KC: Bulls starting preliminary talk on Niko and Rolo trades; Pg 16: Niko would ok a trade to a contender

[Stratmaster]

I would keep Portis because he is shown improvement. He is 22 and one of youngest on roster. As long he isnt asking much in FA you keep him. Either as longterm bench player or asset going forward.

That's why per KC he isnt included in this talks.

Except Niko is so much better than anyone else in a Bulls uniform right now it is ridiculous.

Im a big Lauri fan... but that includes him as well.

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[Chi town]

Keep Niko and trade RoLo, Grant, Portis, and Chuck Holiday.

Play Niko at the 5 and pump his value until the deadline. If you can’t get a top 20 pick by then you keep him.

[TyrusRose2425]

We're not against adding a long term contract so to say, but we're using it as leverage now for if we do take someones long term contract later.

[gardenofsound]

We're not against adding a long term contract so to say, but we're using it as leverage now for if we do take someones long term contract later.

Is this from an insider tip or merely a hunch?

[Benedict Miller]

Hopefully we're exploring all options. I wouldn't mind trading for a 2019 pick.

[fleet]

They better move, the clock is ticking. In 10 more games it may be impossible to trade mainstays on a team that is playing .500 ball or better in the last 15 or 20 games. There is a cutoff point.

[sh0ck]

What Hinkie did was a disgrace to the sport and the league, we have six banners hanging in our rafters we don't have to resort to such unsophisticated tactics like "throw as much **** on the wall and see what sticks". We're going to be bad this year ,then get that one big guy and reboot.

It is and it isn't, I mean not a lot of franchises would draft three centers to begin building around. And Noel and Okafor didn't work out for them. They really only started to get good around Embiid, Saric, and Simmons. Who knows about Fultz.

As for us, who knows, we don't really talk about free agents much, but that's an area we also have the ability to improve our Roster with. We won't knock it out of the park getting Klay, Durant, Westbrook, or Lebron---but at very least, we could build a good bench mob like back in 2010. Not very difficult to improve upon guys like Zipser, Valentine, and Grant.

Dunn/Lavine/Markkanen plus two other starters from the draft and free agency could start to look less embarrassing.

Noel and MCW were taken in drafts where they could've gotten McCollum/Adams/Giannis. Out of the NBA Anthony Bennett was the #1 in that draft. National media had a field day when the Bulls took Markkanen, would you rather have DSJ or Kenard or whatever else came after?

You have to make a savvy pick when you're that close to the top. Hinkie has a Eastern finalist if he doesn't **** up that draft. You cant resign yourself to "oh let's be bad for 4 years and get top picks" that strategy doesn't work if you **** up your draft, and can set you years back.

I rather have Donovan Mitchell, that kid is a stud lol

However, the realistic comp is the drafting Lauri over DSJ and Monk (both guys that people were mad at the Bulls for passing up). And I think Lauri has looked like a more valuable piece than both of those guys (especially over Monk).

[NikosTheGoat]

Keep Niko and trade RoLo, Grant, Portis, and Chuck Holiday.

Play Niko at the 5 and pump his value until the deadline. If you can’t get a top 20 pick by then you keep him.

maybe you trade him for the first overall pick. the **** you want a top 20 pick for? so you can replace him with another denzel? the grass is not always greener, friends.

[GimmeDat]

Keep Niko and trade RoLo, Grant, Portis, and Chuck Holiday.

Play Niko at the 5 and pump his value until the deadline. If you can’t get a top 20 pick by then you keep him.

maybe you trade him for the first overall pick. the **** you want a top 20 pick for? so you can replace him with another denzel? the grass is not always greener, friends.

If you can get a top 20 pick for Niko it's a deal every day of the week. It's youth, it's cap flexibility, and it's helping the tank.

[NikosTheGoat]

Keep Niko and trade RoLo, Grant, Portis, and Chuck Holiday.

Play Niko at the 5 and pump his value until the deadline. If you can’t get a top 20 pick by then you keep him.

maybe you trade him for the first overall pick. the **** you want a top 20 pick for? so you can replace him with another denzel? the grass is not always greener, friends.

