caliber but not star caliber.
2: He's going to be paid a ton of money.
3: You probably have to give up something that has real value to get him.

When you add those three things up, it's pretty high risk that you aren't in a better position afterwards than you were before.

1. Still a huge upgrade compared to the currenty guys we are having at this position. We do not need a "Star"on every single spot but high IQ players.

2. Based on the craziness goining around the league he's would be worth every single penny.

3. What do we really have with "real" value except (probably) Zach and PWill? Imo, nothing and we would not have to give up one of those two.

I truly believe Lonzo would change the status quo ....in a decenst way.

[dougthonus]

1. Still a huge upgrade compared to the currenty guys we are having at this position. We do not need a "Star"on every single spot but high IQ players.

I think it is highly questionable that he is a "huge" upgrade.

2. Based on the craziness goining around the league he's would be worth every single penny.

Contracts in his range are almost always bad. It's very rare for these to be good deals. Expecting it to be a good deal is setting yourself up for disappointment. If 20M is a good deal, he'll get offered 28M.

3. What do we really have with "real" value except (probably) Zach and PWill? Imo, nothing and we would not have to give up one of those two.

Future 1st round picks. NOP is demanding two of them for Lonzo currently (granted, I don't think they will get two, and I'd be awfully upset if we traded two).

I truly believe Lonzo would change the status quo ....in a decenst way.

I understand this belief but don't share it.

I think factoring in the trade value you give up, the contract value you have to offer, and his overall talent that you come out in a 'meh' situation.

Makes me sad overall that we didn't get Brogdan a couple years ago, whom was in a similar situation, similar likely cost, but a much better player.

[StunnerKO]

Read on Twitter

Too much buzz around the Knicks, now reported to be offering Robinson. They seem most thirsty.

I don't think we can beat this offer, if it's really on the table.

That offer stinks Robinson , Adams and Hayes and Zion doesn’t fix anything of their flaws

[sco]

Read on Twitter

Too much buzz around the Knicks, now reported to be offering Robinson. They seem most thirsty.

I don't think we can beat this offer, if it's really on the table.

That offer stinks Robinson , Adams and Hayes and Zion doesn’t fix anything of their flaws

I wonder if we can get in on that deal and get a C?

BTW, I saw this - that we offered Lauri for him.

https://lonzowire.usatoday.com/2021/03/23/lonzo-ball-trade-rumors-pelicans-bulls-nuggets-bol-bol/

[bearadonisdna]

1. Still a huge upgrade compared to the currenty guys we are having at this position. We do not need a "Star"on every single spot but high IQ players.

I think it is highly questionable that he is a "huge" upgrade.

2. Based on the craziness goining around the league he's would be worth every single penny.

Contracts in his range are almost always bad. It's very rare for these to be good deals. Expecting it to be a good deal is setting yourself up for disappointment. If 20M is a good deal, he'll get offered 28M.

3. What do we really have with "real" value except (probably) Zach and PWill? Imo, nothing and we would not have to give up one of those two.

Future 1st round picks. NOP is demanding two of them for Lonzo currently (granted, I don't think they will get two, and I'd be awfully upset if we traded two).

I truly believe Lonzo would change the status quo ....in a decenst way.

I understand this belief but don't share it.

I think factoring in the trade value you give up, the contract value you have to offer, and his overall talent that you come out in a 'meh' situation.

Makes me sad overall that we didn't get Brogdan a couple years ago, whom was in a similar situation, similar likely cost, but a much better player.

perspective, if we get him, its likely we will have to pay him more than zach for his 1st full year.


tbh i agree its not a huge upgrade, i dont think he good enough to dispel a zach at point guard narrative. very few players are but i wouldnt invest to to still have a backcourt in flux.

[chefo]

From the yahoo sports article this morning...

It said in the title that Lauri was offered for Lonzo... but then in the body of the article it wrote that it was discussed, but not seriously and it went nowhere.

In other words, it sounds like NO asked for Lauri and was told to go pound sand --"Sato and 2 2nds is what you can have".

