2020 NBA Draft Thread: Bulls pick 4th: PT 2

PlayerUp · Post #981 » by **PlayerUp** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 12:09 pm

BullsFTW wrote:As of right I still have Edwards going #1, and if GSW keeps the pick, I think they’ll draft Deni. Charlotte in my opinion will draft Wiseman, which leaves the Bulls the option to draft Ball or Hayes.

You take Ball then at #4 and look to trade down.

PlayerUp · Post #982 » by **PlayerUp** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 12:18 pm

CjayC wrote:If I'm Wiseman though, I'm definitely letting the hype do the talking for me, especially since a ton of big boards have him as a Top 3 prospect even on that small sample size. There's a lot for Obi to lose as well with only 1 year of elite production. Better to leave off on a good note, than raise more questions about his position as a tweener.

Which is why we should stay away from these prospects. Don't buy into the hype.

Grodoboldo · Post #983 » by **Grodoboldo** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 2:17 pm

Yeah, I can't see how not going to the combine doesn't raise flags for these guys. It doesn't mean that they'll drop, but I'd be concerned if I had to make a decision about them.

Bulldog23 · Post #984 » by **Bulldog23** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 2:25 pm

I like Wiseman and Hayes, but Okoro is intriguing. I want to see his measurements and agility test scores. The Bulls have no long term answers for wings on this team. This has to be addressed in free agency and draft.

cjbulls · Post #985 » by **cjbulls** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 3:47 pm

MrFortune3 wrote:
cjbulls wrote:No extra picks unless the Bulls have a very unique, specific target. The one thing this team does not need is to try to grow more young guys all at the same time. You spoil all of them by focusing on none of them.

There will be plenty of focus on the young guys. The FO is going to bring in as much young talent as possible if we follow the Nuggets model.

Except this would be even more extreme than Nuggets model. Let’s look at their roster from 3 years ago to put them in a place where the Bulls should be now. Of their main rotation guys, they played 4 younger guys and had a host of good vets. The Bulls have a few vets (Only Porter good, but unhealthy) plus LaVine and then 6 younger guys.

VETS
K Faried
Gallinari
W Chandler
W Barton
J. Nelson

YOUNGS
G Harris
E Mudiay
J Murray
N Jokic

The Bulls have

VETS
Thad
Sato
Porter
LaVine (???)

YOUNGS
Coby
WCJ
Lauri
Hutch
Gafford
#4 pick
More draft picks (???)

cjbulls · Post #986 » by **cjbulls** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 3:50 pm

Grodoboldo wrote:Yeah, I can't see how not going to the combine doesn't raise flags for these guys. It doesn't mean that they'll drop, but I'd be concerned if I had to make a decision about them.

I kind of see it the opposite, from a player perspective. If I’m a top choice, why would I risk it at a combine? No one has played an organized game in 6 months or more. Things can only really go wrong for guys like Toppin, Edwards and Ball.

PlayerUp · Post #987 » by **PlayerUp** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 3:51 pm

Bulldog23 wrote:IOkoro is intriguing. I want to see his measurements and agility test scores. The Bulls have no long term answers for wings on this team. This has to be addressed in free agency and draft.

Forget free agency Bulls have no cap space. Trades and draft are more realistic at the moment. Free agency will wait until 2021 but all teams will have cap space then. Personally if I'm the Bulls I take on assets for bad contracts and forget about free agency in 2021.

As for Okoro, he needs to show his shot has improved and he is developing some offensive moves.

PlayerUp · Post #988 » by **PlayerUp** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 3:53 pm

cjbulls wrote:
Grodoboldo wrote:Yeah, I can't see how not going to the combine doesn't raise flags for these guys. It doesn't mean that they'll drop, but I'd be concerned if I had to make a decision about them.

I kind of see it the opposite, from a player perspective. If I’m a top choice, why would I risk it at a combine? No one has played an organized game in 6 months or more. Things can only really go wrong for guys like Toppin, Edwards and Ball.

If they feel confident their games have improved and want to show it off, they would show up.

cjbulls · Post #989 » by **cjbulls** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 4:25 pm

PlayerUp wrote:
cjbulls wrote:
Grodoboldo wrote:Yeah, I can't see how not going to the combine doesn't raise flags for these guys. It doesn't mean that they'll drop, but I'd be concerned if I had to make a decision about them.

I kind of see it the opposite, from a player perspective. If I’m a top choice, why would I risk it at a combine? No one has played an organized game in 6 months or more. Things can only really go wrong for guys like Toppin, Edwards and Ball.

If they feel confident their games have improved and want to show it off, they would show up.

It’s not about confidence. It’s about playing your hand and right now they have the best hands.

If Edwards shows up and has a poor shooting day he could drop from #1 all the way to 5. He’s already going 1, so why risk it? Same for Ball who could fall from 3 to 7. Toppin just needs to look not quite as athletic as everyone hopes or test poorly in some of the agility drills for him to drop.

Most of these guys at the top can’t move up much further but can fall significantly. Wiseman is probably the exception but even then there are reasons like promises which may keep him from showing up.