If you can get a top 20 pick for Niko it's a deal every day of the week. It's youth, it's cap flexibility, and it's helping the tank.

you can get a real youthful and flexible team by signing 12 18-year-olds for the minimum contract. but why would you want to?

i'm not concerned about jerry's pocketbook. i'm concerned about this notion of making the team objectively worse on the off chance that you improve your draft odds slightly in order to draft...some kid who might perhaps be as good as niko?

again, the grass is not always greener! trading the best player on the team for someone who has a really low probability of ever being as good as niko...seems like poor roster management.

[GimmeDat]

maybe you trade him for the first overall pick. the **** you want a top 20 pick for? so you can replace him with another denzel? the grass is not always greener, friends.

If you can get a top 20 pick for Niko it's a deal every day of the week. It's youth, it's cap flexibility, and it's helping the tank.

you can get a real youthful and flexible team by signing 12 18-year-olds for the minimum contract. but why would you want to?

i'm not concerned about jerry's pocketbook. i'm concerned about this notion of making the team objectively worse on the off chance that you improve your draft odds slightly in order to draft...some kid who might perhaps be as good as niko?

again, the grass is not always greener! trading the best player on the team for someone who has a really low probability of ever being as good as niko...seems like poor roster management.

That's pretty clearly not the point. Saving cap is not about Jerry's pockets, it's about giving us the ability to bring talented win-now players in the fold once we're a good basketball team again. The best way to hit the treadmill is paying role players before acquiring your stars. It will drastically decrease our ceiling as a basketball club.

Niko's a good player, and I'm one of the boards biggest supporters of him, but he was also getting DNP's with Joff taking his minutes as recently as last season - after 3 good games, you can't declare him the best player.

If there's no market for him, keep him, he's a good player, even though he'll eat in to our cap and be at least 30 by the time we're competitive again. But if a 1st is on the table, it would be foolish to pass it up.

[RedBulls23]

We're not against adding a long term contract so to say, but we're using it as leverage now for if we do take someones long term contract later.

You mean to get a team to give up more assets?

[Onibuh]

I don't get the fascination of sucking and losing. Why not Keep the guys that are worth it and get rid of guys that have no future on this Team? the way Dunn improves, Lauri Plays as rookie and Niko taking a leader role will get this Team Ws. You add Nwaba and Lavine is still out. That's enough Talent already. Everybody wants the next Lebron, but if you have Talent that isn't too old you Keep it for your rebuild.
If they improve more and more than you'd think if adding 1 good FA is enough to compete for the 2nd round.

[Kaled]

I don't get the fascination of sucking and losing. Why not Keep the guys that are worth it and get rid of guys that have no future on this Team? the way Dunn improves, Lauri Plays as rookie and Niko taking a leader role will get this Team Ws. You add Nwaba and Lavine is still out. That's enough Talent already. Everybody wants the next Lebron, but if you have Talent that isn't too old you Keep it for your rebuild.
If they improve more and more than you'd think if adding 1 good FA is enough to compete for the 2nd round.

And we do that to become like the 2011 76ers? A team that makes it to the playoffs but never accomplishes anything ever? Yeah, i rather tank and grab a once in a lifetime talent like any of the top talents in this draft class look like, than becoming a fringe playoff team.

[NikosTheGoat]

If you can get a top 20 pick for Niko it's a deal every day of the week. It's youth, it's cap flexibility, and it's helping the tank.

you can get a real youthful and flexible team by signing 12 18-year-olds for the minimum contract. but why would you want to?

i'm not concerned about jerry's pocketbook. i'm concerned about this notion of making the team objectively worse on the off chance that you improve your draft odds slightly in order to draft...some kid who might perhaps be as good as niko?

again, the grass is not always greener! trading the best player on the team for someone who has a really low probability of ever being as good as niko...seems like poor roster management.

That's pretty clearly not the point. Saving cap is not about Jerry's pockets, it's about giving us the ability to bring talented win-now players in the fold once we're a good basketball team again. The best way to hit the treadmill is paying role players before acquiring your stars. It will drastically decrease our ceiling as a basketball club.

Niko's a good player, and I'm one of the boards biggest supporters of him, but he was also getting DNP's with Joff taking his minutes as recently as last season - after 3 good games, you can't declare him the best player.