[dougthonus]

From the yahoo sports article this morning...

It said in the title that Lauri was offered for Lonzo... but then in the body of the article it wrote that it was discussed, but not seriously and it went nowhere.

In other words, it sounds like NO asked for Lauri and was told to go pound sand --"Sato and 2 2nds is what you can have".

Not that it matters really, but what the article said was that discussions went no where not that the Bulls were taking some hardline stance. It didn't even mention Sato/2nds. It could also be that we offered Lauri for Ball and NOP said no. It just said that line didn't go anywhere, not which side refused to move.

Also worth noting, the original source is a bleacher report article, and the yahoo guy is just a random blogger who scraped it (and credited it), and many of these sites have someone that writes the article title for you (ie, the yahoo guy who wrote the article didn't likely write the sensational headline).

[TheStig]

Who are these max FA's we're going to sign in the next year or two? There is no one on the market. And Lonzo at 20 is still very tradable imho.

What if it isn't 20m? What if someone offers him 28m?

What if it takes your 1st rounder next year and not 2nds to get him? (The Pelicans fans were throwing up in their mouths over our reported offer and laughed at the idea of taking it).

If it was Sato and 2nds, I would trade for Lonzo and just see what happens in FA. I doubt, to be honest, that this gets it done for the Pelicans though. However, Porter for Lonzo + Bledsoe, that could be something there because the money to the team might be worth something.

I also don't think Lauri will be around. So I think you can build a team around Lavine and Lonzo and try to figure out the rest. It seems we're keen on getting better and not rebuilding. Personally, I'd sell off everyone and gain assets to rebuild. Lonzo is the kind of young 2 way player that you get that can make a winning impact and improve.

Generally, you think more of Lonzo than I do, but I don't hate the idea of getting him.

The risks are generally:
1: He's starter caliber but not star caliber.
2: He's going to be paid a ton of money.
3: You probably have to give up something that has real value to get him.

When you add those three things up, it's pretty high risk that you aren't in a better position afterwards than you were before.

I wouldn't trade my first for him because he's going into RFA. The most I would do is Sato and Coby or Lauri for him. So 1sts are not at stake for me.

I also think that NO would view Bledsoe as an asset and not a liability. So dumping his salary isn't a plus like you make it out to be.

As for the risks. I do think he's a good starter caliber but not a star. So I don't think that's a risk or overpay at 20m. I think that's fair. If he gets a max offer, then you let him walk. If I lose a 2nd or Coby or Lauri in this gamble, that's fine. I don't really value them all that much. If I gain Ball on a 20m deal, I've got a good 2 way starting pg. Well worth the risk.

[chefo]

From the yahoo sports article this morning...

It said in the title that Lauri was offered for Lonzo... but then in the body of the article it wrote that it was discussed, but not seriously and it went nowhere.

In other words, it sounds like NO asked for Lauri and was told to go pound sand --"Sato and 2 2nds is what you can have".

Not that it matters really, but what the article said was that discussions went no where not that the Bulls were taking some hardline stance. It didn't even mention Sato/2nds. It could also be that we offered Lauri for Ball and NOP said no. It just said that line didn't go anywhere, not which side refused to move.

Also worth noting, the original source is a bleacher report article, and the yahoo guy is just a random blogger who scraped it (and credited it), and many of these sites have someone that writes the article title for you (ie, the yahoo guy who wrote the article didn't likely write the sensational headline).

Correct. I just tried putting two and two together. We're rumored to have offered Sato and 2nds. Lauri was discussed but went nowhere. Odds are we didn't make that offer based on the information above.

P.S. Actually in the article it says: "This is not the first time the Bulls have been mentioned as The Ringer’s Kevin O’Connor reported the team has dangled Tomas Satoransky and second round picks for Ball as well."

