Lonzo Ball Thread (UPDATE: Bulls Offer Sato + 2nd Round picks)

[weneeda2guard]

I wouldn't give up much for lonzo
It's clear he wants Chicago and Chicago wants him. We can always just sign him in the off season. Pelicans are not going to match. Pelicans need to get something now for him. Same issue we have with lauri.

[sco]

I wouldn't give up much for lonzo
It's clear he wants Chicago and Chicago wants him. We can always just sign him in the off season. Pelicans are not going to match. Pelicans need to get something now for him. Same issue we have with lauri.

Since he wants other teams too and other teams want him too, I think there is some value to being able to keep him by matching.

I think Lauri makes the most sense as it is clear (to at least me) that the FO values him below his expected asking price/market value...so we'd be trading rights to players that we wouldn't likely keep.

If NY still wants a PG, I wonder what Sato and other assets could fetch us in terms of Noel or Robinson?

[MrSparkle]

I know it seems like a low-ball, but Sato & 2nds centered deal is really quite decent for both sides. NOP extends Sato to another few years of $10m, and SVG/Zion have a multi-position 3D guard with handles locked up.

Lonzo on a $20m+ salary would be a complete waste of their cap, and Robinson from NYK would hardly make any sense since they already have more defensive centers then you would ever want on one roster.

Doesn't seem too useful for the Pels. They have tons and tons of extra 1st rounders. 2nd rounders don't do anything for them. Lonzo at 20M doesn't waste their cap more than anyone elses. They still have a need for a player like him too.

Well I agree that the 2nds are useless to them, but I think Lonzo's also useless. His shooting stats are hot air IMO; the 3P% is unsustainable. Already came down to 38%, and I expect he'll finish the season at 33-35%. It was a high-volume figure of set-shots during a low-pressure part of the season: empty-stand, half-the-league's-starters-observing-COVID-protocols.

The "improved-shooting" is hot-air in my book. We're talking about small-margin big-percentage differences, just like with Lauri. Lonzo's making 0.2 more FTs on 0.1 less attempts this year; 0.7 more 3Ps on 1.5 more 3PAs.

If you're paying him $20m, you'd want him to expand on his 19% usage, kind of how Brogdon went from 19% with Giannis to 25% in IND. The key is whether Lonzo can be a primary ball-handler, and that's how you'll get your bang-for-buck. Don't see that happening in NOP, with Zion and Ingram ahead, not to mention a pool of prospects like Kira.

Straight up, I think Sato improves their team now and tomorrow. The fair question is whether they're going for Cade Cunningham. If so, then sure, they keep Lonzo or move him for more prospects.

I'm not even sold on Lonzo RFA market value, let alone paying more than Sato. But he would be a medium-risk/good-reward gamble.

[chefo]

Just to note--Ball's agent wants $20M per. Doesn't mean he'll get it or should get it.

Lonzo has done nothing in his career to date to signify he's worth anything near that. His best year, he's been a thoroughly-replaceable Sato-level player, and these guys don't make $20 per.

I think he or his handlers view him as some "star", but he's been a not-so-efficient role-player at best, and a bench warmer, busted 2nd pick at his worst. His handlers are trying to anchor people's biases on a large number, but to me they are waaaaaay off. They're thinking "I just need one idiot to bite" and if they hype him enough they may get somebody to, but that contract may end up aging very poorly the moment the ink dries.

It's akin to Lauri's agent coming out and saying he's looking for the rookie max. You can "look" for whatever you want, doesn't mean you'll get it.

[TheStig]

I wouldn't trade my first for him because he's going into RFA. The most I would do is Sato and Coby or Lauri for him. So 1sts are not at stake for me.

Coby is probably worth a mid round 1st to me right now. I would be okay swapping Lauri for Lonzo, but I think it'd be a bit like swapping deck chairs. It's not a bad thing to do if you just want to try lonzo out though.

I also think that NO would view Bledsoe as an asset and not a liability. So dumping his salary isn't a plus like you make it out to be.

This doesn't appear to be true from the news. Bledsoe has completely tanked and is widely viewed as a large liability and there are talks they may buy him out after the deadline.

