How Much Can the Bulls Pay Jimmy Butler?

[sweetcity]

Just curious to know what the cap situation is and how much the Bulls can in theory offer Jimmy Butler? Is it a situation where Taj Gibson will have to be traded to offer Butler max money? If Gibson can't be moved then what can the bulls afford?

[Rerisen]

Here is an article from the stickied salary info that does a good job explaining the Butler salary implications.

http://www.basketballinsiders.com/nba-r ... my-butler/

The gist depending on salary cap fluctuations is he could get around 16 for his max, probably within a half mil either way.

The Bulls can afford to pay him his max, without having to trade Taj, though they might choose to do something like that to afford more flexibility elsewhere.

[sweetcity]

Here is an article from the stickied salary info that does a good job explaining the Butler salary implications.

http://www.basketballinsiders.com/nba-r ... my-butler/

The gist depending on salary cap fluctuations is he could get around 16 for his max, probably within a half mil either way.

The Bulls can afford to pay him his max, without having to trade Taj, though they might choose to do something like that to afford more flexibility elsewhere.

Thanks for posting, what would happen if an opposing team offered even more, lets say $20m?

[Rerisen]

Thanks for posting, what would happen if an opposing team offered even more, lets say $20m?

They can't, his max salary is prescribed by the rules of the CBA.

Which cannot be more than ~25% of the salary cap.

[sweetcity]

So if the cap goes up to $80m, in theory a team good pay upwards of $25m per. How did Kobe get such a big deal this off season then? Because he was unrestricted?

[Rerisen]

Kobe's max is much higher because its based off your previous contract and tenure in the league.

If the cap goes up way more than expected then yeah, Jimmy's max will also raise with it.

[sweetcity]

Ok thanks for the help with that, I've been curious as to what would happen... I guess its hopefully safe to assume her isnt going anywhere regardless?

[League Circles]

So if the cap goes up to $80m, in theory a team good pay upwards of $25m per. How did Kobe get such a big deal this off season then? Because he was unrestricted?

Well 25% of 80 mil is 20 mil, but anyways its not truly a % of the salary cap but a related number.

Kobe has 30-40 more years of service than Jimmy which is why he could get so much. And because of other factors I won't elaborate on.

But the bottom line is that the Bulls can match ANY offer Jimmy receives, period, end of story.

[sweetcity]

So its just a question of if the cap goes up and there is a team out there aggressive enough to drive up the value to the point management / ownership wouldnt match

[Rerisen]

Also, the Bulls FO have already stated just about a promise they won't be outbid for Jimmy. That he isn't going anywhere.

[dougthonus]

So its just a question of if the cap goes up and there is a team out there aggressive enough to drive up the value to the point management / ownership wouldnt match

The cap won't make some big unexpected jump this year. They already have good estimates on what it will be, and the remaining variables are pretty small.

16.5 million is still a ton of money, but it seems likely the Bulls would match any contract and just straight up offer him the max anyway.

The interesting thing for Butler is that he's not a good iso player which is typically what a team pays for, but once the new TV deal comes in the year after Butler's contract, the cap will go up to like 80 million, so his 16 million dollar salary will suddenly look 25% smaller by comparison.

In which case, the Bulls are in a pretty safe spot in terms of matching him without overpaying. They, of course, would have been even better off had they locked him up at 12 million or whatever it was this summer, but that had its own risks and Butler's ascendance this year has been more or less unprecedented [it literally may be the biggest year over year improvement using advanced metrics ever].

[League Circles]

Yeah they're keeping him. Doing so may possibly affect another couple small moves such as whether or not they use part or all of the full MLE or MMLE, and whether or not they make certain trades, but since they value continuity, I think these players are probably extremely likely to be Bulls next year:

Noah
Gasol
Taj
Niko
McD
Snell
Butler
Rose
Kirk
Bulls 2015 (or Cleveland's or Sac's) #1 pick


I'd say there's a pretty decent chance that they re-sign MDJ and/or Brooks using an exception as well.

[transplant]

I don't have much doubt that the Bulls will re-sign Butler. My question/concern is the player option (opt-out) Butler's agent is likely to want (and get).

[League Circles]

I don't have much doubt that the Bulls will re-sign Butler. My question/concern is the player option (opt-out) Butler's agent is likely to want (and get).

Good point. But if the Bulls offer without it but still the max maybe another team won't bother wasting their time solely to help Jimmy Butler and his agent get what they want from Chicago.

