Some Observations From Afar

JimmyJammer · Post #1 » by **JimmyJammer** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 8:36 pm

Watching USA basketball has taught me it is going to be a long process for Derrick Rose to get back to that MVP level, that's if he ever gets there again. So far, Kyrie Irving, one of our potential adversaries, has looked quite better. This worries me a lot because, we cannot afford to see a better Kyrie Irving than Derrick Rose for the upcoming season if we have any aspiration to make it to the nba Finals.

As it stands, Kyrie Irving is arguably the third best player on the Cavs. For us to have the 4th best player on the court when we meet up down the road is a reality I am not ready to deal with. That implies our complementary players have to outplay The Cavs' complementary players by a big margin in order to have a chance. With seasoned veterans like Shawn Marion, Mike Miller, Ray Allen(?) James Jones and Thompson, I would have to wonder if we really have an edge.

So, coaching could be our biggest advantage, that's if Thibs ever learn how to maximize his roster. I hate to say it, our chances are not looking too good.

Axl Rose · Post #2 » by **Axl Rose** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 8:43 pm

Kyrie might be beating Rose on the offensive end but Rose hasn't even been all that aggressive on offense....hes been very passive

the story is his defense which has been much better than Kyries

transplant · Post #3 » by **transplant** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 8:46 pm

I suggest that you begin believing that DRose is the 2nd-best player on a court that includes Lebron James, Kevin Love, and Kyrie Irving. It's not hard, just believe it.

Things will still look tough, but not hopeless.

You're welcome.

chifan1798 · Post #4 » by **chifan1798** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 8:46 pm

^^^^^ Yeah, Rose tends to defer when playing around other allstars. He doesn't seem like the type of player to just try and take over, so he looks less aggressive on the offensive end. When Rose becomes the undisputed leader offensively for us, I think we see an improvement in aggressiveness, but it will be just a matter of him getting the rust off, and seeing how he looks.

Post #5 » by **CBS7** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 8:47 pm

Semantics, but Noah is better than Kyrie overall.

Ring_Me · Post #6 » by **Ring_Me** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 8:51 pm

Post #7 » by **coldfish** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 8:51 pm

Why is it just dawning on people that Cleveland is going to be very good? Is it because they didn't have a big public decision and ensuing party? Point blank: Cleveland is better than Miami in 2010.

So, um, yeah, the Bulls are in trouble.

Its not over though and there is a lot of time between now and next May. Anyone who thought that Rose was going to be "110%" the first time he played basketball was delusional. Other things could come into play that push Chicago up. McDermott being able to do most of what he did in college in the pros. Gasol seeing a resurgence now that he is away from D'Antoni. etc. This is going to be a fun season but I am entering it with the full knowledge that Chicago is not nearly the best team in the NBA on paper.

johnnyvann840 · Post #8 » by **johnnyvann840** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 9:03 pm

coldfish wrote: Point blank: Cleveland is better than Miami in 2010.

Not sure how anyone really believes this. Think about it. This is just crazy talk, now.

Miami's big strength was their defense. That is what separated them. They could shut you down in the 4th Q when they turned it on with Wade and Lebron running all over the floor like MJ and Scottie. And they had the toughness of Haslem and Joel Anthony to protect the paint and rim. The Cavs will be starting three embarrassingly bad defensive players in Love, Irving and Waiters.

This is not even bringing playoff experience into it. Wade was a Finals MVP. Bosh had been through series as a #1. Haslem had a ring and was battle tested.

Axl Rose · Post #9 » by **Axl Rose** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 9:04 pm

coldfish wrote:Point blank: Cleveland is better than Miami in 2010..

i think Cavs will be good and will probably beat us but i dont think they are as good as the heat

but we'll have to wait and see how they play

i admit they have a nice roster and i could be proven wrong here

Red Larrivee · Post #10 » by **Red Larrivee** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 9:06 pm

If each team's best players are on the court, Cleveland has 3 of the 4 best players. Coldfish is right; on paper 2014 Cleveland is better than 2010 Miami. Carlos Arroyo and Joel Anthony were Miami's starting point guard and center on opening night in 2010. Cleveland's starting lineup has one of the league's more underrated players in Anderson Varejao and an enigma in Dion Waiters. It's also worth noting that Chicago doesn't possess the same rebounding advantage they held against Miami. Love and Varejao are both elite rebounders at their position.

Cleveland is going to be really good and there's no argument from me if anyone considers them the favorite. Even if Rose returns to MVP mode, Chicago is still a scorer away from closing a small, but noticeable gap.