As for the risks. I do think he's a good starter caliber but not a star. So I don't think that's a risk or overpay at 20m. I think that's fair. If he gets a max offer, then you let him walk. If I lose a 2nd or Coby or Lauri in this gamble, that's fine. I don't really value them all that much. If I gain Ball on a 20m deal, I've got a good 2 way starting pg. Well worth the risk.

I wouldn't want to lose Coby to let Lonzo walk. I'd be okay with those other pieces leaving, though you would be worse off losing Sato to let Lonzo walk, there isn't much long term risk there.

If someone give you a mid 1st for Coby, you take it in run. He's a late first at best.

I hadn't heard he was a buyout candidate. He certainly wasn't a liability when they got him.

You have to give something to get something...... And Lonzo isn't getting the max from anyone. I think he'll get around 20 million. If he were a max guy, lots of people would be throwing out offers.

[Chicago-Bull-E]

Woj mentioned Chicago as the team to watch for in a Ball deal. Also mentioned Philly as a long shot.

[jnrjr79]

I know it seems like a low-ball, but Sato & 2nds centered deal is really quite decent for both sides. NOP extends Sato to another few years of $10m, and SVG/Zion have a multi-position 3D guard with handles locked up.

Lonzo on a $20m+ salary would be a complete waste of their cap, and Robinson from NYK would hardly make any sense since they already have more defensive centers then you would ever want on one roster.

Doesn't seem too useful for the Pels. They have tons and tons of extra 1st rounders. 2nd rounders don't do anything for them. Lonzo at 20M doesn't waste their cap more than anyone elses. They still have a need for a player like him too.

Isn’t the whole idea here that NO has already decided it’s not going to pay what it’ll take to keep Lonzo?

There is also no such thing as useless draft picks - if NO can’t realistically use them for themselves, they can be flipped down the line.

I agree it’s not an overwhelming offer, but if NO doesn’t want to keep Lonzo, then they should be in take the best deal on the table mode.

[DASMACKDOWN]

I think for us Lonzo would be a slightly inclined move. Meaning not quite a lateral move but only a slight impact. I keep saying he is a rich mans Sato. You will be fine with him starting for now but its not enough to say we wont ever have to look for a pg.

[dougthonus]

Well I agree that the 2nds are useless to them, but I think Lonzo's also useless. His shooting stats are hot air IMO; the 3P% is unsustainable. Already came down to 38%, and I expect he'll finish the season at 33-35%. It was a high-volume figure of set-shots during a low-pressure part of the season: empty-stand, half-the-league's-starters-observing-COVID-protocols.

The "improved-shooting" is hot-air in my book. We're talking about small-margin big-percentage differences, just like with Lauri. Lonzo's making 0.2 more FTs on 0.1 less attempts this year; 0.7 more 3Ps on 1.5 more 3PAs.

If you're paying him $20m, you'd want him to expand on his 19% usage, kind of how Brogdon went from 19% with Giannis to 25% in IND. The key is whether Lonzo can be a primary ball-handler, and that's how you'll get your bang-for-buck. Don't see that happening in NOP, with Zion and Ingram ahead, not to mention a pool of prospects like Kira.

Straight up, I think Sato improves their team now and tomorrow. The fair question is whether they're going for Cade Cunningham. If so, then sure, they keep Lonzo or move him for more prospects.

I'm not even sold on Lonzo RFA market value, let alone paying more than Sato. But he would be a medium-risk/good-reward gamble.

The things you wrote aren't worse for the Pels than any other team in the league. Those are comments on Lonzo as a whole. You either want to take the risk or you don't. I don't see any reason why the Pels would be less or more likely to take it than the next team.

Those same risks exist for any other team trading for him. If Sato helps them more, then why would we trade them Sato, whom should also help us more, and throw in 2nds?

The answer to that for the Pelicans is only if they just decided they don't want Lonzo at all under almost any circumstances. Their recent stance would suggest that might not be true, but that could simply be posturing to try and get a better offer.