If there's no market for him, keep him, he's a good player, even though he'll eat in to our cap and be at least 30 by the time we're competitive again. But if a 1st is on the table, it would be foolish to pass it up.

let's presume you trade niko and get back 0 salary in return. the bulls are left with a whopping 3.6 million dollars in salary cap space. who you bringing in with that? archie goodwin? worth noting that niko's current contract is incredibly team friendly. paul millsap is making 30 million dollars this season. taj gibson makes more than mirotic. thaddeus young does. what is a better use of 12.5 million dollars than mirotic?

he was getting dnp's because fred's a bad coach. it was night and day how bad the bulls were when he was benched. it was like that with rondo too. everyone knew joffrey had no business "eating into" that playing time. guy is barely an nba player.

i just don't get this notion of recycling good players for "young" players who, on the basis of simple probability, will likely never be as good. it doesn't give you flexibility to do anything, it just makes you worse.

i also don't get this notion of 30-year-olds being bad for winning. it's been a common theme. do teams with a bunch of 22-year-olds go deep in the playoffs? when we're "ready to compete" so to speak, you don't want a scoring power forward in his prime on that team?

[WindyCityBorn]

I don't get the fascination of sucking and losing. Why not Keep the guys that are worth it and get rid of guys that have no future on this Team? the way Dunn improves, Lauri Plays as rookie and Niko taking a leader role will get this Team Ws. You add Nwaba and Lavine is still out. That's enough Talent already. Everybody wants the next Lebron, but if you have Talent that isn't too old you Keep it for your rebuild.
If they improve more and more than you'd think if adding 1 good FA is enough to compete for the 2nd round.

And we do that to become like the 2011 76ers? A team that makes it to the playoffs but never accomplishes anything ever? Yeah, i rather tank and grab a once in a lifetime talent like any of the top talents in this draft class look like, than becoming a fringe playoff team.

So acquiring a star through free agency or trade is not possible any more? Or just drafting smart and find a gem late. I'm fine with getting a hopefully a top 3 pick next summer then playing to win. But I believe in our current young talent more than most of you do.

[GimmeDat]

you can get a real youthful and flexible team by signing 12 18-year-olds for the minimum contract. but why would you want to?

i'm not concerned about jerry's pocketbook. i'm concerned about this notion of making the team objectively worse on the off chance that you improve your draft odds slightly in order to draft...some kid who might perhaps be as good as niko?

again, the grass is not always greener! trading the best player on the team for someone who has a really low probability of ever being as good as niko...seems like poor roster management.

That's pretty clearly not the point. Saving cap is not about Jerry's pockets, it's about giving us the ability to bring talented win-now players in the fold once we're a good basketball team again. The best way to hit the treadmill is paying role players before acquiring your stars. It will drastically decrease our ceiling as a basketball club.

Niko's a good player, and I'm one of the boards biggest supporters of him, but he was also getting DNP's with Joff taking his minutes as recently as last season - after 3 good games, you can't declare him the best player.

If there's no market for him, keep him, he's a good player, even though he'll eat in to our cap and be at least 30 by the time we're competitive again. But if a 1st is on the table, it would be foolish to pass it up.

let's presume you trade niko and get back 0 salary in return. the bulls are left with a whopping 3.6 million dollars in salary cap space. who you bringing in with that? archie goodwin? worth noting that niko's current contract is incredibly team friendly. paul millsap is making 30 million dollars this season. taj gibson makes more than mirotic. thaddeus young does. what is a better use of 12.5 million dollars than mirotic?

he was getting dnp's because fred's a bad coach. it was night and day how bad the bulls were when he was benched. it was like that with rondo too. everyone knew joffrey had no business "eating into" that playing time. guy is barely an nba player.

i just don't get this notion of recycling good players for "young" players who, on the basis of simple probability, will likely never be as good. it doesn't give you flexibility to do anything, it just makes you worse.

i also don't get this notion of 30-year-olds being bad for winning. it's been a common theme. do teams with a bunch of 22-year-olds go deep in the playoffs? when we're "ready to compete" so to speak, you don't want a scoring power forward in his prime on that team?

Cap flexibility isn't about this season. It's about having cap space when we're actually a competitive team again. Also, the idea of trading Niko isn't about dumping his current deal, it's essentially an expiring as it is. The point is that keeping Niko suggests wanting to have him long term, which would require a non-team friendly, long term deal. To compare deals like Millsap's, Gibson, Young, etc. is to ignore the context in which those deals were made. Would the Bulls fanbase be happy if we signed either of those guys to their current contract right now?

