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Assuming Noah isn't going to be close to 100% this year, is there any way we can play championship-caliber defense?

Can Taj play the 5 while we live with Pau getting beat on the perimeter by athletic PFs?

I feel like this team can still knuckle down and play good defense, but we're not seeing it with any measure of consistency. The optimist in me says we can crank it up in the playoffs. The realist says we are what we are in terms of defense.

Shill wrote:Assuming Noah isn't going to be close to 100% this year, is there any way we can play championship-caliber defense?

Can Taj play the 5 while we live with Pau getting beat on the perimeter by athletic PFs?

I feel like this team can still knuckle down and play good defense, but we're not seeing it with any measure of consistency. The optimist in me says we can crank it up in the playoffs. The realist says we are what we are in terms of defense.

I think it's vital to find a second perimeter defender on this roster. That alone would make a big difference. Taj and Jimmy can still be really disruptive on the defensive end, but a third guy would really allow us to play more of a lock down style.

HomoSapien wrote:

Shill wrote:Assuming Noah isn't going to be close to 100% this year, is there any way we can play championship-caliber defense?

Can Taj play the 5 while we live with Pau getting beat on the perimeter by athletic PFs?

I feel like this team can still knuckle down and play good defense, but we're not seeing it with any measure of consistency. The optimist in me says we can crank it up in the playoffs. The realist says we are what we are in terms of defense.

I think it's vital to find a second perimeter defender on this roster. That alone would make a big difference. Taj and Jimmy can still be really disruptive on the defensive end, but a third guy would really allow us to play more of a lock down style.

Rose stepping up would help, but none of the top scoring PGs really bring it on defense consistently.

In my opinion, its all PACE dependent.

If you look at the Boston Celtics (with Thibs as the defensive assistant), you can see the pace in the year they won the title when and the subsequent few years trend is very similar to how we were the last 3 years and the pace of the current Bulls.

Conclusion:
With older, injured bigs AND a higher pace, we cant maintain the same defensive effectiveness as prior years. There are that many MORE rotations, that many MORE covers and that much MORE help side work to do.

It also doesnt help that Derrick hasnt been that good on PG defense so far. Several times this season, we have not even been able to stop the first wave of attack.

As long as Jo is not 100%, we will suffer defensively. Pau and Niko can get us there on the offensive end but the struggle on the other. Aaron Afflalo would be nice but just for the year.

I posted this back during pre-season, but didn't get much traction. Interesting read.

About things that have surprised you?

Yes.

One of the things we looked a lot last year was pick-and-roll coverages. At that point, we were only able to identify the four players involved: the ball-handler, the screener, the on-ball defender and the screen defender. What was really interesting is that we were looking at Noah and Hinrich [compared to] Hinrich and Boozer, Hinrich and Boozer were a “better” combination in terms of defending the pick-and-roll on a points per possession basis, We thought “how can this be?” Joakim Noah is a much better defender, you have to watch 10 seconds of basketball to know that.

So when we looked at it, who is the other big on the floor? When it was Boozer [defending the screen] it was Joakim Noah [as the other big on the floor.] Noah was more impactful when he’s loading up the strong side on “ICE” coverage than when he’s put in a ball-screen. [In ICE} he can defend those next two passes, so he’s more important than when Boozer is just trying to force [the ball-handler] to the sideline and keep him out of the middle.

So it was really interesting to think about, how does that work for other teams? Do you want to put the best [defensive] big man in the ball-screen so you weaken the help-side defense? How do you do that strategically? And we went from thinking about just two players to thinking about how the whole team worked together defensively.

http://nyloncalculus.com/2014/10/06/ind ... c-sportvu/

I don't see being top 3 like in recent years this season. It's unrealistic.

Noah is not getting back to DPOY, and we've added other weaker defenders that don't get the system as well, and reduced the play time of our other best defender, Taj Gibson.

Other existing players like Kirk and Dunleavy have gotten older and slower.

Rose is also not concerned about defense much in his desire to get other things working first.

That doesn't mean we are bound to be 11th the whole year. We have things we could try. Starting Gibson. Moving Noah back to center and seeing if Gasol can at least do Boozer's job as well as Boozer (when we did have elite defense still).

Playing Aaron Brooks less, who is probably the worst defender on the team.

Making a trade for a better 2 way starter, than can handle big minutes, improve our capacity to switch, and reduce reliance on mediocre backup talent.

Rerisen wrote:I don't see being top 3 like in recent years this season. It's unrealistic.

Noah is not getting back to DPOY, and we've added other weaker defenders that don't get the system as well, and reduced the play time of our other best defender, Taj Gibson.

Other existing players like Kirk and Dunleavy have gotten older and slower.

Rose is also not concerned about defense much in his desire to get other things working first.

That doesn't mean we are bound to be 11th the whole year. We have things we could try. Starting Gibson. Moving Noah back to center and seeing if Gasol can at least do Boozer's job as well as Boozer (when we did have elite defense still).

Playing Aaron Brooks less, who is probably the worst defender on the team.