I could see the Bulls offering something like the 4 year max with a 5th year at the max but only partially guaranteed in that 5th year or something.

Bottom line I expect jimmy to be here, both he and the org have publicly said it's a Sure thing. That means we'll be his best offer but not necessarily the true 5 year max fully guaranteed.

[Indomitable]

Ok thanks for the help with that, I've been curious as to what would happen... I guess its hopefully safe to assume her isnt going anywhere regardless?

So what team do you root for.

[dougthonus]

I don't have much doubt that the Bulls will re-sign Butler. My question/concern is the player option (opt-out) Butler's agent is likely to want (and get).

You can't do ETO and PO anymore, and ETO can only be for fifth season and PO only for last season which means if Jimmy does get an option it will be 2+1, 3+1, or 4+1.

If I'm Butler I try to argue for the 4+1 max contract myself. I'm all for betting on myself for a big raise, but I would rather lock in a guaranteed 90 million than lock in a guaranteed 50 million and play FA again after 2/33 or 3/50.

That said, I think you could make the case either way.

If he does 4+1 then the option really isn't likely to hurt the Bulls any and will probably end up getting executed IMO.

[transplant]

I don't have much doubt that the Bulls will re-sign Butler. My question/concern is the player option (opt-out) Butler's agent is likely to want (and get).

You can't do ETO and PO anymore, and ETO can only be for fifth season and PO only for last season which means if Jimmy does get an option it will be 2+1, 3+1, or 4+1.

If I'm Butler I try to argue for the 4+1 max contract myself. I'm all for betting on myself for a big raise, but I would rather lock in a guaranteed 90 million than lock in a guaranteed 50 million and play FA again after 2/33 or 3/50.

That said, I think you could make the case either way.

If he does 4+1 then the option really isn't likely to hurt the Bulls any and will probably end up getting executed IMO.

Thanks, Doug. I always love when I learn something.

[TimRobbins]

The cap won't make some big unexpected jump this year. They already have good estimates on what it will be, and the remaining variables are pretty small.

16.5 million is still a ton of money, but it seems likely the Bulls would match any contract and just straight up offer him the max anyway.

The interesting thing for Butler is that he's not a good iso player which is typically what a team pays for, but once the new TV deal comes in the year after Butler's contract, the cap will go up to like 80 million, so his 16 million dollar salary will suddenly look 25% smaller by comparison.

In which case, the Bulls are in a pretty safe spot in terms of matching him without overpaying. They, of course, would have been even better off had they locked him up at 12 million or whatever it was this summer, but that had its own risks and Butler's ascendance this year has been more or less unprecedented [it literally may be the biggest year over year improvement using advanced metrics ever].

If the Bulls have any sense, they would offer a 5-year max on day one. As you mentioned, once the cap goes up, Jimmy's contract will become a huge asset. Otherwise, they could face a Parsons situation where some team offers Jimmy a 3 year max deal with a player option and a trade kicker, which would make his contract a lot less valuable.

[MC3]

With Derrick Rose playing like he does. You must pay him the max, you match every offer he get. You dont really have much choice. He is the best player on this team. And we would be pretty much nowhere without him. We would be Brooklyn Nets. Maybe bit better, we still have picks for rebuilding if we let him go.

[Dez]

The cap won't make some big unexpected jump this year. They already have good estimates on what it will be, and the remaining variables are pretty small.

16.5 million is still a ton of money, but it seems likely the Bulls would match any contract and just straight up offer him the max anyway.

The interesting thing for Butler is that he's not a good iso player which is typically what a team pays for, but once the new TV deal comes in the year after Butler's contract, the cap will go up to like 80 million, so his 16 million dollar salary will suddenly look 25% smaller by comparison.

In which case, the Bulls are in a pretty safe spot in terms of matching him without overpaying. They, of course, would have been even better off had they locked him up at 12 million or whatever it was this summer, but that had its own risks and Butler's ascendance this year has been more or less unprecedented [it literally may be the biggest year over year improvement using advanced metrics ever].

If the Bulls have any sense, they would offer a 5-year max on day one. As you mentioned, once the cap goes up, Jimmy's contract will become a huge asset. Otherwise, they could face a Parsons situation where some team offers Jimmy a 3 year max deal with a player option and a trade kicker, which would make his contract a lot less valuable.

They can't offer the 5 year max, Derrick Rose is our 5 year max player.