[MalagaBulls]

Apart from the inherent value Lonzo may or may not bring as a facilitator/creator, Father Ball has started to make noise again recently trying to get some team to bite & "bring his boys together". AK & BD don't strike me as the types to allow the "Chino Hills Bulls" to grow roots here. Lastly, I think Lonzo has started to distance himself from his father's influence but do we really need that kind of circus distraction here?

[TheStig]

Apart from the inherent value Lonzo may or may not bring as a facilitator/creator, Father Ball has started to make noise again recently trying to get some team to bite & "bring his boys together". AK & BD don't strike me as the types to allow the "Chino Hills Bulls" to grow roots here. Lastly, I think Lonzo has started to distance himself from his father's influence but do we really need that kind of circus distraction here?

I am down to bring the Ball boys together. Lamelo can force a trade here any day to play with Lonzo.....

[NecessaryEvil]

[LateNight]

This is a non-update. It just says they want a good deal and will hold him if not - it’s sourced to KOC. Saving you the click if you’re not on IG

[Michael Jackson]

Apart from the inherent value Lonzo may or may not bring as a facilitator/creator, Father Ball has started to make noise again recently trying to get some team to bite & "bring his boys together". AK & BD don't strike me as the types to allow the "Chino Hills Bulls" to grow roots here. Lastly, I think Lonzo has started to distance himself from his father's influence but do we really need that kind of circus distraction here?

I am down to bring the Ball boys together. Lamelo can force a trade here any day to play with Lonzo.....

MJ likes NC players and salaries match well enough so how about LaMelo for Coby? Can’t see any reason what the Hornets wouldn’t want to do that. Not a single one at all.

[TheStig]

I'm sure they're trying to pump up his value but if you're not a playoff team and you're not resigning him, wouldn't you just move off him? That is what we will see. It'll be others bidding up his value in the final hours.

[NecessaryEvil]

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The Bulls could very well have the cap space to take a swing at Ball, but I guess Windhorst is implying that since negotiations have started this far in advance, it could be easy to eventually find an outcome that leaves everyone happy.

Probably safe to say it's likely he's coming here one way or another.

[chefo]

Here's a funny thought--if you make Sato officially available, I bet you get calls from every single playoff bound team in the league.

What rumors do we have so far for Lonzo?

* Bol Bol--last guy off the bench for the Nuggets; is not ready to play and will not play on NO
* Sixers--won't give up Thybulle for him, a guy who while a good defender, hasn't broken 5 ppg yet; if Lonzo doesn't even net you a super-raw, defense first modern-day version of Ronnie Brewer, they're probably offering straight-up trash
* The Hawks offered Cam Reddish--one of the worst busts of the last decade (he's like bad Coby, but full-time)
* The Knicks beat writers quoted NY execs saying they're giving up neither draft assets nor major rotational pieces because they're playing well and don't want to disrupt chemistry
* We've offered Sato and 2nds.

So, in the "bidding war", we're the only ones offering anything that's NOT utter trash.

[ZOMG]

Here's a funny thought--if you make Sato officially available, I bet you get calls from every single playoff bound team in the league.

What rumors do we have so far for Lonzo?

* Bol Bol--last guy off the bench for the Nuggets; is not ready to play and will not play on NO
* Sixers--won't give up Thybulle for him, a guy who while a good defender, hasn't broken 5 ppg yet; if Lonzo doesn't even net you a super-raw, defense first modern-day version of Ronnie Brewer, they're probably offering straight-up trash
* The Hawks offered Cam Reddish--one of the worst busts of the last decade (he's like bad Coby, but full-time)
* The Knicks beat writers quoted NY execs saying they're giving up neither draft assets nor major rotational pieces because they're playing well and don't want to disrupt chemistry
* We've offered Sato and 2nds.

So, in the "bidding war", we're the only ones offering anything that's NOT utter trash.

Bingo.

This is why sending Lauri to NO would make the Bulls the laughing stock of the league.

[CaPiTanAK]

Prep that Lonzo Ball Bulls jersey. Let’s stabilize that pg position for the next 6-8 years.

[FriedRise]

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