Blaming Fred for his DNP's is a cop out, he was really bad at times in his role last season. Same with Rondo, the stretch where Rondo went from starting to sitting, most people were at minimum in favor of benching him for his poor play. It was only once he was reintroduced to the lineup that he was any good.

A 30 year old isn't bad for winning, but a 30 year old on a long term contract when the Bulls are just starting to get back in to playoff contention isn't. Why waste that cap when you can use it on somehow who fits our window and needs, whilst getting a 1st round pick in the process.

We're not competing with a bunch of 22 year olds, that's being facetious. He will be in his prime and he will not be a positive contract when this team is at its peak.

[Kaled]

I don't get the fascination of sucking and losing. Why not Keep the guys that are worth it and get rid of guys that have no future on this Team? the way Dunn improves, Lauri Plays as rookie and Niko taking a leader role will get this Team Ws. You add Nwaba and Lavine is still out. That's enough Talent already. Everybody wants the next Lebron, but if you have Talent that isn't too old you Keep it for your rebuild.
If they improve more and more than you'd think if adding 1 good FA is enough to compete for the 2nd round.

And we do that to become like the 2011 76ers? A team that makes it to the playoffs but never accomplishes anything ever? Yeah, i rather tank and grab a once in a lifetime talent like any of the top talents in this draft class look like, than becoming a fringe playoff team.

So acquiring a star through free agency or trade is not possible any more? Or just drafting smart and find a gem late. I'm fine with getting a hopefully a top 3 pick next summer then playing to win. But I believe in our current young talent more than most of you do.

Possible to acquire a star through FA? Yes. Is it going to happen anytime soon? Unlikely. It didn't happened when our team was one of the best ones in the league and we had the most talented young player in the league, how is it going to happen now that every team is trying to build a superteam? I'm all for positivity and giving our young guys a chance, but to think that this group of players is capable of anything more than a first round exit on the playoffs is just deluding yourself.

[Onibuh]

And we do that to become like the 2011 76ers? A team that makes it to the playoffs but never accomplishes anything ever? Yeah, i rather tank and grab a once in a lifetime talent like any of the top talents in this draft class look like, than becoming a fringe playoff team.

So acquiring a star through free agency or trade is not possible any more? Or just drafting smart and find a gem late. I'm fine with getting a hopefully a top 3 pick next summer then playing to win. But I believe in our current young talent more than most of you do.

Possible to acquire a star through FA? Yes. Is it going to happen anytime soon? Unlikely. It didn't happened when our team was one of the best ones in the league and we had the most talented young player in the league, how is it going to happen now that every team is trying to build a superteam? I'm all for positivity and giving our young guys a chance, but to think that this group of players is capable of anything more than a first round exit on the playoffs is just deluding yourself.

Bulls have Cap Space. Not every Team has Cap Space.
Teams that lose a star via FA could trade their 2nd best Player to rebuild.

Bulls have a fast rebuild thanks to starting the rebuild with Dunn, Lavine and #7 in the Draft. They have Niko who may finally become that Quality starter you Keep even when you are good. Portis improves and you got lucky with adding Nwaba for free. That is something to build on. I wouldn't want to have Ball or Fultz or Jackson over Markkanen. I remember when Bennett was the can't miss #1 pick. No guarantees and if you can add to this roster base it might actually become a good Young Team that is interesting to sign with.

[WindyCityBorn]

And we do that to become like the 2011 76ers? A team that makes it to the playoffs but never accomplishes anything ever? Yeah, i rather tank and grab a once in a lifetime talent like any of the top talents in this draft class look like, than becoming a fringe playoff team.

So acquiring a star through free agency or trade is not possible any more? Or just drafting smart and find a gem late. I'm fine with getting a hopefully a top 3 pick next summer then playing to win. But I believe in our current young talent more than most of you do.

Possible to acquire a star through FA? Yes. Is it going to happen anytime soon? Unlikely. It didn't happened when our team was one of the best ones in the league and we had the most talented young player in the league, how is it going to happen now that every team is trying to build a superteam? I'm all for positivity and giving our young guys a chance, but to think that this group of players is capable of anything more than a first round exit on the playoffs is just deluding yourself.

We have a lottery pick coming up and LaVine has yet to join the team. By next season we could looking at team set up really well for the future.

I think LaVine is going to blow up and become a star. So like said before I believe in the young players more than most of you do so I don't think we need 3 or 4 years of tanking to build a contender if we hit in the next draft.