I think this was an honest, clumsy leak from NO (if it wasn't made up to begin with) meant to imply that a team is willing to offer a promising, well-playing young player for Lonzo, which is meant to bid up his price to whomever really wants him. I guess NO is probably underwhelmed with what offers have come their way (say Sato and 2 2nds) and this is a way to try to get better ones.

We've also heard that teams have called the Bulls for Lauri and they are listening, but I don't think the Bulls gain anything by leaking that Lauri's trade value is Lonzo.

[dougthonus]

I wouldn't trade my first for him because he's going into RFA. The most I would do is Sato and Coby or Lauri for him. So 1sts are not at stake for me.

Coby is probably worth a mid round 1st to me right now. I would be okay swapping Lauri for Lonzo, but I think it'd be a bit like swapping deck chairs. It's not a bad thing to do if you just want to try lonzo out though.

I also think that NO would view Bledsoe as an asset and not a liability. So dumping his salary isn't a plus like you make it out to be.

This doesn't appear to be true from the news. Bledsoe has completely tanked and is widely viewed as a large liability and there are talks they may buy him out after the deadline.

As for the risks. I do think he's a good starter caliber but not a star. So I don't think that's a risk or overpay at 20m. I think that's fair. If he gets a max offer, then you let him walk. If I lose a 2nd or Coby or Lauri in this gamble, that's fine. I don't really value them all that much. If I gain Ball on a 20m deal, I've got a good 2 way starting pg. Well worth the risk.

I wouldn't want to lose Coby to let Lonzo walk. I'd be okay with those other pieces leaving, though you would be worse off losing Sato to let Lonzo walk, there isn't much long term risk there.

[MrSparkle]

Well, sure seems to be a lot of interest in Ball, but all the offers could be as crappy as ours. Now Philly? Ha- eager to see what Morey is willing to offer to put Lonzo next to Simmons, Thybulle and Embiid (what the?). Maybe Morey had enough semi final exits and 3P contests in HOU, and wants to win the old-fashioned way, pre-3P line.

[LateNight]

BTW, I saw this - that we offered Lauri for him.

https://lonzowire.usatoday.com/2021/03/23/lonzo-ball-trade-rumors-pelicans-bulls-nuggets-bol-bol/

"Lonzowire"??? Does USA Today really have a whole Lonzo Ball section??

[FriedRise]

Read on Twitter

[MrSparkle]

I know it seems like a low-ball, but Sato & 2nds centered deal is really quite decent for both sides. NOP extends Sato to another few years of $10m, and SVG/Zion have a multi-position 3D guard with handles locked up.

Lonzo on a $20m+ salary would be a complete waste of their cap, and Robinson from NYK would hardly make any sense since they already have more defensive centers then you would ever want on one roster.

[dougthonus]

I know it seems like a low-ball, but Sato & 2nds centered deal is really quite decent for both sides. NOP extends Sato to another few years of $10m, and SVG/Zion have a multi-position 3D guard with handles locked up.

Lonzo on a $20m+ salary would be a complete waste of their cap, and Robinson from NYK would hardly make any sense since they already have more defensive centers then you would ever want on one roster.

Doesn't seem too useful for the Pels. They have tons and tons of extra 1st rounders. 2nd rounders don't do anything for them. Lonzo at 20M doesn't waste their cap more than anyone elses. They still have a need for a player like him too.

[chefo]

BTW, I am not convinced that Sato is that much of a worse distributor, or defender, or scorer than Lonzo.

Sato, with 30 min / game, has been a 10&7 player, with a TS% > 60%. He gets 55 touches / game as a starter, Lonzo gets 75.

I mean, Sato is at 12/4/8 per 36 with above average defense, and elite efficiency scoring-wise, which is about as perfect as a 4th / 5th banana on a good team as you can get. Sato has been one of the Bulls best players this year, when he's on the court, and he's on the books for cheap for another year. This is not as big of an underpay as people are making it out to be.

[JimmyJammer]

New Orleans has sat Ball over the past two games without any indication of being injured is a sign that he will be traded. I don't know what it will take, but I am happy to know that we are in the running.