Making a trade for a better 2 way starter, than can handle big minutes, improve our capacity to switch, and reduce reliance on mediocre backup talent.

I commend you for your persistence, Re.

Gasol is quite simply overrated by Bulls fans on defense. Hesnot good at help D in our system and that hurts it. Noah isn't good right now, so if we want to play tough top level D with Pau he's got to have good perimeter defense in front of him.

That means Taj, Snell, Butler and Rose. Rose has been crap a lot on D but has shown enough flashes that I think he'll improve. Moore and Kirk are OK. MDJ and Niko are passable. Doug and Brooks are trash.

Gar Paxdorf wrote:Gasol is quite simply overrated by Bulls fans on defense.

Duuuuuude. Shh. Don't blaspheme.

Don't you see all those blocks he gets on sportscenter?

Rerisen wrote:

Gar Paxdorf wrote:Gasol is quite simply overrated by Bulls fans on defense.

Duuuuuude. Shh. Don't blaspheme.

Don't you see all those blocks he gets on sportscenter?

DPOY

Rerisen wrote:

Gar Paxdorf wrote:Gasol is quite simply overrated by Bulls fans on defense.

Duuuuuude. Shh. Don't blaspheme.

Don't you see all those blocks he gets on sportscenter?

I know you're being sarcastic, but to be clear, he is a very good shot blocker. Not sure how good of a shot-alterer he is (like chandler and noah have been for us). He's not terrible on D just not "good". He's average. Him and Noah being average is why we need Taj so much.

And Snell

Rerisen wrote:

Gar Paxdorf wrote:Gasol is quite simply overrated by Bulls fans on defense.

Duuuuuude. Shh. Don't blaspheme.

Don't you see all those blocks he gets on sportscenter?

The case though is that Gasol can actually carry ass our on Offense when the rest of us look like garbage. So he gets a pass for his defensive limitations.

Boozer would be like "I'll take this fadeaway" and just bank on that to work all night. It usually didn't

Rerisen wrote:

Gar Paxdorf wrote:Gasol is quite simply overrated by Bulls fans on defense.

Duuuuuude. Shh. Don't blaspheme.

Don't you see all those blocks he gets on sportscenter?

It was funny how there were headlines about the Bulls putting on a "defensive clinic" against the Nuggets with 18 blocks, ignoring that we still gave up over 100 points.

HomoSapien wrote:I think it's vital to find a second perimeter defender on this roster. That alone would make a big difference. Taj and Jimmy can still be really disruptive on the defensive end, but a third guy would really allow us to play more of a lock down style.

It looks like Snell could be that guy if his confidence continues to rise. He has been playing much, much better on the defensive end of late, especially his man-on-man coverage. He's definitely got the height, wing span and athleticism.

Gar Paxdorf wrote:

Rerisen wrote:

Gar Paxdorf wrote:Gasol is quite simply overrated by Bulls fans on defense.

Duuuuuude. Shh. Don't blaspheme.

Don't you see all those blocks he gets on sportscenter?

I know you're being sarcastic, but to be clear, he is a very good shot blocker. Not sure how good of a shot-alterer he is (like chandler and noah have been for us). He's not terrible on D just not "good". He's average. Him and Noah being average is why we need Taj so much.

Yeah shot blocking individual possessions have sure value, but really say little about the rest of a guy's defensive impact.

Similar to say Chris Paul getting 3 or 4 steals, but then still perhaps getting lit up for 35 efficient points by Westbrook bullying his small size. Overall, that would be a poor defensive night.

Mr Funk wrote:

HomoSapien wrote:I think it's vital to find a second perimeter defender on this roster. That alone would make a big difference. Taj and Jimmy can still be really disruptive on the defensive end, but a third guy would really allow us to play more of a lock down style.

It looks like Snell could be that guy if his confidence continues to rise. He has been playing much, much better on the defensive end of late, especially his man-on-man coverage. He's definitely got the height, wing span and athleticism.

I jumped off the Snell bandwagon a few weeks ago. Mostly because I felt like I was pulling the bandwagon myself and not really enjoying the ride.

I do think that Snell has the potential to be a HUGE difference maker.

One more LeBron defender or JR defender. At 6'7, and with his wingspan he can really make shots hard to come by. And his 3 point percentages are good.

If he can get it together, we have solved our backup wing issue for good.

My sense is that a few things are going on:

1) Noah, IMO, isn't far off physically right now; however, I think his transition to PF has been tougher than we would have otherwise thought (on both ends of floor). Defensively, he has stuggled most against stretch 4's.

2) Rose used to be a stellar PG defender, even against the quicker guards. He has been average at best.

3) We have downgraded a little (but less than I expected) defensively going from Deng to MDJ.

4) With so many new guys playing meaningful minutes, our rotations are a little slow.

I would say they are just not interested in playing defense. they think they can out score you.

I posted in another thread. The Bulls have lost recently to Utah, Washington and Orlando where Pau/Noah got burned on defense by big men.

Pau can play PF like Boozer but Noah is no longer the old Noah to save Pau's butt