JimmyJammer · Post #11 » by **JimmyJammer** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 9:08 pm

It almost seems like to me everything has to be right for us to have a chance. That invokes Derrick Rose being healthy and great, Pau staying healthy and playing close to the level he played when he first went to the Lakers, Jimmy rediscovering his shot, getting some valuable contributions from the rookies. There are so many variables, it feels like it is an impossible feat.

Post #12 » by **CBS7** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 9:11 pm

Noah is not the 5th best player between the two teams. Come on, now.

I do think it isn't far fetched to say that this Cavs team is better than the 2010 Heat though. They fit better offensively and are deeper, but they haven't any playoff experience.

Lack of defense is overblown. We're better if they are going to be downright bad defensively. However, I just don't see that.

johnnyvann840 · Post #13 » by **johnnyvann840** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 9:11 pm

Red Larrivee wrote:If each team's best players are on the court, Cleveland has 3 of the 4 best players. Coldfish is right; on paper 2014 Cleveland is better than 2010 Miami. Carlos Arroyo and Joel Anthony were Miami's starting point guard and center on opening night in 2010. Cleveland's starting lineup has one of the league's more underrated players in Anderson Varejao and an enigma in Dion Waiters. It's also worth noting that Chicago doesn't possess the same rebounding advantage they held against Miami. Love and Varejao are both elite rebounders at their position.

Cleveland is going to be really good and there's no argument from me if anyone considers them the favorite. Even if Rose returns to MVP mode, Chicago is still a scorer away from closing a small, but noticeable gap.

They really don't have three of the 4 best players . Have you forgotten Joakim Noah is on the Bulls? He's pretty good. You and Coldfish are both wrong and you'll see.

Post #14 » by **coldfish** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 9:12 pm

johnnyvann840 wrote:
coldfish wrote: Point blank: Cleveland is better than Miami in 2010.

Not sure how anyone really believes this. Think about it. This is just crazy talk, now.

Miami was 3 elite non-complementary players and absolute crap in 2010. People never really accepted that the hype about them was always overstated. Love is perfectly suited to play next to Lebron. He doesn't have to change his game at all. After the big 3 in Cleveland, you still have some competent players. Guys like Dion Waiters and Varejao are better than what Miami had.

People tend to forget that false pedophilia charges are what got Chris Anderson to Miami for the vet min. Ray Allen took a paycut to join the Heat. Focus on the words I wrote and compare the 2010 Miami team to what Cleveland is going to be opening day.

johnnyvann840 · Post #15 » by **johnnyvann840** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 9:14 pm

coldfish wrote:
johnnyvann840 wrote:
coldfish wrote: Point blank: Cleveland is better than Miami in 2010.

Not sure how anyone really believes this. Think about it. This is just crazy talk, now.

Miami was 3 elite non-complementary players and absolute crap in 2010. People never really accepted that the hype about them was always overstated. Love is perfectly suited to play next to Lebron. He doesn't have to change his game at all. After the big 3 in Cleveland, you still have some competent players. Guys like Dion Waiters and Varejao are better than what Miami had.

People tend to forget that false pedophilia charges are what got Chris Anderson to Miami for the vet min. Ray Allen took a paycut to join the Heat. Focus on the words I wrote and compare the 2010 Miami team to what Cleveland is going to be opening day.

We'll see. That is why they play the games.

johnnyvann840 · Post #16 » by **johnnyvann840** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 9:15 pm

Cleveland is going to be dreadful on defense. Defense is half the game.. maybe more than half the game in the playoffs.

JimmyJammer · Post #17 » by **JimmyJammer** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 9:17 pm

I must admit, however, getting Kyrie Irving and Waiters to play off the ball is going to be the challenge in Cleveland. If that transition is seamless, we are going to be in quite a trouble.

RememberLu · Post #18 » by **RememberLu** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 9:20 pm

Kyrie Irving sucks, Derrick is already better than him

waffle · Post #19 » by **waffle** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 9:20 pm

our issues for 2-3 years have been on the offensive end. This team looks at WORST average on offense. That is the difference. We hold our own on offense and make life miserable on defense.

Please (insert deity of your choice) let us stay mostly healthy this year so that at least it will be a fair contest.

the ultimates · Post #20 » by **the ultimates** » Sun Aug 24, 2014 9:23 pm

Is an 18 and 10 Love with bad defense better than a 16 and 7 Bosh with very good defense? People can talk individually about how good Irving, James and Love are but one of those three players is going to suffer stat's wise. Let's not forget what Bosh was offensively before Miami. Five straight 20+ ppg seasons and the last year in Toronto he was 24 and 10.8. Whether Love or Irving somebody is going to have to make the adjustment to being a third option.