NecessaryEvil · Post #990 » by **NecessaryEvil** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 4:26 pm

No way GSW takes Deni with the 2nd pick.

As a team competing for titles, I don't see how that helps them at all.

TheFinishSniper · Post #991 » by **TheFinishSniper** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 4:36 pm

GSW will trade their pick most likely.

Andi Obst · Post #992 » by **Andi Obst** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 4:37 pm

NecessaryEvil wrote:No way GSW takes Deni with the 2nd pick.

As a team competing for titles, I don't see how that helps them at all.

To be fair, it's hard to find any rookie who can be a key part of a contender. That's why so many people think they will look to trade the pick, after all.

I would certainly look for possibilities to trade out of this draft and collect more future draft capital in their position.

kodo · Post #993 » by **kodo** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 4:48 pm

PlayerUp wrote:
cjbulls wrote:
Grodoboldo wrote:Yeah, I can't see how not going to the combine doesn't raise flags for these guys. It doesn't mean that they'll drop, but I'd be concerned if I had to make a decision about them.

I kind of see it the opposite, from a player perspective. If I’m a top choice, why would I risk it at a combine? No one has played an organized game in 6 months or more. Things can only really go wrong for guys like Toppin, Edwards and Ball.

If they feel confident their games have improved and want to show it off, they would show up.

For top players, that's done in private workouts with the teams they want to go to, not the public combine.

Top players rarely participate in the basketball portions. The very top don't even show up for anything, and the ones that do show up are doing it for the measurements, interviews & meetings. The ones that actually play are trying to move up from the 2nd round or lower 1st round.

Also worth mentioning, it's often reported that the combine scrimmages are chaotic and messy and can make everyone look bad because the players have never played with each other, there's no consistent coaching system that's been practiced all season, and nobody cares about winning/losing they only care about how good they individually look. It's basically a recipe for terrible basketball. Think NBA summer league, and lower the quality a few notches.

Jvaughn · Post #994 » by **Jvaughn** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 5:03 pm

Read on Twitter

?s=19

Read on Twitter

?s=19

Not sure if I trust it, but what does this do to the order if this holds true?

cjbulls · Post #995 » by **cjbulls** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 5:56 pm

Jvaughn wrote:

Read on Twitter
?s=19

Read on Twitter
?s=19

Not sure if I trust it, what does this do to the order if this holds true?

I was just about to post this. Several good tidbits but I’m not sure about Wasserman’s sources. They torched Edwards:

“ Teams are worried about Edwards' drive and enthusiasm for winning, and according to a source, the Golden State Warriors aren't a likely landing spot due to these concerns.

Despite media projections and upside that everyone acknowledges, he has a shaky reputation within NBA circles. Dion Waiters has been used by skeptics as a comparison or low-end outcome for Edwards, an inefficient scorer at Georgia whose Bulldogs finished 13 of 14 teams in the SEC.

Scouts and executives have mentioned that his teams haven't won at any level, and that he even forgets plays and actions.”

FriedRise · Post #996 » by **FriedRise** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 6:09 pm

Read on Twitter

TheFinishSniper · Post #997 » by **TheFinishSniper** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 6:41 pm

Wolves are scared to pick wrong guy because of pressure of KAT leaving if they make wrong choice. They need someone to build around. Not mention they have no clue how to draft really outside time when Sanders was in charge. On other side GSW is scared picking that high and picking wrong guy because if that guy is not instantly good and they start benching him for vet it will create pressure on spotlight. Top pick not playing, not getting minutes, shots etc. His agent wanting better situation and on other hand GSW want to go for title. Specially again if they are not sold on certain guy.

I like this scenario. Because it makes Bulls front runner for this scenarios. Yes while it's huge red flag there are no "guaranteed star" it makes for team like Bulls perfect chance to gamble because 4th in crapshoot draft is really good opportunity to get someone good. Not too high and not too low. This isnt 2 star or 3 star draft where we will miss a player. This is zero stars draft.

JohnnyTapwater · Post #998 » by **JohnnyTapwater** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 7:05 pm

I'll be honest - I don't like how LaMelo comes off. I'll just chalk it up to youth.

Pax for Prez · Post #999 » by **Pax for Prez** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 7:28 pm

French point guard Killian Hayes, for instance, confirmed that he has interviewed with the Spurs, Wizards, Knicks, Bulls, and Warriors, adding that his agent has told him to expect to come off the board between No. 2 and No. 10 on draft night (Twitter link via Mike Vorkunov of The Athletic).

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2020/09/draft-rumors-hayes-j-smith-ball-edwards-krejci.html

TheFinishSniper · Post #1000 » by **TheFinishSniper** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 8:02 pm

Pax for Prez wrote:French point guard Killian Hayes, for instance, confirmed that he has interviewed with the Spurs, Wizards, Knicks, Bulls, and Warriors, adding that his agent has told him to expect to come off the board between No. 2 and No. 10 on draft night (Twitter link via Mike Vorkunov of The Athletic).

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2020/09/draft-rumors-hayes-j-smith-ball-edwards-krejci.html

i love when agents whispers to player's ego bull***. always good news to know with what to deal when FA comes...

Who do you want?